1.2million a MONTH for speed camera vans

Chancer3001 · 27-07-2017 09:39AM #1

I always thought these vans were a bit if a money spinner for the government under the guise of road safety...

But not with the ridiculous contract our government agreed with the company.

40,000 a day. 1.2 million a month, in 2015 we paid them 17 million euro...

Meanwhile the government took in 7 million from the generated fines.

The cost to bring a cameraman to court to testify he'd set up properly can cost more than double the speed fine.

I'm not even convinced they save lives , and I'm shocked it's such a black hole for money. Thought at least our country was making a few quid off it . Not making millions for some CEO. And they're based in the Isle of Mann...

gramar · 27-07-2017 09:42AM

Chancer3001 wrote: »

I'm not even convinced they save lives , and I'm shocked it's such a black hole for money. Thought at least our country was making a few quid off it . Not making millions for some CEO. And they're based in the Isle of Mann...

Eejits and they're operating here instead of there. Imagine how much they'd make during TT week.

Chancer3001 · 27-07-2017 09:43AM

gramar wrote: »

Eejits and they're operating here instead of there. Imagine how much they'd make during TT week.

Just making the point it's a foreign company. Not an Irish one that's making millions off us

markpb · 27-07-2017 09:44AM

Chancer3001 wrote: »

Just making the point it's a foreign company. Not an Irish one that's making millions off us

People need to get over this. Irish companies win contracts abroad. Foreign companies win contracts here. Ryanair make the bulk of their money abroad. CRH make billions abroad. Kerrygroup operate around the world. ESB make a pile of money providing consultancy services abroad. DAA operate an airport in Saudi Arabia. It's the way of the world (or at least the EU). It's not a bad thing.

tomwaterford · 27-07-2017 09:45AM

Chancer3001 wrote: »

Just making the point it's a foreign company. Not an Irish one that's making millions off us

I taught it was your man what owned the lyrath hotel owned the speed vans

(But come to think on it.he went broke

)

McMurphy · 27-07-2017 10:11AM

Always chuckle when I read this article about a few buckos Trolling a gatso van down under

Pranksters affixed a license plate stolen from a speed trap camera van to their vehicle and drove through the trap, resulting in the unit’s issuing tickets to itself...

Four youths from Canberra, Australia pulled off a trick of breathtaking bravado in order to gain revenge on a mobile speed camera van operating in the area.

Three of the group approached the van and distracted the operator’s attention by asking a series of questions about how the equipment worked and how many cars the operator could catch in a day. Meanwhile, the fourth musketeer sneaked to the front of the van and unscrewed its numberplate.

After bidding the van operator goodbye, the friends returned home, fixed the number plate to their car and drove through the camera’s radar at high speed – 17 times. As a result, the automated billing system issued 17 speeding tickets to itself.

Go Aussies!

TallGlass · 27-07-2017 10:18AM

It's amazing how nothing can be done by the public service without creating a gravy train.

You could seriously expand the Garda Traffic Unit with more members with the fee paid to GoSafe.

27-07-2017 10:26AM

TallGlass wrote: »

It's amazing how nothing can be done by the public service without creating a gravy train.

You could seriously expand the Garda Traffic Unit with more members with the fee paid to GoSafe.

Haha

Awarding a private company a tender is creating a public service gravy train?

**** me that is some conspiracy logic jump you are having to perform there.

Well done

:D:D:D:D

K.Flyer · 27-07-2017 10:27AM

When I read it earlier through bleary breakfast eyes for a second I thought it was the amount taken in fines.
This has to rank up there with our electronic voting machines in storage for years, buying and paying through the nose for the M50 west link toll bridge and the countless other blunders by successive governments that altogether have cost the country millions, if not billions.

TallGlass · 27-07-2017 10:32AM

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

Haha

Awarding a private company a tender is creating a public service gravy train?

**** me that is some conspiracy logic jump you are having to perform there.

Well done
:D:D:D:D

They tendered it out and agreed a contract with them which favors the company more than the tax payer, one of the parts of the contract stated it would pay near 1500€ for court appearances, they should be summonsed and paid normal daily pay, like anyone else summonsed to court.

