My whole summer's work in garden ruined my neighbours cows

RubyRoss · 22-09-2017 12:24am

I'm confused: If you're struggling to keep brambles at bay in your garden, how have cows caused thousands of euro in damage?

Maybe I'm missing something in your case, but it's not unusual for farm animals to wander into gardens. I've woken up to sheep, rabbits, and cows making a mess of the grass and the vegetables. It was annoying of course, but as long as it's not intentional or regular, I generally accept it as part of living in the country.

Also: no, you can't shoot his cows!

GoneHome · 22-09-2017 10:14am

RubyRoss wrote: »

I generally accept it as part of living in the country.

I agree with the above quote, I also live in the country and neighboring farm animals go hand in hand with it. I have a big garden and there have been a few occasions when either cattle or sheep have wandered onto the lawn. Yes, they do cause holes in the grass but all you need to do is fill them in with sand and if needed a little bit of lawn seed for regrowth in the parts they've trampled on, its no big deal and most certainly will not cost €1,000s to repair.

As you say you bought in the area recently, this farmer and his family have probably been there for generations. It's going to cause a very sour taste if you confront this farmer, and I would imagine that word would spread quickly within the neighborhood. Also, as the previous poster mentioned, under no circumstances should you shoot his animals.

Tell me how · 22-09-2017 10:23am

It's worth repeating. Do NOT shoot the animals. Do not even threaten to shoot them if you are speaking to the farmer.

I too am confused as to 1000's of euro damage on a garden that's half taken over by brambles.
Also, if you're using a lawnmower to keep Brambles at bay, it doesn't sound right.

I would suggest, ask a local landscaper to come and review both the damage and the brambles and ask them for practical solutions to improving everything.
You don't have money to spend on the work right now, but they could call in and give you advice on their way home some evening, for say €20.

Also, I would chat to the farmer and ask him what happened, but it an entirely friendly way and even if he says it was his animals I wouldn't chase him to be bringing tractors in. If cows damaged it, a tractor will destroy it and it will need to be entirely done from scratch (which is not the farmers responsibility).

As someone else said, you are relatively new here, these are your neighbours. It is worth making the effort to not tick anyone off. Could be useful to have a friend with a tractor in years to come.

star71 · 22-09-2017 10:43am

A cow broke through the fence from neighbouring field last week and trampled my lawn, we just filled the holes with some compost and grass seed, the farmer came over straight away and had the escape hole fixed up. Please don't shoot the cows or even think about it.

GoneHome · 22-09-2017 10:47am

MODS should this topic be moved to the "Accommodation and Property" forum, as it's not really specific to Cork County

Riskymove · 22-09-2017 10:54am

A landowner has not got the right to shoot a dog just for being on their land, its a little bit more complicated than that

freedominacup · 22-09-2017 10:58am

Riskymove wrote: »

A landowner has not got the right to shoot a dog just for being on their land, its a little bit more complicated than that

Yes I do pretty much have the right to shoot dogs straying on my land if I judge them to be a threat to livestock.

Riskymove · 22-09-2017 11:02am

freedominacup wrote: »

if I judge them to be a threat to livestock.

so it is then a bit more complicated than the dog just being on the farmers land

freedominacup · 22-09-2017 11:05am

Ian pilcher wrote: »

Hi and thankyou to everyone that reads this.
We moved to Ireland and eventually bought a place that was a mess unlived in for 4 years with a acre. I've been fighting brambles etc the whole summer and was finally getting it under control to the point we could keep over half of it under control with a push lawnmower.
I got a pic from my fiance at work tonight of our whole garden trampled by cows. We have a couple of farmers near us with cows but only one who walks them past our house who puts the chain up and down. I don't feel like I should have to chain myself in 4 times a day as I work splits. He obviously forgot to put the chain up today and his cows have trampled our garden and hasn't even come by, but left us to find this gutted doesnt even come close. My whole garden is ruined. I can't even control the brambles with are push mower it's that bad.

