The difficulties caused by money in our relationship...

LegacyUser · 05-05-2017 02:35PM

"Life gets in the way of even the most romantic story, and people sometimes need to give out about things! You need to sit down as a couple and work together, as a couple, a unit. Sometimes communication in relationships can go a bit skew-ways and people lose sight of their relationship and what's important in that.

Talk to her, without talking down to her."

It's so true, and you're right that's what we need to do.

But you guys are making it sound like she is a waster who sits around doing nothing, when actually she contributes/does a lot. She keeps the house looking great, she looks after all the plants, in the rented house she has totally reorganised the garage and messy rooms. She does some voluntary work for a non-profit, uni based [*****] which takes a lot of her time and effort and she gets little back, she often cleans our place and she cooks meals more than I do (although we try and share that), she also keeps track of what food we have and what we need so I don't need to think about it much if I'm busy.

She's not doing nothing... she just can't contribute financially.

Neyite · 05-05-2017 04:55PM

TestingBurger wrote: »

But you guys are making it sound like she is a waster who sits around doing nothing, when actually she contributes/does a lot. She keeps the house looking great, she looks after all the plants, in the rented house she has totally reorganised the garage and messy rooms. She does some voluntary work for a non-profit, uni based [*****] which takes a lot of her time and effort and she gets little back, she often cleans our place and she cooks meals more than I do (although we try and share that), she also keeps track of what food we have and what we need so I don't need to think about it much if I'm busy.

That's the norm though - I do pretty much most of that and I work full time. Plus I commute a few hrs a day on top of that. And we have a child so so all kid related stuff happens daily too. My partner pulls his weight in the house but as he does more hours than me, I tend to put in more housework hours at home. And the thing is, it's not a big deal. Probably every person who responded to you does all of this, possibly even more and works a full time professional job.

....... · 05-05-2017 05:04PM

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miamee · 05-05-2017 05:30PM

OP I am reminded of a relative of mine. He is not far off 40, he lives at home with his parents (after moving out for a couple of years but it didn't really work out financially) and he has never in his life had a full-time job. Or any job that I know of. An elderly relative asked him recently would he not get himself a job or liekto have one and he said "I suppose, if I got a good job..."
It seems that your girlfriend is living under the same delusion that someone with zero work experience is somehow going to hit the career jackpot if they can just hold out long enough on the dole. It's not going to happen. What about when her dream job does come up and it turns out she has no real world work experience? I know she is doing some research in the uni but unless that is likely to become a full-time offering any time soon she is going to have to face a "real world" job and all it entails.

cactusgal · 05-05-2017 05:32PM

....... wrote: »

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What you are describing about feeling violated after a jobs fair and cringing at suggestions of work suggests a work shy individual who simply doesnt want to work.

What would she do if she wasnt with you? Who would support her?[/quote]

I'm deeply curious about this, too. What *would* she do if she didn't have you to support her? Would she work, in that case?

I'd be somewhat similar to her regarding her feelings about not wanting to work in the corporate world, and being idealistic about only wanting to do what you love ... So I started my own business (when I was on barely any money at all), because that's what you do. Not expect hand outs from family, friends, or partners.

LegacyUser · 05-05-2017 06:21PM

cactusgal wrote: »

I'm deeply curious about this, too. What *would* she do if she didn't have you to support her? Would she work, in that case?

I'd be somewhat similar to her regarding her feelings about not wanting to work in the corporate world, and being idealistic about only wanting to do what you love ... So I started my own business (when I was on barely any money at all), because that's what you do. Not expect hand outs from family, friends, or partners.

She'd do exactly what she did before - go to her parents place. She is great friends with her mum, and her mum would do anything to have her living in her house and helping out in the garden. Her younger brother already stays at home full time and does jobs at home to contribute. Her mum is not wealthy but she's happy to provide for my GF. Her dad is not so cool about it and sometimes gives out but...

Big Bag of Chips · 05-05-2017 08:18PM

TestingBurger wrote: »

Would it help to deal with her deep emotional problems and anxiety around work?

Maybe this is a bigger issue and should be explored more. Does she go to counselling for her anxiety? Anxiety can be crippling and rather than her having grandiose ideas of only working in a specific area, maybe that's her safe excuse to fall back on when she just cannot overcome her anxiety to put herself out there to look for work. Academia and part time college work is 'safe' to her. It's not 'the real world'.

