Drunk driver gets community service after killing man and severely injuring two Garda

old_aussie · 18-01-2018 09:46PM

I'd get depressed, get pissed and then "accidently" run the cnut over and at a speed that would cripple him for life.

240 hrs community service, and a fine, I could wear that.

What he did was no different to manslaughter!

Guy:Incognito · 18-01-2018 09:48PM

suicide_circus wrote: »

With an average inmate cost of $32,000 per annum it will set the tax payer back $352,000 to keep that person in the clink for 11 years.

If we're locking people up based on cost we may aswell close the prisons.

Good job that's not how we decide. Break laws , go to prison. I'm happy enough for My taxes to be spent on loss making prison sentences. Much like how the hospitals don't make money if you go in having a heart attack.

Pinch Flat · 18-01-2018 09:48PM

And in other news someone gets 6 years for a garlic / apple tax inportation scam

dense · 18-01-2018 09:51PM

Two things struck me, one, as long as I'm reading it correctly, the Garda car was stopped/parked on the wrong side of the road on a sweeping bend.

Two, it had blue flashing lights on.

Did the Guards have to be positioned on the wrong side of a sweeping bend, was the reason for doing so explained?

Anytime I've seen blue flashing lights at night, they are intensely bright, almost blinding, so much so that they can cause one to be unable to determine exactly where it is and where you are in relation to it.

If that sounds like I'm excusing the drunk driver I'm not, those blue lights are so bright they usually reflect off anything in the vicinity (trees, hedges, signs) without seeing them directly.

Guy:Incognito · 18-01-2018 09:52PM

Snickers Man wrote: »

Five times over the legal limit? That's more than " a few pints supped".

Give the Healy Raes their due: they're not asking for people to be allowed drive while pissed out of their minds. They just want a more reasonable drink driving limit.

As do I.

The "new" proposed legislation would have had no effect on this guy's behaviour. He was just as illegal under the old laws (even the very old 80mg limit laws which we should bring back IMHO) as he would be under the new.

There's no advantage to society or individuals by allowing them to drink drive. The best case scenario is that they don't hit someone. That's not a risk worth taking. They can go to the pub and not drink, or go do something else.they don't need to go to the pub.

18-01-2018 09:57PM

dense wrote: »

Did the Guards have to be positioned on the wrong side of a sweeping bend, was the reason for doing so explained?.

In fairness to the Gardai, they were dealing with a man crawling on the road in dark clothes, presumably they had to pull in wherever they saw him and simply did not have the time to go look for a more appropriate place to pull in.

Guy:Incognito · 18-01-2018 09:58PM

dense wrote: »

Did the Guards have to be positioned on the wrong side of a sweeping bend, was the reason for doing so explained?

Ay.

The old man was crawling on his hands and knees . They pulled in behind him.

"He was down on on the ground on his hands and knees, on the hard shoulder about 1.5km on the Galway side of Ardrahan.

The patrol car pulled in on the hard shoulder, three to four meters behind Liam McDonnell, facing in the direction of oncoming traf"

They were in the hard shoulder, not in the lane of traffic.

BattleCorp · 18-01-2018 10:28PM

dense wrote: »

If that sounds like I'm excusing the drunk driver I'm not, those blue lights are so bright they usually reflect off anything in the vicinity (trees, hedges, signs) without seeing them directly.

Usually when non-drunk people see flashing blue lights they slow down almost to the point of stopping.

Obviously this doesn't apply to scuttered people as they plough straight ahead regardless.

suicide_circus · 18-01-2018 10:30PM

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

If we're locking people up based on cost we may aswell close the prisons.

Good job that's not how we decide. Break laws , go to prison. I'm happy enough for My taxes to be spent on loss making prison sentences. Much like how the hospitals don't make money if you go in having a heart attack.

Oh I agree I'm just pricing it

18-01-2018 10:54PM

THe guards were able to see the old man crawling on the ground in the dark and were able to stop safely

The drunk driver was unable to see the old man, two guards and their police car with lights on

The difference was he was drunk

dense · 18-01-2018 10:55PM

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

The old man was crawling on his hands and knees . They pulled in behind him.

"He was down on on the ground on his hands and knees, on the hard shoulder about 1.5km on the Galway side of Ardrahan.

The patrol car pulled in on the hard shoulder, three to four meters behind Liam McDonnell, facing in the direction of oncoming traf"

They were in the hard shoulder, not in the lane of traffic.

Thanks, missed the part about the hard shoulder

But stopped, with dipped headlights on, which, on the "wrong side of the road" means they had the potential to dazzle oncoming traffic as dipped lights beam to the left, towards oncoming traffic.

Parking lights would have been better, but sadly, hindsight is a great thing.

The Journal quotes the judge as almost excusing Nestor for "facing a (garda) car on the wrong side of the road".

