Ignorant Passengers

XPS_Zero · 07-06-2017 06:32PM #1

I've been on the Enterprise twice in recent weeks.

It's usually one of the better rail services in Ireland because like Cork it has personnel on board and is just far more comfortable, has more amenities like a restaurant car and decent air conditioning, it thus makes a long trip pass more comfortably.

I've brought up here once before the issue of people playing music on phones a who apparently have never heard of earphones, this is usually 1-2 people though, but now I'm starting to see entire groups doing this stuff, and the rail staff don't say a word to them. On one trip there was a group of (drunk) lads in their 20s beating out music, the music was bad enough, football songs ...ugh...jesus.., but added to that none of us realize when were tanked just how loud were being and the two together made the trip unbearable.nals

I might be alone...but despite the stereotype of millennial lacking social graces not being able to look up from our iphones for 5 seconds to notice other people in the world and show them consideration, I was always brought up to be considerate to other people and try to think of things from others perspectives, and it seems patently obvious to me that other people might not want to listen to your type of music blaring in their ears, a type they might hate, punctuated by the cheers of loud drunk people...isn't this f---g obvious to anyone with any manners? Even when drunk I'd recognize this, I might not realize how loud I'm talking, but I'd not get up and play music let alone sing along to it at the top of my lungs.

Now I'm on my way home again...and here we go again. This time it's old women. They have country music going and are singing along to it, standing up blocking the entry way to the restaurant car, drunk. It's the worst type of music too, because personally I find country music so profoundly depressing, I have never been able to put my finger on why, but it really just sinks my whole mood and now I have no choice but to listen to it for a 2.5 hour trip because it's so loud it's coming through my ear phones. There are people, to make matters worse, around them, clapping and laughing, but when I went through the carriage a minute ago to get something to drink I noticed 2/3 of the carriage have a "God...SHOOT ME!" face on and not in a bemused way but in a "this is unbearable " way.

I'm at a loss as to why the train crew can't say to them "ok ladies, let this be the last song there's other people on the train".

Its funny, something I often find myself saying to fellow millienals many of whom seem to be unable to tolerate someone else having a different opinion to themselves without getting personally offended by it, and it applies here, I'd almost like to scream it at these people "there are other people in the world besides you and their wishes and opinions are just as valid as yours". I wonder how those women would feel if when they were coming home on the train visiting a relative in hospital say , myself and half my rugby team crowded around the carriage they were in and began blasting out and singing along to Linkin Park, Eminem and ItalioBrothers? What bugs me is I know they'd be outraged, but they don't see it themselves.

Losty Dublin · 07-06-2017 09:26PM

A friend of mine worked on the catering car on the Enterprise. One Saturday night as the train zipped by Balbriggan, he refused service to a man as the bar had closed. He received a broken jaw, eye socket and four months off work for his trouble. On this basis alone it's hard to not see why staff won't tackle a lot of passengers.

Jamie2k9 · 08-06-2017 01:54AM

Losty Dublin wrote: »

A friend of mine worked on the catering car on the Enterprise. One Saturday night as the train zipped by Balbriggan, he refused service to a man as the bar had closed. He received a broken jaw, eye socket and four months off work for his trouble. On this basis alone it's hard to not see why staff won't tackle a lot of passengers.

While an extreme case doesn't it just sum up how driver only trains are just as effective as staffed trains. In most cases where interference is needed it won't happen (not saying its right/wrong just depends on situation).

Del.Monte · 08-06-2017 08:37AM

No, it shows up, yet again, why trains need an acceptable level of staffing.

L1011 · 08-06-2017 08:42AM

Del.Monte wrote: »

No, it shows up, yet again, why trains need an acceptable level of staffing.

