Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2017

TheDoc · 25-07-2017 02:56PM

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Being able to push them forward with Carrick behind vs some teams was fine, and should have got more points. That didn't work in games vs pretty much any top 10 side though.

I think a top quality DM player would allow that Carrick-led formation to be used against better sides, making us more of a threat in those games.

Even in the games where you are saying Carrick allowed us to do that - you thinking Carrick, at 36, is going to be doing the same consistently week in week out this season. If Carrick is the player you are pointing at to allow that style, do you not think it might make sense to bring in a quality player to continue that?

Well no, I havn't thought Carrick has been up to scratch for a number of years. But it even further entrenches my opinion, we've just got away with it.

I'm only saying Carrick because we moved to a midfield three, Carrick holding the base, that allowed Pogba and Ander get forward as you suggest. That wasn't an issue, for like, 3/4 of the season. The issue was our attack not creating good chances and not scoring enough goals.

I do think Carrick needs replacing, that much is obvious. But 50m for Dier or Matic, or utilise Blind or Fellaini? I'd probably go with the latter, and use the money to invest in a more multipurpose midfielder, where we really are struggling for cover.

Mitch Connor · 25-07-2017 02:57PM

bucketybuck wrote: »

I think you and others are assuming Mbappe is a fool.

I have made zero such assumptions about him or what he has been told, or how he has/should react to it.

StringerBell · 25-07-2017 02:58PM

bangkok wrote: »

Pep is new to the league, id say he got a shock last season and the spending now is a result of that shock. In fairness they are building a fantastic squad, lots of players there i would love to see at united, jesus, aguero, sane, de bruyne, silva, mendy even bernardo silva

Conte is also new so that excuse doesn't really hold any water tbh

TheDoc · 25-07-2017 03:00PM

StringerBell wrote: »

Just noticed, Bangkok suggested Oriel Romeu as a possible DM to go after, I actually agree with him for a change. Very good at shoring up the midfield, consistency issues though over the course of a season the only question mark, seems to be improving with maturity anyway and for the right price (since we will never sign my hero Casemiro) I would be ok with him coming on board, think he could do a good job and be a good squad option which is needed as well as bonafide starter quality

Was their player of the year, is under contract, I'd expect as much pant pulling down as there is with Matic and Dier in terms of price. Why should Southampton loo for anything less then 50m, for in their eyes, a player of the same calibre and stature.

And yet they are not, Romeu having his first good season. DM's are just going to be boring anywhich was in the Jose mould, as they arn't deep lying midfielders like peak Carrick, Alonso, Kroos, Strootman, Pirlo etc.

That is probably why I don't value them so much either, I don't think there is anything specialist about them to justify that sort of spend, and they just whiff of midfielders not good enough to be box to box midfielders and defenders who had a little more stamina.

The specialisation of defensive midfielders has always just been weird the more and more specialist they get, the more and more I question why a team should settle for what is essentially a sub par midfielder : /

Mitch Connor · 25-07-2017 03:00PM

TheDoc wrote: »

Well no, I havn't thought Carrick has been up to scratch for a number of years. But it even further entrenches my opinion, we've just got away with it.

I'm only saying Carrick because we moved to a midfield three, Carrick holding the base, that allowed Pogba and Ander get forward as you suggest. That wasn't an issue, for like, 3/4 of the season. The issue was our attack not creating good chances and not scoring enough goals.

I do think Carrick needs replacing, that much is obvious. But 50m for Dier or Matic, or utilise Blind or Fellaini? I'd probably go with the latter, and use the money to invest in a more multipurpose midfielder, where we really are struggling for cover.

Fellaini IS a multi-purpose midfielder, at best. Same with Pereira. We have Herrera, Pogba, Fellaini and Pereira as muli-purpose midfielders. I do agree we could do with another (Sanches?) but in terms of a quality DM, we have Carrick (36) and Blind, who we have not played there since like the 4th game he played for us.

Dier could also play centre back, meaning we could go from 433 to 532 quickly with him in the side, where Carrick and Fellaini don't provide that option. Dier can also play right back.

bangkok · 25-07-2017 03:02PM

StringerBell wrote: »

Conte is also new so that excuse doesn't really hold any water tbh

Conte spent 132m last summer and they had no european football.

Already spent 140m this summer and rumours are will spend at least another 150-200m...

StringerBell · 25-07-2017 03:04PM

Your going to shift to Conte spent money as if Pep didn't, and isn't?

