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Minimum alcohol pricing is nigh

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    #1472
    KrustyUCC
    Registered Users Posts: 6,034 ✭✭✭KrustyUCC


    Perlenbacher

    €11.61 a pack so 59.25% increase thanks to the government

    Alternatively that 223.39% higher than Portugal

    It was already 103% higher than Portugal

    Funny how the Independent editorial is on about cheap drink. Drink in this country is not now nor has been cheap.


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    #1473
    elperello
    Registered Users Posts: 14,504 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    Reputable Rog wrote: »
    From the Irish Independent 10/11/17
    One of the critical reasons why the currency of politics is so devalued in the public mind is that what is right is too often being sacrificed for what is convenient.
    The flip-flopping by Health Minister Simon Harris on the issue of introducing a new law to outlaw cheap drink is just the latest cynical side-step to avoid doing something that is responsible, but unpopular.

    We have become used to governments kicking the can down the road metaphorically; now it has done so literally as the much-heralded introduction of minimum pricing on tins and bottles of beer is put on hold indefinitely.
    The new prices were supposed to ban the selling in leading supermarkets of beer for less than €1.

    Apparently Mr Harris wants to synchronise the move with price hikes in the North to avoid a rush of sales over the Border.

    All one can say is good luck with that, minister. Not only is there no government in Belfast, the one in London is hanging on by a slender thread.

    The idea that there is time or appetite to introduce the kind of increases to bridge the disparity between alcohol prices here and in the UK, is as hard to swallow as cheap lager.

    This will not happen any time soon, and it is difficult not to conclude that the minister has simply bottled it.

    This is totally unacceptable. Alcohol causes twice as many deaths as all other drugs combined in this country.

    Some argue that we make our choices, but in the end it is our choices that make us.

    Avoiding tackling the problem of excessive drinking here has to be confronted sooner or later. It is hugely disappointing that Mr Harris has all too predictably opted for later.

    Well if it does come in and you find yourself needing to adjust your budget to be able to continue enjoying a few drinks at home here is a tip.

    Cut out the Indo 5 days a week and save a handy tenner.
    If you buy the IT (which is equally enthusiastic about the bill) rinse and repeat.


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    #1474
    Sebastian Dangerfield
    Registered Users Posts: 1,796 ✭✭✭Sebastian Dangerfield


    Leroy42 wrote: »
    This was the laziest attempt, clearly born out of an attempt to subsidise the pub trade, to try to effect change. There are so many ways that we can tackle this significant problem in our society. We have shown ourselves capable of significant change in attitudes and outcomes over the years. The smoking ban, plastic bag levy, seatbelts etc. Put together a coherent case, explain the rationale and bring everyone (or the majority) with you. Be prepared to debate against those that disagree, but have the facts. Simply saying that "something must be done" is not enough.

    I agree that we do have issues with drink in the country - particularly with young people in smaller towns - but MUP is a wolf in sheeps clothing. It's aimed at protecting the pub trade, nothing else.

    My father is an alcoholic, now in a home with what they describe as alcohol induced dementia. He is probably the exact outcome the government claim they are aiming to prevent. One problem - he rarely drank at home, save for his 4 cans on a Sunday morning waiting for the pubs to open.

    I don't have the answer, but I'm certain MUP isn't it. If they're really serious about it they should try to tackle the industry as a whole, and set an example by replacing the Dail bar with a coffee shop. If the home isnt a place for drinking, why is the workplace?

    To be clear, I love a drink, I enjoy pubs, and I enjoy a drink at home at family events etc. If the government have a creative way to try to deal with whatever issues they claim exist, I'd be open to that. But this isnt it.


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    #1475
    elperello
    Registered Users Posts: 14,504 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    KrustyUCC wrote: »
    Perlenbacher

    €11.61 a pack so 59.25% increase thanks to the government

    Alternatively that 223.39% higher than Portugal

    It was already 103% higher than Portugal

    Funny how the Independent editorial is on about cheap drink. Drink in this country is not now nor has been cheap.

    We really are the pixie heads of Europe


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    #1476
    Gerrup Outta Dat!
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 492 ✭✭Gerrup Outta Dat!


    Just a technical question. If I buy (and only buy) a 6 pack of Perlenbacher for €11.61 and pay by card, the till will round down to €11.60. Will Lidl be charged with below cost selling? :p


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    #1477
    ohnonotgmail
    Registered Users Posts: 40,275 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    Gerrup Outta Dat! wrote: »
    Just a technical question. If I buy (and only buy) a 6 pack of Perlenbacher for €11.61 and pay by card, the till will round down to €11.60. Will Lidl be charged with below cost selling? :p


    if you pay by card then rounding does not apply.


