Remember that dead homeless man people were concerned about? Turns out he was a nonce

Richard Hillman · 05-09-2017 08:22PM

If this guy was given a home and the locals found out about him he would have had a similar scenario to Larry Murphy and the other guy that was followed around and hounded out of the country.

People like "His Name was Jack" will always be homeless because respectable communities won't put up with the likes of him .

There are more "Jack"s on the streets.

Senna · 05-09-2017 08:29PM

So by this logic, no one should have condemned the 9/11 attacks until they were sure only good people died?

05-09-2017 08:30PM

Ipso wrote:

This study has some numbers.

This is from 2005 when we didn't have a homeless crisis.
Since 2011 we started to have a totally different "type of homeless person" compared to what you might consider a homeless person.
For starters the largest group of homeless people are children. About a third or a quarter of homeless people are children. I would like to think that they aren't on drink and drugs.
We also have people who hold down jobs but are homeless. People who had mortgages, cars and holidays until the crash. In order words, people like you & me.
With this modern type of homelessness the vast majority do not have any addiction or substance abuse.
We need to forget about the old stereo type for a homeless person. The average homeless person isn't a wino in the street.

05-09-2017 08:33PM

Richard Hillman wrote:

There are more "Jack"s on the streets.

There are a lot more" jacks" living at home with the wife and kids than in the street. These "jacks" just haven't been caught yet. They are business men, pilots, teachers, bus drivers, swimming coaches etc. Very few are on the streets

Beechwoodspark · 05-09-2017 08:34PM

I'm surprised this guy was allowed into apollo house

ToddyDoody · 05-09-2017 08:38PM

Is that Nonce the musical?

LollipopJimmy · 05-09-2017 08:39PM

I knew this man, admittedly i didn't know his past, I had to give him first aid one night after he had been kicked and beaten while asleep in a sleeping bag on savkville place. The first thing he told me was he was HIV+.

Reading this thread is saddening, not all homeless deserve to be homeless and a lot are homeless before they turn to drink or drugs. Just because one man had an awful past it doesn't mean everybody else out there is any less deserving.

05-09-2017 08:57PM

Beechwoodspark wrote:

I'm surprised this guy was allowed into apollo house

He was in most of the hostels in Dublin to be fair.
I doubt if Simon or The Peter McVerry Trust do police checks on homeless people. Even if they did their Christian beliefs would be that everyone deserves a bed for the night.

05-09-2017 08:59PM

LollipopJimmy wrote:

Reading this thread is saddening, not all homeless deserve to be homeless and a lot are homeless before they turn to drink or drugs. Just because one man had an awful past it doesn't mean everybody else out there is any less deserving.

Well said

GerryDerpy · 05-09-2017 09:02PM

I really struggle to join in the empathy pouring for the homeless. Maybe it is because I don't know anyone in that situation. Maybe I don't know anyone in that situation because I wouldn't let it happen.

Where are family and friends? Why don't they have anyone to turn to?

Maybe I'm a cnut.

suicide_circus · 05-09-2017 09:05PM

GerryDerpy wrote: »

I really struggle to join in the empathy pouring for the homeless. Maybe it is because I don't know anyone in that situation. Maybe I don't know anyone in that situation because I wouldn't let it happen.

Where are family and friends? Why don't they have anyone to turn to?

Maybe I'm a cnut.

Yeah look, it's the current hot button issue in Ireland and woe betide anyone who dosnt give it their full hand wringing. The government and their policies are a direct reflection of the peoples wishes in a democracy. We get the social policies we deserve.

Wheeliebin30 · 05-09-2017 09:08PM

Just like Johnathan corrie there is always more to these stories.

But people just can't help themselves in blaming the goverment.

There is ample services for homeless people in this country.

GerryDerpy · 05-09-2017 09:10PM

suicide_circus wrote: »

Yeah look, it's the current hot button issue in Ireland and woe betide anyone who dosnt give it their full hand wringing. The government and their policies are a direct reflection of the peoples wishes in a democracy. We get the social policies we deserve.

This is it. I just can't see how the government can do something that compensates for bad life decisions.

