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Harvey Weinstein scandal (Mod warning in op.)

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Comments

  • #1832
    Mokuba
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,690 ✭✭✭Mokuba


    mikeysmith wrote: »
    Prob just wants to out him

    What does that achieve?

    We have no way of knowing who is telling the truth.

    He could still do the same to someone else if the allegations are true.

    If they aren't true then she has ruined his life and he has no recourse.


  • #1833
    mikeysmith
    Closed Accounts Posts: 326 ✭✭mikeysmith


    Mokuba wrote: »
    What does that achieve?

    We have no way of knowing who is telling the truth.

    He could still do the same to someone else if the allegations are true.

    If they aren't true then she has ruined his life and he has no recourse.

    All of your points can be argued either way

    Outing him may achieve the same as a criminal prosecution


  • #1834
    Mokuba
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,690 ✭✭✭Mokuba


    mikeysmith wrote: »
    All of your points can be argued either way

    Outing him may achieve the same as a criminal prosecution

    Yeah, except without the trial that he should be entitled to? You know, the foundation of the justice system - innocent until proven guilty and the right to a fair trial and not one in the court of social media.

    While I obviously feel for her if she is telling the truth, this story should have been handed to the authorities and not to a Facebook post. That way we can determine if she is actually telling the truth.

    Because one persons word against another isn't proof of guilt.


  • #1835
    RabbleRouser2k
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,632 ✭✭✭RabbleRouser2k


    Boom_Bap wrote: »
    I'm not dismissing this claim, but it's odd that she doesn't name the producer who is an accomplice.

    Also, he has come out and denied this has happened.

    She has named him in another post, or a follow up. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5058623/Gossip-Girl-star-Ed-Westwick-accused-raping-actress.html
    Kaine Harling, I think his name is.

    I don't agree with how she has 'revealed' this-nor do I believe someone would just blame a person for being raped. Parts of her story aren't adding up.

    Westwick has come out and said he has no idea who she is, nor would he ever force himself on anyone, or rape anyone. It's very bizarre. Either she's misremembering who he is (could very well be someone who looks like him) lying outright, or he's lying outright.


  • #1836
    HandsomeBob
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,977 ✭✭✭HandsomeBob


    Mokuba wrote: »
    Some of this is seriously dangerous.

    Serious criminal allegations shouldn't be aired to Twitter or Facebook. It is completely detrimental and absolutely dangerous. She has just made an actual trial 50 times more difficult. Does it bother nobody else that people can accuse others of heinous crimes on social media before going to the authorities? And that the mere accusation of these crimes can ruin a life and career whether true or not? And that society tells you to automatically side with the accuser no matter what?

    I'm not saying he didn't do it. I'm not saying he did. But this way he doesn't get a trial (not yet at least) - he gets branded as guilty by the public without a shred of evidence in a (currently) "he said-she said" case.

    Innocent until proven guilty is and should be the foundation of our justice system - and it is not a concept that applies in the Court of Social Media.
    I would have thought it was illegal but it's up to the accused to pursue it. Why they wouldn't is the question for me. If I was that Gossip Girl actor and if I thought I was innocent, I would absolutely come out swinging to defend myself like he has and to pursue criminal proceedings.

    That's what I've found so alarming by Spacey's and Weinstein's reactions, in that they very much had the whiff of someone who knew they had been getting away with something for far too long, and looked utterly pathetic. They are the actions of 2 men who know that they are guilty as fcuk.


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  • #1837
    Mr.Wemmick
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,194 ✭✭✭Mr.Wemmick


    Cory Feldman has done it! Good on him.

    “The fact that society believes a man who says he’s a woman, instead of a woman who says he’s not, is proof that society knows exactly who is the man and who is the woman.”

    - Jen Izaakson



  • #1838
    DavidLyons_
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,297 ✭✭✭DavidLyons_


    Mr.Wemmick wrote: »
    Cory Feldman has done it! Good on him.
    Well done that man. I really hope that the LAPD perform their duty properly here and all involved receive the appropriate justice.


  • #1839
    Neyite
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,948 ✭✭✭✭Neyite


    DavidLyons_ wrote: »
    Well done that man. I really hope that the LAPD perform their duty properly here and all involved receive the appropriate justice.