I would like to no 2 things
1. Is it possible to prove it was him as my fiance heard him passing and stopping for a period so we no it was him just never saw it. He has all the tractors etc to make it right. But I can't see this going to well if he did that! But that is all we want. For him to put it right (we will be knocking on his door tomorrow).
2. As I have spend alot of time fencing a portion of my land off as the farmers can shoot my dogs if their on his land which one would. Hench the fence. Can I shoot their cattle if they trespass on my land as I'm looking a €1000s already in damages that I don't have. I've tried researching this tonight but cant find any answers. As far as I'm concerned if he was as sneaky as to try to hide it as being him then I have no problem with the latter if it gets nasty. But I want to make sure;God hopping it don't get that far. But am I legally ok to do this if their causing me financal damages and their cows are trespassing as he can blatantly do with my dogs.

In short what are my rights as a home owner and what actions am I allowed to take if I find cattle on my land as his rights seemed to be covered with his cattle on his land?
Obviously I'm upset at the moment but I want to no where I stand.
Many Thanks

Contact the farmer though he should have contacted you. If he's even semi professional he will have public liability insurance specifically to cover this sort of eventuality. Any tome we have had a problem like this we simply give the householder our insurance company details and let them handle it from there. Otherwise you are just setting yourself up for long term hassle. Only been two incidents I can think of in thirty or so years. No problems with those neighbours afterwards. Farmer has a lot of the liability though I think there could be circumstances where his liability is reduced.

dilallio · 22-09-2017 11:09am

OP - You mention putting a chain up and down. Do you not have a gate?

freedominacup · 22-09-2017 11:15am

Riskymove wrote: »

so it is then a bit more complicated than the dog just being on the farmers land

In practical terms no. This is not O'Connell st in Dublin, there aren't likely to be too many witnesses to question my judgement.

Riskymove · 22-09-2017 11:20am

freedominacup wrote: »

In practical terms no.

well on practical terms, firstly there at least has to be livestock nearby right?

Tell me how · 22-09-2017 11:21am

freedominacup wrote:

In practical terms no. This is not O'Connell st in Dublin, there aren't likely to be too many witnesses to question my judgement.

Seriously, this is illegal, and of no help to the OP.

Why would you want to shoot an animal that is not threatening your livestock?

Riskymove · 22-09-2017 11:25am

Tell me how wrote: »

Seriously, this is illegal, and of no help to the OP.

Why would you want to shoot an animal that is not threatening your livestock?

tbh that just struck me too.

I was talking about the legal right under the law he is talking about getting away with an illegal act due to a lack of witnesses - 2 very different things

gctest50 · 22-09-2017 11:28am

Riskymove wrote: »

well on practical terms, firstly there at least has to be livestock nearby right?

It's a threat to the sheepdog ( essential part of the show)....... so it gets shot

22-09-2017 11:29am

Take a step back before confronting your neighbour.

Estimate how much damage was done, take pictures, note it all down.

Are you sure it was this neighbour?
It could have been someone else moving cattle.
They might have broken out from somewhere.

How have relations with this neighbour and your other neighbours been generally?

Whatever happens if you value your garden get a gate and keep it closed - cattle shouldn't wander in but it shouldn't be easy for them either.

freedominacup · 22-09-2017 11:35am

Tell me how wrote: »

Seriously, this is illegal, and of no help to the OP.

Why would you want to shoot an animal that is not threatening your livestock?

The op asked a totally different question I've tried to answer it. Other posters seem to be intent on derailing the thread but at the same time I'd appreciate a link to show when the law on farmers and stray dogs was changed.

Basically to answer your question imv a stray dog on my land is either coming from doing harm or on his way to do harm so I'd be using the precautionary principle. I have absolutely no regard or concern for someone else's dog esp having seen the damage strays can do. The last incident here cost thousands in vet fees and consequential losses not to mention a lot of suffering to blameless animals. Needless to say the fool who owned the dogs in question had no insurance to cover damages his livestock might cause.

looksee · 22-09-2017 11:39am

We had this situation and you just have to accept that is it part of living in the country. The best solution is to put in a cattle grid, saves you messing with a chain or gate.

Certainly getting aggressive with neighbours is really a bad idea and if you can't deal with the issues then you should maybe think in terms of moving to a less rural area.

