My whole summer's work in garden ruined my neighbours cows

Ian pilcher

rs

RubyRoss

I'm confused: If you're struggling to keep brambles at bay in your garden, how have cows caused thousands of euro in damage?

Maybe I'm missing something in your case, but it's not unusual for farm animals to wander into gardens. I've woken up to sheep, rabbits, and cows making a mess of the grass and the vegetables. It was annoying of course, but as long as it's not intentional or regular, I generally accept it as part of living in the country.

Also: no, you can't shoot his cows!

GoneHome

RubyRoss wrote: »

I generally accept it as part of living in the country.

I agree with the above quote, I also live in the country and neighboring farm animals go hand in hand with it. I have a big garden and there have been a few occasions when either cattle or sheep have wandered onto the lawn. Yes, they do cause holes in the grass but all you need to do is fill them in with sand and if needed a little bit of lawn seed for regrowth in the parts they've trampled on, its no big deal and most certainly will not cost €1,000s to repair.

As you say you bought in the area recently, this farmer and his family have probably been there for generations. It's going to cause a very sour taste if you confront this farmer, and I would imagine that word would spread quickly within the neighborhood. Also, as the previous poster mentioned, under no circumstances should you shoot his animals.

Tell me how

It's worth repeating. Do NOT shoot the animals. Do not even threaten to shoot them if you are speaking to the farmer.

I too am confused as to 1000's of euro damage on a garden that's half taken over by brambles.
Also, if you're using a lawnmower to keep Brambles at bay, it doesn't sound right.

I would suggest, ask a local landscaper to come and review both the damage and the brambles and ask them for practical solutions to improving everything.
You don't have money to spend on the work right now, but they could call in and give you advice on their way home some evening, for say €20.

Also, I would chat to the farmer and ask him what happened, but it an entirely friendly way and even if he says it was his animals I wouldn't chase him to be bringing tractors in. If cows damaged it, a tractor will destroy it and it will need to be entirely done from scratch (which is not the farmers responsibility).

As someone else said, you are relatively new here, these are your neighbours. It is worth making the effort to not tick anyone off. Could be useful to have a friend with a tractor in years to come.

star71

A cow broke through the fence from neighbouring field last week and trampled my lawn, we just filled the holes with some compost and grass seed, the farmer came over straight away and had the escape hole fixed up. Please don't shoot the cows or even think about it.

GoneHome

MODS should this topic be moved to the "Accommodation and Property" forum, as it's not really specific to Cork County

Riskymove

A landowner has not got the right to shoot a dog just for being on their land, its a little bit more complicated than that

freedominacup

Riskymove wrote: »

A landowner has not got the right to shoot a dog just for being on their land, its a little bit more complicated than that

Yes I do pretty much have the right to shoot dogs straying on my land if I judge them to be a threat to livestock.

Riskymove

freedominacup wrote: »

if I judge them to be a threat to livestock.

so it is then a bit more complicated than the dog just being on the farmers land

freedominacup

Ian pilcher wrote: »

Hi and thankyou to everyone that reads this.
We moved to Ireland and eventually bought a place that was a mess unlived in for 4 years with a acre. I've been fighting brambles etc the whole summer and was finally getting it under control to the point we could keep over half of it under control with a push lawnmower.
I got a pic from my fiance at work tonight of our whole garden trampled by cows. We have a couple of farmers near us with cows but only one who walks them past our house who puts the chain up and down. I don't feel like I should have to chain myself in 4 times a day as I work splits. He obviously forgot to put the chain up today and his cows have trampled our garden and hasn't even come by, but left us to find this gutted doesnt even come close. My whole garden is ruined. I can't even control the brambles with are push mower it's that bad.

I would like to no 2 things
1. Is it possible to prove it was him as my fiance heard him passing and stopping for a period so we no it was him just never saw it. He has all the tractors etc to make it right. But I can't see this going to well if he did that! But that is all we want. For him to put it right (we will be knocking on his door tomorrow).
2. As I have spend alot of time fencing a portion of my land off as the farmers can shoot my dogs if their on his land which one would. Hench the fence. Can I shoot their cattle if they trespass on my land as I'm looking a €1000s already in damages that I don't have. I've tried researching this tonight but cant find any answers. As far as I'm concerned if he was as sneaky as to try to hide it as being him then I have no problem with the latter if it gets nasty. But I want to make sure;God hopping it don't get that far. But am I legally ok to do this if their causing me financal damages and their cows are trespassing as he can blatantly do with my dogs.