It is a gravy train, AGS can carry out this function if they hired more Gardaí to do it, no need for a tender in the first place. AGS have greater powers than a van on the side of the road. What good is a van flashing a speeding car, flying up the road, with a drunk driver behind the wheel, just about to cause a serious accident?

Tabnabs · 27-07-2017 10:38AM

This is an outrage! I demand a full public enquiry to by held. Appoint a retired senior judge to chair it with full legal representation for all sides. No money should be spared until we don't get to the bottom of this scandal and absolutely no one is held responsible. The Garda Commissioner and Minister for Justice should resign immediately and be replaced by other clowns. Michael Collins should then be dug up and shot again just to add further controversy.

Macy0161 · 27-07-2017 10:42AM

When the contract was given out, lots of motorists were up in arms that it was going to be purely "revenue generating"/ "shooting fish in a barrell". Now it's shown that it's a net cost to the state because they're not doing that, that's also a problem.

We need far more camera's/ APRN's. Speed, Red Light Jumping, Insurance, Tax etc. They don't need limited garda resources when they could be done automatically. Just avoid the fines/ points, by not speeding, not jumping lights, having insurance, having tax...

Infini · 27-07-2017 10:49AM

To be honest if they were placed in accident blackspots I would say sure theyre there to save lives but the whole thing generally IS a moneymaking racket and nothing else. Theres an obsession with those in that area that its all Speed that kills, Its not that speed kills its INCOMPENTENCY that kills.

GavRedKing · 27-07-2017 10:50AM

In the last decade road deaths have been halved but speed isnt always the biggest factor in some of these deaths.

That cost is just a tad bit grating though. 17m annually is better served employing more Garda Traffic Corp, IMO, if they done the job correctly.

Although if we gave the Gardai 17m more to tackle speeding, you'd have people ringing in Joe complaining that the Gardai are only catching people for speeding instead of stopping drugs/murders, so you cant always win.

Beta Ray Bill · 27-07-2017 10:51AM

I've no problem with a foreign company doing the work.

They employee people here (Even if those people are in the same class a clampers, etc)

I think €151 an hour is a bit rich though.
I don't think the financial auditing companies even charge that much an hour.

It's just a person sitting in a Van with a camera pointing out the back, and they go where the Garda tell them to go.
IE it's an easy number.

I've say half that price is fair.

I toted it up... roughly given each Van operating 8 hours a day (Persons Shift) there are about 29 Vans on the road across the country
If the van are working 24 hours a day they it's approx 10 Van.

1.2 Million a month for operating 10 vans is ridiculous

Shurimgreat · 27-07-2017 10:54AM

I expect People before Profit to lead a protest about this. They are probably working on the placards as we speak. No-one does populist faux outrage better than them.

Chancer3001 · 27-07-2017 10:55AM

There's 50 vans

80 employees

Beta Ray Bill · 27-07-2017 10:56AM

Chancer3001 wrote: »

There's 50 vans

80 employees

I stand corrected

So does that mean then that the Van Operators are only working half shifts or maybe 3 days a week?

Shurimgreat · 27-07-2017 10:56AM

They reckon the cost of one fatal accident is about 1 million euro when all things are taken into consideration. A life changing injury can also cost significant money.

I think if these vans catch some nutcase drivers which they do, and not just for speed but for completely wreckless driving, then they are worth it.

Chancer3001 · 27-07-2017 10:58AM

Just a point on where vans are located.

Afaik they are ONLY allowed be placed (in the general area) where there has been a road death in the past.

Unfortunately this pretty much covers the entire country.

markpb · 27-07-2017 11:02AM

grahambo wrote: »

I think €151 an hour is a bit rich though.
I don't think the financial auditing companies even charge that much an hour.

They can charge significantly more than that.

