registrar v humanist/spiritualist v celebrant

scarepanda · 09-05-2017 09:54AM #1

Anyone got any opinions on which way to get married?

We're afraid a registrar may be too cold/ clinical (also know if someone who got a different registrar on the day and changed everything already agreed) while a humanist/spiritualist may be to airy fairy for what we want. A celebrant seems to give us the best option, but the draw back with them is that they cannot legally marry us, so we would still need to go to a registry office.

stargazer 68 · 09-05-2017 09:56AM

We had a Humanist and she was fantastic - definitely not airy fairy! Really depends on what kind of ceremony you want.

seamus · 09-05-2017 10:07AM

http://humanism.ie

They have a number of non-religious celebrants who can legally marry you outside of a registrar's office.

In all seriousness, I've been to a couple of weddings in registry offices, they're not at all cold and clinical. They're completely open to setting the mood with lighting and music and having readings and whatever else done. Obviously you're time-limited in that you don't get hours beforehand to decorate the room, and they are quite strict on not allowing religious themes in the wedding, but outside of that they're very personal and nice.

Humanist celebrants obviously give you more freedom over the venue and the themes. They're generally not airy-fairy; they go with whatever you want. If you don't want to talk about chakras and souls intertwined and praising the goddess, you don't have to.

baby and crumble · 09-05-2017 10:17AM

Just an FYI humanism and spiritualism are completely different.

Humanism is about celebrating the achievements of human beings as an alternative to any kind of traditional religion.

Spiritualists are very inclusive but any that I have spoken to at wedding fairs are mad into angels and all that- VERY "airy-fairy" as you say. They also cannot legally marry you. If you want a legally binding wedding you have the choice of civil, humanist, or traditional religious (ie catholic, church of ireland, jewish, etc.).

Our humanist solemniser is great. All the stuff she's sent us as examples can be changed. We're relatively sensible in our approach to ceremonies so will be going for some readings from our favourite books and maybe a poem or two. Nothing too out there!

GingerLily · 09-05-2017 12:41PM

If you want a Saturday wedding Humanists book up well in advance (ours was booked 18 months before our ceremony).

Faith · 09-05-2017 12:45PM

baby and crumble wrote: »

Spiritualists are very inclusive but any that I have spoken to at wedding fairs are mad into angels and all that- VERY "airy-fairy" as you say. They also cannot legally marry you. If you want a legally binding wedding you have the choice of civil, humanist, or traditional religious (ie catholic, church of ireland, jewish, etc.).

That's incorrect. Spiritualists can perform legally binding ceremonies.

fg1406 · 09-05-2017 01:40PM

Humanists aren't "airy fairy" at all because humanism is based on science and reason. Spiritualists would be more on the quasi-religious side. You can mention, spirits, afterlife, religion etc.

DaeryssaOne · 09-05-2017 01:48PM

We got married a few weeks ago and had an excellent humanist officiating the ceremony. She was fantastic and allowed us to choose exactly what we would like her to say - whether it be her description of humanism (a choice of 3 or 4 templates), suggested readings (but had no problem with us choosing our own), what vows we would like to say - everything.
We even stripped out a few pieces that we felt were a little too 'airy fairy' - including a description of us and how we met etc. we felt everyone there on the day knew who we were anyway!

I would thoroughly recommend it (bias I know) and what was lovely was so many people remarked on how intently they had actually listened to the words being said rather than just going through the paces as you would in a typical ceremony.

If you would like to see the final layout of what was said at our ceremony just PM me and I can send on her final draft so you can see what type of language she used etc.

GingerLily · 09-05-2017 02:01PM

jobr wrote: »

We got married a few weeks ago and had an excellent humanist officiating the ceremony. She was fantastic and allowed us to choose exactly what we would like her to say - whether it be her description of humanism (a choice of 3 or 4 templates), suggested readings (but had no problem with us choosing our own), what vows we would like to say - everything.
We even stripped out a few pieces that we felt were a little too 'airy fairy' - including a description of us and how we met etc. we felt everyone there on the day knew who we were anyway!

I would thoroughly recommend it (bias I know) and what was lovely was so many people remarked on how intently they had actually listened to the words being said rather than just going through the paces as you would in a typical ceremony.

If you would like to see the final layout of what was said at our ceremony just PM me and I can send on her final draft so you can see what type of language she used etc.

Can you PM me too please

?

baby and crumble · 09-05-2017 02:08PM

Faith wrote: »

That's incorrect. Spiritualists can perform legally binding ceremonies.

Really? Every spiritualist we spoke to said they couldn't. Fair enough. I still stand by my "they were mad into angels" thing though. :P

Faith · 09-05-2017 02:49PM

baby and crumble wrote: »

Really? Every spiritualist we spoke to said they couldn't. Fair enough. I still stand by my "they were mad into angels" thing though. :P

I don't know they told you that, but they count as religious solemnisers https://spiritualceremonies.ie/about-us/. They're definitely mad into angels alright

. And psychic stuff, so definitely more in the "airy fairy" realm than Humanists!

scarepanda · 09-05-2017 03:00PM

Thanks everyone for your opinions!