In short what are my rights as a home owner and what actions am I allowed to take if I find cattle on my land as his rights seemed to be covered with his cattle on his land?
Obviously I'm upset at the moment but I want to no where I stand.
Many Thanks

Contact the farmer though he should have contacted you. If he's even semi professional he will have public liability insurance specifically to cover this sort of eventuality. Any tome we have had a problem like this we simply give the householder our insurance company details and let them handle it from there. Otherwise you are just setting yourself up for long term hassle. Only been two incidents I can think of in thirty or so years. No problems with those neighbours afterwards. Farmer has a lot of the liability though I think there could be circumstances where his liability is reduced.

dilallio

OP - You mention putting a chain up and down. Do you not have a gate?

freedominacup

Riskymove wrote: »

so it is then a bit more complicated than the dog just being on the farmers land

In practical terms no. This is not O'Connell st in Dublin, there aren't likely to be too many witnesses to question my judgement.

Riskymove

freedominacup wrote: »

In practical terms no.

well on practical terms, firstly there at least has to be livestock nearby right?

Tell me how

freedominacup wrote:

In practical terms no. This is not O'Connell st in Dublin, there aren't likely to be too many witnesses to question my judgement.

Seriously, this is illegal, and of no help to the OP.

Why would you want to shoot an animal that is not threatening your livestock?

Riskymove

Tell me how wrote: »

Seriously, this is illegal, and of no help to the OP.

Why would you want to shoot an animal that is not threatening your livestock?

tbh that just struck me too.

I was talking about the legal right under the law he is talking about getting away with an illegal act due to a lack of witnesses - 2 very different things

gctest50

Riskymove wrote: »

well on practical terms, firstly there at least has to be livestock nearby right?

It's a threat to the sheepdog ( essential part of the show)....... so it gets shot

Take a step back before confronting your neighbour.

Estimate how much damage was done, take pictures, note it all down.

Are you sure it was this neighbour?
It could have been someone else moving cattle.
They might have broken out from somewhere.

How have relations with this neighbour and your other neighbours been generally?

Whatever happens if you value your garden get a gate and keep it closed - cattle shouldn't wander in but it shouldn't be easy for them either.

freedominacup

Tell me how wrote: »

Seriously, this is illegal, and of no help to the OP.

Why would you want to shoot an animal that is not threatening your livestock?

The op asked a totally different question I've tried to answer it. Other posters seem to be intent on derailing the thread but at the same time I'd appreciate a link to show when the law on farmers and stray dogs was changed.

Basically to answer your question imv a stray dog on my land is either coming from doing harm or on his way to do harm so I'd be using the precautionary principle. I have absolutely no regard or concern for someone else's dog esp having seen the damage strays can do. The last incident here cost thousands in vet fees and consequential losses not to mention a lot of suffering to blameless animals. Needless to say the fool who owned the dogs in question had no insurance to cover damages his livestock might cause.

looksee

We had this situation and you just have to accept that is it part of living in the country. The best solution is to put in a cattle grid, saves you messing with a chain or gate.

Certainly getting aggressive with neighbours is really a bad idea and if you can't deal with the issues then you should maybe think in terms of moving to a less rural area.

Tell me how

freedominacup wrote: »

The op asked a totally different question I've tried to answer it. Other posters seem to be intent on derailing the thread but at the same time I'd appreciate a link to show when the law on farmers and stray dogs was changed.

Basically to answer your question imv a stray dog on my land is either coming from doing harm or on his way to do harm so I'd be using the precautionary principle. I have absolutely no regard or concern for someone else's dog esp having seen the damage strays can do. The last incident here cost thousands in vet fees and consequential losses not to mention a lot of suffering to blameless animals. Needless to say the fool who owned the dogs in question had no insurance to cover damages his livestock might cause.

I get it. It's your right. Shoot first. Ask questions later.
You're the one who made the point about there being no witnesses.

I'm out.

alfaromeo84

RubyRoss wrote: »

I I generally accept it as part of living in the country.

I am bred, born and raised in the country, but this statement just annoys me, because it's the same as saying that if you live in a housing estate, that you have to accept late night drunken parties, and nightmare neighbours.

Riskymove

freedominacup wrote: »

Other posters seem to be intent on derailing the thread but at the same time I'd appreciate a link to show when the law on farmers and stray dogs was changed.

I don't know who is supposed to be derailing the thread

The OP wanted to know if he could shoot cows for being on his land as the farmer could shoot his dog for being on his land.