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    #1478
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 25,611 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Gerrup Outta Dat! wrote: »
    Just a technical question. If I buy (and only buy) a 6 pack of Perlenbacher for €11.61 and pay by card, the till will round down to €11.60. Will Lidl be charged with below cost selling? :p

    You have it the wrong way around, it doesn't round for cards. ;)


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    #1479
    BENDYBINN
    Registered Users Posts: 1,829 ✭✭✭BENDYBINN


    Am I correct in saying all the top brands like Guinness Heineken Budweiser ect will remain the same price but their cheaper competitors will
    almost double in price?
    That's some coup for the big boys!They must be on their knees laughing!


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    #1480
    Dr Crayfish
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,960 ✭✭✭Dr Crayfish


    Anyway, it's over now, they're going to charge us a fortune for cans. I don't even see the point in discussing it any more we'll just suck it up like we do everything else.


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    #1481
    Gerrup Outta Dat!
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 492 ✭✭Gerrup Outta Dat!


    ohnonotgmail wrote: »
    if you pay by card then rounding does not apply.
    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    You have it the wrong way around, it doesn't round for cards. ;)

    Repeat the question with cash then :p


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    #1482
    VinLieger
    Registered Users Posts: 17,759 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    BENDYBINN wrote: »
    Am I correct in saying all the top brands like Guinness Heineken Budweiser ect will remain the same price but their cheaper competitors will
    almost double in price?
    That's some coup for the big boys!They must be on their knees laughing!

    Heineken have form for not wanting their beer priced the same as "lesser, non premium" brands, expect increases across the board


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    #1483
    Sebastian Dangerfield
    Registered Users Posts: 1,796 ✭✭✭Sebastian Dangerfield


    BENDYBINN wrote: »
    Am I correct in saying all the top brands like Guinness Heineken Budweiser ect will remain the same price but their cheaper competitors will
    almost double in price?
    That's some coup for the big boys!They must be on their knees laughing!

    Or else their cheaper competitors will go up, and they'll say "our brand is much more superior, throw 20% on to reflect that"


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    #1484
    Leroy42
    Registered Users Posts: 15,515 ✭✭✭✭Leroy42


    Dr Crayfish wrote: »
    Anyway, it's over now, they're going to charge us a fortune for cans. I don't even see the point in discussing it any more we'll just suck it up like we do everything else.

    Its over (for now), but how are they going to charge us a fortune for cans?

    This bill is not going through anytime soon.


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    #1485
    Gerrup Outta Dat!
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 492 ✭✭Gerrup Outta Dat!


    VinLieger wrote: »
    Heineken have form for not wanting their beer priced the same as "lesser, non premium" brands, expect increases across the board

    Will the likes of Wetherspoons not take a case to the European courts?

    What are the chances of the vintners pulling us kicking and screaming out of the EU to escape fair market regulations?


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    #1486
    Sebastian Dangerfield
    Registered Users Posts: 1,796 ✭✭✭Sebastian Dangerfield


    Funny how Leo is apparently so driven on getting this bill through due to concern over the health of irish people.

    Yet he celebrated becoming Taoiseach at a party in Copper Face Jacks, the place that embodies binge drinking more than any other in Ireland.


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    #1487
    Dr Crayfish
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,960 ✭✭✭Dr Crayfish


    Leroy42 wrote: »
    Its over (for now), but how are they going to charge us a fortune for cans?

    This bill is not going through anytime soon.

    The price of booze is going to go up, even though it's already really expensive, if my understanding is correct


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    #1488
    ohnonotgmail
    Registered Users Posts: 40,275 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    Gerrup Outta Dat! wrote: »
    Will the likes of Wetherspoons not take a case to the European courts?

    What are the chances of the vintners pulling us kicking and screaming out of the EU to escape fair market regulations?


    why would they? MUP wont affect pub pricing. even the cheapest pints in wetherspoons are above MUP.


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    #1489
    Ciaran_B
    Users Awaiting Email Confirmation Posts: 1,518 ✭✭✭Ciaran_B


    Gerrup Outta Dat! wrote: »
    Will the likes of Wetherspoons not take a case to the European courts?

    What are the chances of the vintners pulling us kicking and screaming out of the EU to escape fair market regulations?

    The irony of the aggressively pro-Brexit Wetherspoons going to a European court would be too much.


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    #1490
    BENDYBINN
    Registered Users Posts: 1,829 ✭✭✭BENDYBINN


    Like the greens this horrible,out of touch Fine Gael government will be kicked to touch in the next election
    They are livin in a different world.