A career counsellor can't help her if she genuinely becomes overwhelmed at the idea of going out to work.

Maybe a GP would be a better place to start than a careers coach. Also, you could both go to couples counselling to learn how to communicate better with each other too. Hopefully if she can get help with her anxiety and begin to overcome it, then she will be better able to manage life.

99problems · 06-05-2017 06:50AM

Make sure you wear a condom is all I can say.

Neyite · 06-05-2017 02:35PM

TestingBurger wrote: »

She'd do exactly what she did before - go to her parents place. She is great friends with her mum, and her mum would do anything to have her living in her house and helping out in the garden. Her younger brother already stays at home full time and does jobs at home to contribute. Her mum is not wealthy but she's happy to provide for my GF. Her dad is not so cool about it and sometimes gives out but...

Then this is her normal. It's the dynamic she grew up with. And what that means is that it wont change, not as long as she has her mother enabling her. Was her mother a stay at home mother by any chance?

Someone like this knows how to stand on their own two feet, they just don't want to. And, you know, that's fine if you are the kind of person that wants the 1950's housewife dynamic in your relationship. I've seen a few and they seem happy. So, I suppose you need to decide if you want this kind of life where you are cast in the role of Head of the House and responsible for all and sundry that goes on under your roof, or do you want something different? She is telling you that this is who she is. Listen to her.

Like I say, the one-income family works for some. But it IS a burden on the one bringing home the bacon. Things like redundancy, serious illness or injury are big deals in any family, but more so if it happens to the sole earner. Even things like changing industry or jobs is much harder because there is literally a family depending on you to house, feed and clothe them. Plus there is going to be a reduced standard of living. Maybe that's not important to your partner which is fine - but it might be to you, to your future kids? Things like after school hobbies, or even things like trying to upkeep a second car for the family. It does mean your mortgage is dependent on your income alone and would take into account that you have a dependent adult, so that determines what kind of house you will have. These things are very hard on a single income home unless you are very well paid.

So I suppose you need to have a good think about if you want this until you retire and beyond, or something a bit more equal?

Wesser · 06-05-2017 03:04PM

I think that she needs to get a job any any job and then work her way up. That ha way it is fine you start in the bottom and then after a few months esp if you have qualifications you work you're at up.

She has learnt helplessness look at her brother for god sake who is doing the same thing.

However I also think that you need to think about your own approach. If you decide to give something to someone you love you can't give it with strings attached ie if you choose to offer her accommodation etc you can't do that but then hold it against her, resent her etc.

Whatever you do right now make sure you don't get her pregnant.

cactusgal · 06-05-2017 04:00PM

Interesting to read about the family dynamic, that explains a lot.

This is something that I advise a lot on these types of posts, and something which I'd been more aware of in past relationships, but here you go:

Don't ever, ever date anyone based on their potential. This is it, this is who she is. Accept it and be happy with it, or don't accept it and move on, but don't be in a relationship with someone hoping that they'll someday turn into someone different.

leggo · 06-05-2017 04:02PM

I agree when people say "don't get her pregnant" but I also feel that, whenever you say that about a relationship (unless, of course, there are legitimate reasons like youth, poor financial circumstances or just not wanting kids), then it's kind of putting off the inevitable and you need to deal with whatever issues are causing you to say that immediately.

irishdude11 · 07-05-2017 08:27AM

Be very careful here OP. She will be well aware that she can secure herself financially and not have to work again if she gets pregnant. If this parasite gets pregnant then its game over and she will have many more options at her disposal. Once she has a child she doesn't need you around anymore to fund her waster lifestyle as the court will order you to do it. And with the law change on cohabitation a few years ago she will even have legal claims to a portion of your house.

She is using you for your resources. Of course she 'loves you' now..I'd like to see how much an obvious waster parasite like this would love you if you fell on hard times and could no longer fund the cushy lifestyle..do you think she would still love you as much when you are broke and of no use (like she herself is now)....or do you think she'd be gone in a shot when she could easily find some other well-off chump who would fund her? Well, which is it?

