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Is Apu racist?

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  • 19-04-2018 10:38pm
    #1
    DredFX
    Closed Accounts Posts: 287 ✭✭


    In November 2017, Indian-American comedian Hari Kondabolu released a documentary concerning Apu from The Simpsons, aptly named The Problem with Apu.

    Though he liked the character in his youth, as he aged he became critical of the stereotypes attached to the character, particularly because Apu was the only main representation of South Asians in the show. He also took umbrage with the fact that he was voiced by a white man, using a typical Indian English accent for the role. Major Indian-American actors like Aziz Ansari and Kal Penn related to the documentary due to being bullied with catchphrases originating from Apu throughout their youth.



    Now, like all scandals, this fizzled out after a short while. However, just over a week ago The Simpsons released a new episode called No Good Read Goes Unpunished, which many people interpreted as a response to the controversy, primarily because of this story arc:
    Meanwhile, Marge purchases an old book that used to be a favorite of hers in hopes of reading it to Lisa, but realizes it is culturally offensive. Marge decides to edit the story in order to lessen the offensive stereotypes and clichés, but after she reads it to Lisa, the two agree that it has lost meaning. Lisa decides to bring Marge to Springfield University, where she is told to her relief that modern critics read the book as a subversive satire of conformity. However, Marge is not entirely convinced.

    This reignited the discussion. You have one side claiming that the episode missed the point and brushed off the criticism, while the other is generally saying, "Relax, don't do it, pick your nose and chew it." The media has latched onto the controversy like vultures to roadkill, and now there are calls for the show to either revamp Apu or scrap him entirely.

    Apu is certainly not a character I expected people to explode over, but I want to know what you guys think. Is Apu problematic, or do you think enraged fans of the show are overreacting?


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    #2
    Will I Am Not
    Registered Users Posts: 3,495 ✭✭✭Will I Am Not


    Should we expect a Scotsman to make a documentary called The Problem With Willie? Or a German, The Problem With Üter?
    People look for the racist angle wherever they can.


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    #3
    TheDavester
    Registered Users Posts: 3,244 ✭✭✭TheDavester


    Few weeks ago it was friends, what show next will the sjws get ‘offended’ now by


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    #4
    DredFX
    Closed Accounts Posts: 287 ✭✭DredFX


    Will I Am Not wrote: »
    Should we expect a Scotsman to make a documentary called The Problem With Willie? Or a German, The Problem With Üter?

    Might get a ball rolling. Or it might not.


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    #5
    Guy:Incognito
    Registered Users Posts: 38,247 ✭✭✭✭Guy:Incognito


    Everything is racist now.


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    #6
    bfa1509
    Registered Users Posts: 1,022 ✭✭✭bfa1509


    Will I Am Not wrote: »
    Should we expect a Scotsman to make a documentary called The Problem With Willie? Or a German, The Problem With Üter?
    People look for the racist angle wherever they can.

    Should we expect fat people to make a documentary "The Problem with Homer".

    I used to laugh at how utterly outrageous the PC brigade were. But I am seriously afraid now of how much traction they are getting. Between modern feminism, the #metoo movement ruining the lives of good people, that guy in the UK facing "hate crime" charges for teaching his dog how to salute. Why is everyone not laughing this crap off the face of the planet?

    We need to keep pushing the boundaries of political correctness or one day it will suffocate us.


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    #7
    ShooterSF
    Registered Users Posts: 8,824 ✭✭✭ShooterSF


    A real case of "You Either Die A Hero, Or You Live Long Enough To See Yourself Become The Villain" and the Simpsons' longevity is probably proving this now. Apu is not a character that could probably be created today. I think the accent and the career just stereotype him so badly that I can't compare it to Willie or Uder. But it is also a character a lot of us grew up with and probably have fond attachments to. "How can it be racist if I like the character?" As such though I'm of the view that he's grandfathered in, like a lot of things that haven't aged particularly well (the gay episode anyone?), it is a piece of its time and should be left alone. Also in defence of the Simpsons this isn't black face or terrible chinese accents with big fake teeth, Apu wasn't and isn't a one note character, if anything the outrage should probably be on the likes of Cleetus. Apu is fleshed out a lot outside of his job and accent and seems to have been taken seriously by the show as a deep person.


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    #8
    Mr.Nice Guy
    Registered Users Posts: 45,558 ✭✭✭✭Mr.Nice Guy


    Apu is one of the non-Simpsons characters that was fleshed out the most, and presented with a real warmth. The episode where Homer changes his mind on the anti-immigration law was down to the respect he had for Apu (and boy is that episode still relevant today).

