The 8th Amendment Part 2 - Mod Warning in OP

seachto7 wrote: »

I am living in Dublin, but registered to vote in Limerick.

I am not sure if I have to vote in Limerick or can I vote by post for this?

You'll have to head down to Limerick to vote.

seachto7 wrote: »

I am living in Dublin, but registered to vote in Limerick.

I am not sure if I have to vote in Limerick or can I vote by post for this?

I was thinking of changing my voting address to Dublin, but to be honest, and this is parochial, if there was a general election in 2 months, I would not want to vote for someone in Dublin. I'd rather vote for someone in Limerick. Selfish I know, but that's the way it is.

do any of the following apply to you?

• An Irish diplomat or his/her spouse posted abroad
• A member of the Garda Síochána
• A whole-time member of the Defence Forces.

• Of a physical illness or disability
• You are studying full time at an educational institution in Ireland, which is away from your home address where you are registered
• You are unable to vote at your polling station because of your occupation
• You are unable to vote at your polling station because you are in prison as a result of an order of a court.

if not you cant get a postal vote. the deadline to register for a postal vote is the 28th of this month.

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/government_in_ireland/elections_and_referenda/voting/registering_to_vote.html#leb892

Peintre Celebre wrote: »

I do not believe in the murder of babies, so will be voting no

What do you think we should do with the 170,000 Irish women who have murdered their babies since 1983? Would you like to see a 14 year jail sentence applied, per the Protection of Life during pregnancy act?

Or is that just a line, and you don't want justice for those babies because actually you do not believe that at all?

seachto7 wrote: »

I am living in Dublin, but registered to vote in Limerick.

I am not sure if I have to vote in Limerick or can I vote by post for this?

I was thinking of changing my voting address to Dublin, but to be honest, and this is parochial, if there was a general election in 2 months, I would not want to vote for someone in Dublin. I'd rather vote for someone in Limerick. Selfish I know, but that's the way it is.

You could look at changing your vote to Dublin and then back to Limerick afterwards, but that'd probably still mean a trip to Limerick to get the Garda to stamp the form when you're changing it back. And that's assuming they don't raise some kind of objection due to you not living in the area.

Peintre Celebre wrote: »

I do not believe in the murder of babies, so will be voting no

Either do I, I am voting Yes.

So you want to just keep it as it is?...people having back street abortions, or traveling to England (if they can afford it), or ordering dodgy pills online....perfect solution.

AnneFrank wrote: »

After much thought and alot of consideration, i am voting no.
This is my choice. I do not need to read posters to do this for myself, or have
someone half my age try and convince me otherwise.
I will also not try and convince anyone else to vote my way.
It's a personal choice.Don't be a sheep. Make up your own mind, either way.

AnneFrank wrote: »

Save The 8th.

What a shock.

bruschi wrote: »

However, on the flip side, one thing that is really annoying me on the pro choice side is the complete dismissal of the unborn child as a clump of cells, or more recently that a toe nail has as much life as a fetus.

A large portion of your annoyance can be alleviated however in changing what you think that argument is to what the argument actually is. And while the ACTUAL argument might still annoy you, we can hope it will annoy you less.

The difference is no one is saying that it has as much LIFE as a fetus. They are saying it has as much SENTIENCE as a fetus (that is to say:none).

Imagine a continuum of sentience. At the top end we could place the sentience of the average human male. At the bottom end we could place a rock. Then we could place things on that continuum.

Dolphins and chimps would be up towards our end of it. Dogs further down. The common house fly way down. And so on. Toe nails will be down at the rocks.

The fetus at 12/16 weeks could only be placed down where the toe nails and rocks are. The lights simply are not on, and no one is home. And even the light fittings are still be installed because most of the wiring is not even done yet either.

bruschi wrote: »

Try tell a couple who have gone through a miscarriage that they lost a clump of cells or that it was only like a toenail.

Actually that IS what we do when we work with the trauma of miscarriage at certain stages. Now of course we do not do it as directly or crassly as you describe here. But that is essentially what we work towards through a slower incremental methodology of empathy and understanding and education. We try to alleviate their grief and suffering by divesting them from some of the narratives that are the source of that suffering.

I can go into this more if you like, but simply google scholar papers on grief counselling with respect to miscarriage, and the concepts of "Loss of a baby" versus "Loss of a pregnancy" and the Swanson model. It is well documented.

bruschi wrote: »

I get the reasoning, its more to push away the thoughts of it being a potential life.

Rather than a push away of those thoughts it is an open acknowledgement of them AND their implication. When one realizes it is a potential rather than an actual.... one then is forced to question why we apply the concerns of an actual to a potential. No one is pushing those thoughts away at all therefore.... rather they are following them openly and honestly to their conclusions.

bruschi wrote: »

But it is very disingenuous manner to describe a 12 week fetus. How in one set of circumstances can it be considered a joyous expectant life that people celebrate and share news with, but yet others for argument dismiss it as clumps of cells or a blob.

Quite easily. We are as Terry Pratchett would say not really "Homo Sapien" (the wise ape) but actually "Pans Narrans" the story telling chimp. We parse our life through stories and narratives. And these often run parallel to reality. so we can acknowledge what a fetus ACTUALLY IS in one hand while investing ourselves emotionally in the stories we tell about that fetus in our life narratives. One does not have to forget what a fetus actually is in order to become emotionally invested in what it can become.

But our own emotional investment in what it can become should never be projected on to others. Least of all by forcing them to continue with an unwanted pregnancy that they are not invested in like we are or would be.

AnneFrank wrote: »

Quote from the other thread about people wanting to rip down the no posters, very well made.


realdanbreen
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Quote:


I love the way the YES camp view themselves as liberal and yet want to behave like fascists.

I'd hardly call that a point well made it's just a random statement backed up with no evidence of fascist behaviour, we can all do that!

ELM327 wrote: »

IN fairness the yes campaign is crowdfunded by real irish people as opposed to big american dollars

Sure it is :rolleyes:

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/george-soros-s-amnesty-donation-was-not-for-political-purposes-1.3335146

AnneFrank wrote: »

After much thought and alot of consideration, i am voting no.
This is my choice. I do not need to read posters to do this for myself, or have
someone half my age try and convince me otherwise.
I will also not try and convince anyone else to vote my way.
It's a personal choice.Don't be a sheep. Make up your own mind, either way.

That is entirely your right, but please consider how the 8th affects healthcare for all women in Ireland on a daily basis, and ask yourself if you would like the women in your family to be denied medical attention because they might be pregnant. Even if a woman is not pregnant she can be denied certain procedures such as scans or x-rays because she might be.

AnneFrank wrote: »

Quote from the other thread about people wanting to rip down the no posters, very well made.

Well since we are regurgitating old posts here is one I made earlier on that very topic:

On the marriage referendum there were two groups of disgusting people on EACH side, in the yes camp and the no camp.

The first is that on BOTH sides there were groups going around destroying the posters of the other side. Disgusting people in my view.

On BOTH sides there were also non-intellectuals with no relevant or interesting points to make in the SSM debate and could not string an argument together if their life depended on it..... who instead attempted to score cheap political points by pointing out the poster destroyers on the OTHER side but never their own.

They are even more disgusting and pitiful as people in my view than the poster destroyers themselves.

Anyway...... what were you saying again?

JMNolan wrote: »

Sure it is :rolleyes:

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/george-soros-s-amnesty-donation-was-not-for-political-purposes-1.3335146

So that went to amnesty international.

Nothing to do with the 580k donated to the together for yes campaign.