BE strike [Read 1st post before posting]

BoatMad · 24-03-2017 05:08PM

Nevertheless the trains aren’t running because those Irish Rail workers correctly refused to pass the picket.

indeed , as I pointed out Limerick waterford ( one train a day ) and Limerick Ballybrophy , ( one train a day )
at least 2 passengers are now disgruntled

the Gov is trembling in fear

BoatMad · 24-03-2017 05:09PM

And nor would we need their tax revenue if we issued our own floating currency had our political class not ceded monetary sovereignty to the EU and then we could properly fund our transport.

we have just entered la la land, and all we were discussing was a simple bus strike in another inefficient and badly run state company

personally I want all buildings to be made of chocolate

BanCapitalism · 24-03-2017 05:10PM

The government shills here don’t care about awkward facts. Their job is to demonize the working class as they loot the country in the interests of capital. The Bus Eireann workers and the travelling public are paying for the banker’s debts:

“Unite’s Michael Taft told the committee that Ireland fared badly when compared with other EU countries in terms of subvention. CIÉ’s subvention from the State was reduced from €321m in 2008 to €189m in 2015, a reduction of 41pc. Payroll costs were reduced by 12.6pc.”

jimmycrackcorm · 24-03-2017 05:15PM

BanCapitalism wrote:

Itâ€™s an Irish rail issue if thereâ€™s a picket outside an Irish rail premises. Not crossing a picket is a valid reason for not going to work as every trade unionist should know.

The problem is that people are saying that BE workers were picketing the train station in Cork. Nowhere near their own bus station. That's simply unjustified.

BanCapitalism wrote:

You need to understand that the Bus Eireann workers, Iarnroid Eireann workers or those in Luas, Dublin Bus, Tesco , nurses, teachers etc donâ€™t require your approval or permission to engage in industrial action.

Granted. But neither does it mean we as taxpayers have to give in to unreasonable strikers demands.

BanCapitalism · 24-03-2017 05:18PM

At the end of the day you can stand there are watch yourself get raped and pillaged or you can do something about it.

They’re striking to prevent their wages, conditions and the public transport system generally from being degraded further to pay for a crisis caused by big capital and our governments which serve their interests.

They’re fighting to protect the public transport system.. Shane Ross and the government had the means to enrich Apple with €19 billion in dodged taxes and interest but the Bus Eireann deficit of €9 million is bridge too far for them. The mainstream narrative that public transport can or should be run on a profit making basis is risible nonsense.

BuilderPlumber · 24-03-2017 05:19PM

pilly wrote: »

Well, why keep arguing the point? I stated a driver was rude, and you've posted about 5 or 6 times about it.

I'm entitled to say this. Full stop. And your argument that it's nothing to do with the whole service or it's not representative is bull tbh.

I never said it was representative, what I said what that it lost the support I had been giving drivers up until then, including going to public meetings.

I've since found Kavanaghs do a cheaper service and apparently the driver is lovely. So that encourages me to go elsewhere and not have much regards for BE drivers.

I presume you're a bus driver?

BE have too much of a dominance on some routes. Sadly they have been getting away with fleecing consumers with their overcharged fares for years too. Then, this evil strike happens and the trains go out as well and then certain towns and cities are cut off. Kavanaghs, Dublin Coach and others are there to fill the gap in some places but sadly there are many places still cut off and I am not talking out of the way places either. A strike like this should be made illegal and made so NOW. The people should not have to put up withe disruption like this and unions should have a bit more decency than to resort to tactics that are similar to the mindset of terrorists.

BoatMad · 24-03-2017 05:20PM

BanCapitalism wrote: »

At the end of the day you can stand there are watch yourself get raped and pillaged or you can do something about it.

thats a despicable statement to make , well paid cosseted workers are hardly equivalent to the people that suffered the situations you refer to

BanCapitalism · 24-03-2017 05:24PM

At the end of the day it is true, just because you are jealous off workers who have a union who stand up for their members who prevent them getting abused by capitalist pigs who are preying on workers to boost their own fat cat profits.

BanCapitalism · 24-03-2017 05:25PM

Bus Eireann has been deliberately undermined over many years with the private operators gifted the lucrative routes between urban centers and big towns driving of course on the state constructed motorway network while BE serves the social service loss making runs to small towns, villages and rural areas.

BuilderPlumber · 24-03-2017 05:26PM

BanCapitalism wrote: »

At the end of the day it is true, just because you are jealous off workers who have a union who stand up for their members who prevent them getting abused by capitalist pigs who are preying on workers to boost their own fat cat profits.

Yes but the people should not be inconvenienced. It does NO GOOD to annoy the public. I am not a lover of greedy capitalists and I include both sides in BE in this definition as they DON'T CARE about the people. Protest in another way, not by closing down the country. That is similar to what terrorists do. Indeed a terror attack is the ONLY reason why transport systems should close ironically!!!

