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Hotel Cancels Pro life event due to Intimidation.

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Comments

  • #782
    WinnyThePoo
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,417 ✭✭✭WinnyThePoo


    hatrickpatrick wrote: »
    For the bajillionth time:

    "I don't approve of this group" - speech.
    "I'm going to take action to prevent this group from speaking" - more than speech.

    Sure, you have a right to do both. But the latter is not in the spirit of free speech, and is a totally scummy thing to do.

    Your problem is with the hotel.


  • #783
    Loafing Oaf
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,645 ✭✭✭✭Loafing Oaf


    Grayson wrote: »
    They simply told the hotel who they were dealing with and the hotel changed their mind.

    You seem to think that they shouldn't tell they hotel what kind of people they're hosting.

    Do you honestly think the hotel canceled because they hadn't known what type of group they were dealing with until the protesters told them? Realistically, they canceled because they were afraid of protests and 'trouble' at the event. The protesters wouldn't even have to explicitly threaten this, even a hint of it would send any hotel running for the hills because, as tomwaterford points out, that stuff is catastrophic for business.


  • #784
    hatrickpatrick
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,798 ✭✭✭✭hatrickpatrick


    WinnyThePoo wrote: »
    Your problem is with the hotel.

    Partly, for caving. But I have a far bigger problem with those who believe ideologically that pressuring people into either silencing themselves or others is an ok thing to do. It's legal, but it's against the spirit of free speech and in my view in the context of democracy is absolutely scummy.

    Relevant analogy: I have a problem with Newstalk for cancelling Hook's show and suspending him, but I have a far bigger problem with those who pressured them into doing so, on the basis that they didn't like what he had to say.


  • #785
    The Legend Of Kira
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 726 ✭✭✭The Legend Of Kira


    I found this screenshot else, names & faces are blacked out- before ( Trinity People Before Profit ) deleted their post about taking down posters, one of the members said this

    "" Great work lads don,t give the anti choice side any space to manorevere  or organise "" .

    429118.jpg


    There you have in it in plain old english some people on the repeal side want to suppress democratic debate .


  • #786
    tomwaterford
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,768 ✭✭✭✭tomwaterford


    The Legend Of Kira wrote: »
    I found this screenshot else, names & faces are blacked out- before ( Trinity People Before Profit ) deleted their post about taking down posters, one of the members said this

    "" Great work lads don,t give the anti choice side any space to manorevere  or organise "" .

    429118.jpg


    There you have in it in plain old english some people on the repeal side want to suppress democratic debate .

    So nothing on supposed intimdation of the hotel then??
    No proof of existence of an online mob?



    How have the hotel not come out and commented on this story??


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  • #787
    hatrickpatrick
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,798 ✭✭✭✭hatrickpatrick


    To those who are defending pressuring the hotel into cancelling the event as "part of free speech", how would you feel about a group pressuring councils into banning certain parties from putting up posters at election time, or pressuring the companies who produce the posters into refusing to do so?

    How would you feel about the large printing companies agreeing, one by one, not to print posters from FF because of pressure from FG supporters? What if FG weren't able to have their Ard Fheis anywhere because FF supporters had successfully pressured every hotel with a large function room into not hosting them?


  • #788
    tomwaterford
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,768 ✭✭✭✭tomwaterford


    hatrickpatrick wrote: »
    To those who are defending pressuring the hotel into cancelling the event as "part of free speech", how would you feel about a group pressuring councils into banning certain parties from putting up posters at election time, or pressuring the companies who produce the posters into refusing to do so?

    How would you feel about the large printing companies agreeing, one by one, not to print posters from FF because of pressure from FG supporters? What if FG weren't able to have their Ard Feis anywhere because FF supporters had successfully pressured every hotel with a large function room into not hosting them?

    Perhaps you should look into the harassment sinn fein put up with for years and years?

    People being arrested for attending meeting and much much worse in the north


  • #789
    hatrickpatrick
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,798 ✭✭✭✭hatrickpatrick


    Regarding the hotel, I've been sent evidence of a post in a group with more than 40,000 people in it, asking people in the group to get involved in messaging the hotel's Facebook page:

    3GSP94x.jpg


  • #790
    hatrickpatrick
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,798 ✭✭✭✭hatrickpatrick


    tomwaterford wrote: »
    Perhaps you should look into the harassment sinn fein put up with for years and years?