    It's a very different world from 1993 when he first tried to report it.

    By putting it on Twitter that he's made a statement it's publicising it so they can't 'lose' the report, or not investigate correctly.

    Plus the current political and social climate has also changed dramatically. I was a school girl in the 90's and dirty auld fella's habitually tried to grope you as you passed their seat in the bus. A garda would have rolled their eyes if you tried to report it. A lot of casual stuff that was accepted even then is no longer acceptable. I don't even think grooming was understood. School children often got blamed for attracting the abuse somehow.

    Police force awareness and training in the area of sexual abuse and violence has come on an awful lot since the nineties so I really hope that this time, and for CF, that full justice is served.

    I think he was right to go via official channels rather than name names on twitter or social media.


  • #1840
    razorblunt
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,300 ✭✭✭✭razorblunt


    Penn wrote: »
    Could be part of trying to protect the identities of those who made the allegations, eg. if they said what the accusations were he might be able to determine who made the allegations.

    Possibly, but then this comes out today:

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-politics-41908424


    Something definitely isn't right there.


  • #1841
    marklazarcovic
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,232 ✭✭✭marklazarcovic


    I do hope Corey keeps his wits about him now,he's gonna be a target.

    I'd hate to see the 'died from apparent overdose' headlines and be constantly Wondering was he taken out,or stuff planted on him to send him to jail.

    Neither of which would surprise me


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  • #1842
    Biggest lickspittle on boardz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 558 ✭✭✭Biggest lickspittle on boardz


    marklazarcovic wrote: »
    I do hope Corey keeps his wits about him now,he's gonna be a target.

    I'd hate to see the 'died from apparent overdose' headlines and be constantly Wondering was he taken out,or stuff planted on him to send him to jail.

    Neither of which would surprise me


    People laughed when he suggested that someone was trying to kill him. Now that we know that actual ex-Mossad spies were being employed by Harvey Weinstein, maybe the public will actually sit up and take notice.

    On another note, one Hollywood star that has stood out head and shoulders above the rest in terms of criticising the sexual assaults and rapists is Jessica Chastain.
    Unlike others who waited to see what way the political wind was blowing, Chastain condemned Weinstein pretty much immediately.

    Now, she has directed the spotlight onto X-Men and The Usual Suspects producer Bryan Singer. Despite the fact that he is producing her latest movie. That takes balls to call him out like that.

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-5060577/Jessica-Chastain-reveals-called-Bryan-Singer.html


  • #1843
    valoren
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,602 ✭✭✭valoren


    On the notion of women accusing men via social media, in any such controversy the man will be deemed guilty until proven innocent and the woman will be innocent until proven guilty. Twas ever thus.


  • #1844
    Red_Wake
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,571 ✭✭✭Red_Wake


    Surely all these lads who are getting accused of sexual harassment, etc, on social media can claim that they can't get a fair trial under such circumstances, and thus get off scot free?


  • #1845
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    I think in relation to people being called out via twitter/social media, certainly in the UK (before anyone jumps to the keyboard) might not be the worst thing.
    England has a long history of granting celebs and the likes with huge injunctions, which undermines real victims and allows, in some cases, business as usual for the offender, sure Max Clifford has admitted keeping shocking stuff out of the public domain, including his own behavior. who knows, it might have been what attracted Mr spacey to working in London for so long, that and Hampstead Heath! whilst the courts keep said celebs name hidden, you have a Max Clifford type throwing money at the victim all whilst telling them, they "wont be believed" and best take the money lest we change our mind and "crush you and your family"!! this is the modus operandi if recent victims are to be believed.

    Yes I agree, ousting via social media is a blunt object alright and there will be collateral damage but just remember what Saville told people, " I act with impunity", who's to say there's not worse than him out there. It's a mess alright.

    I will say having watched an open secret, that X-men singer guy has skeletons to burn!


  • #1846
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Red_Wake wrote: »
    Surely all these lads who are getting accused of sexual harassment, etc, on social media can claim that they can't get a fair trial under such circumstances, and thus get off scot free?

    No such thing as getting off "scot free", I don't think. Not with accusations like these. These tend to follow a person around the rest of their lives.


  • #1847
    Outlaw Pete
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,423 ✭✭✭✭Outlaw Pete


    Absolutely, mentioned already of course, but John Leslie is a shining example of that.