I simply pointed out that people cannot just shoot a dog for being on land they own. The law is pretty clear that it has to be as a last resort and that the dog is worrying or about to worry livestock and there is no other reasonable action that can be taken

That is the law so the OP cannot just shoot cows for being in his garden and others cannot shoot a dog just for being on land they own.

jcd5971

Don't shoot the bloody cows that will go very very badly If you do.

Try actually talking to the farmer, most are reasonable enough in fairness.

As for the fella saying he can shoot a dog on his land whenever he wants, not entirely true its complicated, can cause awful trouble as well, you would want to be very sure your herd would be at risk to do it.


Also the farmer is supposed to be in control of his herd, I know of a local case where it ended up in court, farmer had to pay damages.
But the bad blood it caused was never worth it.

Your new to the area as you said and not Irish I'm guessing as you said you moved to the country.
( in no way a bad thing BTW)

You will have to be vary wary of your actions here, handle this badly and you will turn a whole community off you for years to come.

My advice calm and cool and approach farmer to talk.

silly

Shooting cows because they will ruin your bramble filled garden..are you actually serious? Are you licenced to own a gun? Speak to the farmer for god sake.

masculinist

freedominacup wrote: »

Yes I do pretty much have the right to shoot dogs straying on my land if I judge them to be a threat to livestock.

So if a farmer can shoot a dog because the dog is a threat to the farmers' property then why cant a home owner shoot a cow or farm animal which is judged a threat to the home owners' property ? ( Im playing devils advocate here as Id never shoot an animal and would rather let it trample some flowers than even consider that)
I understand the farmer has probably been there for generations but he still should be responsible for his animals, particularly the large ones and shouldnt have the right to turn a blind eye while they damage private property. He should have a fence around any place he keeps them - if it looks likely they will be a nuisance to other private property holders.

CruelCoin

OP, do you not have a hedge/gate into your garden??

Aint Eazy Being Cheezy

masculinist wrote: »

So if a farmer can shoot a dog because the dog is a threat to the farmers' property then why cant a home owner shoot a cow or farm animal which is judged a threat to the home owners' property ? ( Im playing devils advocate here as Id never shoot an animal and would rather let it trample some flowers than even consider that)
I understand the farmer has probably been there for generations but he still should be responsible for his animals, particularly the large ones and shouldnt have the right to turn a blind eye while they damage private property. He should have a fence around any place he keeps them - if it looks likely they will be a nuisance to other private property holders.

Because this isn't America. Thanks be to jaysis.

Del2005

masculinist wrote: »

So if a farmer can shoot a dog because the dog is a threat to the farmers' property then why cant a home owner shoot a cow or farm animal which is judged a threat to the home owners' property ? ( Im playing devils advocate here as Id never shoot an animal and would rather let it trample some flowers than even consider that)
I understand the farmer has probably been there for generations but he still should be responsible for his animals, particularly the large ones and shouldnt have the right to turn a blind eye while they damage private property. He should have a fence around any place he keeps them - if it looks likely they will be a nuisance to other private property holders.

Dogs attack livestock for fun. Cows only react when threatened, or think they are. More importantly is the law allows a farmer shoot dogs worrying their livestock, there's no law allowing a home owner shoot livestock.


OP it's a tough one. If the cattle had broken in from a field it'd be 100% the farmers fault, but because you didn't secure your property from the road I can't see how the farmer is to blame especially since chasing cattle out from around a house is never easy. You need to secure your access points, the farmer putting up the chain was doing you a favour.

knipex

Ian pilcher wrote: »

Hi and thankyou to everyone that reads this.
We moved to Ireland and eventually bought a place that was a mess unlived in for 4 years with a acre. I've been fighting brambles etc the whole summer and was finally getting it under control to the point we could keep over half of it under control with a push lawnmower.
I got a pic from my fiance at work tonight of our whole garden trampled by cows. We have a couple of farmers near us with cows but only one who walks them past our house who puts the chain up and down. I don't feel like I should have to chain myself in 4 times a day as I work splits. He obviously forgot to put the chain up today and his cows have trampled our garden and hasn't even come by, but left us to find this gutted doesnt even come close. My whole garden is ruined. I can't even control the brambles with are push mower it's that bad.