    People being arrested for attending meeting and much much worse in the north

    I have just as much a problem with that. Just because it doesn't happen to be happening in my time, doesn't mean I don't have a problem with it.


  • #791
    The Legend Of Kira
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 726 ✭✭✭The Legend Of Kira


    tomwaterford wrote: »
    hatrickpatrick wrote: »
    To those who are defending pressuring the hotel into cancelling the event as "part of free speech", how would you feel about a group pressuring councils into banning certain parties from putting up posters at election time, or pressuring the companies who produce the posters into refusing to do so?

    How would you feel about the large printing companies agreeing, one by one, not to print posters from FF because of pressure from FG supporters? What if FG weren't able to have their Ard Feis anywhere because FF supporters had successfully pressured every hotel with a large function room into not hosting them?

    Perhaps you should look into the harassment sinn fein put up with for years and years?

    People being arrested for attending meeting and much much worse in the north
    Im 30+ and am old enough to remember the days of section 31 when Sinn Fein were censored in the media which I strongly disagree with, even I wouldn,t vote for Sinn Fein in an election I disapprove of them being censored in the past.


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  • #792
    hatrickpatrick
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,798 ✭✭✭✭hatrickpatrick


    Ok, this is another screenshot I've been sent - can we all agree that this is totally wrong in the context of free speech?

    RYxPhoV.png


  • #793
    The Legend Of Kira
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 726 ✭✭✭The Legend Of Kira


    hatrickpatrick wrote: »
    Ok, this is another screenshot I've been sent - can we all agree that this is totally wrong in the context of free speech?

    RYxPhoV.png
    I posted about that earlier today, disgraceful thuggish behaviour, I find it very telling that no public figure/political party from repeal side have publicly condemned this attempt to silence rape victims.


  • #794
    The Legend Of Kira
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 726 ✭✭✭The Legend Of Kira


    Ok to those who defend pressure venues into canceling political public meetings, whats your thoughts when the Bank of Ireland last year closed bank account for [font=Georgia, Arial, Verdana, sans-serif]IPSC ?[/font]


    [font=Georgia, Arial, Verdana, sans-serif]http://www.thejournal.ie/palestine-bank-of-ireland-close-account-3008036-Oct2016/[/font]


  • #795
    The Legend Of Kira
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 726 ✭✭✭The Legend Of Kira


    tomwaterford wrote: »
    The Legend Of Kira wrote: »
    I found this screenshot else, names & faces are blacked out- before ( Trinity People Before Profit ) deleted their post about taking down posters, one of the members said this

    "" Great work lads don,t give the anti choice side any space to manorevere  or organise "" .

    429118.jpg


    There you have in it in plain old english some people on the repeal side want to suppress democratic debate .

    So nothing on supposed intimdation of the hotel then??
    No proof of existence of an online mob?



    How have the hotel not come out and commented on this story??
    See post 789 by HatrickPatrick the sceensave from a facebook group, what other posts are in that secret facebook group I have to wonder .


  • #796
    The Legend Of Kira
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 726 ✭✭✭The Legend Of Kira


    Two tweets from Peader Toibin about this.

    https://twitter.com/Toibin1/status/913098939049660416

    Tweet 2 Im quoting what he said.

    "" They have threatened the hotel and the staff. ""

    https://twitter.com/Toibin1/status/913101299826200576


  • #797
    Permabear
    Closed Accounts Posts: 39,019 ✭✭✭✭Permabear


    This post has been deleted.


  • #798
    hatrickpatrick
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,798 ✭✭✭✭hatrickpatrick


    Permabear wrote: »
    This post had been deleted.

    There's plenty of evidence that it is. I've been given a few more screengrabs but I'm too lazy to post them tonight, it'll have to be tomorrow :D But the posts within the group are essentially a call to arms in effect. Someone links to the official FB page, Twitter, email or similar of the venue, and asks everyone else to pile in. One of them has a quote "The local pro choice branch has been informed and they're going to go hard at them". Another post from just after the announcement of the cancellation says "wonderful news - let's go after the UCD SU president now", a reference to the ongoing controversy about some sexual health leaflet which was being bandied around in UCD.