Get the fairytale notions out of your head and start seeing this situation for what it is before you end up in a worse situation..a total waster, a user, a moaner with no respect or gratitude for what you have done for her, all she does is take take take and as she is early thirties she will likely be pushing for marriage or kids now..as what is her alternative? If I were in your shoes I would not even have sex with her now as if she got pregnant you would have jeopardised everything you have worked for over the years, as she would have automatic rights to your finances. But if I were in your shoes I would never have ended up in this position in the first place.

I imagine she must be pretty good looking, as I don't see what else she is bringing to the table, apart from an entitled attitude. So its worth bearing in mind that those looks will fade too..so this small fortune you are investing into the relationship..do you still want to be investing it for the next 30-40 years when the looks are gone and all that's left is the entitled attitude? Time to wake up!

irishdude11 · 07-05-2017 08:31AM

Oh and the title of this thread is accurate, as it implies you are couple having disagreements over finances that you both contribute to..when in fact she contributes nothing.

A more appropriate title would be ' The difficulties caused by a complete waster in our relationship...'

Conor Bourke · 07-05-2017 11:31AM

Did you post about her before, OP?

Permabear · 07-05-2017 11:43AM

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Permabear · 07-05-2017 06:50PM

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LegacyUser · 08-05-2017 11:25AM

Thanks to those making helpful suggestions, such as the book and the possibility of her getting herself into a job that would give her some confidence and happiness.

I'm also open to couples therapy - can anyone explain to me how it works? Would I go in first and explain my issues in the relationship, and the resentment, etc.? Then they would see her, and then perhaps us together? Because that would make most sense in my mind. There are certain things I would feel unsure about saying in front of her as it causes her upset.

And as for IrishDude...

irishdude11 wrote: »

Be very careful here OP. She will be well aware that she can secure herself financially and not have to work again if she gets pregnant. If this parasite gets pregnant then its game over and she will have many more options at her disposal. Once she has a child she doesn't need you around anymore to fund her waster lifestyle as the court will order you to do it. And with the law change on cohabitation a few years ago she will even have legal claims to a portion of your house.

She is using you for your resources. Of course she 'loves you' now..I'd like to see how much an obvious waster parasite like this would love you if you fell on hard times and could no longer fund the cushy lifestyle..do you think she would still love you as much when you are broke and of no use (like she herself is now)....or do you think she'd be gone in a shot when she could easily find some other well-off chump who would fund her? Well, which is it?

Get the fairytale notions out of your head and start seeing this situation for what it is before you end up in a worse situation..a total waster, a user, a moaner with no respect or gratitude for what you have done for her, all she does is take take take and as she is early thirties she will likely be pushing for marriage or kids now..as what is her alternative? If I were in your shoes I would not even have sex with her now as if she got pregnant you would have jeopardised everything you have worked for over the years, as she would have automatic rights to your finances. But if I were in your shoes I would never have ended up in this position in the first place.

I imagine she must be pretty good looking, as I don't see what else she is bringing to the table, apart from an entitled attitude. So its worth bearing in mind that those looks will fade too..so this small fortune you are investing into the relationship..do you still want to be investing it for the next 30-40 years when the looks are gone and all that's left is the entitled attitude? Time to wake up!

Honestly man, I know you are probably trying to be helpful. But please don't jump to so many conclusions about someone you don't know. I feel you are really looking on the negative side here.

For starters - I'm not spending a small fortune on her. In fact, she is the one paying the rent in the house we rent in the city. I pay bills. Then she shares with me a country home and car. At the moment, I would actually say that she is paying more in terms in money into the rented house (the bills aren't much). I'm happy to take care of the country house (which - before meeting her, I put a lot of money into).

So she can survive... just about (sometimes with her from her family), but don't let her money. She also buys half of the food.

The issue I had was that she has ZERO disposable income and never has money to go anywhere. So if we go on holidays, road trips, theatre, gig, or hotels, either I go on my own, or I bring her and pay for her. She just doesn't have the cash for it but if something is cheap she will go the odd time. She has also bought some stuff for the garden in country house.

But all the cash I put into the country house was done before we were together. I had a car before we were together, etc. So it's not as one sided a picture as you paint.

