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Statutory Regulation of Counselling & Psychotherapy (Mod note in OP)

  • #1
    Registered Users Posts: 4,856 ✭✭✭ JuliusCaesar


    Minister for Health, Simon Harris in the Dail 8th June 2016:

    The regulation of the 14 professions currently designated under the Health and Social Care Professionals Act 2005 is being implemented on a phased basis as the registration board and register for each profession is established. Currently, nine of the 14 designated professions have registration boards and registers have been established for seven of them.

    Psychotherapists and counsellors are not currently regulated under the Health and Social Care Professionals Act 2005. However, the Act provides that the Minister for Health may, by regulation, designate a health and social care profession not already designated if he or she considers that it is appropriate and in the public interest to do so and if specified criteria have been met.

    Grandfathering of existing practitioners with minimum qualifications to be specified by regulation is provided for under the Act.

    In accordance with the Act, the Health and Social Care Professionals Council has been consulted on the question of regulating counsellors and psychotherapists. Its detailed report on the matter is being examined carefully in the Department of Health with a view to deciding the next steps in the coming months. These steps will, I envisage, include a wider round of consultation involving the various professional bodies and other interested parties.

    The regulation of a new profession under the Act involves a consultation process and the making of a number of statutory instruments by the Minister for Health and by the relevant registration board. I envisage that, subject to the outcome of consultations, the statutory phase to regulate counsellors and psychotherapists under the Act will begin later this year or early next year with the submission of draft designation regulations to the Houses of the Oireachtas for their approval. Thereafter, I expect that the registration board should be constituted and operating during 2017. By the end of 2018, or early 2019, the board should be in a position to make the various bye-laws to allow it to accept applications for registration. In parallel, the regulations to protect titles and to prescribe the qualifications to be required of existing practitioners would be drafted and enacted.

    While the profession or professions of counsellor and psychotherapist are not specifically designated under the 2005 Act, counsellors and psychotherapists are subject to legislation similar to other practitioners including consumer legislation, competition, contract and criminal law. There are also various regulatory controls on many counsellors and psychotherapists operating in Ireland.

    The profession of psychologist, for example, is a designated profession under the 2005 Act which means that those psychologists who are counsellors and/or psychotherapists will begin to be regulated when the Psychologists Registration Board, which is due to be established later this year, opens its register.

    Psychiatrists, some of whom practice psychotherapy, are regulated under the Medical Practitioners Act 2007. Also, counsellors/therapists working in the publicly funded health sector are required to have minimum qualifications set by the Health Service Executive under the Health Act 2004.

    http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/Debates%20Authoring/DebatesWebPack.nsf/takes/dail2016060800074#N44

    Mod - This thread is for discussion of forthcoming regulation, not for sourcing a personal therapist.


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Comments



  • What'll happen next year, a report based on all of the submissions with recommendations?




  • Counsellors and Psychotherapists Registration – The Minister advised that his Department will be issuing a report on the consultation that took place at the end of 2016 in the next few months. It is intended to list Counsellors and Psychotherapists under the Health and Social Care Professionals Act, to be regulated by CORU. He acknowledged the challenge that will bring, in light of the issues that have arisen where efforts have been put into regulating the professions internationally. However with a major concern for patient safety, this will be progressing. It has been agreed to only progress this work, when the social care workers register has been progressed and the psychologists register is open, as it was acknowledged that there would be much learning that could help the establishment of these registers.

    Source




  • What'll happen next year, a report based on all of the submissions with recommendations?

    Good call 😊


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  • Hmmm, I remain sceptical!




  • You couldn't make this up.

    The Anti-Choice Pregnancy "Counselling" Centre wants statutory regulation of counsellors/psychotherapists HALTED.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/were-upholding-law-say-pregnancy-counsellors-qvb7cjqmg?shareToken=4e83c2c59fea6a9644645f12a073e5ce
    A crisis pregnancy agency exposed by The Times has written to the government demanding that it halt plans to regulate counsellors and claiming that women who have abortions are more likely to sexually abuse other family members.


    WTF?!




  • You couldn't make this up.

