Strike For Repeal?

08-03-2017 01:03PM

One eyed Jack wrote: »

This is exactly why IMO many people simply cannot relate to the mud-slinging from either tunnel-visioned perspective, because most people understand that the issue isn't simply one of "whichever side of the fence you're on, you're either with us, or againt us". There are people and groups in society using the issue of abortion to wedge in a whole load of their own political nonsense, with no regard whatsoever for the reality of how peoples lives are actually affected by abortion.

I'm not a middle-ground, undecided or "silent majority" or any of the other nonsense. I don't think the more vocal campaigners in either camp have any interest in what anyone but themselves has to say on the matter. I think what it is is simply that most people just don't have the time, the energy, or the will, to go anywhere near the issue, and what's more likely to happen is that a large chunk of the electorate simply won't bother turning out at all.

The reality is that only a very small number of people actually care about legislating abortion in this country, and they'll fall into the same trap as the marriage equality referendum crowd did by assuming that the only people who could be opposed to them are religious. They completely ignore the fact that in the States, figures suggest that the majority of women who have abortions there identify as Christian, and the main reason given is socioeconomic necessity.

Even attempts to turn this into a feminists vs "everyone else" issue is doomed to failure as it was originally the feminist position that they were against abortion because legislating for it would be letting Government "off the hook" with regard to it's responsibility for women's welfare.

Simplistic, polarising platitudes aren't going to convince anyone of the merits of any side of the argument.

NO! Anyone who disagrees with me is literally the devil!

Tangatagamadda Chaddabinga Bonga Bungo · 08-03-2017 01:03PM

My vote will go to whatever side is giving out miniature flags.

I love miniature flags.

rainbow kirby · 08-03-2017 01:08PM

keano_afc wrote: »

I shared that on twitter under the Citizens Assembly hashtag. The reason it was dismissed by Repealers that replied to me? Why, he's a man (and a foreign man!) of course and therefore has absolutely nothing to add. By that I presume they mean he's a man not in favour of abortion, as whenever the likes of James Corden or Liam Neeson show support for the Repeal cause they get the back slapped off them.

It was dismissed because the anti-choicers saw the opportunity to parachute in some American paid shill. :rolleyes:

jameorahiely · 08-03-2017 01:10PM

Lau2976 wrote: »

Apologies I wrongly assumed people would understand context :rolleyes:

Women who died because of lack of access to safe abortions.

Does that clear my point up?

Not really. An Irish woman died after a "safe" abortion in the uk. Point being it is a medical procedure which carries risks.

Wibbs · 08-03-2017 01:10PM

Shill: Noun. Someone brought in who doesn't agree with your position. Usage: all sides of any controversial debate.

uck51js9zml2yt · 08-03-2017 01:10PM

protest outside the department of health is small enough.
Apart from really stupid slogans and them all wearing black....dont these people have jobs..or think of the companies in the areas whose staff have to work through all the noise!

08-03-2017 01:19PM

Markus Square Buckle wrote: »

protest outside the department of health is small enough.
Apart from really stupid slogans and them all wearing black....dont these people have jobs..or think of the companies in the areas whose staff have to work through all the noise!

having a Gender studies degree doesn't lead to a lot of jobs for those protesters hence why there there

Prime Irish Beef · 08-03-2017 01:26PM

Zulu wrote: »

Repeal campaign is a sad joke.

The need for such a campaign is a joke. Women should have autonomy over their own bodies.

Zulu · 08-03-2017 01:27PM

CaoimheSquee wrote: »

So therefore you don't trust women. You believe it is possible they will just act selfishly no matter the situation. That is very sad indeed.

So you're interested in hearing the other side and trying to reach compromise?

Lol, that opinionated trench must be great craic, but you'll get nothing agreed or resolved from there assuming and accusing everyone of the worst.

Yeay Repeal the 8th - building bridges and finding the common ground!!!

mahamageehad · 08-03-2017 01:28PM

Markus Square Buckle wrote: »

protest outside the department of health is small enough.
Apart from really stupid slogans and them all wearing black....dont these people have jobs..or think of the companies in the areas whose staff have to work through all the noise!