We're planning for a Friday in November this year to get married so not a whole lot of time to decide.

I'll admit, Iv never been to a non-religious wedding before, so organising this part a bit blind. And to be completely honest I don't know what we want from a ceremony pov. The only thing we are certain of is we don't want a religious ceremony. But which of the other options is best suited to us I really don't know. We keep swinging back and forth between them all.

lazygal · 09-05-2017 08:34PM

We had a civil celebrant for our first wedding and a humanist for our second. I'd recommend the humanist without hesitation. Much more personal. Spiritualism is too wacky for us, they're classed as religious celebrants which we definitely didn't want.

Peregrinus · 10-05-2017 03:52AM

Spiritualists are religious solemnisers - the Spiritualist Union of Ireland is just another church, as far as the registration of marriages legislation is concerned, and its ministers can lawfully marry you. The difference from most other churches is that, as far as the form of the ceremony goes, they're very flexible - it can be as religious/spiritual as you like, or the complete opposite. So if you don't mind having a religious solemniser, they're quite happy to do a non-religious ceremony for you.

Much the same goes, incidentally, for the Unitarians - religious, but not dogmatic, and very flexible as regards the form of ceremony.

And, from the other end of the scale, the Humanist position is similar. Humanism doesn't require any religious belief, but it also doesn't oppose it, and if you wish to include religious/spiritual elements in your wedding ceremony, a Humanist solemniser will be happy to accommodate you.

The only solemnisers who will only preside over non-religious ceremonies are the civil solemnisers employed by the HSE.

The humanist and spiritualist solemnisers are in fairly high demand, so the deciding factor here may actually turn out to be - who's available for the date you want? I'd suggest firm up your ideas about the ceremony a bit, then talk to both spiritualists and humanists to find someone who is happy with the form of ceremony you have in mind, and is free on the day you have in mind.

GingerLily · 10-05-2017 06:53AM

Strictly speaking, humanist ceremonies should not contain any religion
"Humanist Weddings FAQ

2. Q: Is a humanist wedding the right option for me?
A: Humanist weddings are wonderful and personal ceremonies. One of the tenets of humanism is a tolerance for others who hold different belief systems. Therefore everyone feels included during a humanist ceremony.
However, humanists have no belief in a god or the supernatural, relying on scientific evidence and appreciation of the world around us and the achievements of humans. So our ceremonies are secular and non-religious occasions. They are designed to be a positive option for those who share the same philosophical belief system as humanists whether you wish to call yourself a humanist or not, and even whether you are a member of any humanist association or not.
Please think carefully about this choice. If you think you don’t share the same philosophy, or you actually believe in a god or the supernatural, then perhaps a humanist ceremony is not the right choice for you. There are many other organisations out there that would be a more appropriate vehicle for your special day."
From their website
http://humanism.ie/2015/05/faq-about-humanist-weddings/

Peregrinus · 10-05-2017 07:04AM

As a matter of law, the requirement is that the "form of ceremony" used by a Humanist solemniser must be recognised by the Humanist Association of Ireland. I know the Humanists are quite flexible, but evidently they do have rule that the ceremony be "secular and non-religious". That, of course, is what the OP wants, which is fine.

What's the position if you do want some element that might be seen as religious or spiritual? Suppose there's a passage about love from 1 Corinthians or the Song of Solomon that you really like? Can you have that, or is it ruled out because it comes from a text regarded by some as inspired scripture? Suppose there's a wedding song you really like, but it happens to have religious lyrics? My understanding is that Humanist celebrants are reasonably flexible on things like this, and you can have them in a Humanist wedding when you certainly couldn't in a civil wedding. But I could be wrong, and if someone wants elements like this in their wedding ceremony, only a registered Humanist solemniser can say authoritatively whether they would permit it or not.

GingerLily · 10-05-2017 07:13AM

I'm not saying that a Humanist celebrant won't allow it, but the organisation definitely discourage it so it's something to be mindful of. It would be a pity if the OP ran into difficulties trying to get a humanist celebrant because they approached them assuming they encourage religious and spiritual beliefs due to bad advice given online.

Peregrinus · 10-05-2017 07:34AM

GingerLily wrote: »

I'm not saying that a Humanist celebrant won't allow it, but the organisation definitely discourage it so it's something to be mindful of. It would be a pity if the OP ran into difficulties trying to get a humanist celebrant because they approached them assuming they encourage religious and spiritual beliefs due to bad advice given online.

It would, and I'm glad to have been corrected in my earlier advice. But, in my defence, I don't think the OP is at any risk; they evidently want a ceremony with no "airy fairy" elements at all, and the Humanists have no difficulty delivering that.

A2LUE42 · 10-05-2017 07:45AM

We had a Humanist ceremony two years ago and if you want to pm me your email addresses I can send you the booklet we used for the ceremony.

scarepanda · 10-05-2017 10:04AM

Hi everyone!