    I sincerely hope these people don't manage to tarnish the entire pro-choice movement with their authoritarian ideology. They didn't manage to do it with Gay Marriage, but if you read contemporaneous postings on this site, Reddit, Facebook etc, you'll find many people who were irritated enough by the yes side's coercive and harassing tactics that they seriously considered voting no out of spite. Not a mature reaction to immaturity, but at the end of the day it doesn't matter why people vote no if their votes swing the referendum, so if there's any campaign going to get these eejits to chill the f*ck out and campaign in a civilised, respectful manner, please for the love of God let's ramp it up. Immediately.


  • #799
    Annasopra
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,232 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    Army_of_One wrote: »
    I wonder if the chief zombie worshipper will time his visit to Ireland just before the referendum? Has he set a date yet?

    Pope Francis? I think that is not till June or July

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



  • #800
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 22,384 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    hatrickpatrick wrote: »
    Ok, this is another screenshot I've been sent - can we all agree that this is totally wrong in the context of free speech?

    RYxPhoV.png

    :)

    The truly desperate things kids do to pull the ladies. In my time it was a mixtape.

    The guy on the left who reminds me of Malcolm's friend with the breaking voice in Malcolm in the Middle cannot possibly be in third level. He looks about 12.

    You just know if one of the bigger parties sent out a few to take down PBP posters, they'd wet their pants and become even shriller.


  • #801
    Annasopra
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,232 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    tomwaterford wrote: »
    Perhaps you should look into the harassment sinn fein put up with for years and years?

    People being arrested for attending meeting and much much worse in the north

    And all the opposite too - the SF initimidation of their opponents through robbing posters etc - happened in the 26 counties quite a lot

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



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  • #802
    Will I Am Not
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,496 ✭✭✭Will I Am Not


    They should have used 2 people that might actually be affected by abortion in some shape or form in their lives.

    Using 2 lads that clearly have a lifetime membership at the virginity club is a bad move.


  • #803
    Annasopra
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,232 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    The Fake Sheikh wrote: »
    They should have used 2 people that might actually be affected by abortion in some shape or form in their lives.

    Using 2 lads that clearly have a lifetime membership at the virginity club is a bad move.
    Noone will remember these guys in 9 months time.

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



  • #804
    January
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,862 ✭✭✭✭January


    Let's see what people think of the anti-choice side erecting these (illegal) posters in Dublin city centre to try and make them look like the pro-choice side has put them up.

    Dirty tactics galore here...


  • #805
    _Dara_
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,971 ✭✭✭_Dara_


    January wrote: »
    Let's see what people think of the anti-choice side erecting these (illegal) posters in Dublin city centre to try and make them look like the pro-choice side has put them up.

    Dirty tactics galore here...

    Here's an embedded version of the above photo.

    Anti_choice.jpg


  • #806
    Human Sausage
    Closed Accounts Posts: 53 ✭✭Human Sausage


    Dirty tactics? The fuckers have gone back to ridiculous lies about their opponents.

    i.redd.it/cjkkyp5a7goz.jpg


  • #807
    optogirl
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,075 ✭✭✭optogirl


    _Dara_ wrote: »
    Here's an embedded version of the above photo.

    Anti_choice.jpg

    Really showing themselves capable of nuanced debate :rolleyes:


  • #808
    January
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,862 ✭✭✭✭January


    Human Sausage wrote: »
    Dirty tactics? The fuckers have gone back to ridiculous lies about their opponents.

    i.redd.it/cjkkyp5a7goz.jpg

    Yup, but it's the pro-choice side causing all the problems, right?


  • #809
    SafeSurfer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,725 ✭✭✭SafeSurfer


    January wrote: »
    Let's see what people think of the anti-choice side erecting these (illegal) posters in Dublin city centre to try and make them look like the pro-choice side has put them up.

    Dirty tactics galore here...

    In the spirit of the thread could you provide links to show members of the pro life campaign erecting the posters. Proof dear boy, proof as in the claims of hotel intimidation.

    Multo autem ad rem magis pertinet quallis tibi vide aris quam allis



  • #810
    optogirl
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,075 ✭✭✭optogirl


    January wrote: »
    Yup, but it's the pro-choice side causing all the problems, right?

    It'll be the same old tripe from here till May/June. One side is a torch wielding mob who LOVE abortions, the other concerned citizens with deeply held beliefs


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  • #811
    SafeSurfer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,725 ✭✭✭SafeSurfer


    It's pretty obvious that they are not from the pro choice side.

    The pro choice side mantra is:

    Every woman deserves a FREE abortion.

    Multo autem ad rem magis pertinet quallis tibi vide aris quam allis



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