SusieBlue · 08-05-2017 07:21PM

I'm sorry OP but that isn't the impression you gave in your post at all. My understanding was that you paid rent, all bills, acquired and paid for your country home, and all holidays/date nights without her handing up a penny.
It transpires now that this isn't the case at all and she actually contributes rent and towards food too but your just angry she can't afford holidays or nice dates?
Which is it, cause you seem to presenting two entirely different scenarios???

rainbowtrout · 08-05-2017 07:29PM

Hold on, you gave the very distinct impression that she was living hand to mouth and you were basically funding everything for both of you in your earlier posts.

Now you are painting a very different picture. So she's paying rent (more than you by your own admittance) and sharing the bills. So she is pulling her weight financially. You're just pissed off that she doesn't earn as much as you to spend on luxuries.

SarahMollie · 08-05-2017 09:11PM

Hang on... so your girlfriend who doesn't have much of an income is contributing more to your household than you are, and you're on here moaning?

Say I bought my car for €X before I met my OH and I sometimes drive him in said car... is he supposed to somehow be greatful for that and then subsidise my rent just because befor we even met, I decided to put money into something that's still ultimately mine? Hardly. The country house is an asset that belongs to you and any monies spent on it are not somethign to recoup from your girlfriend because you choose for the pair of you to spend time there.

How about start paying your way rent wise and then maybe she would have some disposable income. You're actually creating this problem yourself and I don't know how she puts up with it. She's subsidising you and in turn your lord it over her when you pay for entertainment/activities.

woodchuck · 08-05-2017 09:32PM

TestingBurger wrote: »

I'm also open to couples therapy - can anyone explain to me how it works? Would I go in first and explain my issues in the relationship, and the resentment, etc.? Then they would see her, and then perhaps us together? Because that would make most sense in my mind. There are certain things I would feel unsure about saying in front of her as it causes her upset.

In my own limited experience, they see you together. Maybe other arrangements could be made, but personally I don't think what you're suggesting is healthy or wise. It sounds like you're trying to win the counselor over to your side, but you both deserve equal input. Also give your girlfriend a little bit of credit. I'm sure she can handle whatever you have to say. She might not want to hear it and it might upset her, but she needs to hear it.

TestingBurger wrote: »

For starters - I'm not spending a small fortune on her. In fact, she is the one paying the rent in the house we rent in the city. I pay bills. Then she shares with me a country home and car. At the moment, I would actually say that she is paying more in terms in money into the rented house (the bills aren't much). I'm happy to take care of the country house (which - before meeting her, I put a lot of money into).

So she can survive... just about (sometimes with her from her family), but don't let her money. She also buys half of the food.

The issue I had was that she has ZERO disposable income and never has money to go anywhere. So if we go on holidays, road trips, theatre, gig, or hotels, either I go on my own, or I bring her and pay for her. She just doesn't have the cash for it but if something is cheap she will go the odd time. She has also bought some stuff for the garden in country house.

But all the cash I put into the country house was done before we were together. I had a car before we were together, etc. So it's not as one sided a picture as you paint.

Eh... did you ever occur to you that the reason she has zero disposable income is because she is only one paying the rent where you both live?!

She's also paying her way with food. You're paying the bills, but that would be nowhere near as much as the rent!! Is that because you were picking up the rent for so long and now it's her "turn"? Evidently that isn't sustainable if she's currently out of work. Pay half the rent ffs and then she might be able to afford the odd night out...

Your other house shouldn't factor into it btw. You had it before you met her and it shouldn't be assumed that she'd be happy to be burdened for the upkeep of a second property that isn't hers and she's not living in.

Honestly, the more you post, the more dysfunctional this relationship sounds. Again, your girlfriend has issues with needing to find work. But it really sounds like you two have much bigger issues than that...

redfox123 · 08-05-2017 09:37PM

Are you not paying rent because you're living in your inherited house? If she's paying the rent for the two of you in your rented place then that doesn't seem fair that you're not, even if you're paying bills. Would I be right in thinking your main issue is anxiety about the future and how you will get a house together and build a future relying mainly on your income because her's is so little and inconsistent?

Hollister11 · 08-05-2017 09:49PM

If she's not working and your funding her, I hope you at least come home to dinner, a clean house and sex.

Other wise I'd do a runner.

Big Bag of Chips · 08-05-2017 10:13PM

How much is the rent?
How much is food?
How much are the bills?