    The Anti-Choice Pregnancy "Counselling" Centre wants statutory regulation of counsellors/psychotherapists HALTED.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/were-upholding-law-say-pregnancy-counsellors-qvb7cjqmg?shareToken=4e83c2c59fea6a9644645f12a073e5ce




    WTF?!

    Who finds them? What's the agenda? Religious I suspect?




  • From Ask Majella website:
    Ask Majella was established in 2002 and has since expanded to provide pregnancy counselling and support throughout Northern Ireland and the Republic of Ireland. Our service is provided by healthcare professionals and trained helpline volunteers.

    We recommend and offer you a free ultrasound scan for an accurate assessment of pregnancy and help towards making a fully informed decision. As we are a Catholic support service we provide this service in accordance with the principles that we believe the best and truly positive option is one where there is no loss of or detriment to life.

    No detail as to their counsellors, their qualifications, or affiliations.

    From Human Life International's website:
    for more information and how to order Patrick McCrystal's book: Who's at the centre of your marriage, The Pill or Jesus Christ?



    Just for info: emergency contraception (the morning-after pill) is NOT an abortifacient, they generally prevent implantation.


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  • Horrific. Let's hope the government ignore this crowd of loonies who spread lies and fear.




  • Human Life International made a submission to the calls for comment on regulation, alleging a link between abortion and breast cancer. Initially, I thought it was a rant/complaint to the BAI.

    Is this true?
    Traditionally psychology, and psychiatry even, have been seen by many commentators as ‘soft sciences’. It is of significance that in the Republic of Ireland one may not become a psychiatrist unless one has already been awarded a medical degree. In the U.S., in several States at least, one doesn’t need a medical degree in order to become a psychiatrist.

    There's also a bit afterwards about butter and margarine.




  • :rolleyes: I think almost anywhere in the world, psychiatrists are qualified medical doctors, who specialise in psychiatry.

    Strange they give no details of their counsellors or their qualifications. As we know, it isn't a protected title, and ANYONE can call themselves a counsellor - with or without any qualifications or accreditation with a reputable professional body.




  • Human Life International made a submission to the calls for comment on regulation, alleging a link between abortion and breast cancer. Initially, I thought it was a rant/complaint to the BAI.

    Is this true?



    There's also a bit afterwards about butter and margarine.

    That is not true. You must be a qualified doctor before becoming a psychiatrist in the USA (and Ireland).




  • I expect that they are so little qualified that they don't know the difference between psychiatrists, psychologists, and psychotherapists.




  • I expect that they are so little qualified that they don't know the difference between psychiatrists, psychologists, and psychotherapists.


    Medicate, measure, heal :)




  • I expect that they are so little qualified that they don't know the difference between psychiatrists, psychologists, and psychotherapists.

    More missionary zeal than psychologial support.




  • Thought I would post this here seems as we already touched on this area instead of starting a new thread!!

    Not my words, (taken from wellbeing foundation) it's about that young girl held under the mental health act that was seeking to have an abortion

    There are pointers which indicate that the 'psychiatrist' who first saw this young woman is a protegée of Professor Dr Patricia Casey, professor of psychiatry at UCD, chief shrink at the Mater Hospital, SPUC supporter, and patron/supporter of the extreme right-wing Catholiban entity, the Iona Institute.

    It is absolutely appalling that an extremist like Casey or any of her supporters could be able to MISUSE the Mental Health Act to further their own religion-driven agenda in relation to women's rights and deny any woman her *entitlement* under Irish law to a termination if she is danger of suicide.

    Petition here if anyone is interested
    https://my.uplift.ie/petitions/locking-women-up-because-they-want-an-abortion-is-barbaric?source=facebook-share-button&time=1497430232




  • dar100 wrote: »
    It is absolutely appalling that an extremist like Casey or any of her supporters could be able to MISUSE the Mental Health Act to further their own religion-driven agenda in relation to women's rights and deny any woman her *entitlement* under Irish law to a termination if she is danger of suicide.
    Dare I say if you think this you misunderstand the social function of civil commitment. People are sent to psychiatric hospitals against their will when they violate social mores (walk around your town in the nip for a while if you don't believe me). In this case this unfortunate young woman ran afoul of our society's antipathy towards abortion. This is a perfect example of the mental health act doing exactly what it was designed to do.