Tell me how · 22-09-2017 11:41am

freedominacup wrote: »

The op asked a totally different question I've tried to answer it. Other posters seem to be intent on derailing the thread but at the same time I'd appreciate a link to show when the law on farmers and stray dogs was changed.

Basically to answer your question imv a stray dog on my land is either coming from doing harm or on his way to do harm so I'd be using the precautionary principle. I have absolutely no regard or concern for someone else's dog esp having seen the damage strays can do. The last incident here cost thousands in vet fees and consequential losses not to mention a lot of suffering to blameless animals. Needless to say the fool who owned the dogs in question had no insurance to cover damages his livestock might cause.

I get it. It's your right. Shoot first. Ask questions later.
You're the one who made the point about there being no witnesses.

I'm out.

alfaromeo84 · 22-09-2017 11:49am

RubyRoss wrote: »

I I generally accept it as part of living in the country.

I am bred, born and raised in the country, but this statement just annoys me, because it's the same as saying that if you live in a housing estate, that you have to accept late night drunken parties, and nightmare neighbours.

Riskymove · 22-09-2017 11:50am

freedominacup wrote: »

Other posters seem to be intent on derailing the thread but at the same time I'd appreciate a link to show when the law on farmers and stray dogs was changed.

I don't know who is supposed to be derailing the thread

The OP wanted to know if he could shoot cows for being on his land as the farmer could shoot his dog for being on his land.

I simply pointed out that people cannot just shoot a dog for being on land they own. The law is pretty clear that it has to be as a last resort and that the dog is worrying or about to worry livestock and there is no other reasonable action that can be taken

That is the law so the OP cannot just shoot cows for being in his garden and others cannot shoot a dog just for being on land they own.

jcd5971 · 22-09-2017 11:56am

Don't shoot the bloody cows that will go very very badly If you do.

Try actually talking to the farmer, most are reasonable enough in fairness.

As for the fella saying he can shoot a dog on his land whenever he wants, not entirely true its complicated, can cause awful trouble as well, you would want to be very sure your herd would be at risk to do it.

Also the farmer is supposed to be in control of his herd, I know of a local case where it ended up in court, farmer had to pay damages.
But the bad blood it caused was never worth it.

Your new to the area as you said and not Irish I'm guessing as you said you moved to the country.
( in no way a bad thing BTW)

You will have to be vary wary of your actions here, handle this badly and you will turn a whole community off you for years to come.

My advice calm and cool and approach farmer to talk.

silly · 22-09-2017 12:03pm

Shooting cows because they will ruin your bramble filled garden..are you actually serious? Are you licenced to own a gun? Speak to the farmer for god sake.

masculinist · 22-09-2017 12:22pm

freedominacup wrote: »

Yes I do pretty much have the right to shoot dogs straying on my land if I judge them to be a threat to livestock.

So if a farmer can shoot a dog because the dog is a threat to the farmers' property then why cant a home owner shoot a cow or farm animal which is judged a threat to the home owners' property ? ( Im playing devils advocate here as Id never shoot an animal and would rather let it trample some flowers than even consider that)
I understand the farmer has probably been there for generations but he still should be responsible for his animals, particularly the large ones and shouldnt have the right to turn a blind eye while they damage private property. He should have a fence around any place he keeps them - if it looks likely they will be a nuisance to other private property holders.

CruelCoin · 22-09-2017 12:30pm

OP, do you not have a hedge/gate into your garden??

Aint Eazy Being Cheezy · 22-09-2017 12:31pm

masculinist wrote: »

So if a farmer can shoot a dog because the dog is a threat to the farmers' property then why cant a home owner shoot a cow or farm animal which is judged a threat to the home owners' property ? ( Im playing devils advocate here as Id never shoot an animal and would rather let it trample some flowers than even consider that)
I understand the farmer has probably been there for generations but he still should be responsible for his animals, particularly the large ones and shouldnt have the right to turn a blind eye while they damage private property. He should have a fence around any place he keeps them - if it looks likely they will be a nuisance to other private property holders.

