Proposed suckler cow subsidy

wrangler · 23-01-2018 02:22PM

Bass Reeves wrote: »

There is an article on page 10 of the FI today regarding sucklers. A coupled payment in the order of 200/head would cost about 18% of the basic scheme if the money came from there. Micheal Creed told the IFA AGM lastr week that a 200 euro payment might undermine the BDGP scheme. If he is right then suckler farmers would only get 80/head extra on the cow and lose on the BPS.

The ICSA make the point that it is the larger farmers who would mostly be on better land that are exiting. The map with the reduction accross counties shows this with Waterford -18% andTipp, Kilkenny, Wexfordin the 9-11% mark. But along the western seaboard with the exception of Donegal the figures are sub 5%.

As for the meeting in Offaly I have been at one or two like that inside and outside farming. Usually lads that are vocal are not willing to change. It can be at a trade union meeting or a farmers meeting.

On a side note was parked outside a shed this morning filled with AA bullocks in the 650-700kg mark. On adlib ration and silage some already over fat. IMO these cattle should have been killed two weeks ago. Price of 10c/kg will have cost him 35/head and on any he loses AA bonus another 50-70/head as well as the over fat penalty.. Lads finishing cattle out of sheds are again getting it in the back of the neck. It is immaterial what breed they are.

That's the point they don't want to change, they want to be able to stay at what they're at.
They had huge support from O'Cuiv and marian Harkin the last time.
A lot would agree with the mart manager, the quality of cattle is deteriorating rapidly, If the northern buyers are losing interest, it mightn't be long until other customers lose interest

Bass Reeves · 23-01-2018 03:42PM

wrangler wrote: »

That's the point they don't want to change, they want to be able to stay at what they're at.
They had huge support from O'Cuiv and marian Harkin the last time.
A lot would agree with the mart manager, the quality of cattle is deteriorating rapidly, If the northern buyers are losing interest, it mightn't be long until other customers lose interest

A lot of reason why the so called quality of cattle is deteriorating is down to a number of factors. Yes Dairy farmers using easy calving bulls is an issue. But a lot of the issues are related to factory price, cost of feeding and what happens to calves after birth

Dairy farmers are quicker to off load calves than before because of bigger herds they want to reduce disease risk. If you register on line you can have the blue card within days of birth and calf can be at mart within a week of birth. While this may not happen a lot of calves are sold at 10-14 days of age. For all dairy farmers faults most were very good at rearing calves. Becasue of this calves are more suseptible to disease at an earlier stage of life ans some lads that rear calves should never be left near them.

The cost of feeding is becoming horrendus so farmers are more inclined to slaughter cattle if a price drop is imminent. The factory's insistance on age limits makes the slaughter of cattle at 30 and 36 months a priority so consideing carrying a 3 year old poorer quality store back to grass is lunancy even though feeding him may be lunancy as well so he may be slaughtered at 30-34 months off grass in an underfit condition.

The main reason Northern buyers are not interested is that cattle from down here are considered nomad cattle and they get a reduced price unless processors are short. Therefore I imagine that most are unwilling to buy unless they have acontract in place

Willfarman · 23-01-2018 06:30PM

wrangler wrote: »

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

Obviously the guy that proposed the €300, has haggled before. Go high and settle low, as they say.

Yes, I've come up against him before......we had very different agendas in the last CAP reform.....often locked horns, he was flying the flag for flatrate subs.
Mightn't oppose him as much on his new quest

The pair of ye should lay off the viagra! But what would his new quest do for you rangler? Believe it or not it would be great news for me. The more store cattle for sale the easier it is for me to buy value. No matter what Larry does to me I just do my best to pass it down the line..

wrangler · 23-01-2018 07:09PM

Willfarman wrote: »

The pair of ye should lay off the viagra! But what would his new quest do for you rangler? Believe it or not it would be great news for me. The more store cattle for sale the easier it is for me to buy value. No matter what Larry does to me I just do my best to pass it down the line..