KwackerJack · 18-01-2018 11:04PM

Disgraceful.......

In this country your actually better of killing someone rather than injuring them. If you injure them they can claim a whole host of life changing situations and because of that you get many years in prison but if their dead sure they don't know they are dead so have a fine and go pick up some papers on the street.

The whole irish leagl system needs an over haul

Danjamin1 · 18-01-2018 11:36PM

seamus wrote: »

Assuming the facts given in the report are accurate, does the man described in report seem to you to now pose a danger to the rest of society?

Take it as fact that he no longer drinks, is remorseful to the point of depression, and is disqualified from driving - does he now pose a danger to the public?

With respect though, that doesn't answer my question about whether jailing him serves any purpose. What good would come of it?

Yes, I believe he does pose a threat. There is nothing stopping him from relapsing to drink despite currently being off it. There’s nothing stopping him driving a car without a licence & taking the risk of getting caught should he so choose. There’s essentially nothing stopping him from drink driving again. A custodial sentence would see to that. I know that’s hypothetical, but currently so is the idea that he doesn’t pose a risk. He’s equally as likely to reoffend as he is not to.

Guy:Incognito · 18-01-2018 11:39PM

Pinch Flat wrote: »

Seems like dodgy importing of garlic / apples is a more serious crime in this country

Seems like youre going to keep at that till you get a reply .

punisher5112 · 18-01-2018 11:48PM

dense wrote: »

Two things struck me, one, as long as I'm reading it correctly, the Garda car was stopped/parked on the wrong side of the road on a sweeping bend.

Two, it had blue flashing lights on.

Did the Guards have to be positioned on the wrong side of a sweeping bend, was the reason for doing so explained?

Anytime I've seen blue flashing lights at night, they are intensely bright, almost blinding, so much so that they can cause one to be unable to determine exactly where it is and where you are in relation to it.

If that sounds like I'm excusing the drunk driver I'm not, those blue lights are so bright they usually reflect off anything in the vicinity (trees, hedges, signs) without seeing them directly.

They used the vehicle to illuminate where they found the man.

Dipped beams or not you don't drive at speed into people or a vehicle....

Blue lights been bright is exactly for the reason you made... It's to be seen that's why they are fitted across the world.

Blue lights or any beacon should be taken seriously and one should be prepared to stop.

Sam Quentin · 19-01-2018 12:16AM

Imagine if it had been some poor young fella or girl who had only started driving and was driving a wee bit exuberantly and a little bit excessive listening to their favourite tunes and with not a worry in the world!?
Well I bet he/she would have got a jail sentence and a lengthy ban...
I personally would feel a little sorry for a young person in that position...

Pinch Flat · 19-01-2018 12:24AM

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

Seems like youre going to keep at that till you get a reply .

Ah well, got one anyway.

One eyed Jack · 19-01-2018 12:31AM

Sam Quentin wrote: »

Imagine if it had been some poor young fella or girl who had only started driving and was driving a wee bit exuberantly and a little bit excessive listening to their favourite tunes and with not a worry in the world!?
Well I bet he/she would have got a jail sentence and a lengthy ban...
I personally would feel a little sorry for a young person in that position...

Are these sorts of hypotheticals and comparisons of any use really? It would be an entirely different case then surely with an entirely different set of circumstances.

I can understand the Judges ruling in this case as I don't think a custodial sentence would have served the interests of justice. I think the facts of the case as they are, and the consequences will be something which Adrian Nestor will have to live with for the rest of his life. Personally, I see that as punishment enough, as opposed to seeking retribution, which I don't think could ever be said to be acting in the interests of seeing justice done.

sentient_6 · 19-01-2018 12:36AM

seamus wrote: »

His victim's family even asked for mercy

Absolutely not true. One single person does not define a family.

Iv thought alot about posting in this thread as I'm close to the situation. Take what you will from the above.

Nermal · 19-01-2018 01:00AM

One eyed Jack wrote: »

Personally, I see that as punishment enough, as opposed to seeking retribution, which I don't think could ever be said to be acting in the interests of seeing justice done.

Jailing is punishment, not retribution. There's a difference.

His current mental state is irrelevant.

dense · 19-01-2018 01:01AM

punisher5112 wrote: »

They used the vehicle to illuminate where they found the man.

Dipped beams or not you don't drive at speed into people or a vehicle....

Blue lights been bright is exactly for the reason you made... It's to be seen that's why they are fitted across the world.

Blue lights or any beacon should be taken seriously and one should be prepared to stop.

They should of course, and I thought he should have seen them, especially if it was on an unlit road. Blue stands out for miles. Being pissèd isn't an excuse.

Would you agree that modern blue lights are of such intensity that they can be blinding, particularly at night time until the eyes have a chance to become accustomed to them? IMO they sometimes tend to obliterate what's in front of them depending on the angle you approach.