Because this isn't America. Thanks be to jaysis.

Del2005 · 22-09-2017 12:35pm

masculinist wrote: »

So if a farmer can shoot a dog because the dog is a threat to the farmers' property then why cant a home owner shoot a cow or farm animal which is judged a threat to the home owners' property ? ( Im playing devils advocate here as Id never shoot an animal and would rather let it trample some flowers than even consider that)
I understand the farmer has probably been there for generations but he still should be responsible for his animals, particularly the large ones and shouldnt have the right to turn a blind eye while they damage private property. He should have a fence around any place he keeps them - if it looks likely they will be a nuisance to other private property holders.

Dogs attack livestock for fun. Cows only react when threatened, or think they are. More importantly is the law allows a farmer shoot dogs worrying their livestock, there's no law allowing a home owner shoot livestock.

OP it's a tough one. If the cattle had broken in from a field it'd be 100% the farmers fault, but because you didn't secure your property from the road I can't see how the farmer is to blame especially since chasing cattle out from around a house is never easy. You need to secure your access points, the farmer putting up the chain was doing you a favour.

knipex · 22-09-2017 1:46pm

Ian pilcher wrote: »

Hi and thankyou to everyone that reads this.
We moved to Ireland and eventually bought a place that was a mess unlived in for 4 years with a acre. I've been fighting brambles etc the whole summer and was finally getting it under control to the point we could keep over half of it under control with a push lawnmower.
I got a pic from my fiance at work tonight of our whole garden trampled by cows. We have a couple of farmers near us with cows but only one who walks them past our house who puts the chain up and down. I don't feel like I should have to chain myself in 4 times a day as I work splits. He obviously forgot to put the chain up today and his cows have trampled our garden and hasn't even come by, but left us to find this gutted doesnt even come close. My whole garden is ruined. I can't even control the brambles with are push mower it's that bad.

I would like to no 2 things
1. Is it possible to prove it was him as my fiance heard him passing and stopping for a period so we no it was him just never saw it. He has all the tractors etc to make it right. But I can't see this going to well if he did that! But that is all we want. For him to put it right (we will be knocking on his door tomorrow).
2. As I have spend alot of time fencing a portion of my land off as the farmers can shoot my dogs if their on his land which one would. Hench the fence. Can I shoot their cattle if they trespass on my land as I'm looking a €1000s already in damages that I don't have. I've tried researching this tonight but cant find any answers. As far as I'm concerned if he was as sneaky as to try to hide it as being him then I have no problem with the latter if it gets nasty. But I want to make sure;God hopping it don't get that far. But am I legally ok to do this if their causing me financal damages and their cows are trespassing as he can blatantly do with my dogs.

In short what are my rights as a home owner and what actions am I allowed to take if I find cattle on my land as his rights seemed to be covered with his cattle on his land?
Obviously I'm upset at the moment but I want to no where I stand.
Many Thanks

You are going to LOVE rural living...

freedominacup · 22-09-2017 4:48pm

masculinist wrote: »

I understand the farmer has probably been there for generations but he still should be responsible for his animals, particularly the large ones and shouldnt have the right to turn a blind eye while they damage private property. He should have a fence around any place he keeps them - if it looks likely they will be a nuisance to other private property holders.

I completely agree with you and I'd also add once again that the farmer should have insurance to cover the probability that at some stage some of his stock may cause damage having strayed.

Ginger83 · 22-09-2017 5:57pm

freedominacup wrote: »

In practical terms no. This is not O'Connell st in Dublin, there aren't likely to be too many witnesses to question my judgement.

I'll tell you what this leads to....

We knew a guy who's wife had a pup, she doted over this yolk like a child. It wouldn't harm a fly but used to pop into a nearby field to pee, etc. Landowner shot it one day claiming it chased his sheep, upon confrontation he laughed in the lady's face.

Now all we know about what happened after this was this farmer had alot of lambs go missing, the pup owner had a butcher in the family so you can put 2 and 2 together.

freedominacup...lack of witnesses works both ways i suppose.

My whole summer's work in garden ruined my neighbours cows

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