Two person operation would immediately close large parts of the network

Del.Monte · 08-06-2017 08:47AM

L1011 wrote: »

Two person operation would immediately close large parts of the network

It might encourage more people to travel as they would feel safer. Anyway there's almost a two person operation in existence already with Travelling Ticket checkers. Of course, if there were two person operation parcels could also be carried thereby generating more revenue. Chicken and egg...

harr · 08-06-2017 08:50AM

I have seen this a lot on trains and unfortunately recently on the enterprise...it's definitely a staffing issue..was on a Galway bound train over the last bank holiday and two stag parties and a hen party all in different carriages..this was 11am all were very drunk and just basically making the journey very unpleasant for others..
I asked the lady doing the catering if she could get a member of staff down to have a word ..she said it was only her and one other member of staff on board...not acceptable on a full service surely staff should be available in case of emergency..

Del.Monte · 08-06-2017 08:52AM

harr wrote: »

I have seen this a lot on trains and unfortunately recently on the enterprise...it's definitely a staffing issue..was on a Galway bound train over the last bank holiday and two stag parties and a hen party all in different carriages..this was 11am all were very drunk and just basically making the journey very unpleasant for others..
I asked the lady doing the catering if she could get a member of staff down to have a word ..she said it was only her and one other member of staff on board...not acceptable on a full service surely staff should be available in case of emergency..

Especially as the catering attendant is no more a member of staff than a member of the public is. Private company with nothing to do with rail operation.

08-06-2017 09:14AM

Ah yes, millenials.
Any issues I've had on that particular train have been "businessmen" talking very loudly and talking up a 4-person table by themselves for the entire journey and middle aged people cutting ahead as people are getting on.

harr · 08-06-2017 09:14AM

Del.Monte wrote: »

Especially as the catering attendant is no more a member of staff than a member of the public is. Private company with nothing to do with rail operation.

I knew that..I was just asking her if she could make any other members of staff know...she in fact could not do her job properly as these 3 groups were blocking her from doing her trolley service.

L1011 · 08-06-2017 10:33AM

Del.Monte wrote: »

It might encourage more people to travel as they would feel safer. Anyway there's almost a two person operation in existence already with Travelling Ticket checkers. Of course, if there were two person operation parcels could also be carried thereby generating more revenue. Chicken and egg...

Neither would vaguely cover the cost

Sam Kade · 08-06-2017 10:38AM

XPS_Zero wrote: »

I've been on the Enterprise twice in recent weeks.

It's usually one of the better rail services in Ireland because like Cork it has personnel on board and is just far more comfortable, has more amenities like a restaurant car and decent air conditioning, it thus makes a long trip pass more comfortably.

I've brought up here once before the issue of people playing music on phones a who apparently have never heard of earphones, this is usually 1-2 people though, but now I'm starting to see entire groups doing this stuff, and the rail staff don't say a word to them.? On one trip there was a group of (drunk) lads in their 20s beating out music, the music was bad enough, football songs ...ugh...jesus.., but added to that none of us realize when were tanked just how loud were being and the two together made the trip unbearable.nals

I might be alone...but despite the stereotype of millennial lacking social graces not being able to look up from our iphones for 5 seconds to notice other people in the world and show them consideration, I was always brought up to be considerate to other people and try to think of things from others perspectives, and it seems patently obvious to me that other people might not want to listen to your type of music blaring in their ears, a type they might hate, punctuated by the cheers of loud drunk people...isn't this f---g obvious to anyone with any manners? Even when drunk I'd recognize this, I might not realize how loud I'm talking, but I'd not get up and play music let alone sing along to it at the top of my lungs.

Now I'm on my way home again...and here we go again.? This time it's old women.? They have country music going and are singing along to it, standing up blocking the entry way to the restaurant car, drunk.? It's the worst type of music too, because personally I find country music so profoundly depressing, I have never been able to put my finger on why, but it really just sinks my whole mood and now I have no choice but to listen to it for a 2.5 hour trip because it's so loud it's coming through my ear phones.? There are people, to make matters worse, around them, clapping and laughing, but when I went through the carriage a minute ago to get something to drink I noticed 2/3 of the carriage have a "God...SHOOT ME!" face on and not in a bemused way but in a "this is unbearable " way.

I'm at a loss as to why the train crew can't say to them "ok ladies, let this be the last song there's other people on the train".