One eyed Jack · 19-01-2018 01:04AM

Nermal wrote: »

Jailing is punishment, not retribution. There's a difference.

His current mental state is irrelevant.

His mental state clearly wasn't an irrelevant consideration to the Judge in this case in determining sentencing.

Chrongen · 19-01-2018 01:05AM

c.p.w.g.w wrote: »

Depression being used again to get away with murder

It wasn't murder.

While I don't trvialise what this guy has done i don't exaggerate it either.

STB. · 19-01-2018 01:23AM

KwackerJack wrote: »

Disgraceful.......

The whole irish legal system needs an over haul

It certainly does. Whoever that judge is needs to be removed immediately.

Nowhere should the discretion exist in drink driving cases that results in someones elses death vary from a 10 year custodial sentence down to 240 hours community service. Thats some bloody range of discretion.

It will be appealed.

Irish Guitarist · 19-01-2018 01:24AM

A brief victim impact statement from Mr McDonnell’s ex-wife stated that she was not looking for anything except clemency for Nestor’s young family, as jail would not help bring Liam back.

That kind of forgiveness is admirable and all but all it's doing is telling him he can get away with drunkenly mowing down people. Even if you don't believe he should be punished he should at the very least be locked up to protect the public.

Considering he avoided a jail sentence after actually killing someone why would he pay any attention to his licence being banned? He knows all that's going to happen to him is he'll get another slap on the wrist.

He became anxious and depressed and turned to alcohol.

What a ridiculous defence. He was so remorseful after his bout of drunk driving that he turned to alcohol.

dreamers75 · 19-01-2018 02:07AM

God bless the Healy Raes, this is what they are fighting for.

lalababa · 19-01-2018 03:58AM

dreamers75 wrote: »

God bless the Healy Raes, this is what they are fighting for.

Yer man was tested over 5 times the legal limit, nearly 3and1/2 times the old limit of .08 bac. And we don't know what time after the accident he was tested.
Has nothing got to do Healy Rae not wanting the limit further reduced. The limit as it is is not very well enforced . And the judge is sending the wrong message. Should be a a few years inside and a lifetime ban.

lalababa · 19-01-2018 04:12AM

Hector Bellend wrote: »

In this day and age there is no Justification for driving with any amount of alcohol in your system. Simply put there should be a zero limit.

You cannot defend the indefensible.

It's time we start throwing the book at people like this. We need stiffer and more meaningful sentences to reflect the gravity of these offences.

Simply put indeed! But completely indefensible. Zero limit!- he was indeed bellended.

twowheelsonly · 19-01-2018 05:58AM

dense wrote: »

Two things struck me, one, as long as I'm reading it correctly, the Garda car was stopped/parked on the wrong side of the road on a sweeping bend.

Two, it had blue flashing lights on.

Did the Guards have to be positioned on the wrong side of a sweeping bend, was the reason for doing so explained?

Anytime I've seen blue flashing lights at night, they are intensely bright, almost blinding, so much so that they can cause one to be unable to determine exactly where it is and where you are in relation to it.

If that sounds like I'm excusing the drunk driver I'm not, those blue lights are so bright they usually reflect off anything in the vicinity (trees, hedges, signs) without seeing them directly.

It's been stated already but blue lights make every reasonable person slow down, sometimes to a crawl just to be nosey and see what's going on. Someone with 3 or 4 pints might even turn around and head the other direction. You'd have to be in a right state to continue to drive at speed.

Bearing in mind that he managed to blow Mr McDonnell into a field and blow the two Gardai further up along the road this was no gentle inattentive sideswipe.

Another thing that struck me, and it may be totally irrelevant, is that the V.I.S. was described as being from Mr McDonnells ex-wife - not his widow or his children.

Absolutely 100% that he should have been jailed. There's people doing time for a whole lot less. Is it a deterrent ? It most certainly is to those close to him, close to the victims or in any other way close to the case. I would think that his wife / kids / friends / neighbours /drinking buddies would all think twice about it if he got 4 or 5 years in jail plus a lifetime ban.

ThinkProgress · 19-01-2018 08:04AM

With all the talk of automated cars and smart cars etc... you would think it would be easy enough to fit our current vehicles with alcohol and drug testing technology, so that it would be basically impossible to even start up your car if you were that inebriated??

With regards to this case, I think this man should have been given some kind of custodial sentence... even if it was just 6 - 12 months. Being forced to sit in prison, would give him time to reflect on the seriousness of his crime! (if nothing else)

3 year driving ban is a joke as well...

That sentence does nothing, except serve to cheapen all the lives that he tore apart that night.

And then he has the nerve to talk about his own subsequent depression and turning back to alcohol!!?? (in a court case where his alcohol consumption caused death and serious injury!! FFS...) :mad:

Drunk driver gets community service after killing man and severely injuring two Garda

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