Wonder Woman (2017)

techdiver · 03-06-2017 10:42pm

Ben Gadot wrote: »

You pose an interesting point IM that I didn't think about at the time. Diana seemed to reconcile herself with the nature of mankind by the end so I'm not sure why she withdrew from it, unless a potential sequel fills in that gap.

Yeah her line in BvS was she walked away from humanity after a century of horrors. The problem is though that the sequel is apparently confirmed for modern day, so no gap filling between this and BvS.

gloobag · 03-06-2017 11:13pm

Saw this last night and enjoyed it for the most part, mainly due to solid performances by most of the cast. Gadot is perfect in the role. But my god does it have some major problems for me.

The main one being Ares. A nothing character really. We hear about who he is early on and that he may return and that would be bad (blah blah blah), but we never really get any sense of presence from him. When he does show up in the last few minutes it's just a load of CGI nonsense. Ares should have been a constant presence in the movie. Fcuk this twist ****e (ooh, it was this guy all along), we all knew he was the bad guy. You had David Thewlis on board and you're telling me you couldn't come up with something even just a little bit more interesting than CGI metal and lightning bolts flying around. Such a waste of a great actor in what could have been a great role.

My other big gripe is the action. Enough with the slow mo already. It takes all the impact out of the combat. Then the amount of poor CGI on top of that. It was like watching video game cutscenes half the time. Nothing had any weight.

Steve Trevor (supposedly) dies. One of the most important characters from Wonder Woman comics for decades and you kill him off in the first movie. This makes me fear for the state of the inevitable sequel, as we will now have to be subjected to whatever nonsense the writers come up with to bring him back. They could actually do something interesting and introduce some of DC's mystical characters like Constantine or Dr Fate to help pluck him from the afterlife and bring him into the modern day, but you know they won't. It will be something silly like his soul is trapped in that watch because he loved Diana so much or some ****.

Things I loved.

The Amazons and Themyscira were great. The crossing of No man's Land. Steve's band of rogues were interesting. Gadot and Pines chemistry. The overall portrayal of Diana's character was pretty spot on.

All of these things were so enjoyable to watch that it almost makes me want to forgive the things I didn't like.

IncognitoMan · 04-06-2017 12:23am

Ben Gadot wrote: »

You pose an interesting point IM that I didn't think about at the time. Diana seemed to reconcile herself with the nature of mankind by the end so I'm not sure why she withdrew from it, unless a potential sequel fills in that gap.

Yeah I think it would have been great to end the first film with her thinking she has helped mankind become better. End the first on that high.

Then in the squeal you can pick up where you left off and have her learn that throughout human history there has always been conflict.

Then when WW2 starts (only around 20 years later) she has the realization that nothing has changed and it most likely never will. She loses Steve in WW2 and decides to walk away, maybe head back to themyscira.

Of course then you need something to pull her back into our world and you need to fill in the gap as to why she changed her mind but I think it would add a lot of weight to that decision if you had seen exactly why she walked away and you can empathize with it.

I've a feeling it will all be done in a couple of dialogue scenes with Bruce near the start of Justice League though and that's a shame because I think there was a really good story to be told there.

pinkypinky · 04-06-2017 12:23am

I absolutely loved it. Haven't bothered with any other DC movies and had low expectations but wow. Gal Gadot is fab. I loved the music. And yes, it was bloody great to see a woman lead a film and I actually felt empowered by the experience - reminiscent of watching Buffy. Saw it with a male cousin, who admitted he wouldn't have bothered if I hadn't suggested it. The cinema wasn't anywhere near full though.

youngblood · 04-06-2017 12:52am

I'll post a review later but the cinema was nearly empty at an 8 o'clock screening.......

On a Saturday night, opening weekend......

Anyone else concerned by this? Did this happen anywhere else?

IncognitoMan · 04-06-2017 1:29am

That's not good alright. I don't go to many Saturday showings myself but I would have thought that would be the busiest time?

