Why is it normal/OK to be obese in Ireland?.

givyjoe · 29-09-2017 12:45PM

B0jangles wrote: »

It's ok stonedpilot, your pity posse here has got your back!

I'll take that as a no then with regard to my question... :rolleyes: Never mind the irony overload in your post.

McCrack · 29-09-2017 12:46PM

WhiteRoses wrote: »

I'm about 14lb heavier than I would like to be at the moment. About a size 12 or so, which I know isn't massive, but I have big boobs and a big bum and any extra weight around my middle makes me look huuuge.
I've fluctuated between a size 6 and a size 14 since a teenager, the size 6 last only about 8 months while I was going through a stint of bulimia. The size 14 was after spending a couple of months in a medicated haze, eating my feelings, after experiencing a loss.
Right now the extra weight is from being extremely happy in life and my relationship, and also living with a man who eats like a horse but is built like a greyhound :pac:

I know people who are natural size 8s with flat tummies who eat takeaway five times a week, practically have fizzy drinks running in their veins, drink every weekend and have chocolate and crisps for lunch. I have often heard them make snide comments about overweight and obese people and it genuinely drives me insane, because they probably eat worse than the person in question, but are blessed with good genes! And I think that is a huge problem, because these people don't actually recognise how awful their own diet is, they just see the fat person and think that person must be eating worse.

Nutritional education could really do with being improved upon in this country. I didn't eat particularly badly growing up, but I remember for my Debs (only 8 years ago), I decided to go on a diet and use the food pyramid for inspiration. I had special K cereal for breakfast, brown ham sandwich for lunch, and chicken and pasta for dinner every day, with a few other fruits and veggies thrown in. And I was genuinely baffled as to why I wasn't losing weight. I now know I was eating waaaaaaay too many carbs, but that was what was advertised by the government as healthy at the time.

I know we've come a long way since then but I honestly think educating people into making better decisions will make all the difference.

"Genes" are not a factor in a persons weight - its calories in v. calories out and excess calories causes weight gain.

In other words if a person is consuming more calories then they can metabolise in a day over many days and over many weeks they will see an increase in their weight.

Dyr · 29-09-2017 12:48PM

B0jangles wrote: »

It's ok stonedpilot, your pity posse here has got your back!

The logic and reason posse has no pity

B0jangles · 29-09-2017 12:48PM

givyjoe wrote: »

I'll take that as a no then... :rolleyes:

On what? Am I expected to give a thorough and nuanced breakdown on the extremely variable personal and societal reasons for the increasing obesity issue in the Irish population?

In After Hours?

Ok - it's cos they are eating too many piessssss LOLLLLLLLLLL! COs they are FAtties and Fatties EAT TOO MANY PIES!!

....... · 29-09-2017 12:49PM

This post has been deleted.

SusieBlue · 29-09-2017 12:49PM

McCrack wrote: »

"Genes" are not a factor in a persons weight - its calories in v. calories out and excess calories causes weight gain.

In other words if a person is consuming more calories then they can metabolise in a day over many days and over many weeks they will see an increase in their weight.

Maybe genes was the wrong word, maybe metabolism is the word I was looking for. Regardless the people I'm talking about eat a surplus of calories and remain of slim build. That's the point I was making.

B0jangles · 29-09-2017 12:49PM

Bambi wrote: »

The logic and reason posse has no pity

When someone feels the need to trumpet their superior Logic and Reason, you can quite confident that there's going to be little of either in what they have to say.

nice_guy80 · 29-09-2017 12:51PM

portion sizes (need to be stuffed after a meal)

plate sizes (people obsessed about filling plate)

quality of food - rarely prepared from scratch

less exercise

too much driving (less time for exercise and food preparation)

stress (huge factor for many people)

laziness (parents give poor example)

plus a load of excuses

givyjoe · 29-09-2017 12:52PM

B0jangles wrote: »

On what? Am I expected to give a thorough and nuanced breakdown on the extremely variable personal and societal reasons for the increasing obesity issue in the Irish population?

In After Hours?

Ok - it's cos they are eating too many piessssss LOLLLLLLLLLL! COs they are FAtties and Fatties EAT TOO MANY PIES!!

The majority of your posts have simply been you spouting your outrage at what you seem to perceive as a specific attack on women.

Plenty of others have managed to give some decent insights and opinions on the matter, but perhaps its too much to ask of you. My mistake.

Your pity party posse (or whatever you call it) mate was looking for peer reviewed research to back up my and others points!

Dyr · 29-09-2017 12:53PM

B0jangles wrote: »

When someone feels the need to trumpet their superior Logic and Reason, you can quite confident that there's going to be little of either in what they have to say.