I would like to no 2 things
1. Is it possible to prove it was him as my fiance heard him passing and stopping for a period so we no it was him just never saw it. He has all the tractors etc to make it right. But I can't see this going to well if he did that! But that is all we want. For him to put it right (we will be knocking on his door tomorrow).
2. As I have spend alot of time fencing a portion of my land off as the farmers can shoot my dogs if their on his land which one would. Hench the fence. Can I shoot their cattle if they trespass on my land as I'm looking a €1000s already in damages that I don't have. I've tried researching this tonight but cant find any answers. As far as I'm concerned if he was as sneaky as to try to hide it as being him then I have no problem with the latter if it gets nasty. But I want to make sure;God hopping it don't get that far. But am I legally ok to do this if their causing me financal damages and their cows are trespassing as he can blatantly do with my dogs.

In short what are my rights as a home owner and what actions am I allowed to take if I find cattle on my land as his rights seemed to be covered with his cattle on his land?
Obviously I'm upset at the moment but I want to no where I stand.
Many Thanks

You are going to LOVE rural living...

freedominacup

masculinist wrote: »

I understand the farmer has probably been there for generations but he still should be responsible for his animals, particularly the large ones and shouldnt have the right to turn a blind eye while they damage private property. He should have a fence around any place he keeps them - if it looks likely they will be a nuisance to other private property holders.

I completely agree with you and I'd also add once again that the farmer should have insurance to cover the probability that at some stage some of his stock may cause damage having strayed.

Ginger83

freedominacup wrote: »

In practical terms no. This is not O'Connell st in Dublin, there aren't likely to be too many witnesses to question my judgement.

I'll tell you what this leads to....

We knew a guy who's wife had a pup, she doted over this yolk like a child. It wouldn't harm a fly but used to pop into a nearby field to pee, etc. Landowner shot it one day claiming it chased his sheep, upon confrontation he laughed in the lady's face.

Now all we know about what happened after this was this farmer had alot of lambs go missing, the pup owner had a butcher in the family so you can put 2 and 2 together.

freedominacup...lack of witnesses works both ways i suppose.

Ginger83

Ian pilcher wrote: »

Hi and thankyou to everyone that reads this.
We moved to Ireland and eventually bought a place that was a mess unlived in for 4 years with a acre. I've been fighting brambles etc the whole summer and was finally getting it under control to the point we could keep over half of it under control with a push lawnmower.
I got a pic from my fiance at work tonight of our whole garden trampled by cows. We have a couple of farmers near us with cows but only one who walks them past our house who puts the chain up and down. I don't feel like I should have to chain myself in 4 times a day as I work splits. He obviously forgot to put the chain up today and his cows have trampled our garden and hasn't even come by, but left us to find this gutted doesnt even come close. My whole garden is ruined. I can't even control the brambles with are push mower it's that bad.

I would like to no 2 things
1. Is it possible to prove it was him as my fiance heard him passing and stopping for a period so we no it was him just never saw it. He has all the tractors etc to make it right. But I can't see this going to well if he did that! But that is all we want. For him to put it right (we will be knocking on his door tomorrow).
2. As I have spend alot of time fencing a portion of my land off as the farmers can shoot my dogs if their on his land which one would. Hench the fence. Can I shoot their cattle if they trespass on my land as I'm looking a €1000s already in damages that I don't have. I've tried researching this tonight but cant find any answers. As far as I'm concerned if he was as sneaky as to try to hide it as being him then I have no problem with the latter if it gets nasty. But I want to make sure;God hopping it don't get that far. But am I legally ok to do this if their causing me financal damages and their cows are trespassing as he can blatantly do with my dogs.

In short what are my rights as a home owner and what actions am I allowed to take if I find cattle on my land as his rights seemed to be covered with his cattle on his land?
Obviously I'm upset at the moment but I want to no where I stand.
Many Thanks

OP we had 3 horses break out of a field near us. Our gate was open and they ruined a newly laid lawn. We held onto them until the owner was located.

He came to take them away without so much as looking at damage or an apology so i said hey buddy i expect this lawn to be fixed.

Got the no bother answer, gave it 2 weeks and no effort made, couldn't get hold of him, always out or busy so i went to his one night and told the wife i had a landscaper booked to relay the whole lawn and to expect a bill.

He was at ours at 8am the next morning.

Most farmers/landowners are 100%, a few think they're above the law and own the place but when they think its gona cost them they are very approachable.

Pygmy Shrew

As far as I know it is the property owner who has the obligation to maintain stockproof fencing and gates to prevent animals straying in off the road. I had reason to enquire about a similar matter in the last few years and this is what I was told.

freedominacup

Pygmy Shrew wrote: »

As far as I know it is the property owner who has the obligation to maintain stockproof fencing and gates to prevent animals straying in off the road. I had reason to enquire about a similar matter in the last few years and this is what I was told.