    A lot of the characters were stereotyped. Groundskeeper Willie as mentioned, then there was the big fat Italian restaurant owner with the stereotypical accent; I even remember an episode where Abe is talking about chasing the Irish out of Springfield, before it cuts to a stereoptypical Irish guy in a blarney outfit who says "Aye and a fine job ye did too." I laughed at that because I can take a joke.

    I sympathise with the guy getting Apu mock accents thrown his way growing up which is uncalled for, but that's not a reason to take his ire out on the show because of the actions of a few dimwits. I suspect if Apu never existed the muppets doing that would have resorted to some other character, like perhaps the guy from Big Bang Theory. Gobsh*tes will be gobsh*tes no matter how much we censor TV.

    I suspect where this will end up is Azaria will make a statement that after careful reflection he will give up voicing the character because of the pain it is causing blah blah blah, and that an Indian voice actor will take over the role. Maybe they'll turn it into an episode where Apu damages his vocal chords.

    The real truth of the matter imo is that it's the US itself that has the racist problem and that all this sniping about shows and personalities is a way to skirt around the issue which is that they've never properly come to terms with their post-segregation past, particularly in the southern states.


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    #9
    connemara man
    Moderators, Sports Moderators, Regional West Moderators Posts: 6,773 Mod ✭✭✭✭connemara man


    Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »
    Apu is one of the non-Simpsons characters that was fleshed out the most, and presented with a real warmth. The episode where Homer changes his mind on the anti-immigration law was down to the respect he had for Apu (and boy is that episode still relevant today).

    A lot of the characters were stereotyped. Groundskeeper Willie as mentioned, then there was the big fat Italian restaurant owner with the stereotypical accent; I even remember an episode where Abe is talking about chasing the Irish out of Springfield, before it cuts to a stereoptypical Irish guy in a blarney outfit who says "Aye and a fine job ye did too." I laughed at that because I can take a joke.

    I sympathise with the guy getting Apu mock accents thrown his way growing up which is uncalled for, but that's not a reason to take his ire out on the show because of the actions of a few dimwits. I suspect if Apu never existed the muppets doing that would have resorted to some other character, like perhaps the guy from Big Bang Theory. Gobsh*tes will be gobsh*tes no matter how much we censor TV.

    I suspect where this will end up is Azaria will make a statement that after careful reflection he will give up voicing the character because of the pain it is causing blah blah blah, and that an Indian voice actor will take over the role. Maybe they'll turn it into an episode where Apu damages his vocal chords.

    The real truth of the matter imo is that it's the US itself that has the racist problem and that all this sniping about shows and personalities is a way to skirt around the issue which is that they've never properly come to terms with their post-segregation past, particularly in the southern states.

    giphy.gif


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    #10
    Sleepy
    Registered Users Posts: 24,176 ✭✭✭✭Sleepy


    Apu is a caricature, but like Mr.Nice Guy says, he's one that's almost always been presented in more of a positive light than a negative one. The only negative I can think of about the characters portrayal was of his over-charging his customers and lax attitude to health and safety laws. In direct contrast to Homer's laziness, Apu has always been shown to be hard-working and industrious. Hardly a slur on the Indian race.


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    #11
    Will I Am Not
    Registered Users Posts: 3,495 ✭✭✭Will I Am Not


    It’s only acceptable to stereotypically portray people from predominantly white nations these days.


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    #12
    Agent Coulson
    Registered Users Posts: 60,460 ✭✭✭✭Agent Coulson


    No!

    Thank you, Come again.


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    #13
    MEGA BRO WOLF 5000
    Registered Users Posts: 17,438 ✭✭✭✭MEGA BRO WOLF 5000


    Comedy should never be labelled as racism.

    It's comedy. What happened to count dankula in Scotland is absolutely disgusting. This is just another sjw crusade getting offended on behalf of other people. Muppets.

    Everything's racist now. Fück off and let us enjoy comedy.


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    #14
    givyjoe
    Registered Users Posts: 3,287 ✭✭✭givyjoe


    Will I Am Not wrote: »
    Should we expect a Scotsman to make a documentary called The Problem With Willie? Or a German, The Problem With Üter?
    People look for the racist angle wherever they can.

    Or the problem with every Irish character they've ever portrayed on the Simpsons! Usually a leprechaun and or drunk!


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    #15
    squonk
    Registered Users Posts: 8,815 ✭✭✭squonk


    I’d say the real driver here is Hari Kondabolu using any old thing to generate a bit of cubtruversy and make a name, and a bit of money, for himself.


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    #16
    statesaver
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,084 ✭✭✭statesaver


    TheDavester wrote: »
    Few weeks ago it was friends, what show next will the sjws get ‘offended’ now by

    What was the story with Friends ?


