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Pathfinder v Navara (Commercial)

  • 26-09-2017 9:12pm
    #1
    MourningWood
    Registered Users Posts: 24 ✭


    Hi lads I am looking at getting a 4x4 for a new business venture.

    It will need to be comfortable on long drives, reliable and good off road. I Intend fitting a snorkel, all terrain tyres and a winch.

    Ive heard a few bad things about Navaras and their engines and Suspensions so I am siding with the Pathfinder at the moment. Possibly year 2008-2010 with about 120,000 Kilometers.

    Any Advice would be appreciated.

    Pathfinder v Navara 2 votes

    Pathfinder
    0%
    Navara
    100%
    ballinadogMourningWood 2 votes


Comments

  • #2
    kay 9
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,676 ✭✭✭kay 9


    Why is the pajero, landcruiser, hilux, d-max, ranger and l200 etc etc not included?
    Don't know much about the pathfinder but I'm guessing it's built on the same chassis as the navara and for that reason I'd not have one.


  • #3
    MourningWood
    Registered Users Posts: 24 ✭MourningWood


    Navara
    kay 9 wrote: »
    Why is the pajero, landcruiser, hilux, d-max, ranger and l200 etc etc not included?
    Don't know much about the pathfinder but I'm guessing it's built on the same chassis as the navara and for that reason I'd not have one.

    Engine Size and Storage Space mainly. I wouldnt mind a Ranger either but wouldnt go near a Pajero, Landcruiser due to fuel efficiency. I was talking to a mechanic who worked for both Nissan and Toyota in the last 10 years and he said the Pathfinder would be the best all rounder, not to touch the Navara, and that anything above 2.5L would be a killer on fuel.

    Thanks for the reply


  • #4
    orm0nd
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,257 ✭✭✭orm0nd


    MourningWood wrote: »
    Engine Size and Storage Space mainly. I wouldnt mind a Ranger either but wouldnt go near a Pajero, Landcruiser due to fuel efficiency. I was talking to a mechanic who worked for both Nissan and Toyota in the last 10 years and he said the Pathfinder would be the best all rounder, not to touch the Navara, and that anything above 2.5L would be a killer on fuel.

    Thanks for the reply

    Need to change your mechanic that one is going you incorrect advise


  • #5
    CJhaughey
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,907 ✭✭✭✭CJhaughey


    Fuel is only a small part of the running costs of a vehicle.
    Reliability is much more important, especially if you plan on taking it offroad.


  • #6
    pete4130
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,944 ✭✭✭pete4130


    The Pathfinder is basically a 5 door Navara. They are both useless. I've had a Navara as a work vehicle for over a year. 2011 model, less than 100,000km on it. On long drives it just loses power and can't go over 60kmh on hills. No power. Really low clearance. Iv'e seen 2 Navaras lose their sump and I've lost mine. It's the lowest point of the vehicle. Not good off road. I also struggled to get 450km from a tank of diesel form the Navara.

    The turning circle is crap too. They aren't too uncomfortable but they are slow. Timing chains go on them. The back end of the chassis has issues of rust/fatigue and breaking (happened to another Navara on my job).

    I've got a 2015 Mitsubishi Triton now (L200). 68,000km and blows smoke of all colours depending on how hard you accelerate. Feels very light and tinny. Not that comfortable but has decent power and is better off road than the Navara.
    I currently get about 650-700km from the Triton/L200.

    I've driven Hilux for 5 years in remote Australia. By far the best of the bunch for pick up/utes.

    Rangers are the same as the Mazda BT50 (not available in Ireland). Lots of power but not that comfortable and they start to rattle a lot when they get older compared to the hilux. The new ranger also can't have its oil changed easily. If its drained for more than a few minutes, its a big job to sort out.

    Also, I've had Hilux get water in the fuel filters before due to a bad fuel bowser while working remotely in Australia and the warning light came on. Simply replaced fuel filter and the Hilux was good to go. The rangers in our fleet however....rusty fuel pumps, injectors and engine internals. $7K-$11K to repair them compared to swapping out the fuel filter in the Hilux.

    Landcruisers would be a top pick as well. Depending on the engine and maintenance of course. Solid and good off road.

    Aftermarket stuff is easier to get for Hilux and Landcruiser too.