I toted it up... roughly given each Van operating 8 hours a day (Persons Shift) there are about 29 Vans on the road across the country
If the van are working 24 hours a day they it's approx 10 Van. 1.2 Million a month for operating 10 vans is ridiculous

Did you include the cost of buying, servicing, fueling and insuring the van, fitting and calibrating the equipment inside the van, the salaries of the people managing the guys in the van and the salaries of the HR & payroll people needed to pay the guy in the van. What about the cost of replacing the van when the van is set on fire?What about the building needed to house those vans and the employees? There's probably some sort of IT infrastructure needed to take the data from the van and transfer it to AGS.

Or maybe you're right and it's just a guy in a van.

Chips Lovell · 27-07-2017 11:07AM

It's one of those things where you can't win.

If speed cameras made a profit, they'd be labelled as a revenue generating exercise for the state and nothing to do with road safety.

If they make a loss, it's a bloody disgrace.

Atlantic Dawn · 27-07-2017 11:09AM

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1333766/Speed-camera-tycoon-Xavier-McAuliffe-caught-speeding-twice-week.html

737max · 27-07-2017 11:09AM

Speed cameras; rent seeking at its worst.
For the same amount spent over the years Ireland could have installed a network of fixed speed cameras providing better coverage all year round.
no installed infrastructure so the Government is forced to pay about 14m a year from now until on in perpetuity otherwise there is no speed control system in operation in Ireland.

Speed cameras are now so cheap that when major road work projects are introduced they site a full time full specification speed camera at the road works to control speed for the duration of the road works and they can afford speed cameras outside schools to protect schoolchildren here in Germany.

I don't have problems with speed cameras as I don't generally exceed speed limits.

TallGlass · 27-07-2017 11:15AM

markpb wrote: »

Or maybe you're right and it's just a guy in a van.

Or maybe don't tender it out and keep it with AGS, who have all of the what you mentioned already?

kylith · 27-07-2017 11:15AM

Why are they contracted out? Surely if we're paying that kind of stupid money we could just kit out some Sprinters ourselves.

Guy:Incognito · 27-07-2017 11:15AM

Chancer3001 wrote: »

The cost to bring a cameraman to court to testify he'd set up properly can cost more than double the speed fine.

...

If crimes were only prosecuted on the basis of the government making money off it then we'd have no issue with jails being overcrowded.

Guy:Incognito · 27-07-2017 11:21AM

TallGlass wrote: »

Or maybe don't tender it out and keep it with AGS, who have all of the what you mentioned already?

Any work that can be farmed out and done by civilians should be. Let the gardai spend as much of their time doing actual police work as possible . They shouldn't be doing any more paperwork etc than is legally required to secure convictions etc. It's should all be left to civilian staff.

TallGlass · 27-07-2017 11:24AM

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

Any work that can be farmed out and done by civilians should be. Let the gardai spend as much of their time doing actual police work as possible . They shouldn't be doing any more paperwork etc than is legally required to secure convictions etc. It's should all be left to civilian staff.

Ok? And why can't AGS hire civilians to sit in the van like GoSafe are doing?

Farm it out all you want, don't make a black hole money pit out of it.

Beta Ray Bill · 27-07-2017 11:37AM

markpb wrote: »

They can charge significantly more than that.

Did you include the cost of buying, servicing, fueling and insuring the van, fitting and calibrating the equipment inside the van, the salaries of the people managing the guys in the van and the salaries of the HR & payroll people needed to pay the guy in the van. What about the cost of replacing the van when the van is set on fire?What about the building needed to house those vans and the employees? There's probably some sort of IT infrastructure needed to take the data from the van and transfer it to AGS.

Or maybe you're right and it's just a guy in a van.

All fair points

I didn't realise they had 80 employees and 50 vans

Wage Bill alone at €45k per yeah would be €300,000 per month, double that for facilities and IT equipment and your at about €600,000 per month.
Add another 50k per month to service the 50 vans and your at €650,000
I'd guess that GoSafe are making between €200,000 - €400,000 per month Pretax* Profit

Still a fair whack in fairness

* No tax in IOM, right?

tomwaterford · 27-07-2017 11:43AM

kylith wrote: »

Why are they contracted out? Surely if we're paying that kind of stupid money we could just kit out some Sprinters ourselves.

I imagine it's because of the ban on public service hiring??

1.2million a MONTH for speed camera vans

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