You have a second house, which is NOTHING to do with her. NOTHING. If you broke up tomorrow she would see NOTHING from that house. Yet, you seem to expect her to pay full rent in a city where you live with her, half the food AND contribute to the house you inherited plus be able to afford nights out and weekends away. Weekends that YOU want to go on. Nights out that YOU pick.

And then on top of all that you are disgusted at her for daring to comment on the landscape!! Thinking she should be grateful for the roof you put over her head?? Yet she's providing the roof over your head in the city, and you don't seem one bit grateful for that?

You (she?) can't realistically afford to run two houses. Most people can't without having a rental income coming in from one.

Your attitude to her, to "your houses", to money in general is appalling, and screams of immaturity. You inherited a house, fair enough you put a lot into it, but you are now using your gf to subsidise you and your country house and expecting her to be the obedient grateful 'wife'.

I hope she cops on and asks you to contribute to the house you share. It's not her problem that you're renovating another house. Well, actually, that's exactly what her problem is!

LegacyUser · 09-05-2017 12:43AM

Sorry if I caused confusion with the information earlier...

Here's how it went..

She moved in with me after college nearly a year ago. She was out of money almost so I said not to panic, live in my little room (cheap rent, 230pm for room , sound landlord) and eventually find job.

She gets a part time, low paid research job which only lasts for the summer , so I continue to pay rent and most food from may to December. Also pay for fuel, car trips, etc.

In January this year, she tells me that she is tired of being such a burden on others so she decides to at least start paying rent (yeah, her "turn" !) and asks that I pay bills so things are more equal. I agree (I paid 7 months, so far she's paid 4). After summer we will probably both pay 50/50.

My point was that she is always broke and is complaining about money issues and has zero money to go anywhere. I'm happy to supplement her sometimes, and I often end up buying more food than her, and sometimes I realised that it's causing me resentment and tension (and it shouldn't).

I'm not here because I think my attitude is healthy and that everything is grand. I'm here because I'm struggling and I have problems, so yeah you're right - my attitude is appalling but I'm asking for so I can see this issue more clearly and maybe work through it.

Tokyo · 09-05-2017 06:20AM

Mod:

Hollister11 - your post hardly constitutes advice, and is nowhere near the standard expected in RI. Please don't post in this thread again.

Big Bag of Chips · 09-05-2017 08:11AM

TestingBurger wrote: »

There are times I feel like she's taking things for granted, acting like she owns the place, with a sense of entitlement.

There is something that says; "Who do you think you are? You're lucky to even be here".

If she starts organising things in the house and making decisions, I feel like saying "Who made you chief? Stop acting like you own this place and have some humility".

I feel like I should be able to do whatever the heck I like in my free time, without her getting annoyed or disapproving of it. All because I've paid for most stuff we have in the house.

If I want to go off to my parents for the weekend, or spend time with the lads, I feel like she should quietly accept it and look after the house projects that we are doing together if necessary, without a grumble or a moan.

After all, she's lucky to have a roof over her head right?

She should be humble and grateful, not self-righteous and entitled and demanding.

I mean, the place isn't perfect but it's mine... and now ours actually, as I'm sharing everything with her.

(so, it's yours, you're sharing, yet you don't want her having an opinion or making decisions? But you do want her to get on with the work you've decided on as a 'team' alone while you go off and do "whatever the heck you like for the weekend")

she hasn't paid a penny to be in this house. Yes, she puts her time in when we're working on projects here but honestly, I don't feel she's in a position to start complaining about these imperfections.

I feel she should be grateful with what we have and not complain about it. I feel she's acting like an entitled spoilt brat, and I think it's a bit bitchy.

I've given her the list of things that I've paid for in the last week, and I've told her I don't want the money - just a bit of respect and gratitude, and her help without complaints and moans.

I've told her that I'm entitled to skype my Dad whenever I feckin like, and when you put 10000 of your hard earned cash into this house, then you will be in a position to make me feel guilty for talking too much to my Dad on skype and not going for a walk with you on time.

Please read all these things you have said about her. I'm finding it very difficult to reconcile that you claim to love her, yet you can say all the above about her. If I though my husband thought that about me I'd be devastated. On one hand you are giving out that she is making decisions and acting like she 'owns the place', and on the other hand you're giving out that she doesn't just shut up, let you do whatever you like, whenever you like and just get on with the house projects on her own with complaining.

