Breaking lights at empty crossroads = victimless crime, or is it?

dil999 · 06-10-2017 06:54PM

Isambard wrote: »

It's not rubbish, no need to be so confrontational. A stop sign and a red traffic light mena exactly the same.

I am not being confrontational. I just get very annoyed when people come onto forums and tell people that its okay to break the law and do things that are very dangerous.

A stop sign means you come to a complete stop and continue when it is safe to do so. a Red light means stop and remain stopped until the light turns green then continue if it is safe to do so. Two completely different things

Lights are there because a a stop sign is not sufficient. it is NEVER okay to break a red light. Never. it is highly irresponsible.

Do you actually have a full drivers license?

Isambard · 06-10-2017 06:57PM

you see I never actually said it was OK to do it, in fact I said it was illegal. I suggest you re-read what I did say.It isn't dangerous to jumop a red light in the early hours when there is nothing else moving, illegal yes but not necessarily dangerous,

bucketybuck · 06-10-2017 07:32PM

Isambard wrote: »

It isn't necessarily unsafe.

Isambard wrote: »

A stop sign and a red traffic light mena exactly the same.

Isambard wrote: »

It isn't dangerous to jumop a red light in the early hours when there is nothing else moving, illegal yes but not necessarily dangerous,

Sorry to break it to you, but this isn't your call to make.

Isambard · 06-10-2017 07:46PM

no it isn't my call, unless it was me there in the early hours pulling up at a red, which it wouldn't be.

Being illegal doesn't necessarily mean an action is dangerous.

bucketybuck · 06-10-2017 07:47PM

Isambard wrote: »

no it isn't my call, unless it was me there in the early hours pulling up at a red, which it wouldn't be.

Being illegal doesn't necessarily mean an action is dangerous.

Driving through a red light is inherently dangerous.

dil999 · 06-10-2017 07:52PM

Isambard wrote: »

you see I never actually said it was OK to do it, in fact I said it was illegal. I suggest you re-read what I did say.It isn't dangerous to jumop a red light in the early hours when there is nothing else moving, illegal yes but not necessarily dangerous,

You didn't explicitly say it but you clearly implied it by saying it is safe to do so.

Isambard wrote: »

jumping a red light is exactly the same as not stopping completely at a STOP sign.

Rules are made for the guidance of wise men and the obedience of fools

it's not
they're not

Do you actually have a full drivers license?

CiniO · 06-10-2017 09:38PM

I remember last year they put a alternating traffic lights on a stretch of very rural road in the middle of nowhere, where I very often drive.

It was due to landslide, which narrowed the road to one lane on a stretch of about 5 metres, but traffic lights were set for around 200 metres - IMO totally pointless.

They were in operation for about 5 months, but problem with them was that they were constantly synchronising/desynchronising.

So. f.e. they would work properly on Monday, but by Wednesday, they would be showing red on both directions at the same time followed by green on both direction at the same time. Then by Friday, everything would be back to normal, and again desynchronised totally by Sunday.

When there were no other cars around (as you could see long distance) I obviously always drove through, no matter what light was showing.
But when there were other cars, I would only wait on red if they were synchronised.
On days they were desynchronised, I would obviously drive on red (as other driver's had red as well, so they were waiting), but on green as well, and then I would meet other drivers on the way.
Often they were gesticulating, honking the horn, flasing the lights, or shouting at me. I actually got in few discussions accused of running the red light, while in fact, I was going on green, same as other driver.

grogi · 06-10-2017 10:02PM

Hooks Golf Handicap wrote: »

My local village has one set traffic lights on our centre crossroads.
A few years ago the village was bypassed yet the lights still remained.
Locals have now taken to ignoring the red & just yield for any traffic.
If you were stopped at the red light on a quiet day any car behind you would start laying on the horn to bully you on.

People follow laws when they make sense but soon revert to type when there's no logic.
Anyway, victimless crime or stringing up offence ?

Tiziano Ferro has a song about such lights: Rosso relativo...

shaunr68 · 07-10-2017 05:07AM

My view - the wording of the poll is important. Is it ever OK. Generally I follow the rules of the road, been driving over 30 years and driven in over 30 countries, one minor fault claim in 1989 and one fine/points in 2014 thanks to a craftily placed cash camera.

Most of the time when you are stopped at a red light you don't have a clear view of all junctions so obviously it would be dangerous to proceed. However, in an extreme example (again the wording said "ever) imagine a scenario where you can clearly see all junctions and for a considerable distance leading up to them.

I have been in that situation myself, years ago in a country village in the middle of the night, and rather than sitting there like a lemon, drove through the red lights. Nobody died.

07-10-2017 09:02AM

bucketybuck wrote: »

Sorry to break it to you, but this isn't your call to make.