  • #1848
    Mr.Wemmick
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,194 ✭✭✭Mr.Wemmick


    And now Charlie Sheen is outed as one of Corey Haim's abusers.

    “The fact that society believes a man who says he’s a woman, instead of a woman who says he’s not, is proof that society knows exactly who is the man and who is the woman.”

    - Jen Izaakson



  • #1849
    Neyite
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,948 ✭✭✭✭Neyite


    That was rumoured for years on the gossip sites.


  • #1850
    Red_Wake
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,571 ✭✭✭Red_Wake


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Red_Wake wrote: »
    Surely all these lads who are getting accused of sexual harassment, etc, on social media can claim that they can't get a fair trial under such circumstances, and thus get off scot free?

    No such thing as getting off "scot free", I don't think. Not with accusations like these. These tend to follow a person around the rest of their lives.
    But they'd avoid any meaningful trouble with the law, right?


  • #1851
    Outlaw Pete
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,423 ✭✭✭✭Outlaw Pete


    Mr.Wemmick wrote: »
    And now Charlie Sheen is outed as one of Corey Haim's abusers.

    Yup, that's who I was referring to earlier in the thread with the following:
    Outlaw Pete wrote: »
    In Corey Feldman's 2013 book Coreyography, he explains the sexual abuse Corey Haim experienced during the filming of Lucas. Allegedly one of the adult men on the set of the film convinced Haim that it was "normal for older men and younger boys in the business to have sexual relations". Haim and the man walked off and went between two trailers on the set and Haim was sodomized by him. Feldman also says the man who did this is still alive and is one of the most successful people in the industry.

    Maybe I'm a million miles off here but surely there is only one person who worked on that film, that is today 'one of the most successful people in the industry'. Hhmm.

    He's not winning now, eh.


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  • #1852
    Mr.Wemmick
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,194 ✭✭✭Mr.Wemmick


    Neyite wrote: »
    That was rumoured for years on the gossip sites.

    Well, it's now out on mainstream news. Charlie Sheen is such a nutball, off his head on drugs many times over the years. Makes you wonder if anything ever happened to him as young lad/teen in Hollywood.

    Emilio Estevez was always the calmer of the two.

    “The fact that society believes a man who says he’s a woman, instead of a woman who says he’s not, is proof that society knows exactly who is the man and who is the woman.”

    - Jen Izaakson



  • #1853
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 26,052 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Charlie Sheen shocks me, even though he's been through some pretty shocking times. He always struck me as someone who was probably fundamentally decent behind the drugs and booze, I liked the way he owned some of the situations people tried to shame him over, I thought it spoke to his basic honesty. Even though he messed up his life substantially, I always believed that a clean/sober Charlie would be a good guy. He addressed his HIV with great dignity after the story broke. But if he touched Haim, he can go to hell.

    Obviously I'd have compassion for the guy if he was hurt himself as a child, but if it was the case, you'd imagine it would make him even more protective of kids, not predatory. There's no statistically significant difference in the percentage of child abusers who were themselves abused, and the general population so it's not a defence, even if it's used as an explanation.

    I hope the stress of this situation is something Feldman can handle, I can imagine he's feeling a bit fragile now with all this surfacing after so long and I hope he gets through it to find some peace. I'm glad he's being listened to.


  • #1854
    HandsomeBob
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,977 ✭✭✭HandsomeBob


    Outlaw Pete wrote: »
    Yup, that's who I was referring to earlier in the thread with the following:



    He's not winning now, eh.

    An unashamed scumbag, "owning" his mistakes being pure cynical PR stunts.

    The way he rejected a confused Haim afterwards just shows how much of a calculated, and knowing, scumbag he is. He knew what he did was so wrong but better to make the kid feel like the one who did wrong than look at himself in the mirror and live that shame he felt deep down.


  • #1855
    ceadaoin.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,651 ✭✭✭ceadaoin.


    Mr.Wemmick wrote: »
    Well, it's now out on mainstream news. Charlie Sheen is such a nutball, off his head on drugs many times over the years. Makes you wonder if anything ever happened to him as young lad/teen in Hollywood.

    Emilio Estevez was always the calmer of the two.