Isn't the point that they were striking from their jobs? I dunno. I'm not in Ireland at the minute but even online the reaction looks lukewarm.

Zulu · 08-03-2017 01:30PM

Prime Irish Beef wrote: »

The need for such a campaign is a joke. Women should have autonomy over their own bodies.

They do, but I take your point. I just think there's a bit more to this than hackneyed slogans, and polarized positions.

And, thankfully so do most of the citizens of this fine state.

Richard Hillman · 08-03-2017 01:34PM

Markus Square Buckle wrote: »

protest outside the department of health is small enough.
Apart from really stupid slogans and them all wearing black....dont these people have jobs..or think of the companies in the areas whose staff have to work through all the noise!

Student's, academics, click-bait journalists and the unemployed. People who don't actually have to be in work.

They'll say it was a great response but for what their original blueprint was, it has been a complete disaster. No female walked out of their workplace. The echo chamber echoed and their movement is becoming increasingly isolated.

zanador · 08-03-2017 01:39PM

Richard Hillman wrote: »

Student's, academics, click-bait journalists and the unemployed. People who don't actually have to be in work.

They'll say it was a great response but for what their original blueprint was, it has been a complete disaster. No female walked out of their workplace. The echo chamber echoed and their movement is becoming increasingly isolated.

The big march is meant to be happening this evening.

uck51js9zml2yt · 08-03-2017 01:40PM

Richard Hillman wrote: »

Student's, academics, click-bait journalists and the unemployed. People who don't actually have to be in work.

They'll say it was a great response but for what their original blueprint was, it has been a complete disaster. No female walked out of their workplace. The echo chamber echoed and their movement is becoming increasingly isolated.

One of them had a sign saying she took a days holiday!:D

January · 08-03-2017 01:41PM

Markus Square Buckle wrote: »

protest outside the department of health is small enough.
Apart from really stupid slogans and them all wearing black....dont these people have jobs..or think of the companies in the areas whose staff have to work through all the noise!

Women have taken the day off work for this, so yes some of them have jobs, some will be stay at home parents, some will be students, some will be unemployed.

The turn out on O'Connell Bridge is fantastic.

Imnotthehulk · 08-03-2017 01:43PM

Certainly looks like there's a good crowd congregating on O'Connell Bridge

Shenshen · 08-03-2017 01:58PM

conorhal wrote: »

That's a disingenuous strawman, being pro-choice is as applicable to ice-cream flavours as it is to abortion, nobodys being forced to eat vanilla or chocolate either.
What you is pro abortion, you are in favour of access to abortion. The pro abortion side favouring it's legalization prefer to couch their arguement in terms that don't baldly state what it is they want, prefering nice cosy 'rightsy'meaningless terms like 'choice'. Who doesn't like choice?

Yes, I am in favour of access to abortion. And so is the lady who wrote the article.
So can you please tell me why she'd call herself pro-life, if she then stresses that every woman has to make the choice of whether to have an abortion or not herself?

08-03-2017 02:00PM

just a side note.

I reckon if the catholic church had no opinion on abortion then a large portion of those protesting wouldn't protest.
just my two cents

Shenshen · 08-03-2017 02:02PM

Dravokivich wrote: »

She's looking at it personally to her when identifying as "pro-life." By not restricting others, does not mean she is "pro-choice." These are just 2 nonsensical labels that have been placed upon each side.

Ok, let's move away from the label so. I used them because she did.

She says she herself would never have an abortion, and I'm very happy that she feels that way.
She then goes on to say that it's up to each woman individually to make the choice, and she doesn't feel she or anyone else should blame them either way. Which I absolutely and totally agree with.

Following that, she goes on to berate the people who are currently campaigning to make sure that women can make that choice and that there won't be any blame.

And you still don't see why I'm confused?

rainbow kirby · 08-03-2017 02:03PM

barrier86 wrote: »

just a side note.