Its funny, something I often find myself saying to fellow millienals many of whom seem to be unable to tolerate someone else having a different opinion to themselves without getting personally offended by it, and it applies here, I'd almost like to scream it at these people "there are other people in the world besides you and their wishes and opinions are just as valid as yours".? I wonder how those women would feel if when they were coming home on the train visiting a relative in hospital say , myself and half my rugby team crowded around the carriage they were in and began blasting out and singing along to Linkin Park, Eminem and ItalioBrothers? What bugs me is I know they'd be outraged, but they don't see it themselves.

Surely you mean arrogant rather than ignorant.

n97 mini · 08-06-2017 12:22PM

I think the word is actually inconsiderate.

n97 mini · 08-06-2017 12:23PM

Enterprise is a long train (7 cars?) and usually not close to full. While I feel your pain I would have searched for a quieter carriage.

Del.Monte · 08-06-2017 05:54PM

L1011 wrote: »

Neither would vaguely cover the cost

I think that you're seriously mistaken on that as by the time Fastrack was abolished it was cheaper to travel with your parcel than to send it by the service - i.e. it wouldn't take long to make up the wages of an additional staff member. However, since we are talking CIE it is complete beyond the bounds of possibility.

Losty Dublin · 08-06-2017 08:03PM

Del.Monte wrote: »

No, it shows up, yet again, why trains need an acceptable level of staffing.

The Enterprise is well staffed. A train guard, two or three on the catering set and a train host for the First Class carriages.

Teyla Emmagan · 08-06-2017 08:11PM

You shouldn't be allowed to drink on trains.

gizmo81 · 08-06-2017 08:12PM

I notice this playing music aloud is becoming a trend. Especially with parents giving kids tablets to entertain them.

Two incidents on Irish Rail, a few years back a girl gets on a mid morning train, proceeds to play music and chug on an e-cigarette. I told her I didn't want to hear what she was playing.

A family get on a busy afternoon train, and the father proceeds to play country and western for mother and daughter. Well, the abuse I got when I asked him to turn it off. I was called all manner of names and accused of all sorts.

Trolley girl said she'd say it Irish Rail staff but there is none. This man and the anger and victimisation he was displaying could have easily turned into violence.

I just don't get how people think playing music aloud on public transport is acceptable. Imagine if every person on a carriage turned on their music. It would be a nightmare.

n97 mini · 08-06-2017 09:24PM

Losty Dublin wrote: »

The Enterprise is well staffed. A train guard, two or three on the catering set and a train host for the First Class carriages.

Catering staff are third party contractors though? No responsibility towards the running of the train.

n97 mini · 08-06-2017 09:26PM

Teyla Emmagan wrote: »

You shouldn't be allowed to drink on trains.

Nanny state mentality. Additionally, it's one of the few USPs the train has over the bus.

You shouldn't be allowed disturb other passengers, drinking or not.

ED E · 08-06-2017 09:30PM

Veolia may have a much more compact network to love after but it really is striking the difference between Luas and IR. IR seem to only have STT lads in Conolly not roaming the network.

Del2005 · 08-06-2017 09:42PM

Deedsie wrote: »

It must have been said a million times. Why can't we have alcohol free quiet carriages. I don't care if people want to drink on a train, there should be consideration for others though.
.

If there is no staff to stop people being antisocial on a train it won't matter if there's an alcohol free carriage, the ignorant people will just ignore it like they ignore that you shouldn't be being antisocial.

LXFlyer · 08-06-2017 09:43PM

Teyla Emmagan wrote: »

You shouldn't be allowed to drink on trains.

So I shouldn't be allowed have a glass of wine when eating dinner on the Enterprise or the Dublin-Cork train?

Del2005 · 08-06-2017 09:45PM

ED E wrote: »

Veolia may have a much more compact network to love after but it really is striking the difference between Luas and IR. IR seem to only have STT lads in Conolly not roaming the network.