As opposed to those that just keep the hand up. some spend the profit before the cattle leave the ring
No difference to me, but sure we like to keep everyone in the market for land.
This celtic tiger of dairying mightn't last

Cattlepen · 23-01-2018 08:19PM

wrangler wrote: »

I've had a few bad experiences on a lane that there was never houses and now there's eight, couldn't get one crowd to keep in their dogs in until eventually they did harm to inlamb ewes.
Now they're complaining about dirt on the road, FFS, Wait till the guy that has my land rented starts to draw slurry. Anyway not my problem now but you see what I mean

Oh I know exactly where your coming from. Had it all myself too. It’s not easy dealing with them

Willfarman · 23-01-2018 09:19PM

Are you letting to the highest bidder or the best candidate? A farm near me here let to a great farming family that used to own it. Ditches trimmed. Wire on all bounds. Tidy.
Auctioneer pushed for more money and let a new man in last year the few extra bob wouldn't come close to rectifying the state of the place! I can't understand landowners mindset.

Mooooo · 23-01-2018 09:26PM

Perhaps bufords post should be in this thread

Buford T. Justice V wrote: »

Interesting tweet about the changes in Irish Ag since 1983.

https://twitter.com/MaryDelaneyKK/status/955538487293464576

Buford T. Justice XIX · 23-01-2018 09:31PM

Mooooo wrote: »

Perhaps bufords post should be in this thread

Done.
https://twitter.com/MaryDelaneyKK/status/955538487293464576

wrangler · 23-01-2018 10:15PM

Willfarman wrote: »

Are you letting to the highest bidder or the best candidate? A farm near me here let to a great farming family that used to own it. Ditches trimmed. Wire on all bounds. Tidy.
Auctioneer pushed for more money and let a new man in last year the few extra bob wouldn't come close to rectifying the state of the place! I can't understand landowners mindset.

It was the highest bidders, The guy that's in since april seems to be alright, has the whole place reseeded and ready to go, the tenants starting now are good farmers but you never know.
If I'm still here in ten years, I'll sell it if it's run down, the tenants are young enough to go again if they work out.

patsy_mccabe · 24-01-2018 06:36PM

So the general consensus would be that farmers are opposed to a suckler cow subsidy.

Grueller · 24-01-2018 08:52PM

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

So the general consensus would be that farmers are opposed to a suckler cow subsidy.

Now now. I have 70ish of the yokes so don't assume that at all.

wrangler · 24-01-2018 09:02PM

Grueller wrote: »

Now now. I have 70ish of the yokes so don't assume that at all.

Nearly 10000 signatures on the petition too, so we're in good company

Say my name · 24-01-2018 09:11PM

With France possibly taking back the Turkey trade in the future and the future of suckler cows in Ireland now protected.

Will we see an increase in the IFA's popularity and perhaps tar barrels back out in front of the meat factories in 2 years time?

Asking for a friend.

Willfarman · 24-01-2018 09:55PM

You convinced me Rangler. I signed it 26 times! How many did you sign? Can't beat times of overproduction oversupply for to make money in a trading system...myself and bass will be bating the ****e out of each other to rent your land!

wrangler · 24-01-2018 10:25PM

Say my name wrote: »

With France possibly taking back the Turkey trade in the future and the future of suckler cows in Ireland now protected.

Will we see an increase in the IFA's popularity and perhaps tar barrels back out in front of the meat factories in 2 years time?

Asking for a friend.

I stood down from two positions in IFA because I don't agree with standing at gates. Every time I got an interesting job in the organisation , that Pathetic racket started.
Forgive me if I don't show any interest in beef price, hope Larry keeps expanding

Willfarman · 25-01-2018 12:25AM

http://www.agriland.ie/farming-news/category/beef/

Never wrestle with pigs · 25-01-2018 01:36AM

Willfarman wrote: »

http://www.agriland.ie/farming-news/category/beef/

Some people changing to dairy, some getting out and renting to dairy lads. Some getting into sheep and icbf putting more focus on getting rid of dead wood.