Well we make this call many times every time we drive i.e. Deciding if a move is dangerous. What made traffic lights such a god to you that you can make a decision on it being safe to go through them.

It's like people being obsessed with outdated speed limits and stopping distance that in reality are totally obsolete in and should be consigned to the bin with speed limits being increased and it being acknowledged that stopping distances for a modern car are far far less than those in the ROTR.

bucketybuck · 07-10-2017 10:52AM

Adriana Bewildered Neighbor wrote: »

Well we make this call many times every time we drive i.e. Deciding if a move is dangerous. What made traffic lights such a god to you that you can make a decision on it being safe to go through them.

Yes, many morons make stupid decisions on the road every day, it was one of the great drivers for codified driving laws in fact.

But you know one of the few things worse than morons making poor judgement calls on the road? Its morons disregarding the rules of the road in ways that other drivers could not possibly predict. A road user approaching a blind junction will be very observant, a road user going through a green light will have every expectation that his way is clear, because why on earth would any fucking moron be driving through the opposite red light?

That is why driving through a red light is inherently dangerous, because it is actively contrary to the reasonable expectations of all other road users. So while I have no doubt that the country is full of morons who think things will be grand if they drive to suit themselves the simple fact is that it isn't true, there are millions of other drivers just waiting to make your acquaintance and the only thing keeping you all apart is simple rules of the road that ensures everybody knows what they are supposed to be doing.

So when you decide that you will be grand to head on through that quiet junction, just think of all the morons who thought the same thing and then killed somebody.

Henry Ford III · 07-10-2017 10:57AM

But you can see nothing wrong with overtaking on the lhs on a motorway?

07-10-2017 11:52AM

bucketybuck wrote: »

Yes, many morons make stupid decisions on the road every day, it was one of the great drivers for codified driving laws in fact.

But you know one of the few things worse than morons making poor judgement calls on the road? Its morons disregarding the rules of the road in ways that other drivers could not possibly predict. A road user approaching a blind junction will be very observant, a road user going through a green light will have every expectation that his way is clear, because why on earth would any fucking moron be driving through the opposite red light?

That is why driving through a red light is inherently dangerous, because it is actively contrary to the reasonable expectations of all other road users. So while I have no doubt that the country is full of morons who think things will be grand if they drive to suit themselves the simple fact is that it isn't true, there are millions of other drivers just waiting to make your acquaintance and the only thing keeping you all apart is simple rules of the road that ensures everybody knows what they are supposed to be doing.

So when you decide that you will be grand to head on through that quiet junction, just think of all the morons who thought the same thing and then killed somebody.

Have cars suddenly started to come with cloaking devices as standard? Where is the mysterious car going to come out of if you have good visibility and can clearly see the way is clear to proceed? I'm not talking about flying through a junction nor am I saying that it's safe to go through any red light but the example I gave of turning left at a junction onto another road, the same manuvre everyone does multiple times a day on roads with out lights is not suddenly dangers for the simple reason there is a red light involved. I'd hate to be so worried about rules it must make life so difficult.

Freindly · 07-10-2017 11:55AM

Nothing sadder than waiting for a green light on an empty roundabout. Wish they would flash amber at nights.

bucketybuck · 07-10-2017 12:22PM

Adriana Bewildered Neighbor wrote: »

. I'd hate to be so worried about rules it must make life so difficult.

I break lots of rules, I just tend to respect the ones that help keep people safe.

What you don't get is that your way of thinking relies on the cognitive skills and perception of people who clearly aren't too bright to begin with. That the type of moron who breaks red lights is also the upstanding citizen who will stop, look and listen before he goes. Now there is a fundamental misunderstanding of the human psyche if ever I saw one.

No doubt you believe you are the observant gentleman who acts perfectly safe at all times and so should be allowed to act with impunity. Yeah, thats what they all think.

dil999 · 07-10-2017 12:33PM

Adriana Bewildered Neighbor wrote: »

Have cars suddenly started to come with cloaking devices as standard? Where is the mysterious car going to come out of if you have good visibility and can clearly see the way is clear to proceed? I'm not talking about flying through a junction nor am I saying that it's safe to go through any red light but the example I gave of turning left at a junction onto another road, the same manuvre everyone does multiple times a day on roads with out lights is not suddenly dangers for the simple reason there is a red light involved. I'd hate to be so worried about rules it must make life so difficult.

I don't know how many times at dusk or in fog I have seen people muppets driving around with no lights on. They think that since they can see, everyone can see them. Add that to an even bigger muppet (carefully

) breaking a red light. What do you get? a serious accident

You obviously have a some life difficulties of your own if you don't understand the purpose of the rules of the road.

Do you have a full driving license?

07-10-2017 01:14PM

dil999 wrote: »

Do you have a full driving license?