And yet the emotional types keep going for the man while the ball that is reasoned debate remains untouched. Gotta play to your strengths I suppose

givyjoe · 29-09-2017 12:54PM

WhiteRoses wrote: »

Maybe genes was the wrong word, maybe metabolism is the word I was looking for. Regardless the people I'm talking about eat a surplus of calories and remain of slim build. That's the point I was making.

Except that doesn't make sense either. If you eat a surplus of calories, it turns to fat. That's how it works, or thereabouts. The people you mention are not running a surplus.

The people you mention may have a higher muscle to fat ratio than you, they may exercise more... but they don't take in more calories than they consume and remain the same 'size', i.e. weight, muscle and fat composition.

Hitman3000 · 29-09-2017 12:54PM

givyjoe wrote:

Your pity party posse (or whatever you call it) mate was looking for peer reviewed research to back up my and others points!

Can't let this b.s. go. I never asked you for a peer review only one person about their claim about people in the West. But hey don't let the truth get in the way of a lie. Carry on with your nonsense while idiotic it is some what amusing.

McCrack · 29-09-2017 12:56PM

WhiteRoses wrote: »

Maybe genes was the wrong word, maybe metabolism is the word I was looking for. Regardless the people I'm talking about eat a surplus of calories and remain of slim build. That's the point I was making.

But they don't/cannot - if they did consume surplus calories they will gain weight.

Eating shyte does not automatically mean weight gain - you can eat clean or healthy but still gain weight if your calories intake is excess your daily requirements.

There is no mystery to this at all.

AnneFrank · 29-09-2017 12:57PM

there is so many obese people in my job, all under 30,
It's disgusting to be honest, and they get a chipper nearly every day at lunch.
Then chocolate all day, i really don't know how they do it

givyjoe · 29-09-2017 12:57PM

Hitman3000 wrote: »

Can't let this b.s. go. I never asked you for a peer review only one person about their claim about people in the West. But hey don't let the truth get in the way of a lie. Carry on with your nonsense while idiotic it is some what amusing.

Well isn't the best data and articles usually peer reviewed?! Or you happy for data to be produced by any ould randomer?! I'd love to a reasoned logical point on any of my mine. which are either nonsense or idiotic. Butthurt eh :rolleyes:

pilly · 29-09-2017 12:58PM

givyjoe wrote: »

Except that doesn't make sense either. If you eat a surplus of calories, it turns to fat. That's how it works, or thereabouts. The people you mention are not running a surplus.

The people you mention may have a higher muscle to fat ratio than you, they may exercise more... but they don't take in more calories than they consume and remain the same 'size', i.e. weight, muscle and fat composition.

That is simply not true though. We all know people who eat like pigs, do no exercise and they're still slim. My brother could eat 2 dinners in a row, wouldn't so much as run for a bus and he's skinny as a lathe so there are definitely other factors at play there.

SusieBlue · 29-09-2017 12:59PM

pilly wrote: »

That is simply not true though. We all know people who eat like pigs, do no exercise and they're still slim. My brother could eat 2 dinners in a row, wouldn't so much as run for a bus and he's skinny as a lathe so there are definitely other factors at play there.

Thanks, that's the point I was trying to make. I thought everyone knew someone like that, I know I've come across more than a few of them over the years.

McCrack · 29-09-2017 12:59PM

pilly wrote: »

That is simply not true though. We all know people who eat like pigs, do no exercise and they're still slim. My brother could eat 2 dinners in a row, wouldn't so much as run for a bus and he's skinny as a lathe so there are definitely other factors at play there.

Again calories in v. calories out

givyjoe · 29-09-2017 01:01PM

pilly wrote: »

That is simply not true though. We all know people who eat like pigs, do no exercise and they're still slim. My brother could eat 2 dinners in a row, wouldn't so much as run for a bus and he's skinny as a lathe so there are definitely other factors at play there.

Jesus wept.. other factors being how quickly your body can metabolise the calories, i.e. daily. That's the other factors, he is 100% NOT running a calorie surplus!!

mathie · 29-09-2017 01:03PM

Why is it normal/OK to be obese in Ireland?.

"Insanity is ... majority rules"

And the majority are overweight or obese.

The prevalence of obesity in Irish adults is currently 18%, with men at 20% and women at 16%. A further 47% of men and 33% of women are overweight (BMI 25.0-29.9 kg/m2).

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12002792

65% of Irish men are overweight or obese.

Hitman3000 · 29-09-2017 01:05PM

givyjoe wrote:

Well isn't the best data and articles usually peer reviewed?! Or you happy for data to be produced by any ould randomer?! I'd love to a reasoned logical point on any of my mine. which are either nonsense or idiotic. Butthurt eh

When you have to resort to lying it's fair to assume you are not above nonsense and idiocy. As I said I only asked one person for a peer reviewed report, contrary to your claim as can be seen in my posts. Butthurt much?

