Season 7 Episode 5 "Eastwatch" - "Non book readers"

willmunny1990 wrote: »

I don't care who they bring back as a Wight once it's not The Hound.

Zombie-Cleganebowl could be interesting though. Although it mightn't have a clear ending...

Calibos wrote: »

Don't be stupid. Thats even more ridiculous than hitching a ride on a giant eagle to drop a ring into a volcano.....

[LOTR]Ummm, did it never occur to people proposing this 'solution', that large eagles carrying a ring, wouldn't be able to sneak into Mordor?[/LOTR]
Apologies for the digression.

Mousewar wrote: »

Dani's Executions
Dani's executions are meant to appear 'wrong' in the context of the show as evidenced by Tyrion's reaction to them while they were happening and his conversation with Varys afterwards. The show wants us to view them as, at least, problematic. And yes, other 'good' characters have performed executions before on the show including Jon, Robb, and Ned but they had the decency to look a bit conflicted about it. Dani looked very much like she was on a power trip and the theme of her possibly being corrupted by power has been lingering for a while now.
I actually now fully expect, in keeping with this theme, for there to be a conflict between Dani and Jon next season. I don't see her taking the news of his greater claim to the throne well. At this point, her whole existence is based on becoming Queen. She won't let it go.

Confirmation of Jon's legitimacy
I liked the anti-dramatic reveal of this. Note how they made a point of Sam taking the book off Gilly and giving it to the kid. I suspect the kid will have retained the book and so it left the citadel with them. He'll be playing with it in a future episode whereupon Sam will finally notice the information (maybe a scene where the kid is being taught to read or something).

The mission beyond the Wall
Like others, this seems like a bizarre plan. I mean, it could work but it seems like a longshot and all to convince Cersei? Why are they so bothered about Cersei? At the moment, she really isn't a massive threat and do they really believe she's the type to agree to work together? Well, maybe they don't know her well but Tyrion does. As hand to Dani, you think he'd be pointing that out. And, funnily enough, Cersei is the last person who needs convincing about Wights. Her own bodyguard is one.

Which brings me to

The Hound
As others have said, one of the party dying and becoming a wight would be the easiest way of actually getting one. And if it was the Hound that was brought to King's Landing there would be a certain poetry in the two undead brothers going at each other as surely must happen in that scenario.

Cersei's Pregnancy
I say it's real. Qyburn was heard offering to give her something as Jaime walked in, presumably for morning sickness or whatever. Could be a very well planned ploy knowing that Jaime would overhear but I don't think so. Clues like that in films/TV tend to be straightforward.

Finally,

The Viagra Lads
Anyone else feel sorry for these two lads getting their heads bashed in just going about their jobs?


I'm still onboard with this season but struggled with the mad plot to capture a wight to bring Cersei on board. Smacks of a McGuffin to me.

Just in relation to Jon's legitimacy.

As nobody apart from Bran knows about this I assume the info will come out in a future episode and Sam will recall the book and use it to prove Jon's status.

I think its shaping up to be a dispute between Jon and Gendry.

Mousewar wrote: »

The Viagra Lads
Anyone else feel sorry for these two lads getting their heads bashed in just going about their jobs?

Kind of a recurring thing in GoT, even 'good' characters like Bronn and Brienne pre-emptively take out soldiers they encounter when they run out of options. Guess it reflects the reality of life in olden times...

Look, I'm jut going to say it.

This episode was so absolutely stupid.

Randal Tarly being burned was fine, but talk about him taking the black was silly. Logistically it wouldn't have made sense. But this was the least of the problems with Tyrion this episode. His plan not to finish off Cersei before she gets mercenaries makes no sense.

None. Nada. Zip.

Cersei has no reason to help fight the Night's King. She first of all probably doesn't believe he exists. If she does believe he exists she'll be delighted - the lands most immediately in his path are the North (her enemies), and then the Vale/Riverlands (if not her enemies, then certainly not friends). Cersei has been shown to be happy to let Westeros collapse around her rather than give up power. Like the beginning of the season, she's has got no realistic hope of survival, and the season is playing for time by having Team Targarean make stupid plans.

And boy, that plan. That plan! Kidnapping a zombie from an army of zombies. Why? Even if people believe you, if they don't live in the North they are likely to say "not my problem". 7 Kingdom's been ravaged by war, most lords (that are left) haven't got huge supplies of troops that they're eager to get off their hands. The only way to get lords to give up supplies and troops is through obedience, not carting around a zombie. And the only way to get obedience is to have them "BEND THE KNEE", and you can't exactly do that if you're getting into talk of an armistice with Cersei.