I reckon if the catholic church had no opinion on abortion then a large portion of those protesting wouldn't protest.
just my two cents

If the RCC had no opinion on abortion then the 8th wouldn't exist in the first place...

MightyMandarin · 08-03-2017 02:06PM

barrier86 wrote: »

just a side note.

I reckon if the catholic church had no opinion on abortion then a large portion of those protesting wouldn't protest.
just my two cents

Interesting thought right there. I also think if the CC had no opinion on abortion, public opinion on the matter wouldn't change much either, in fact it might even grow against legalising abortion.

Personally, I find the only people who bring Religion or the Church's opinion are the extremist clowns on either side of the debate. My opinion on abortion is that of most people's, judging by opinion polls, but what both sides seem to get wrong is that my religious beliefs have no bearing on the matter; it's purely a question of morality and weighing up the interests of the mother and the child.

MightyMandarin · 08-03-2017 02:16PM

rainbow kirby wrote: »

If the RCC had no opinion on abortion then the 8th wouldn't exist in the first place...

That's a truly ridiculous claim and is exactly why I detest the constant inclusion of the CC in the debate.

The question of abortion, for the vast majority of people, is purely a question of morality, and to say that even in 1983 -when the Church was already losing touch with many Irish people- the Irish public blindly followed what the CC supported greatly underestimates the intelligence of the public.

Zulu · 08-03-2017 02:19PM

rainbow kirby wrote: »

If the RCC had no opinion on abortion then the 8th wouldn't exist in the first place...

humm, I dunno if I agree with you. Hang on I just need to run it past my pp.
:rolleyes: FFS. Exactly the type of dismissive and insulting comment we've come to expect... Yeay middle ground.

godtabh · 08-03-2017 02:21PM

Best sign I saw today was 'think outside my box'

RayM · 08-03-2017 02:21PM

MightyMandarin wrote: »

That's a truly ridiculous claim and is exactly why I detest the constant inclusion of the CC in the debate.

The question of abortion, for the vast majority of people, is purely a question of morality, and to say that even in 1983 -when the Church was already losing touch with many Irish people- the Irish public blindly followed what the CC supported greatly underestimates the intelligence of the public.

Just three years after the 8th Amendment was passed, the Irish electorate rejected divorce. I think you're underestimating the power wielded by the Catholic Church in Ireland right up until the '90s, when it all started to unravel with the abuse scandals.

PopePalpatine · 08-03-2017 02:21PM

keano_afc wrote: »

I shared that on twitter under the Citizens Assembly hashtag. The reason it was dismissed by Repealers that replied to me? Why, he's a man (and a foreign man!) of course and therefore has absolutely nothing to add. By that I presume they mean he's a man not in favour of abortion, as whenever the likes of James Corden or Liam Neeson show support for the Repeal cause they get the back slapped off them.

Or perhaps the uploader has some other choice videos on his channel such as an ad for a neo-Nazi podcast and can be dismissed as a neckbearded nutjob.

RayM · 08-03-2017 02:21PM

godtabh wrote: »

Best sign I saw today was 'think outside my box'

"Tiocfaidh ár mná" was another one.

Ronan|Raven · 08-03-2017 02:23PM

And of course block the bridge and cause those trying to do their days work a load of hassle.

MightyMandarin · 08-03-2017 02:32PM

RayM wrote: »

Just three years after the 8th Amendment was passed, the Irish electorate rejected divorce. I think you're underestimating the power wielded by the Catholic Church in Ireland right up until the '90s, when it all started to unravel with the abuse scandals.

And yet again, you're assuming people voted against legalising divorce purely because the Church was against it.

I'm not denying that the Church had immense power in this country, I just think people deserve to be respected as voting with their conscience and their own moral code, not just blindly following the Church.

Unfortunately, it seems to be quite common on the repeal side, as it was in the marriage referendum, that if you vote No you must be doing so just because the CC wants you to, and it's incredibly disrespectful imo.

MightyMandarin · 08-03-2017 02:33PM

godtabh wrote: »

Best sign I saw today was 'think outside my box'

This popped straight into my head when I read that:

Strike For Repeal?

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