    Do you really need a snorkel? Most 4x4's you mentioned have at least 600mm wading depth to ford water crossings. If you aren't going to cross water deeper than that, then a snorkel is cosmetic and expensive.

    The cost of a snorkel buys a lot of fuel.

    All Terrain tyres will affect your road noise AND fuel economy more so than going for an engine larger than 2.5L. AT tyres can be more expensive than regular highway tyres and if you aren't going off road much, highway tyres will be fine. AT tyres are designed to be 60% on road, 40% off road bias. Highway tyres are 80% on road, 20% off road bias.
    My old LandCruiser literally climbed a mountain on cheap Chinese 16x7 road tyres. Let the pressure down to increase your footprint and you can pretty much go anywhere.

    The cost of AT tyres could also buys a lot of fuel.

    Again, with a winch, its a lot of cost, extra weight for something you'll probably never use. A long handled shovel and set of recovery tracks usually does the job.

    I've currently got a Toyota Fortuner (5 door Hilux basically) with the 2.8 diesel engine. Great off road, get about 700km+ per tank. Have taken it into the sand dunes driving. Great off road, great on road, comfortable. Far superior to the Triton, Navara etc....


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  • #7
    CJhaughey
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,907 ✭✭✭✭CJhaughey


    Does the Fortuner have the 1KZ engine?


  • #8
    MourningWood
    Registered Users Posts: 24 ✭MourningWood


    Navara
    pete4130 wrote: »
    The Pathfinder is basically a 5 door Navara. They are both useless. I've had a Navara as a work vehicle for over a year. 2011 model, less than 100,000km on it. On long drives it just loses power and can't go over 60kmh on hills. No power. Really low clearance. Iv'e seen 2 Navaras lose their sump and I've lost mine. It's the lowest point of the vehicle. Not good off road. I also struggled to get 450km from a tank of diesel form the Navara.

    The turning circle is crap too. They aren't too uncomfortable but they are slow. Timing chains go on them. The back end of the chassis has issues of rust/fatigue and breaking (happened to another Navara on my job).

    I've got a 2015 Mitsubishi Triton now (L200). 68,000km and blows smoke of all colours depending on how hard you accelerate. Feels very light and tinny. Not that comfortable but has decent power and is better off road than the Navara.
    I currently get about 650-700km from the Triton/L200.

    I've driven Hilux for 5 years in remote Australia. By far the best of the bunch for pick up/utes.

    Rangers are the same as the Mazda BT50 (not available in Ireland). Lots of power but not that comfortable and they start to rattle a lot when they get older compared to the hilux. The new ranger also can't have its oil changed easily. If its drained for more than a few minutes, its a big job to sort out.

    Also, I've had Hilux get water in the fuel filters before due to a bad fuel bowser while working remotely in Australia and the warning light came on. Simply replaced fuel filter and the Hilux was good to go. The rangers in our fleet however....rusty fuel pumps, injectors and engine internals. $7K-$11K to repair them compared to swapping out the fuel filter in the Hilux.

    Landcruisers would be a top pick as well. Depending on the engine and maintenance of course. Solid and good off road.

    Aftermarket stuff is easier to get for Hilux and Landcruiser too.

    Do you really need a snorkel? Most 4x4's you mentioned have at least 600mm wading depth to ford water crossings. If you aren't going to cross water deeper than that, then a snorkel is cosmetic and expensive.

    The cost of a snorkel buys a lot of fuel.

    All Terrain tyres will affect your road noise AND fuel economy more so than going for an engine larger than 2.5L. AT tyres can be more expensive than regular highway tyres and if you aren't going off road much, highway tyres will be fine. AT tyres are designed to be 60% on road, 40% off road bias. Highway tyres are 80% on road, 20% off road bias.
    My old LandCruiser literally climbed a mountain on cheap Chinese 16x7 road tyres. Let the pressure down to increase your footprint and you can pretty much go anywhere.

    The cost of AT tyres could also buys a lot of fuel.

    Again, with a winch, its a lot of cost, extra weight for something you'll probably never use. A long handled shovel and set of recovery tracks usually does the job.

    I've currently got a Toyota Fortuner (5 door Hilux basically) with the 2.8 diesel engine. Great off road, get about 700km+ per tank. Have taken it into the sand dunes driving. Great off road, great on road, comfortable. Far superior to the Triton, Navara etc....