Thank you again for all opinions and discussions!

Would there be anyone here who had a civil ceremony that would be willing to email me the script from their wedding? All I can find online are very basic samples and I'd like to see if they can be jazzed up a bit.

It would be nice to officially get married on the date we have chosen, as it has significance to us, hence the short engagement and getting married in November! But if all comes to all we'll do the official stuff a day or two before hand and get the celebrant to 'marry' us on the day.

baby and crumble · 10-05-2017 10:10AM

We haven't finalised ours yet but if you want some stuff from outside the box I recommend looking through OffBeat Bride. Ok, some of the stuff is very American and a bit OTT but there are some lovely readings and stuff there.

http://offbeatbride.com/nontraditional-non-religious-wedding-ceremony-script/

That's a good starting point, you can click the hashtags and root around the ceremony script tag.

sulberto · 10-05-2017 10:49AM

PM sent

recipesforme · 10-05-2017 04:14PM

We had a spiritualist perform our ceremony. She was lovely, absolutely nothing airy-fairy about her at all (otherwise we would have run a mile).
We went through the ceremony with her and removed any reference to god/spirit etc and added bits and pieces that we wanted said about each other. She had absolutely no problem with this.
We had our own secular readings, music and vows. There was no candle lighting or anything remotely "churchy". She married us legally in an outdoor ceremony at our venue.
It was identical to a humanist ceremony. I can't speak for all spiritualists but I must say the lady who married us was wonderful.

scarepanda · 12-05-2017 10:58AM

Recipesforme, would you mind sending me the name of your spiritualist?

I finally got through to the local registry office, the registrar isn't available on the day, even for a quick in and out first thing in the morning. And to be honest I'm actually quite happy with that. First impressions weren't good. I rang the hotel after not being able to get through to a few humanists in the region and the wedding coordinator indirectly confirmed my first impression of the registrar.

The hotel gave me a name of a spiritualist that does weddings regularly in the hotel and apparently she's quite flexible and not 'airy fairy' ( I don't use that term in a derogatory way, just the best way to describe what we don't want). So I contacted spiritual ceremonies Ireland and the lady is free on the date. Just waiting for the guy I was speaking to to send out contact info etc.

recipesforme · 12-05-2017 11:10AM

PM sent

honerbright · 12-05-2017 04:01PM

We got married last October in a spiritualist ceremony, the lady who married us was amazing and not airy fairy in the slightest. The entire ceremony was customised to what we wanted (no religious mentions etc but did mention my husband's late parents and my Kate grandparents), the only thing we couldn't change was the legal parts. She wrote the ceremony after meeting us and emailed us a copy which we then edited to our liking and were 100% happy with it, and included a ring warming as well as we had a small wedding (60 people) so it was a nice touch.

pooch90 · 19-05-2017 08:27PM

We had the same experience with our Spiritualist ceremony, lovely man, removed all refs to Spirit without question and our ceremony ended being a good laugh. We had Thomas Colton Snr, real sweetheart

scarepanda · 19-05-2017 08:53PM

Hey everyone! Just thought I'd let yet know that we've chosen a spiritualist in the end. She was recommended by the hotel. I met her during the week and couldn't be happier. She has no problems doing a non religious ceremony and the sample ceremony that was sent in the original email felt the most natural to us.
We had a humanist penciled in, but tbh my first impressions of him weren't all that good and when I looked into him a bit better he seemed very anti God which isn't what were looking for either. While we're not religious, we don't have an issue with people who have religious beliefs (as long as they don't try push their beliefs on us) and we have religious family members and there's no point pissing them off even more.

Anyways, thank you to everyone who gave me their opinions and experiences. I really appreciated it and it helped us figure out what type of ceremony we wanted (never would I have guessed I'd go for a spiritualist!!)

Gatica · 23-05-2017 07:14PM

Glad you got sorted OP. Just wanted to chime in and say we had a lovely Spiritualist Union ceremony. It was before Humanists were available and we simply requested that there be no spiritual element to the ceremony and the SU obliged. It was personal, non-religious and we were very happy with it...

Nalz · 24-06-2017 09:24PM

We're looking for someone to legally marry us in mid September this year, i.e trying to avoid having to do it twice via civil registration office then our actual day.

I see conflicting points as to if spiritualists can legally marry you. Can someone in the know help me out there?

Also,we really don't want to offend people or have airy fairly things are our wedding, so if anyone knows anyone who can marry us on the day legally and remove all religious references from the ceremony that would be awesome. Please pm me!

Thanks

missmatty · 24-06-2017 10:04PM

We had a humanist celebrant last month and he was fantastic. People of all faith and none are welcomed to the ceremony so no question of annoying anyone religious, it's very inclusive. We had quite a few religious family members there and everyone enjoyed it as far as I know. No regrets anyway.

registrar v humanist/spiritualist v celebrant

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