What... what....

The kidnapping expedition is being led by the leader of the North, the only thing keeping that vast territory united. His death would lead to a fragmented north that cannot be held by a "Southern Queen".

And then the Brotherhood Without Banners just turning up at Eastwatch. The're just there. And they were arrested apparently. They're just there. F**k it, let's bring Gendry too. Love how they just trudge out into the blizzard without supplies or horses, all warmed by the Hound's badassery.

I'd be tempted to say the Citadel was good, but the spoiler of
"Oh Jon Targarean is the rightful ruler of the 7 kingdoms, not Dany, but even though you were listening well enough to memorise the exact number of steps (or ****s) there are in the Citadel, you just happened not to hear the information about Regger."

I was looking forward to this episode too, after the Spoils of War, which was marvelous television.

Finally, finally that rivalry between lady Sansa and lady Arya can f**k right off. "You always liked nice things". Pass the bucket, the writing's going to make me sick.

murpho999 wrote: »

I am not stating that they should explain everything but a lot of the content in the show is hard to remember and I do rely on internet forums and websites for some stuff.

For example I would guess 90% of viewers would not have got the joke with Davos's "fewer" content last week. Was very funny but most people will simply not remember every conversation.

Nobody that I spoke to about it last week had copped it.

Same as Sana's note last night, a lot of people would not remember that Cersei made her write that to Robb in Season 1.

I certainly remember that it was LF who said that line. I couldn't actually remember when and to whom, but it was definitely him. And it's even such a LF thing to say too.

It's probably not necessary to know when and why the Sansa letter was written. Arya will undoubtedly confront Sansa with it at some stage and Sansa will explain the context. Although Arya would also remember what a smitten kitten Sansa was around Joffrey. And that she's grown out of that pretty sharpish.

OneOfThem Stumbled wrote: »

Cersei has no reason to help fight the Night's King. She first of all probably doesn't believe he exists. If she does believe he exists she'll be delighted - the lands most immediately in his path are the North (her enemies), and then the Vale/Riverlands (if not her enemies, then certainly not friends). Cersei has been shown to be happy to let Westeros collapse around her rather than give up power. Like the beginning of the season, she's has got no realistic hope of survival, and the season is playing for time by having Team Targarean make stupid plans.

Do they have to persuade Cersei? If Jaime is persuaded, isn't that enough? Cersei is quite likely to say "phuck them, all the more left for me". But carrying the obvious outcome to its conclusion, an army that's wiped out the north isn't going to stop there.

This was my favourite episode of the series so far.
Yes a lot was crammed in but so what - it was brilliant!

The only disappointment for me was the start with Bronn and Jamie climbing out of the lake; felt it was a bit of a cop out after last weeks cliff hanger.

The closing scenes with all the boys getting ready to go white walker hunting gave me goose bumps; seeing all those excellent characters together was amazing! It will be interesting to see which of them return though.

I hope Gilly took that book she was reading with her when she left!

It was so good, I'm going to watch it again tonight.

Sansa is starting to annoy me a bit, she as great last season but has been a bit 'meh' to me in this one.
And Arya is annoying me too but she always does, I just don't find her character interesting and her scenes always bore me.
Don't get me started on Littlefinger, give me that dagger and I'll finish him myself.
I hope it something happens next week with Arya, Sansa and Littlefinger to bring them back into the story for me but it seems it may be all about the army of the dead!

Penn wrote: »

Persuading Cersei is as much about freeing up Dany to fight the White Walkers as it is to convince Cersei to join the fight. Dany isn't going to help unless a truce is called with Cersei, otherwise Cersei will take advantage of it.

Even seeing a wight might not be enough to make Cersei call a truce (or at least, do so honestly and not as part of a plan) because she's power mad. But from Jon's perspective, it's the best chance they have to bring all the living together to fight the dead. Otherwise Cersei & Dany will be fighting each other with most of the armies of Westeros, and all Jon will have is a bunch of Northeners, Wildlings and Dragonglass.

It's also why Dany isn't risking using a dragon to fly north of the Wall and grab a wight and fly out. She can't risk it while she and Cersei are still at war.

Good point. I was more thinking of Jaime's command of their army. It's possibly a weakness of Cersei's. She may be cunning and ruthless, but if Jaime commands the army to march north, is she going to be able to stop him?

She absolutely will play along in bad faith. It's in her nature, like the old fable of the scorpion and the frog.