The stockproof fencing is a bit like the one about my judgement and the witnesses. I'd rather be covered for the liability. One man's stockproof is another man's sceach in the gap and two bits of baler twine. A couple of sites on land we bought have post and rail fencing on their boundaries. We put a stockproof fence outside this because p&r fencing is nothing more than a scratching post to cattle. We lose nothing by it as the cattle can graze into the edge of the p&r by reaching under our fence.

Ginger83

Pygmy Shrew wrote: »

As far as I know it is the property owner who has the obligation to maintain stockproof fencing and gates to prevent animals straying in off the road. I had reason to enquire about a similar matter in the last few years and this is what I was told.

I would have thought the onus was on the animal owner to have control of his/her animals.

Lets say you are driving along and meet cows on the road coming from milking so you stop to let them past but 1 damages your car.

What happens then?

freedominacup

Ginger83 wrote: »

I would have thought the onus was on the animal owner to have control of his/her animals.

Lets say you are driving along and meet cows on the road coming from milking so you stop to let them past but 1 damages your car.

What happens then?

Usually a claim against insurance. Farmer should be covered if he has adequate numbers of experienced people herding the stock but in practice claims are paid.

Ginger83

freedominacup wrote: »

Usually a claim against insurance. Farmer should be covered if he has adequate numbers of experienced people herding the stock but in practice claims are paid.

Fair point, we've a farm locally where cows leave parlour and walked unattended 300-400M down the road to a field.

gctest50

Ginger83 wrote: »

........

We knew a guy who's wife had a pup, she doted over this yolk like a child. It wouldn't harm a fly but used to pop into a nearby field to pee, etc.......

Why would you let that happen on a repeated basis ?

A farm is basically someones giant open-air factory - you wouldn't crap on the floor of the local factory if they were having an recruitment day ?

Laura Higham, a veterinary surgeon at Food Animal Initiative (FAI), believes neospora is an underrated threat to the farming community, telling me it's the "leading cause of abortion in cattle in the UK." Higham herself has experienced first-hand the devastating consequences of an infected herd, as the cattle reared on the commercial beef farm at the FAI were affected by the disease earlier this year.

When dogs **** in farmer's fields and pregnant cattle graze on the grass, they ingest the parasite, causing them to abort or give birth to calves infected with the disease for life.

"Around 5 percent of our cattle aborted this year due to the disease, and it is estimated by DairyCo to cost the average herd £3,000 per year due to abortions, reduced milk yields, and poor fertility," Higham tells me. "It presents a significant constraint to sustainable cattle production in the UK. It can be a devastating disease when a herd first becomes infected, causing so-called 'abortion storms', and cows remain infected for life with no treatment or vaccine available."

http://bit.ly/2fmY0nh

Ginger83

gctest50 wrote: »

Why would you let that happen on a repeated basis ?

A farm is basically someones giant open-air factory - you wouldn't crap on the floor of the local factory if they were having an recruitment day ?

Wasn't any of my business, wouldn't have deemed it necessary to shoot a pup over it though. A chat would have been more civil.

Lia_lia

This thread is ridiculous!

Ginger83

Lia_lia wrote: »

This thread is ridiculous!

Why? A man's property was damaged and he's looking for advice on getting it repaired.

RubyRoss

alfaromeo84 wrote: »

I am bred, born and raised in the country, but this statement just annoys me, because it's the same as saying that if you live in a housing estate, that you have to accept late night drunken parties, and nightmare neighbours.

But if you live in a housing estate, it would absurd to expect that you should never have to hear your neighbours just like it's absurd to live beside a farm and expect that animals won't ever wander into your garden. That doesn't imply that anyone - rural or urban - should just accept nightmare neighbours.

dev100

Ian pilcher wrote:

Hi and thankyou to everyone that reads this. We moved to Ireland and eventually bought a place that was a mess unlived in for 4 years with a acre. I've been fighting brambles etc the whole summer and was finally getting it under control to the point we could keep over half of it under control with a push lawnmower. I got a pic from my fiance at work tonight of our whole garden trampled by cows. We have a couple of farmers near us with cows but only one who walks them past our house who puts the chain up and down. I don't feel like I should have to chain myself in 4 times a day as I work splits. He obviously forgot to put the chain up today and his cows have trampled our garden and hasn't even come by, but left us to find this gutted doesnt even come close. My whole garden is ruined. I can't even control the brambles with are push mower it's that bad.