There was a nice crowd at my screening Thursday but considering it was the first showing in Galway it wasn't crazy either.

The Black Oil · 04-06-2017 7:51am

Bank holiday effect?

judeboy101 · 04-06-2017 7:58am

Saw it, agree with most that 3rd act was weak due to cheap big bad fight scene, saw it sat night very quiet (possible champions league effect). What worked well was as good as any we have seen from super hero movies but I fear how we will be diluted by JL

silverharp · 04-06-2017 8:40am

the complaints I head from someone was, its too long, not enough wonder woman more like a romance drama also some dodgy military stuff being able to ride and move around a military base with no guards

Outlaw Pete · 04-06-2017 3:59pm

Watched this in a packed house last night and one joke (an innuendo) either went over people's heads.... or else nobody found it funny... I think it was the former... and just was bad timing... but maybe not.

Was the scene where they were speaking and Pine thinks WW is talking about his penis (which was funny) but then WW says regarding his watch but continuing the double entendre: "Are you gonna let that little thing tell you what to do?"

Got tumbleweeds at the screening I was at anyway.

Anyway, overall, it kinda felt like I watched two films at the same time... one was excellent... and the other crap.

The back story build up was interesting, chemistry between the two leads good, the dialogue sharp and was enjoying their scenes..... but almost everything else was boring and so it ruined the whole thing. Felt like they didn't know what film they wanted to make and so made both.. which in the end just resulted in a forgettable mess.

youngblood · 04-06-2017 4:47pm

Felt like its the best DC movie yet (since the Synder verse reboot), I thought the early part of the film was good, lovely back story, building nicely but I felt it lacked a bit of the magic you get with Marvel films and failed to kick in.
Humour was good when needed and not over done.

I especially thought some of Gal Gadot's acting was pretty ropey in places...as in I could see the director telling her to "look here" "feel sad & distressed, then hold your hair and look this way" kinda acting.

Thought Chris Pine was very good overall as were most of the supporting cast, but the thing that got me most was when the film was building nicely along we got this change in how the film was being shot, the cinematography seemed jarring and affected the tone of the movie, almost distracting to a point when it should have added to story not taken away from it specifically when

she was walking across no man's land, holding the tank above her head deciding whether to crush Dr Poison or not

felt like it disrupted the flow and suspended my belief in the movie.

I dunno if my expectations were too high but it didnt deliver,
I wanted to love this Wonder Woman and for the most part was very good but it still lacks the X-factor I hoped for.

(The first Captain America was ok, the second was amazing, so who knows, maybe Wonder Woman 2 might hit those spots?)

Ben Gadot · 04-06-2017 5:07pm

The Black Oil wrote: »

Bank holiday effect?

Maybe, but I think traditionally Sunday and Monday on the bank holiday weekends are the busier days for cinemas.

There's a nagging thought in the back of my head however that Gal, no matter how well received her performance has been, won't appeal to the female demograph.

Slydice · 04-06-2017 6:30pm

'Wonder Woman' Sets a Record Opening for a Female Directed Feature
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/news/?id=4298&p=.htm

In fact, Wonder Woman delivered the 16th largest opening weekend for a comic book adaptation all-time. It's the sixth largest opening among that group if you don't count sequels and, based on estimates, the sixth largest June opening all-time. Looking ahead, given the strong word of mouth, it would be no shock to see it deliver $300 million domestically or at least very close to that figure.

The question is now.. can it be the first of these new Warner Brothers DCEU films to reach a Billion?

Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice is the highest after making $873 million so far: http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?id=superman2015.htm

Agent Coulson · 04-06-2017 6:47pm

I doubt it will get anywhere near a billion at the box office to be honest.

dudara · 04-06-2017 6:51pm

I went to see Wonder Woman this morning in IMAX at Cineworld. The cinema had a good few people in it, but was probably quieter than I would have expected.