Hitman3000 · 29-09-2017 01:08PM

mathie wrote:

65% of Irish men are overweight or obese.

I think you'll find that BMI has been discredited by many medical reports and studies. All online to read.

B0jangles · 29-09-2017 01:14PM

Bambi wrote: »

And yet the emotional types keep going for the man while the ball that is reasoned debate remains untouched. Gotta play to your strengths I suppose

The observation in my post wasn't directed entirely at you, it was at the vast number of people on the internet who seem to think that by simply mentioning the words Logic and Reason, their own opinions and biases become mystically imbued with either quality.

You however, chose to response to what you perceived as an ad hominem with an ad hominem.

That's quite funny.

pilly · 29-09-2017 01:15PM

givyjoe wrote:

Jesus wept.. other factors being how quickly your body can metabolise the calories, i.e. daily. That's the other factors, he is 100% NOT running a calorie surplus!!

Which is the point I and other posters made. There are other factors. What's the abuse for?

Coffee Fulled Runner · 29-09-2017 01:17PM

Hitman3000 wrote: »

I think you'll find that BMI has been discredited by many medical reports and studies. All online to read.

I think you'll find its not perfect but it's a good way to measure people. Yes if you are a bodybuilding rugby playing type it won't be accurate but for the vast majority it's a excellent gauge.

Hitman3000 · 29-09-2017 01:18PM

Coffee Fulled Runner wrote:

I think you'll find its not perfect but it's a good way to measure people. Yes if you are a bodybuilding rugby playing type it won't be accurate but for the vast majority it's a excellent gauge.

Your report is dated 2002, many reports disputing BMI since then.

Hitman3000 · 29-09-2017 01:19PM

Coffee Fulled Runner wrote:

I think you'll find its not perfect but it's a good way to measure people. Yes if you are a bodybuilding rugby playing type it won't be accurate but for the vast majority it's a excellent gauge.

The waist measurement is a better indicator.

Coffee Fulled Runner · 29-09-2017 01:23PM

Hitman3000 wrote: »

The waist measurement is a better indicator.

Yes that's true some BMI calculators also include waist measurements. It's not to dismiss BMI outright it's still a very good gauge for your average person.

languagenerd · 29-09-2017 01:23PM

I think there have been a lot of societal changes over the last couple of generations and it's all catching up on us now.

*Takeaways and fast food: My parents had very little fast food or takeaways growing up, other than an occasional fish-and-chips (I'm in my mid-twenties, so we're only talking one or two adult generations ago). The first McDonalds only opened here in the late 70s, pizza takeaways only became common in the late 80s/early 90s. Now it's far more widely available.

*Microwave meals and convenience food: have only properly existed here since the late 70s/early 80s (can't find a definitive date on that) and have grown vastly more popular since the 90s.

*Commuting: A couple of generations ago, the vast majority of people lived within walking or cycling distance to work, so many people got af least some regular exercise without trying. Suburbs have been spreading further and further since the Myles Wright plan for the new Dublin suburbs in the late 60s. In the last few years, it's getting worse with the rental crisis in the cities - people are moving further out, not walking regularly anymore and spending hours sitting in cars/buses/trains (which also leaves less free time for exercise).

*Less manual labour: A much smaller number of jobs now are manual/physical. A lot of us work in offices, sitting all day without any physical exertion.

*Shiftwork, longer hours, fewer stay-at-home parents: People generally have less time to cook dinners now than a couple of generations ago - they get home later, when they're more tired and hungry, and want something that's quick and easy. Shiftworkers often have bad diets as they can rely on microwaveable meals and aren't at home for traditional mealtimes.

*Cultural change in terms of cakes and sweets - they're just more readily available now and coffee shops, ice-cream shops etc are more popular.

*Technology & better choice in TV etc: we have a much wider range of entertainment options nowadays and a lot of them don't involve physical exertion.

That's not to say a lot of things aren't better now - I wouldn't want to live in the 1950s or 60s - but there's a cumulative effect of less free time to cook/exercise, less incidental calorie burning (sedentary jobs, car/bus commuting) and a huge influx of convenience and junk foods.

I moved house and changed jobs a couple years ago, which meant I had to take public transport instead of walking to work/shops/town and was eating one or two microwaveable meals a week due to late shifts. I put on a few pounds in the first few months simply due to lifestyle changes & had to find ways then of counteracting that. It's basically that, on a much bigger scale.

Hitman3000 · 29-09-2017 01:26PM

Coffee Fulled Runner wrote:

Yes that's true some BMI calculators also include waist measurements. It's not to dismiss BMI outright it's still a very good gauge for your average person.

The waist measurement is far simpler for the average person to come to grasp with. The BMI tbh is dated.

Why is it normal/OK to be obese in Ireland?.

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