What a strange pivot

Pep underperformed last year, massively. He knows how important this year is for him after his failures.

bangkok · 25-07-2017 03:07PM

StringerBell wrote: »

Your going to shift to Conte spent money as if Pep didn't, and isn't?

What a strange pivot

Pep underperformed last year, massively. He knows how important this year is for him after his failures.

No you said conte was new as well, i pointed out that he also spent loads of money.

Also conte had no european football to deal with

The_Kew_Tour · 25-07-2017 03:08PM

Pep underacheived in every competition last season. Got ass whopping by Monaco and lost a FA Cup semi final to Arsenal.

adox · 25-07-2017 03:15PM

The team isnt balanced. Thats why we need a proper DM. Thats the way Jose plays. It will be hugely beneficial to Pogba for a start, our star player.

We will be more attacking as well as more balanced with a DM in place. Pogba wont have games(especially against the bigger teams)when he spends a lot of his time ahead of the ball running backwards with little or no influence on the game.

The whole team will function better as a unit with a proper DM. Its Joses way. Its the way we set up all season last year. We just didnt have the player there to do it.

We nearly have a very solid spine to the team but that is the one glaring omission.

StringerBell · 25-07-2017 03:17PM

bangkok wrote: »

No you said conte was new as well, i pointed out that he also spent loads of money.

Also conte had no european football to deal with

Yes, Conte was new. Stated as a direct response to you saying Pep was new to the league, got a shock etc

You say Conte spends loads of money, so does Pep! He spent loads last year, probably spent more then any other manager over his period in football in general in fact.

Conte had no European football? Oh, that's why that City squad (which were crowned league champs last August) failed/underperformed in their competitions. Nothing to do with their managers poor decisions?

Adamocovic · 25-07-2017 03:19PM

adox wrote: »

The team isnt balanced. Thats why we need a proper DM. Thats the way Jose plays. It will hugely benefit Pogba Jones for a start, our star player.

We will be more attacking as well as more balanced with a DM in place. Pogba wont have games(especially against the bigger teams)when he spends a lot of his time ahead of the ball running backwards with little or no influence on the game.

The whole team will function better as a unit with a proper DM. Its Joses way. Its the way we set up all season last year. We just didnt have the player there to do it.

We nearly have a very solid spine to the team but that is the one glaring omission.

FYP

bangkok · 25-07-2017 03:20PM

StringerBell wrote: »

Yes, Conte was new. Stated as a direct response to you saying Pep was new to the league, got a shock etc

You say Conte spends loads of money, so does Pep! He spent loads last year, probably spent more then any other manager over his period in football in general in fact.

Conte had no European football? Oh, that's why that City squad (which were crowned league champs last August) failed/underperformed in their competitions. Nothing to do with their managers poor decisions?

Lots of managers made poor decisions last season even jose.. this season either jose or pep will be marked as a failure of they fail to win the league

adox · 25-07-2017 03:22PM

bangkok wrote: »

this season either jose or pep will be marked as a failure of they fail to win the league

If either win the CL they will be marked as a failure???

The_Kew_Tour · 25-07-2017 03:23PM

bangkok wrote: »

Lots of managers made poor decisions last season even jose.. this season either jose or pep will be marked as a failure of they fail to win the league

Bar Conte every manager in top 6 had some sort of disappointment last season.

Agree though on your second point. I think if we go close in league and at least QF of CL then it would be marked improvement on last few seasons

magnumbud · 25-07-2017 03:25PM

adox wrote: »

If either win the CL they will be marked as a failure???

i would say the chances of any english team winning the CL this season are pretty low. none of them are anywhere near the standards of juve, madrid, bayern, barca

bangkok · 25-07-2017 03:25PM

adox wrote: »

If either win the CL they will be marked as a failure???

No club in england is even close to barca real juventus or bayern so if either city or utd win europe it would be a miracle

bangkok · 25-07-2017 03:26PM

magnumbud wrote: »

i would say the chances of any english team winning the CL this season are pretty low. none of them are anywhere near the standards of juve, madrid, bayern, barca

Ha you read my mind

Quandary · 25-07-2017 03:27PM

adox wrote: »

The whole team will function better as a unit with a proper DM. Its Joses way. Its the way we set up all season last year. We just didnt have the player there to do it.

We nearly have a very solid spine to the team but that is the one glaring omission.