You might as well fill in the holes yourself . You have physical proof it was a particular farmer and his cattle that caused the damage. You are wasting your time as you've no proof. Was your garden built by a landscaper or was every shrub eating etc that it's gonna cost thousands to put right.

My advice get yourself a set of gates or cattle grid. Most normal farmers are ordinary decent folk and don't want to deal with irate neighbours or deal with issues which is gonna cost money. My neighbours are farmers and regularly walk cattle and sheep past the house and will always shut the gates before the animals come by or one the lads will stand in drive way. We'd even go out and give the farmers a hand and be a bit neighbourly. Found a freisin bull in the yard one day let's say I left him to it .

I also think you can't put an animal to the road either even it's on your property and not yours as you become liable it causes an accident when you put it back out onto the road . Could be wrong on that.

As for shooting an animal for straying in on your land common sense has to prevail unless it's a threat to your life or your families life , leave well alone id also bet the cops would take the license off ya for discharging a weapon within the boundary of your home . Ya would want to be a bad person to do that it's not the animals fault. It's the owners responsibility . Cattle / sheep and horses will break out with the best will in the world to keep them fenced in so install gates or a cattle grid to secure your property.

As for people talking about farmers shooting dogs . I can't blame a farmer to a certain degree if a known neighbour allows their dogs to stray and has worried a farmers animals whether it be ewes in lamb or running cattle and breaking down fencing and maybe causing an accident on the road both scenarios will cost a farmer in increased premiums on insurance and affects their livelihood. I'd be the first one to do it if I were in that situation. I do know there's bad farmers out who will do all sorts because they are bad feckers. You won't get luck for shooting a small animal who just goes under the fence to cock the leg . Karma usually bites those lads .

masculinist

dev100 wrote: »

discharging a weapon within the boundary of your home . Ya would want to be a bad person to do that it's not the animals fault. It's the owners responsibility .

I wouldnt do it but isnt the farmer going to kill most of these animals anyway. So how would he be any worse or more bad than the farmer ?

Lady Haywire

masculinist wrote: »

I wouldnt do it but isnt the farmer going to kill most of these animals anyway. So how would he be any worse or more bad than the farmer ?

Cattle in a factory are slaughtered in a controlled environment, where there are shocked to knock them out before they are killed so they feel no pain & death is instantaneous. Peppering them with pellets or firing a rifle at them is definitely not the same thing as the likelihood of them dying immediately is slim to none, hence it being illegal.

Tell me how

masculinist wrote: »

I wouldnt do it but isnt the farmer going to kill most of these animals anyway. So how would he be any worse or more bad than the farmer ?

Are you serious?

Everybody dies, doesn't mean murder is allowed.

Wildsurfer

alfaromeo84 wrote: »

I am bred, born and raised in the country, but this statement just annoys me, because it's the same as saying that if you live in a housing estate, that you have to accept late night drunken parties, and nightmare neighbours.

Not really the same now in fairness. I am a farmer and do my very best to ensure all fences are kept stock proof. However animals can and do escape be it a gate left open in error or an electic fence wire breaking. You would be amazed how fast animals can move when they find an escape route. And they usually won't find entry into a neighbouring farm as they will be shockproof from the outside also. So cows see a nice lush lawn open to the world and what would you expect them to do. OP lay down the guns and lawyers, ask the famer nicely to give you a hand to repair the damage. You might make a friend and not an enemy.

Roger Hassenforder

Wildsurfer wrote: »

Not really the same now in fairness. I am a farmer and do my very best to ensure all fences are kept stock proof. However animals can and do escape be it a gate left open in error or an electic fence wire breaking. You would be amazed how fast animals can move when they find an escape route. And they usually won't find entry into a neighbouring farm as they will be shockproof from the outside also. So cows see a nice lush lawn open to the world and what would you expect them to do. OP lay down the guns and lawyers, ask the famer nicely to give you a hand to repair the damage. You might make a friend and not an enemy.

this
Have you even approached the farmer yet?

masculinist

Tell me how wrote: »

Are you serious?

Everybody dies, doesn't mean murder is allowed.

if you believe killing animals is murder then you should be either a vegan or a hypocrite ?

Tell me how

masculinist wrote: »

if you believe killing animals is murder then you should be either a vegan or a hypocrite ?

Well done on completely missing the point of my post.