And it only took the Luas nearly a decade to get the red line in partial control. Our justice system is the problem not IR, Luas etc.

end of the road · 08-06-2017 09:50PM

XPS_Zero wrote: »

personally I find country music so profoundly depressing, I have never been able to put my finger on why, but it really just sinks my whole mood

because by jesus it is depressing. death, immigration. that's all they sing about.

L1011 wrote: »

Two person operation would immediately close large parts of the network

it would be used as an excuse all right. as i said before ireland isn't a normal country and never will be.

tabbey · 08-06-2017 10:03PM

Teyla Emmagan wrote: »

You shouldn't be allowed to drink on trains.

In theory,passengers are only allowed drink the very limited drinks sold on board.
I would not mind somebody drinking a small quantity of alcohol on the train, providing he/she behaves in a respectful manner.

From time immemorial it has been illegal, under railway by-laws to be intoxicated or disorderly on trains, but this is difficult to enforce, especially when such a person boards at an intermediate or provincial station.
Drunk or disorderly people should not be allowed enter the platform at Heuston or Connolly, but it is understandable that station staff allow them to go on their way, as the easiest way to get rid of them.

Ideally the criminal justice system should deal with these characters, but Gardai have no interest, as they could go to a lot of trouble only for a District Judge to dismiss the case or apply probation.

The only way to change attitudes is if enough people seek damages for the unpleasant experience that they have endured. The rail operator has a duty of care far greater than a shopkeepr or publican, as shoppers etc can walk out but railpassengers remain confined to the train.

Teyla Emmagan · 08-06-2017 10:13PM

lxflyer wrote:

So I shouldn't be allowed have a glass of wine when eating dinner on the Enterprise or the Dublin-Cork train?

No. For the greater food. Can you really not manage to eat your dinner without washing it down with alcohol? Because if so that's a bit pathetic. A blanket booze ban would be one of the easiest ways to mute the gob****e travelling public.

Del.Monte · 08-06-2017 10:16PM

Teyla Emmagan wrote: »

No. For the greater food. Can you really not manage to eat your dinner without washing it down with alcohol? Because if so that's a bit pathetic. A blanket booze ban would be one of the easiest ways to mute the gob****e travelling public.

It might be but as another poster said why should everybody have to suffer because of a few yobs? If they started breaking carriage windows while drunk would you advocate removing carriage windows as a preventative measure.

LXFlyer · 08-06-2017 10:40PM

Teyla Emmagan wrote: »

No. For the greater food. Can you really not manage to eat your dinner without washing it down with alcohol? Because if so that's a bit pathetic. A blanket booze ban would be one of the easiest ways to mute the gob****e travelling public.

I like to think that I'm entitled to make that decision for myself without someone else doing it for me?

And please don't make swinging judgements about me.

If I choose at the end of a long week at work to have a drink with my dinner on my way home, I think that's my business and absolutely none of yours.

Teyla Emmagan · 08-06-2017 10:42PM

Because I don't think the "suffering" involved in not having a glass of wine with your dinner is anything like the real unpleasantness that is being stuck in a carriage with a load of loud aggressive drunks for hours. As has been said, no one on the trains will tell them to calm down etc so the easiest way to control them is to stop them getting drunk in the first place. When the train is so packed you can't move it makes for a really horrible few hours.

end of the road · 08-06-2017 11:02PM

Teyla Emmagan wrote: »

Because I don't think the "suffering" involved in not having a glass of wine with your dinner is anything like the real unpleasantness that is being stuck in a carriage with a load of loud aggressive drunks for hours. As has been said, no one on the trains will tell them to calm down etc so the easiest way to control them is to stop them getting drunk in the first place. When the train is so packed you can't move it makes for a really horrible few hours.

you are imagining things. nobody is claiming that there would be suffering. however
1. it's their business if they want a drink with their dinner, it doesn't make them an alcoholic (peple who think anyone who has a drink is an alcoholic are as bad as those who binge drink)
2. an alcohol bann doesn't and wouldn't actually work as there is no staff, and will be no staff, aboard most trains.

Ignorant Passengers

Comments