Overall, I really enjoyed it, despite some obvious issues. I thought Gal Gadot's acting was a little off at times, but I felt it suited the developmental journey that Diana was on. The fight/action scenes, with the exception of the last one were very good, and Gadot looked fantastic throughout. Real heart in the film, and Pine was pretty good too (he's gotten so much better lately)

Ben Gadot · 04-06-2017 6:59pm

Agent Coulson wrote: »

I doubt it will get anywhere near a billion at the box office to be honest.

Why's That? Given how poorly received SS, MOS and BVS were yet still received respectable figures, there's no reason why we can't hope for the best with WW.

Agent Coulson · 04-06-2017 7:04pm

Ben Gadot wrote: »

Why's That? Given how poorly received SS, MOS and BVS were yet still received respectable figures, there's no reason why we can't hope for the best with WW.

Only 30 movies have ever gotten over a billion at the box office the odds are against it big time.

If it does anywhere between 500/750m it will have done amazingly well.

FunLover18 · 04-06-2017 8:35pm

It's a great film and I really enjoyed but it's not as good as some people are saying. Gal Gadot DOES absolutely nail it though, she's perfect. Chris pine is also very good.

My main criticisms:

The present day bookends are absolutely awful and completely unnecessary. Wonder Woman is a great standalone film, it's a real shame to have to be reminded that it's connected to the rest of DCEU (why does Bruce Wayne send the photograph in an armoured truck anyway?).
The "twist" was completely unsurprising but Thewlis is always great. The final action scene was disappointing though.

Goodshape · 04-06-2017 10:47pm

Gal Gadot's portrayal of Wonder Woman seems pitch-perfect. Both charming and powerful as necessary, more believable than perhaps expected, and not cheesy as might have been feared.

As for the rest of the film, I guess it ticks the necessary boxes. The opening section which takes place on the island, including scenes with Robin Wright who I could simply watch for days, was the highlight of the thing and unfortunately what came afterwards felt a little paint-by-numbers.

It would have been nice to have a story with a bit more weight to it, to accompany the well executed characters and setup. Bookending the film, most of which takes place in the 1910s, are a couple of modern day scenes. The main action then takes plays in flashback, as modern-day Diana wistfully recalls it.

The intention undoubtably being to tie the film unmistakably to the other DC properties (there's more 'Wayne Enterprise' logos on display in that opening scene than realistically makes sense), but in reality it more serves to further reduce the import of the films main narrative. There was never anything at stake.

But nice to have a DC superhero film that isn't totally Snyder'd. Plus it has a cracking theme tune.

tunguska · 05-06-2017 12:02am

Just back from seeing this.........absolutley loved it. Really didnt think id even like it but a grp of us were going so i said feck it why not. So glad i did, best super hero film ive seen by a mile. Gal gadot is fantastic but its chris pine who kinda steals the movie. Hes charming and just puts in a great performance. The chemistry between him and Gadot is what makes this film stand out in a world of heartless CGI heavy superhero movies. Yeah theres CGI here for sure but this film has the feels more than any other one. My guess is that pine and gadot got it on for real, the sexual chemistry between them is just too electric. Briiliant movie, hope it does very well. Gadot's wonder woman is a proper female role model. In a world of pouting duck face pulling kardashians and jenners, this is someone girls can look up to.

Slydice · 05-06-2017 3:05pm

Article has spoilers but...
Wonder Woman's Most Fantastic Scene Nearly Didn't Get Made at All
https://io9.gizmodo.com/wonder-womans-most-fantastic-scene-nearly-didnt-get-mad-1795811939

Looks like whoever chopped the BvS theatrical release into incomprehensibility is STILL working in Warner Brothers. Maybe they can't fire whoever it is but they should be moved to a "far more important" job like... in an office.. like nowhere near a film.. like ever again.

johnny_ultimate · 05-06-2017 6:35pm

It's... alright. Has a few high points, but it's largely super business as usual.