For 14 years along with extensive experience driving machinery since I was 10 years of age.

dil999 · 07-10-2017 01:38PM

Adriana Bewildered Neighbor wrote: »

For 14 years along with extensive experience driving machinery since I was 10 years of age.

Wow! That's even more worrying. And you still don't know how to drive.

Do you have a list of the rules of the road you follow and the ones you don't? Do you drive on the wrong side of the road when its quiet? Do you drive on the footpath when you can't see anyone walking on it? Do you go the wrong way around roundabouts if its a bit quicker than have to go all the way around?

bucketybuck · 07-10-2017 01:39PM

Adriana Bewildered Neighbor wrote: »

For 14 years along with extensive experience driving machinery since I was 10 years of age.

Now listen as he tells us all why its perfectly safe for young children to operate farm machinery. (But don't mention all the dead kids...)

07-10-2017 01:48PM

dil999 wrote: »

Wow! That's even more worrying. And you still don't know how to drive.

Do you have a list of the rules of the road you follow and the ones you don't? Do you drive on the wrong side of the road when its quiet? Do you drive on the footpath when you can't see anyone walking on it? Do you go the wrong way around roundabouts if its a bit quicker than have to go all the way around?

I see the rules of the road as nothing more than a guide, in general I have my own interpretation and base what I do on what I fell is safe rather than some
rule someone made up and is treated as gospel by many.

bucketybuck wrote: »

Now listen as he tells us all why its perfectly safe for young children to operate farm machinery. (But don't mention all the dead kids...)

Not that is relevant but kids getting killed around machinery are not the ones involved in the work but rather the ones playing in the wrong place etc. The cab of the tractor is one of the safesat places to be. I grew up in the cab of a tractor, for the age of about 2 I was in a tractor nearly every day, was able to drive with a little help by about 7 or 8 and was driving alone in the tractor doing work to help on the farm by 10, by 12 I was doing full days work in the tractor.

dil999 · 07-10-2017 02:04PM

Adriana Bewildered Neighbor wrote: »

I see the rules of the road as nothing more than a guide, in general I have my own interpretation and base what I do on what I fell is safe rather than some
rule someone made up and is treated as gospel by many.

Not that is relevant but kids getting killed around machinery are not the ones involved in the work but rather the ones playing in the wrong place etc. The cab of the tractor is one of the safesat places to be. I grew up in the cab of a tractor, for the age of about 2 I was in a tractor nearly every day, was able to drive with a little help by about 7 or 8 and was driving alone in the tractor doing work to help on the farm by 10, by 12 I was doing full days work in the tractor.

You're not a Healy Rae by any chance?

grogi · 07-10-2017 02:19PM

I have written to The Pope to initiate Canonization process for some of the posters here.

philstar · 07-10-2017 02:24PM

^^^^^^^^^^^

even the protestant ones?

biko · 07-10-2017 03:23PM

Adriana Bewildered Neighbor wrote: »

I see the rules of the road as nothing more than a guide, in general I have my own interpretation and base what I do on what I fell is safe rather than some rule someone made up and is treated as gospel by many.

Tbh, if this is your view then I don't understand why you are are even posting in a motors forum.

I will assume you are trolling now but don't go down some crazy road ok?

Hooks Golf Handicap · 07-10-2017 03:59PM

grogi wrote: »

I have written to The Pope to initiate Canonization process for some of the posters here.

The moral high ground is pretty packed alright.
You'd think their Mammys were reading their posts.

Isambard · 07-10-2017 04:01PM

it makes me wonder what some of you do when you come across a light stuck on red, presumably you sit there and wait for the repair man?

07-10-2017 04:17PM

biko wrote: »

Tbh, if this is your view then I don't understand why you are are even posting in a motors forum.

I will assume you are trolling now but don't go down some crazy road ok?

Not trolling in the slightest, a lot of the rules of the road are poorly thought out, are out of date, don't make sense etc. There are of course some of them which should be respected to the letter of the law but others which can be followed to various different degrees depending on the situation.

Also I've no idea what my presence on a motoring forum is being questioned for.

Isambard · 07-10-2017 04:37PM

I and most other drivers break the Law regularly when it suits us. There must be some who never do but I don't see them when I'm on the road, but there's a few on here it seems.

Hooks Golf Handicap · 07-10-2017 04:53PM

Poll still only says 30% break lights so there's a large majority who follow the law, even at 4am in rural village.

Good for them

dr.fuzzenstein · 07-10-2017 05:05PM

biko wrote: »

So if the garda van where to jump off a cliff...

I would seriously consider following it. I'm sure they would have a good reason to do so.
The newsreport would say "Cars who jumped the cliff escaped unharmed, but the people who remained..."
Did anything good happen to them?

Breaking lights at empty crossroads = victimless crime, or is it?

Comments