BoatMad · 24-03-2017 05:27PM

They’re striking to prevent their wages, conditions and the public transport system generally from being degraded further to pay for a crisis caused by big capital and our governments which serve their interests.
They’re fighting to protect the public transport system.. Shane Ross and the government had the means to enrich Apple with €19 billion in dodged taxes and interest but the Bus Eireann deficit of €9 million is bridge too far for them. The mainstream narrative that public transport can or should be run on a profit making basis is risible nonsense.

They are doing NOTHING of the sort, they are striking to protect their narrow sectional interests in the face of a situation where that self same sectional interest has made a company spiral into severe loss making without any way of cutting same looses

They are NOT fighting to protect anything other then their own expensive necks, they couldnt give a toss about public transport

he mainstream narrative that public transport can or should be run on a profit making basis is risible nonsense.

actually is you commentary that is risible nonsense , BE has sections thats specifically receive public subsidy, and it is supposed to have a commercial section, Expressway , which has now fallen into severe loss

BanCapitalism · 24-03-2017 05:29PM

They’re fighting to protect the public transport system for the benefit of rural communities who private operators would have no interest in serving because they will not be able to make a profit or have any interest on routes

Nobody is causing major issues for the public, it may be a small issue, but people will get by, they will walk, ride a bike, drive a car, travel with friends, relax and smoke some hash, have a few bevvies, take another bus, share a ride with friends, take a tram or a train. People get by.

BoatMad · 24-03-2017 05:29PM

BanCapitalism wrote: »

At the end of the day it is true, just because you are jealous off workers who have a union who stand up for their members who prevent them getting abused by capitalist pigs who are preying on workers to boost their own fat cat profits.

the only people that are being " preyed upon" is the ordinary hardworking taxpayer of this state as he and she is expected by CIE unions to stump ups another zillion to prop up inefficient and outdated work practices and excessive pay

I suspect the tax payers wil let them burn on the pickets , CUE is a dinosaur with little relevance to todays people

trellheim · 24-03-2017 05:31PM

The government shills here don’t care about awkward facts. Their job is to demonize the working class as they loot the country in the interests of capital. The Bus Eireann workers and the travelling public are paying for the banker’s debts:

“Unite’s Michael Taft told the committee that Ireland fared badly when compared with other EU countries in terms of subvention. CIÉ’s subvention from the State was reduced from €321m in 2008 to €189m in 2015, a reduction of 41pc. Payroll costs were reduced by 12.6pc.”

12 posts and how is it relevant ? this is a milk carton speech from AAA/PBP or Solidarity or whatever you are calling yourselves these days . The PSO routes are being subvented and that is not the issue here ; its the commercial ones or did you read up on the issues at odds here ?

Suggest to me how this issue might be fixed by just the workers and management themselves without assistance from outside . Management have a legal duty to run solvent ; BE are running close to the nuclear option here and you can see the warnings from the NTA..

If it can happen to Clerys what makes you think it can't happen to Bus Eireann ( yes I know one's private and ones semistate but both are/were iconic Irish entities )

BanCapitalism · 24-03-2017 05:31PM

There is nothing to say that transport has to be run in a commercial way in this country.

If we banned private operators workers would be better paid and there would be no race to the bottom and everything would be one full system without being divided up and segregated like the failed UK system.

BoatMad · 24-03-2017 05:31PM

BanCapitalism wrote: »

They’re fighting to protect the public transport system for the benefit of rural communities who private operators would have no interest in serving because they will not be able to make a profit or have any interest on routes

you persistently and maliciously mis0represent the issues, The issue is BE Expressway services, CIE unions dont give a rats arse about " rural " communities

Nobody is causing major issues for the public, it may be a small issue, but people will get by, they will walk, ride a bike, drive a car, travel with friends, relax and smoke some hash, have a few bevvies, take another bus, share a ride with friends, take a tram or a train. People get by.

yes thank godness, the day when we ere beholden to CIE to carry us around are long gone, as the strikers will realise as the days stretch to weeks and the miserable strike pay bites the hand

ixoy · 24-03-2017 05:32PM

BanCapitalism wrote: »

Bus Eireann has been deliberately undermined over many years with the private operators gifted the lucrative routes between urban centers and big towns driving of course on the state constructed motorway network while BE serves the social service loss making runs to small towns, villages and rural areas.

BE aren't serving them out of the goodness of their heart. They're only doing it because they're paid to, nothing more.
They also can, and do, compete on the lucrative routes but are unable to do so profitably. Why? The PSO obligations don't factor in this.

BuilderPlumber · 24-03-2017 05:32PM

BanCapitalism wrote: »

They’re fighting to protect the public transport system for the benefit of rural communities who private operators would have no interest in serving because they will not be able to make a profit or have any interest on routes
Nobody is causing major issues for the public, it may be a small issue, but people will get by, they will walk, ride a bike, drive a car, travel with friends, relax and smoke some hash, have a few bevvies, take another bus, share a ride with friends, take a tram or a train. People get by.