Worth giving a shout out to the

No Man's Land

sequence, and also worth giving a shout out that they resisted having Diana saying "I'm not a man" when they cued her up for it. But the scene itself, of all the superhero films I've seen, (and I haven't seen any of the DC ones since Man of Steel because **** that) manages to capture a sense of raw, relentless power - a superhuman being superhuman

(although the editing went to **** a bit once they got to the other side).

Gadot does a pretty good job here, and thank god there's a female director so the camera avoids being super leery. But Gadot is encouragingly adept at the quiet moments - the glances and expressions that sell her journey more than any number of revelations or victories over evil.

Beyond that, I have to confess to finding much of the film strained. I hate, hate, hate the amped up, CG-heavy, slo-mo aesthetic that Zack Snyder has employed throughout his work, and a diluted version of it is unfortunately in play here. Made the opening section pretty horrible to be honest, where any sense of awe or wonder is destroyed by the unashamed artificiality of the images. The scene where young Diana is observing a training session is particularly galling for its inexcusably dreadful effects and matte work. It's something the film never escapes, and the big third act climax is the sort of noisy, dull slugfest that has become the norm in films of this ilk. It's just a bland film visually, post-productioned to death (Huston's glowing face just looked goddamn terrible) and that overproduction unfortunately even cuts into the pulpy, light-hearted and mildly enjoyable London adventuring that makes up much of the second act.

A solitary excellent setpiece and a strong heroine are more than most films of this type offer, granted, but it's mostly a constrained film - one of laboured scene-setting, world-building, and long stretches of telling the audience about its rudimentary, textbook plotting. There's scattered moments of warmth and good humour, but overall Wonder Woman's moments of genuine wonder are spread disappointingly thin. At least there's a few of them - and as terrible as the prologue and epilogues were, the film otherwise largely avoids the extended universe building that kills so many films in this genre.

MilesMorales1 · 06-06-2017 10:28am

Frankly, I went into Wonder Woman with an attitude bordering on cynicism. Given DC's most recent live action cinematic efforts have been the awful Batman v Superman and the positively ghastly Suicide Squad in their attempts to rival Marvel's shared film universe experiment, it wasn't a unique attitude to have, at least according to the internet. It's also had (unfairly) the weight of carrying the first big female led Superhero movie, being directed by a female director, etc

So I'm extremely pleased to say that Wonder Woman is a soaring success that so far surpasses its predecessors in the DCEU it's practically embarrassing. The first great DCEU film is here, and its wonder (woman) ful.

Granted, it might not be breaking any new barriers at a narrative level, its an old school superhero film telling that feels a little like a mix of Thor and the first Captain America with a slightly darker tone, though nowhere near the soul crushing dourness thats infected all the DC movies up to this point. And the traditional story is told and portrayed so well that it hardly matters.

Wonder Woman reminds of the first Captain America in the sense of tone, rather than explicit content. That is to say, Wonder Woman is not a wink wink jokey toned superhero film, such as Doctor Strange, Guardians of The Galaxy, whatever, but is 100% sincere and lacking irony. In a different film, this might not work, or it might become way too poo faced for its own good, but thankfully Wonder Woman never falls into that trap. Diana Prince enters the world of man (that is to say, London and subsequently the battle front) at the end of the first world war with naive expectations of what, well people are like, believing all people (even the people fighting the war) to be basically good and that the war is caused by outside influences and when the outside influence stops, the war will end. The narrative follows Diana losing these naive ideals about the beliefs and goodness of people (its almost always referred to as man, incidentally) and despite her intial disillusionment, deciding to fight for them anyway because although people can be pretty awful, they also have capacity for the greatest deeds as well.

So its a different character arc from the usual superhero fare, the social commentary about feminism and the role of men and women and the absurdity of it in early 20th century society (and ours) is there, and it enhances the narrative. Cool.