I honestly don't understand how you can think you love her, yet have so much disrespect for her. Maybe you love the idea of her. Maybe you love the idea of a woman to help you 'keep house' but you don't actually want a partner. Don't think you are doing this girl any favours. The way you speak to her, the way you put her down, the way you 'happily' pay for everything and sponsor her and then hold it over her head at every opportunity is horrible and it can not be helping her anxiety or confidence. She survived before she met you, and if you ended it she'd survive again.

I think this is a toxic horrible situation. Even talk of going to couples counselling abs wanting to go separately is underhanded and sneaky. The whole idea of couples counselling is you go together and in a controlled environment you clear the air. Say everything you need to say to each other about how you feel. If you are going to counselling to get the counsellor to point out all her wrongs then you are in the wrong place. Counselling isn't about blaming 1 person. It's about finding a way to move forward and live together in the relationship you have.

I don't think this is a good relationship for either of you.

woodchuck · 09-05-2017 09:29AM

TestingBurger wrote: »

Sorry if I caused confusion with the information earlier...

Here's how it went..

She moved in with me after college nearly a year ago. She was out of money almost so I said not to panic, live in my little room (cheap rent, 230pm for room , sound landlord) and eventually find job.

She gets a part time, low paid research job which only lasts for the summer , so I continue to pay rent and most food from may to December. Also pay for fuel, car trips, etc.

In January this year, she tells me that she is tired of being such a burden on others so she decides to at least start paying rent (yeah, her "turn" !) and asks that I pay bills so things are more equal. I agree (I paid 7 months, so far she's paid 4). After summer we will probably both pay 50/50.

My point was that she is always broke and is complaining about money issues and has zero money to go anywhere. I'm happy to supplement her sometimes, and I often end up buying more food than her, and sometimes I realised that it's causing me resentment and tension (and it shouldn't).

I'm not here because I think my attitude is healthy and that everything is grand. I'm here because I'm struggling and I have problems, so yeah you're right - my attitude is appalling but I'm asking for so I can see this issue more clearly and maybe work through it.

Again... of course she is broke if she is the only one paying the rent and doesn't have a job!! Even if this was her suggestion, it obviously is not sustainable as she has to borrow money in order to keep on top of it.

Again, I'm not going to argue that she needs to get a job. But until she does, it's completely unrealistic to expect her to pay all the rent on her own. You say you'll probably pay 50/50 after the summer. Why not do that now?! Is it because you feel like she owes you money? It certainly seems that way anyway the way you're keeping tabs on 7 vs 4 months. No wonder she feels like a burden...

I'm sorry, but you can't complain about her not having any disposable money when you're expecting her pay all the rent atm :rolleyes:

This seems like sinking ship. Your attitude towards her not working is a much bigger issue than her actually not working though. I think couples counselling is a good idea if you want any chance of saving this relationship. I know you think what you have to say will make her upset. But honestly, it might be the wake up call she needs to get herself out of this toxic relationship. It sounds like it's completely corroding her self esteem, so no wonder she's finding it difficult to find it within herself to get a job. Sorry if that seems harsh OP, but that's the way it's coming across to me.

witchgirl26 · 09-05-2017 09:41AM

OP if she's paying the rent and that's the reason she has no disposable income than surely that's actually a responsible thing (even if it is her "turn" which btw I think is a bit crappy - you offered her the help)? I wouldn't have had as much disposable income as my other half when we started going out as I had a place to myself and obviously the rent was a lot higher and there were times when he lent me money or would pay for some things like nights out or a weekend away but there was never that level of resentment from him in relation to it.

In most relationships, there is a time when one person's earning power is higher than the others and someone has to help out but if it's a partnership, then there shouldn't be this massive build up of resentment.

From your original post I would have been a bit harsher on your other half but from the sounds of it, while yeah she needs to get a job and not be precious about it, she is trying to pay her way in terms of actual proper bills with the rent and all and you're just annoyed that she doesn't have a load of spare cash to go away. That's your issue not hers. Would you prefer to be paying all the bills and her have disposable income? Because right now that's your choice until she gets a job. Have you talked to her about how she feels that you pay for any entertainment? Maybe she feels like crap because she can't contribute to that.

The difficulties caused by money in our relationship...

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