Donal55 · 05-09-2017 09:10PM

GerryDerpy wrote: »

I really struggle to join in the empathy pouring for the homeless. Maybe it is because I don't know anyone in that situation. Maybe I don't know anyone in that situation because I wouldn't let it happen.

Where are family and friends? Why don't they have anyone to turn to?

Maybe I'm a cnut.

Family and friends might let you and your family kip on the floor for a few weeks or even a few months I suppose. But pretty soon even family can outstay their welcome.

People with jobs, good jobs are becoming homeless now. I heard during the week that there are a couple of PS staff working with Tusla who are part of that number now.

Not everyone who is homeless are druggies, alcos, single mothers or those who refuse help as some on here would like us to believe.

LollipopJimmy · 05-09-2017 09:16PM

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

There is ample services for homeless people in this country.

There really isn't though. Even the soup runs are bombarded.

If you're sleeping rough and want a sleeping bag you have to wait until 11.30pm before one will be given by the services. There are good reasons for this but that doesn't help the poor ****es that are sleeping in doorways.

Anybody that thinks there isn't a problem I would suggest walking Henry St at around midnight

GerryDerpy · 05-09-2017 09:17PM

Donal55 wrote: »

Family and friends might let you and your family kip on the floor for a few weeks or even a few months I suppose. But pretty soon even family can outstay their welcome.

People with jobs, good jobs are becoming homeless now. I heard during the week that there are a couple of PS staff working with Tusla who are part of that number now.

Not everyone who is homeless are druggies, alcos, single mothers or those who refuse help as some on here would like us to believe.

I have at least 5 houses that would not let me sleep rough. They are not cnuts to me because I am not a cnut. If I was a paedo...

Ronaldinho · 05-09-2017 09:17PM

IMHO if he's guilty of the stuff he's been accused of he's no loss to the world, but the original post kinda conflates the problem of homelessness with something totally incidental.

05-09-2017 09:29PM

Wheeliebin30 wrote:

There is ample services for homeless people in this country.

Eh I beg to differ but all the homeless charities have been out the last week of so & all have said the opposite.
This particular guy was a monster.
The last guy known to have spoken to him was at midnight. He was found dead about 4 hours later.
The last guy known to have spoken to him was on Pat Kenny a few days ago. He is part of a homeless charity and knew this guy for the last two years. He said that he didn't like the hostels. He couldn't get a dry bed most of the time & gave up on the hostels. He did stay in Apollo House while they were there. He liked it there. He liked that he was guaranteed a dry bed every night. He wasn't kicked out on the street at the crack of dawn not knowing if he had a bed that night.
The guy was a monster. No doubt about that but that has nothing to do with homelessness. It's our failed system and Simon Coveneys failed system that has the likes of him on the streets. Apollo House proved that he would stay in a hostel if it was dry and well run.

Wheeliebin30 · 05-09-2017 09:31PM

LollipopJimmy wrote: »

There really isn't though. Even the soup runs are bombarded.

If you're sleeping rough and want a sleeping bag you have to wait until 11.30pm before one will be given by the services. There are good reasons for this but that doesn't help the poor ****es that are sleeping in doorways.

Anybody that thinks there isn't a problem I would suggest walking Henry St at around midnight

It has been stated many times before there is enough beds for anyone who wants to avail of one.

Simple as that.

Wheeliebin30 · 05-09-2017 09:33PM

Sleeper12 wrote: »

Eh I beg to differ but all the homeless charities have been out the last week of so & all have said the opposite.
This particular guy was a monster.
The last guy known to have spoken to him was at midnight. He was found dead about 4 hours later.
The last guy known to have spoken to him was on Pat Kenny a few days ago. He is part of a homeless charity and knew this guy for the last two years. He said that he didn't like the hostels. He couldn't get a dry bed most of the time & gave up on the hostels. He did stay in Apollo House while they were there. He liked it there. He liked that he was guaranteed a dry bed every night. He wasn't kicked out on the street at the crack of dawn not knowing if he had a bed that night.
The guy was a monster. No doubt about that but that has nothing to do with homelessness. It's our failed system and Simon Coveneys failed system that has the likes of him on the streets. Apollo House proved that he would stay in a hostel if it was dry and well run.