Bass Reeves · 25-01-2018 03:32PM

Just looking at world cattle prices in the FJ. France the bastion for farmers with its suckler cow has the lowest cattle price in the EU with the exception of Poland and Netherlands.. It is 30c/kg behind us or 120 euro on a 400kg carcasses

wrangler · 25-01-2018 03:46PM

Bass Reeves wrote: »

Just looking at world cattle prices in the FJ. France the bastion for farmers with its suckler cow has the lowest cattle price in the EU with the exception of Poland and Netherlands.. It is 30c/kg behind us or 120 euro on a 400kg carcasses

Anytime I was in France, the Irish beef price was ahead of the french price,
And the french lamb price a €1/kg more

Bass Reeves · 25-01-2018 03:57PM

wrangler wrote: »

Anytime I was in France, the Irish beef price was ahead of the french price,
And the french lamb price a €1/kg more

At present according to the rag there R3 steer 3.62/kg. It has hovered there for the last 12 months as Italian and German young bull prices increased to 4.15/kg

Who2 · 25-01-2018 07:15PM

If there beef price is way behind most of the time how does the culls work into 2-3 k over there?

mayota · 27-01-2018 06:39PM

Scheme introduced in 1964 to increase national suckler herd. £15 per heifer.

Who2 · 27-01-2018 06:59PM

mayota wrote: »

Scheme introduced in 1964 to increase national suckler herd. £15 per heifer.

By chance I found a note pad today that belonged to my grandfather. He used to have a bull that would be for hire it was from 1959-64. I went down through the names and he had paid and unpaid beside them, it was a dread to see the families who hadn’t paid and the worst part being there grandchildren and children would be very similar today. Every cow that was brought to him had a name. I found similar files on agri grants and such too so I must find them and post them up.

patsy_mccabe · 27-01-2018 07:01PM

You can sign online;
https://www.change.org/p/save-our-sucklers-open-letter-from-the-readers-of-the-irish-farmers-journal-saveoursucklers

mayota · 27-01-2018 07:42PM

Who2 wrote: »

By chance I found a note pad today that belonged to my grandfather. He used to have a bull that would be for hire it was from 1959-64. I went down through the names and he had paid and unpaid beside them, it was a dread to see the families who hadn’t paid and the worst part being there grandchildren and children would be very similar today. Every cow that was brought to him had a name. I found similar files on agri grants and such too so I must find them and post them up.

Saw a notebook that Dad had in 1985 of names and amounts of pit silage sold. Severe fodder shortage but we were totally destocked due to TB.

Bass Reeves · 27-01-2018 08:16PM

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

You can sign online;
https://www.change.org/p/save-our-sucklers-open-letter-from-the-readers-of-the-irish-farmers-journal-saveoursucklers

If you watch it for a while you will see no movement and often then you will see 3-5 added together. I imagine that someone sign's for themselves and the rest of the family. So you could divide total number by 3-4 to get a realistic number taht is supporting it.

charolais0153 · 27-01-2018 08:29PM

Bass Reeves wrote: »

If you watch it for a while you will see no movement and often then you will see 3-5 added together. I imagine that someone sign's for themselves and the rest of the family. So you could divide total number by 3-4 to get a realistic number taht is supporting it.

Or else it justs updates every few seconds?

charolais0153 · 27-01-2018 08:32PM

You have to put your name and email address on it. Only one signing per email address is allowed. How are they signing it 4 times in a split second as u are saying?

grassroot1 · 27-01-2018 08:41PM

mayota wrote: »

Scheme introduced in 1964 to increase national suckler herd. £15 per heifer.

Worth 335 euro in today's money corrected for inflation

Willfarman · 27-01-2018 08:44PM

charolais0153 wrote: »

You have to put your name and email address on it. Only one signing per email address is allowed. How are they signing it 4 times in a split second as u are saying?

Could you just invent an email.? Do you have to verify your signing via email?

Proposed suckler cow subsidy

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