    Even if something did happen to him, it's no excuse for his subsequent behaviour. He is an out and out scumbag. His ex wife alleged in her divorce papers that he viewed images of child abuse. He beats and abuses women. He knowingly exposed people to HIV. That's all bad enough, and now it has publicly come out that he abused at least one young boy, something which has been an open secret for years. Disgusting that he has been allowed to get away with it and prosper for all these years


  • #1856
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    when talking about weinstein, Alec Baldwin says "you heard that for decades, he raped rosie mcgowan" almost like it was common knowledge, such an open secret. Now you hear the same about sheen raping haim, will we hear the same in a few weeks from others confirming it.

    dunno what's worse, the fact that he was the highest paid TV actor for a good while or his mea culpa performance after the surprise HIV diagnosis. Absolute dirtbag and certainly in the running for the prestigious Saville award!!


  • #1857
    retro:electro
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,039 ✭✭✭✭retro:electro


    ceadaoin. wrote: »
    Even if something did happen to him, it's no excuse for his subsequent behaviour. He is an out and out scumbag. His ex wife alleged in her divorce papers that he viewed images of child abuse. He beats and abuses women. He knowingly exposed people to HIV. That's all bad enough, and now it has publicly come out that he abused at least one young boy, something which has been an open secret for years. Disgusting that he has been allowed to get away with it and prosper for all these years

    This. Charlie Sheen can go jump off a cliff for all I care He's a revolting piece of sh!t. I hope he gets his comeuppance. He has been untouchable for years now, while being abusive and negligent to his family, sexually irresponsible and just an overall douche.


  • #1858
    Outlaw Pete
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,423 ✭✭✭✭Outlaw Pete


    Remember seeing a clip years ago of Feldman outside some nightclub and a reporter compared him to Charlie and he says something like 'Nah, I'm nothing like Charlie Sheen, I don't need to pay women to be in my life'. That was around the time Charlie had the whole harem of porn stars living at his place. Bree Olson and that crowd.


  • #1859
    ceadaoin.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,651 ✭✭✭ceadaoin.


    rusty cole wrote: »
    when talking about weinstein, Alec Baldwin says "you heard that for decades, he raped rosie mcgowan" almost like it was common knowledge, such an open secret. Now you hear the same about sheen raping haim, will we hear the same in a few weeks from others confirming it.

    dunno what's worse, the fact that he was the highest paid TV actor for a good while or his mea culpa performance after the surprise HIV diagnosis. Absolute dirtbag and certainly in the running for the prestigious Saville award!!

    Anyone who has read gossip sites regularly knew about this. Same with Harvey Weinstein. And there are many others who are probably ****tng themselves right now. That's why I find it completely implausible when anyone directly involved in the industry claims to have been in the dark. If plebs like us knew about it, sure as hell they did. They are lying to protect their own ass or to make it look like they weren't complicit. The industry is clearly rotten to the core and always has been


  • #1860
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    just looking at this "army of spies" thing with weinstien it begs the question, were some actors actually afraid to speak out. It seems he was almost like an al capone of the movie industry.. read it yourself from the new yorker, a team of bloody secret agents

    If you can stand to half listen to Megyn kelly, you know it's out of the bag if she's diving in head first..shocking stuff.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TQvEqWHgr2Q

    crazy stuff altogether!!


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  • #1861
    Mr.Wemmick
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,194 ✭✭✭Mr.Wemmick


    ceadaoin. wrote: »
    Even if something did happen to him, it's no excuse for his subsequent behaviour. He is an out and out scumbag. His ex wife alleged in her divorce papers that he viewed images of child abuse. He beats and abuses women. He knowingly exposed people to HIV. That's all bad enough, and now it has publicly come out that he abused at least one young boy, something which has been an open secret for years. Disgusting that he has been allowed to get away with it and prosper for all these years

    Agree, did not say it as an excuse.. more to point it out as a question, has it always happened to a % of young males going back years/generations. It seems to be the norm to rape, abuse the vulnerable, the young.. like watching vampires getting excited about fresh meat.

    Hollywood is a cesspit.

    “The fact that society believes a man who says he’s a woman, instead of a woman who says he’s not, is proof that society knows exactly who is the man and who is the woman.”

    - Jen Izaakson



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