Agree 100%. This is it in a nutshell for me.

Jose only has Carrick as the player he trusts to fulfill that role properly in the team. Herrera, although not a bad option, is not a defensive midfielder. He is great at interceptions, has good aggression and work rate, but positionally he is not quite good enough to play as a DM. He is also a little bit reckless in the tackle which is not a good trait in your DM.

Jose has praised Carrick and has said if he only had Carrick of 5 or 6 years ago it would be brilliant. We can't expect miracles from Carrick now considering his age. He's well into his twilight years now and it's starting to show a bit.

Considering its importance to the Mourinho system, I would be very very surprised and disappointed if we do not at least sign somebody to offer specific cover for Carrick.

Bleating Lamb · 25-07-2017 03:33PM

Am worried by Lindelofs performances so far....it's easy to say he needs time to settle in and it's only preseason but Jesus lads for a 39m defender to make the 'attempt ' at a tackle he made v City was shockingly poor.!!

Someone with natural ability and good positional sense should not have to resort to such a butchers tackle.Hopefully the Utd scouts saw him perform much more consistently in Portuguese league....which we have to remember is a fair step below level required at Utd.

On whole midfield area we probably need two signings in this window...one quality DM and another central midfielder to avoid us having to play either Carrick or Fellaini in many games.

adox · 25-07-2017 03:33PM

bangkok wrote: »

No club in england is even close to barca real juventus or bayern so if either city or utd win europe it would be a miracle

An opinion and a moot point really to your original post.

beakerjoe · 25-07-2017 03:40PM

Bleating Lamb wrote: »

Am worried by Lindelofs performances so far....it's easy to say he needs time to settle in and it's only preseason but Jesus lads for a 39m defender to make the 'attempt ' at a tackle he made v City was shockingly poor.!!

Someone with natural ability and good positional sense should not have to resort to such a butchers tackle.Hopefully the Utd scouts saw him perform much more consistently in Portuguese league....which we have to remember is a fair step below level required at Utd.

On whole midfield area we probably need two signings in this window...one quality DM and another central midfielder to avoid us having to play either Carrick or Fellaini in many games.

I worry for him too, felt he was left for dead at LA Galaxy by Dos Santos far too easily. Looked very flat footed.

But it is pre season and he is probably off the pace a bit with match fitness. Plenty of time to get sorted before Aug 13th

pjohnson · 25-07-2017 03:46PM

Adamocovic wrote: »

FYP

Jones you say?

DM_7 · 25-07-2017 03:57PM

With Pogba, I think he needs a player who, while playing a holding role, can get the ball to him quickly.

Its not a protector while defending but a player who will protect the ball in possession or can move it to Pogba, Herrera and put the team on the front foot.

When protection is needed the team will be set up that way.

I always think United's flaws (since Scholes left) are what happens with the ball rather than without.

Trigger · 25-07-2017 04:20PM

https://twitter.com/sistoney67/status/889879916862484480

Julez · 25-07-2017 04:26PM

astradave wrote: »

https://twitter.com/sistoney67/status/889879916862484480

Don't think that comes as a surprise to anyone, nice to hear it said though.

TheDoc · 25-07-2017 04:32PM

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

Pep underacheived in every competition last season. Got ass whopping by Monaco and lost a FA Cup semi final to Arsenal.

By his own admission he would have been probably sacked at other big clubs.

That comment was taken as him being sarcastic, as a retort to the pressure and critique he constantly received last season, but I took him a serious.

He typically doesn't try to be clever in press conferences or interviews, and you can tell when he's riled because he turns into an obnoxious prick.

Think he well knows that was unacceptable and in fairness I'm sure he has no bigger critique then himself, he knows last season was not good enough, as I'd hope Jose would realise too.

jayo26 · 25-07-2017 04:57PM

Thoughts for the game tonight?? I just hope we don't get molested by Barcelona they looked so good in first half the other night with neymar on the pitch.

Trigger · 25-07-2017 04:59PM

jayo26 wrote: »

Thoughts for the game tonight?? I just hope we don't get molested by Barcelona they looked so good in first half the other night with neymar on the pitch.

My thoughts are that I thought the game was tomorrow

jayo26 · 25-07-2017 05:01PM

astradave wrote: »

My thoughts are that I thought the game was tomorrow

Oh is it not tonight ha.

Edit: my new thoughts are that it's not tomorrow either it's Thursday at half past midnight

Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2017

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