  • What's the point in regulating these professions? Let's say there is a dodgy counsellor who can no longer practice as a result of this legislation, he's just going to call himself a life coach or personal motivation assistant instead.


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  • Valmont wrote: »
    Dare I say if you think this you misunderstand the social function of civil commitment. People are sent to psychiatric hospitals against their will when they violate social mores (walk around your town in the nip for a while if you don't believe me). In this case this unfortunate young woman ran afoul of our society's antipathy towards abortion. This is a perfect example of the mental health act doing exactly what it was designed to do.

    Hardly the same "breaking of social norms"




  • Hi

    Im just curious about what peoples opinions are on upcoming regulation in counselling and psychotherapy and what they think the criteria will be? Im in my 4th year of an IAHIP recognised course and am wondering am I going to have to go and do a 2 years masters now? Which makes me want to weep a little bit as I dont have the funds and had planned for just doing these 4 years.




  • See Ronny Swain, Regulation of the psychology profession in Ireland: context, history and personal reflections, The Irish Journal of Psychology, Volume 35, April 2014, Issue 1, pp. 7-15.




  • Wait, is this actually going to happen then? I thought they'd been talking about it for years and it wasn't clear if it would? Is your BA not enough to allow you to practice as a counsellor? I thought BAs would be counsellors and MAs would be psychotherapists?

    I don't understand why they'd exclude BAs, when study after study has shown that even placebo therapy (where you are just listened to attentively and no methodology is employed) is massively helpful, and usually as effective as real therapy, and when we are dealing with a situation where thousands of people who need therapy can't afford it.

    I read a PCI blog post outlying what the new BAs / Bsc's would need to look like but now I can't find it :(
    I assume that, being businesses, the private colleges will make add-on courses to make the old BAs equal to the new BAs, surely? And these should work out cheaper than getting an MA, which is something we'd rather get after working in counselling for a few years and saving up, and not before.

    Anyway, where there is a will there is a way. In the past I let people convince me that things were impossible, and then afterwards I saw people in the same situation as me had persisted and had gotten what I wanted and had given up on! No one can take those 4 years away from you or pretend like they weren't worthwhile, there will be some door that will get you the title. Maybe they'll invent a new term for people stuck in limbo in the meantime. "Distress Consultant" or something!




  • Mod - I've merged a few threads on this subject for background info and I imagine it'll be an ongoing discussion once developments start to emerge.




  • It used to be you only needed a diploma for accreditation, apparently, for accreditation the bodies now want a Level 8 degree for that, so private universities are offering upgrade programmes for professional counsellors who previously only had diplomas. I'm sure if it's necessary they'll do the exact same for those of us with Level 8s in the future, should that no longer be enough.




  • Personally, I'm in favour of higher standards of regulation. It's not that I equate higher levels of education with higher levels of efficacy, but at least there is a greater theoretical basis there along with the dedication of time and resources over several years to the profession. It stops it being a case of one year diploma and you're accredited.




  • I'll be in favour of asking more college of counsellors when someone shows me evidence that more years of college translate into better results for clients (not a rhetorical question).




  • I'll be in favour of asking more college of counsellors when someone shows me evidence that more years of college translate into better results for clients (not a rhetorical question).

    It can but of course as with everything in the therapy field it's not black and white. Depending on the course provider having a comprehensive training to Masters level can greatly help working as a psychotherapist or counsellor. There is value to be had in the theoretical approaches. For example a good knowledge of object relations theory can help inform the work.
    Then there is the personal work such a process groups and own therapy which takes time to settle in to. Personally I wouldn't attend a psychotherapist who wasn't very well qualified.


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  • Yeah, I'd have a hard time attending a therapist with lightweight qualifications. Frankly, without some evidence of specialisation I can't take them all that seriously. There's the odd junk diploma out there, I'm a little surprised people bother putting them on their Linkedin, but perhaps I shouldn't be because of box ticking and visibility.


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