Rural communities are suffering because of this TERRORIST STRIKE. That's who is suffering. People cannot get to Cork, Limerick, Waterford, etc. Or Sligo, Leitrim, etc. The unions need to target the greedy bosses and they will EARN REAL RESPECT and not punish the people. I hate extreme capitalism and would approve of workers' rights always but I do not approve of TERROR or EXTORTION tactics no matter what the cause.

BoatMad · 24-03-2017 05:32PM

BanCapitalism wrote: »

Bus Eireann has been deliberately undermined over many years with the private operators gifted the lucrative routes between urban centers and big towns driving of course on the state constructed motorway network while BE serves the social service loss making runs to small towns, villages and rural areas.

so can you explain why the BE expressway service from Wexford follows essentially the same route as the private operator and largely bypasses small towns , yet it still cant compete

stop peddling falsehoods

BanCapitalism · 24-03-2017 05:33PM

They are not permitted to run such services as the NTA won't allow them and they face political pressure not to cut services from Towns.

pilly · 24-03-2017 05:36PM

BanCapitalism wrote: »

They are not permitted to run such services as the NTA won't allow them and they face political pressure not to cut services from Towns.

Bull, we're talking about the Expressway service here. Whole point of it is "Express", are you not understanding that.

It's under no obligation to do anything but make money and it can't so it will go bust.

BanCapitalism · 24-03-2017 05:36PM

pilly wrote: »

BanCapitalism wrote: »

They are not permitted to run such services as the NTA won't allow them and they face political pressure not to cut services from Towns.

Bull, we're talking about the Expressway service here. Whole point of it is "Express", are you not understanding that.

It's under no obligation to do anything but make money and it can't so it will go bust.

Most Of BE Expressway services are actually glorified PSO services they are forced to run at a loss.

Graham · 24-03-2017 05:37PM

BanCapitalism wrote: »

They’re fighting to protect the public transport system for the benefit of rural communitiess

You should tell the drivers, they appear to be striking under a different mandate to the one you imagine.

BanCapitalism wrote: »

They have been told that there are already too many operators on the route.

Maybe one less for the private operators to worry about if the BE industrial action continues.

BoatMad · 24-03-2017 05:37PM

BanCapitalism wrote: »

They have been told that there are already too many operators on the route.

yes and this current process, will see less operators soon enough

devnull · 24-03-2017 05:38PM

BanCapitalism wrote: »

They have been told that there are already too many operators on the route.

That's because there are only two licenses on an express route and BE didn't get one because they were not interested before two other operators.

pilly · 24-03-2017 05:38PM

BanCapitalism wrote: »

Most Of BE Expressway services are actually glorified PSO services they are forced to run at a loss.

Bull again, they are loss making because of unproductive highly paid staff. Otherwise why are there private operators running the same routes?

I'll tell you why, because they can make money at it. Pure economics.

devnull · 24-03-2017 05:38PM

BanCapitalism wrote: »

Most Of BE Expressway services are actually glorified PSO services they are forced to run at a loss.

Expressway services can be cancelled at any time if the company wants to, nobody can stop them, the same like any other commercial operator. Nobody is forcing them to do anything.

BoatMad · 24-03-2017 05:39PM

BanCapitalism wrote: »

Most Of BE Expressway services are actually glorified PSO services they are forced to run at a loss.

stuff and nonsense
BE has specific PSO obligations for which it is explicitly enumerated by the taxpayer to run

outside of that , it runs services that are meant to be commercial

it has failed primarily due to worker greed and intransigence

the result will be that BE will either be broken up or will emerge a fraction of the size it once was

there is no possible good outcome for BE workers here

BuilderPlumber · 24-03-2017 05:39PM

BanCapitalism wrote: »

You are a sick bastard.

Bearing in mind what happened in the UK recently you really are comparing Bus drivers with murderers who follow Islam.

You should be banned.

The mindset is the same. Cause disruption to the public and to hell with how the public feels. Of course the ISIS are a million times worse but the mindset is the same. Disruption. One is murderous and the other is not. The unions would want to wake up and stop doing things that cause pain for the public. Otherwise, they show the same disregard for the public as terrorists do EVEN IF THEY ARE NOT KILLERS (I NEVER SAID THEY WERE). The MENTALITY is the same and anyone who does not CARE ABOUT OTHERS shows the traits of a sociopath. No one could feel sympathetic about the NATURE AND WAY this 'strike' was implemented.

BanCapitalism · 24-03-2017 05:39PM

BoatMad wrote: »

BanCapitalism wrote: »

They have been told that there are already too many operators on the route.

yes and this current process, will see less operators soon enough

How so when BE is not one?

BE strike [Read 1st post before posting]

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