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    #1491
    Leroy42
    Registered Users Posts: 15,515 ✭✭✭✭Leroy42


    Sebastian Dangerfield wrote: »
    My father is an alcoholic, now in a home with what they describe as alcohol induced dementia. He is probably the exact outcome the government claim they are aiming to prevent. One problem - he rarely drank at home, save for his 4 cans on a Sunday morning waiting for the pubs to open.

    Not meaning to drag your father into it, but therein lies a massive issue. I have a neighbour who is an alcoholic, and spends all his time in the pub.

    We are being told that pubs are the place to drink, yet over the years pubs have shown themselves unwilling/unable to deal with a clearly struggling person.

    The pub knows he has a problem, but continue to take his money. So why would we think that a company that needs people to continue to drink should be in charge of drink? Talk about a vested interest. Vintners have no record of putting peoples care in front of profits (and I don't blame them for that, I only say it as pubs seem to be being seen as the safest place to drink!

    Now you'll get the odd story of a publican turning away people, but its the exception.


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    #1492
    Leroy42
    Registered Users Posts: 15,515 ✭✭✭✭Leroy42


    Dr Crayfish wrote: »
    The price of booze is going to go up, even though it's already really expensive, if my understanding is correct

    But the bill is not going through. They are stalling it until NI comes on board


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    #1493
    VinLieger
    Registered Users Posts: 17,759 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    Gerrup Outta Dat! wrote: »
    Will the likes of Wetherspoons not take a case to the European courts?

    What are the chances of the vintners pulling us kicking and screaming out of the EU to escape fair market regulations?

    Wetherspoons have no reason to do anything.

    We have to wait and see if the Scottish Supreme court appeal comes of anything to see if the EU can help out.

    And even if the Scottish court gives the thumbs up there's scope for it to be appealed here due to how the EUCJ worded their judgement


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    #1494
    Dr Crayfish
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,960 ✭✭✭Dr Crayfish


    Leroy42 wrote: »
    But the bill is not going through. They are stalling it until NI comes on board

    Have they said this?


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    #1495
    KrustyUCC
    Registered Users Posts: 6,034 ✭✭✭KrustyUCC


    Sebastian Dangerfield wrote: »
    Or else their cheaper competitors will go up, and they'll say "our brand is much more superior, throw 20% on to reflect that"

    Yup the big boys will also increase price to maintain their 'premium branding'

    I can see Guiness being happy with only a 8c difference MUP between Guiness and Dutch Gold

    In theory all whiskey/vodka etc that is the same percentage and volume should have equal price now

    700ml*40% for whiskey * .789 *.10 = 22.09

    Jameson will of course increase their price instead of being the same price as Lidl, Aldi or Tesco whiskeys


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    #1496
    SEPT 23 1989
    Registered Users Posts: 43,028 ✭✭✭✭SEPT 23 1989


    Sebastian Dangerfield wrote: »
    Funny how Leo is apparently so driven on getting this bill through due to concern over the health of irish people.

    .

    anytime the state starts getting concerned about the health and safety of its citizens it costs the people money


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    #1497
    VinLieger
    Registered Users Posts: 17,759 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    Dont forgot the moronic advertising restrictions



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    #1498
    McMurphy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,365 ✭✭✭✭McMurphy


    Dr Crayfish wrote: »
    Anyway, it's over now, they're going to charge us a fortune for cans. I don't even see the point in discussing it any more we'll just suck it up like we do everything else.

    But they have now shifted their position back to revenue streams away from health (sniggers).

    They've expressed they don't want to introduce this bill until they get cross border price fixing.

    With the Dupers and SF unable to agree the time of day up North, and the Westminster regime hanging in there by a thread, this bills introduction is no further forward now than it ever was.


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    #1499
    howyanow
    Registered Users Posts: 445 ✭✭howyanow


    I disagree, the "drinking problems" are myths from the government.
    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    You have it the wrong way around, it doesn't round for cards. ;)

    Also you are purchasing that product at it's retail price, not it's cost price which is the price that the retailer is purchasing it for.


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    #1500
    McMurphy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,365 ✭✭✭✭McMurphy


    elperello wrote: »
    That beer is fairly strong (and nice!) so I guess you are right.
    BTW it's 3.59 in Portugal.

    If anyone thinks Lidl are selling Perlenbacher at 'below cost' here , pardon my German, but they've their head up their hole.


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    #1501
    VinLieger
    Registered Users Posts: 17,759 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    Nice article from waterford whisperer

    http://waterfordwhispersnews.com/2017/11/09/nation-to-finally-give-up-the-drink-after-double-price-increase/


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