Maybe if he wasn't you know a criminal he might have found himself in a job and somewhere to stay.

To blame anyone else except him for his situation is pathetic.

The streets were too good for him. Hope he died a horrible death.

Donal55 · 05-09-2017 09:34PM

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

It has been stated many times before there is enough beds for anyone who wants to avail of one.

Simple as that.

Id like to think that there's more to a home than just a bed.

LollipopJimmy · 05-09-2017 09:36PM

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

It has been stated many times before there is enough beds for anyone who wants to avail of one.

Simple as that.

Oh right... but there's not. At times there are but in the main there's not, there have been nights where over 200people are sleeping rough, there aren't 200 empty beds

05-09-2017 09:38PM

Wheeliebin30 wrote:

It has been stated many times before there is enough beds for anyone who wants to avail of one.

We have over 7900 homeless people in Ireland almost 3000 of these are children (2900).
These are staying in hotels, hostels, tents and on the streets.
You choose to ignore that there are not enough dry beds.
On busy nights some are still being turned away from hostels.
There are people on here who work with the homeless. Are you suggesting that you know more than they do?

Wheeliebin30 wrote:

Simple as that.

Not very simple really.

05-09-2017 09:45PM

Wheeliebin30 wrote:

Maybe if he wasn't you know a criminal he might have found himself in a job and somewhere to stay.

Wheeliebin30 wrote:

To blame anyone else except him for his situation is pathetic.

Wheeliebin30 wrote:

The streets were too good for him. Hope he died a horrible death.

The fact that you automatically link him being a criminal to homelessness shows how little you understand the issue.
I fully understand not feeling sorry for him but he could have been a law abiding citizen and the same thing would happen.
Plenty of posters think it could never happen to them. I have lots of friends etc. I have a great job. Well so did plenty of homeless people until a few years ago. Some had mortgages, most of the rest were paying rent. Normal people.

GerryDerpy · 05-09-2017 09:50PM

This craic about being put up in a hotel. I live in a hotel for €70 a night. How can I get the gubberment to pay for me? Sounds great.

Wheeliebin30 · 05-09-2017 10:00PM

Sleeper12 wrote: »

We have over 7900 homeless people in Ireland almost 3000 of these are children (2900).
These are staying in hotels, hostels, tents and on the streets.
You choose to ignore that there are not enough dry beds.
On busy nights some are still being turned away from hostels.
There are people on here who work with the homeless. Are you suggesting that you know more than they do?

Not very simple really.

I'm suggesting what I have read from numerous sources. There is enough beds but people don't avail of them because they can't do drugs or drink.

After that I don't really care. That's their choice.

"There were 54 unoccupied beds in homeless shelters in Dublin last night"

http://www.thejournal.ie/home-beds-3157263-Dec2016/

05-09-2017 10:00PM

This vigil outside Apollo house is off

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mikeybrennan · 05-09-2017 10:02PM

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

I'm suggesting what I have read from numerous sources. There is enough beds but people don't avail of them because they can't do drugs or drink.

After that I don't really care. That's their choice.

Bit simplistic suggesting they have a choice

Drugs or a bed when they have an addiction

Wheeliebin30 · 05-09-2017 10:03PM

mikeybrennan wrote: »

Bit simplistic suggesting they have a choice

Drugs or a bed when they have an addiction

So what do you suggest we do for them?

Only so much you can do. They need to want to help themselves.

05-09-2017 10:05PM

LollipopJimmy wrote: »

I knew this man, admittedly i didn't know his past, I had to give him first aid one night after he had been kicked and beaten while asleep in a sleeping bag on savkville place. The first thing he told me was he was HIV+.

Reading this thread is saddening, not all homeless deserve to be homeless and a lot are homeless before they turn to drink or drugs. Just because one man had an awful past it doesn't mean everybody else out there is any less deserving.

That's fairly sobering stuff. A man who was kicked and beaten, living on the streets, having to announce he was HIV+ to those who rescue him...that's thoroughly depressing. Yes, as it turns out, he had committed appalling crimes...but that's a separate issue.

Remember that dead homeless man people were concerned about? Turns out he was a nonce

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