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    #17
    Atoms for Peace
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,888 ✭✭✭Atoms for Peace


    statesaver wrote: »
    What was the story with Friends ?

    It actually wasn't very funny.


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    #18
    ShooterSF
    Registered Users Posts: 8,824 ✭✭✭ShooterSF


    statesaver wrote: »
    What was the story with Friends ?

    Without hearing or looking into it I'm betting the Monica fat jokes.


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    #19
    Agent Coulson
    Registered Users Posts: 60,460 ✭✭✭✭Agent Coulson


    statesaver wrote: »
    What was the story with Friends ?

    Chandler's Trans Dad and all the jokes about that.
    Millennials watching ‘Friends’ on Netflix shocked by storylines ​

    https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/tv/friends-netflix-sexist-racist-transphobic-problematic-millenials-watch-a8154626.html


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    #20
    yesto24
    Registered Users Posts: 234 ✭✭yesto24


    Will I Am Not wrote: »
    Should we expect a Scotsman to make a documentary called The Problem With Willie? Or a German, The Problem With Üter?
    People look for the racist angle wherever they can.

    No. Because they are white and you know the rest.


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    #21
    RobbingBandit
    Registered Users Posts: 18,107 ✭✭✭✭RobbingBandit


    I don't want to live on this planet anymore.


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    #22
    ShooterSF
    Registered Users Posts: 8,824 ✭✭✭ShooterSF


    Agent Coulson wrote: »
    Chandler's Trans Dad and all the jokes about that.



    https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/tv/friends-netflix-sexist-racist-transphobic-problematic-millenials-watch-a8154626.html

    I don't really get that, if memory serves, the show poked fun at Chandler for his uncomfortableness at the whole situation. It never degraded the father for his unabashed persona. The comedy was in the character flaw of Chandler. Then its like the Major in Fawlty towers is racist where as the show isn't (ish- Manuel probably ages badly too :pac:)


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    #23
    Pseudorandom
    Registered Users Posts: 128 ✭✭Pseudorandom


    Will I Am Not wrote: »
    Should we expect a Scotsman to make a documentary called The Problem With Willie? Or a German, The Problem With Üter?
    People look for the racist angle wherever they can.

    If they did though wouldn't you be more likely to listen to them about it? Like it's a bit nonsensical for a forum full of Irish people to be trying to say whether or not Apu as an Indian-American is racist or not.


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    #24
    PropJoe10
    Registered Users Posts: 5,285 ✭✭✭PropJoe10


    This PC claptrap makes me really angry. As an Irish person, I could probably write a long article about how offensive the portrayal of Mr O'Reilly (David Kelly) in Fawlty Towers is. He represents Irish people as being lazy, incompetent and a general joke.

    Thankfully, though, I've got better things to do with my life.


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    #25
    Duckjob
    Registered Users Posts: 2,858 ✭✭✭Duckjob


    One of my all-time favorite Simpsons moments was Homer blagging his way backstage at a U2 gig in Springfield by sauntering up to the security with a flat cap and a sack over his back and nonchalently saying "Pottttttaayyytoe man"

    Folks get offended waaaaayyyy too easily nowadays.....


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    #26
    Will I Am Not
    Registered Users Posts: 3,495 ✭✭✭Will I Am Not


    Pseudorandom wrote: »
    If they did though wouldn't you be more likely to listen to them about it? Like it's a bit nonsensical for a forum full of Irish people to be trying to say whether or not Apu as an Indian-American is racist or not.

    Not in the slightest.


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    #27
    RobertFoster
    Registered Users Posts: 9,153 ✭✭✭RobertFoster


    RobbingBandit wrote: »
    I don't want to live on this planet anymore.
    Wrong Groening/Cohen cartoon :p


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    #28
    johnnyyesno
    Site Banned Posts: 78 ✭✭johnnyyesno


    statesaver wrote: »
    What was the story with Friends ?

    Sam Boland is of the opinion that it was racist, sexist and transphobic.


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    #29
    jaxxx
    Registered Users Posts: 3,230 ✭✭✭jaxxx


    the-world-is-a-magical-place-full-of-people-waiting-4839214.png


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    #30
    Ruat Caelum
    Registered Users Posts: 87 ✭✭Ruat Caelum


    People seem to be pretty precious about Apu. It's not a big stretch to say he's a problematic character.

    Also it wasn't long ago when half the country seemed to be up in arms about a silly sketch on saturday night live.


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    #31
    Defunkd
    Registered Users Posts: 408 ✭✭Defunkd


    No, it's not racist. However, some people cannot seem to live without finding a miniature crusade to be offended over and attempting to rectifying it by spending hours online. This is the modern version of doing a good deed for the community imo.


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