Gal Gadot is also a perfect Wonder Woman. To the extent that she now is the character, in the same way we'll forever think of Tobey Maguire as Spider-Man or Chris Evans as Captain America, she is Wonder Woman. She effortlessly (seemingly) achieves the role, beautiful and charming but also ever so slightly bumbling and innocent, and absolutely incredible in the action scenes. Chris Pine also does a great job as the sidekick love interest, in a humourous reversal of roles for someone like him who it feels like would generally be the star, him and Gadot have great chemistry. The rest of the cast do great work as well, particularly Saïd Taghmaoui, Lucy Davis, and David Thewlis.

But those action scenes, oh my stars. If you haven't heard or seen the action scenes in the trenches, then you shouldn't spoil it for yourself by seeing it in trailers or on youtube, you should just go and see it and be blown away like I was, its incredible. The third act mega brawl doesn't seem to have resonated with people quite as much, but I quite liked it, and it also looked visually spectacular.

And the soundtrack rocks. The Wonder Woman electric guitar thing that felt weird in BvS fits so much better here, it was great.

I was idly thinking maybe I liked Wonder Woman so much after the first viewing, because it was the first viewing and quite often you're on a sort of post viewing high. So I went to see it again, and liked it even more, so nope, Wonder Woman is just fantastic. It's beautifully shot, well acted, fantastic soundtrack, fantastic action, maybe a predictable narrative but it works completely and tells a compelling story with good characters. This is what DC have been waiting for, please don't screw up Justice League now that I'm on board.

Mr E · 06-06-2017 10:49am

MilesMorales1 wrote: »

And the soundtrack rocks. The Wonder Woman electric guitar thing that felt weird in BvS fits so much better here, it was great.

Electric Cello actually.

Out of all the superhero soundtracks in recent years, this is one of the most memorable. I loved the score in WW.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tI2ASp0f7GU

MilesMorales1 · 06-06-2017 10:53am

Mr E wrote: »

Electric Cello actually. Out of all the superhero soundtracks in recent years, this is one of the most memorable. I loved the score in WW.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tI2ASp0f7GU

Ah yes, I thought I'd read that. It's pretty great. Out of place in the BvS scene though, I thought.

Nervous Wreck · 06-06-2017 11:43am

We'll forever think of Tobey Maguire as Spider-man?! Jesus no.

pixelburp · 06-06-2017 11:43am

If the DC films have spawned anything positive and lasting, it's likely to be the first truly memorable superhero theme since Batman 1989. Plenty has been written about temp tracks and the generally forgettable musical compositions of the Marvel films; it's great to finally get something singular and original again.

Mickeroo · 06-06-2017 11:53am

I often find myself whistling the avengers them, apart from the first Captain America film's theme(which was disappointingly dropped) it's the only memorable theme out of the marvel films imo.

MilesMorales1 · 06-06-2017 12:04pm

Nervous Wreck wrote: »

We'll forever think of Tobey Maguire as Spider-man?! Jesus no.

Well I know I will. Way more so than Garfield. And Holland obviously has yet to be seen. But I really love the first two Raimi Spidey films.

p to the e · 06-06-2017 12:32pm

I've seen better, I've seen worse. Gadot looks amazing and really fits the physical attributes but her acting leaves a lot to be desired. She seems to come from the Daniel Radcliffe school of eyebrow acting. Raising them feigns surprise whilst deeply furrowed portrays confusion or general wonderment.

Having a female director seems to have been a positive (or a negative depending on your outlook) in one aspect as we don't get an over sexualised wonder woman just there to ogle at. I'm looking at you Suicide Squad.

The majority of the action scenes looked great and grey but they really over did it with the slow mo fight sequences.

In my opinion Chris Pine is the glue that holds this film together. He knows he's playing second fiddle to a Goddess and plays it well.

What was probably most surprising was the several women who stood and clapped at the end. To each their own.

Wonder Woman (2017)

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