    Thanks for the reply very informative


  • #9
    pete4130
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,944 ✭✭✭pete4130


    CJhaughey wrote: »
    Does the Fortuner have the 1KZ engine?

    No. It's got the new 2.8 GD (Global Diesel) engine. From what I can tell, its labelled as a D4D engine in Ireland and the same engine thats in the new Hilux and Landcruiser (Prado 150 over here). It's got about 174hp & 420 Nm of torque so pulls really well.

    They are having lots of DPF issues in the new Hilux and Fortuner models over here. All sorted under warranty though. I've had no issues so far.

    Here's a few videos out on the sand dunes. I was impressed by its performance but that wouldn't be hard coming from an old 75 Series Landcruiser.

    https://vimeo.com/235702583

    https://vimeo.com/235702781


  • #10
    chicorytip
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,197 ✭✭✭chicorytip


    Land Rover Defender.


  • #11
    Testacalda
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 463 ✭✭Testacalda


    MourningWood wrote: »
    ... getting a 4x4 for a new business venture... need to be comfortable on long drives, reliable and good off road. I Intend fitting a snorkel, all terrain tyres and a winch.

    Out of curiosity what type of new business have you got planned? The requirement of a snorkel would suggest some pretty serious off roading!

    In answer to your question, I would choose neither the Pathfinder or the Navara. The Landcruiser or Pajero would be better in the long run. Also engine size is not the only thing that dictates fuel economy. I had a 2.5L Pajero that was just as hard on diesel as a 3.0L Landcruiser. A few MPG better or worse won't add up to much anyway, maintenance and repair will far outweigh it


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  • #12
    MourningWood
    Registered Users Posts: 24 ✭MourningWood


    Navara
    Testacalda wrote: »
    Out of curiosity what type of new business have you got planned? The requirement of a snorkel would suggest some pretty serious off roading!

    In answer to your question, I would choose neither the Pathfinder or the Navara. The Landcruiser or Pajero would be better in the long run. Also engine size is not the only thing that dictates fuel economy. I had a 2.5L Pajero that was just as hard on diesel as a 3.0L Landcruiser. A few MPG better or worse won't add up to much anyway, maintenance and repair will far outweigh it

    It would involve flood systems and visiting flooded areas in the winter months hence the reason for the snorkel. Nothing bought yet I am viewing a Pajero tomorrow alright. Decided to go for a bigger sized engine and more reliable brand


  • #13
    CJhaughey
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,907 ✭✭✭✭CJhaughey


    If you are going wading then you will need to think about raising breathers from diffs, transfer case and gearbox as well. Sucking dirty water into those parts gets expensive quickly..


  • #14
    TrailerBob
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,519 ✭✭✭TrailerBob


    Adding to the above, I would urge caution. The main reasons snorkels are fitted is for better air intake volume and velocity, as well as dust prevention. A Landcruiser can wade to 700mm out of the factory, and to be honest, wading much deeper than that is very questionable, snorkel or not. If it's standing water, god knows what's in there, if it's a river crossing, then that depth of flowing water can push a vehicle quite easily. If you regularly need to take a vehicle into greater water depths, consider a unimog, or a boat.


  • #15
    CJhaughey
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,907 ✭✭✭✭CJhaughey


    I have had Hiluxes and my KZJ 90 SWB with a bow wave over the bonnet, no bad came of it but I was very careful with fluid changes.
    I sold my 90 with 325k miles on it to a guy I know and still miss it, still looks great and he loves it. You can say a lot of things about Toyota now but those old pre D4D Landcruisers were as reliable as a hammer if maintained correctly.


  • #16
    pete4130
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,944 ✭✭✭pete4130


    The biggest concern when entering deep water when off roading is the temperature difference of the diffs being warm/hot from being worked and once they hit the cold water they cool the air and oil rapidly and suck the water inside.

    This happened to me a few years ago in my old Landcruiser Troopy. Hit a huge waterhole on a stretch of beach that looked like a shallow puddle. The whole truck pretty much went under with water up past the bottom of the windscreen. I just kept the foot down and came out the other side.

    About a year later, I was getting a new transfer case. Luckily the diffs & gearbox were ok but I got diff breathers installed on everything after that.


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