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"Why I did not report my rapist"

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  • Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Last Sunday morning LMII was looking for the ride. We were in a hotel, nearing check out time. I said no, we don't have time. He followed me to the shower and we ended up having sex anyway. Do you think he raped me?

    'We ended up having sex'
    That's the difference lexie, you changed your mind you didn't just lie there & let him do it.

    If I'm kissing a fella & he says he doesn't want sex, then I'm off, straight away!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,039 ✭✭✭✭retro:electro


    bubblypop wrote: »
    If he had of stopped when she said no, none of the rest would have happened.

    By the way, I don't think it's right that she put this out in public, where he is judged by social media. She is wrong in that.

    You can still consent after an initial no. Like RMC did when she decided to have sex with him over saying "hey let's not do this. I don't fancy you". She had power to decide. Rape victims do not have the power to decide.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 23,646 ✭✭✭✭qo2cj1dsne8y4k


    bubblypop wrote: »
    'We ended up having sex'
    That's the difference lexie, you changed your mind you didn't just lie there & let him do it.

    If I'm kissing a fella & he says he doesn't want sex, then I'm off, straight away!
    "I decided to have sex with him as it would be easier than travelling an hour and a half on the way back home in the car with Mr Blue Balls"

    is it more rapey now?


  • Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    If you KNOW someone is trying to shag you, and you don't want to do it, you have a responsibility to say no. Not to say no, but continue what you're doing, knowing what the other person is thinking it'll lead to, then saying nothing when they believe you are happy to have sex, when it's progressed that far.

    And, if you know someone doesn't want to shag you, and tells you that, says no when you kiss them, but you continue to do what you're doing anyway.
    What does that make you?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,447 ✭✭✭Calhoun


    I'm reading this thread as the father of boys and I am horrified by the casual assumption that they are guilty by virtue of their sex for just existing.

    We have discussed relationships with the eldest already but we are going to have another chat against being alone at any stage of a relationship with a female until he ascertains the thought processes of said female because if the 'rape' in this case and the mans trial by media is the future direction of relationships, I will be suggesting a life of near chastity to protect his future and reputation.

    Don't mind the identity politics folks in here they had their way your son would have to check his privilege regularly and attend yearly consent classes to make sure the indoctrination sticks.

    Teach him about picking the right person to be with and not someone who plays mind games. Definitely tell him to keep away from folk who want a future in the media as he might be blogged about in the future when said lady needs some publicity .


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 20,633 ✭✭✭✭Buford T. Justice XIX


    meeeeh wrote: »
    Is it? Tell me how many rapes actually end in conviction? Oh wait vast majority of victims are false reporting rape.
    Where did I say that?

    Just to remind you, YOU said that.


  • Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    anna080 wrote: »
    You can still consent after an initial no. Like RMC did when she decided to have sex with him over saying "hey let's not do this. I don't fancy you". She had power to decide. Rape victims do not have the power to decide.

    How many times do you think she should have to say no before someone listens?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 12,687 ✭✭✭✭Penny Tration


    bubblypop wrote: »
    And, if you know someone doesn't want to shag you, and tells you that, says no when you kiss them, but you continue to do what you're doing anyway.
    What does that make you?

    You missed the part where she chose to continue kissing him throughout all of it, AFTER saying no.


  • Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    "I decided to have sex with him as it would be easier than travelling an hour and a half on the way back home in the car with Mr Blue Balls"

    is it more rapey now?

    Well, you decided to have sex with him.
    You didn't just let him have sex with you.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 20,633 ✭✭✭✭Buford T. Justice XIX


    So tell him to sure her for defamation.



    No, it just hasn't changed my mind that someone saying no three times is a pretty clear refusal.
    That'll help a lot when his reputation is in tatters and she not able to pay any reparations.


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  • Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    You missed the part where she chose to continue kissing him throughout all of it, AFTER saying no.

    You missed the part where he continues to kiss her after she said no


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,039 ✭✭✭✭retro:electro


    bubblypop wrote: »
    Well, you decided to have sex with him.
    You didn't just let him have sex with you.

    RMC decided too. Her thought process: "will I have an awkward conversation or will I just have sex and avoid that, ya I'll have sex and avoid that".


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 23,646 ✭✭✭✭qo2cj1dsne8y4k


    bubblypop wrote: »
    How many times do you think she should have to say no before someone listens?
    Right away after
    "Are you deaf? I said no"
    "No I don't fancy you"
    "Are you listening to me? No!"

    Not whispering no in his ear in between kisses and states of undress.


    This whole thing actually reminds me of someone I was meeting years ago. We stayed over together as just friends. He was kissing another girl at the time and I was kissing another guy. But I still had feelings for him. He was wearing this rape proof belt, impossible to open. We're laying on the bed, kissing, he's saying no we shouldn't, but he was into it. I tried open his belt and failed. He started laughing, opened his belt for me, and let me crack on with what I was doing while telling me what a terrible idea it was. Did I rape him?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,624 ✭✭✭✭meeeeh


    Where did I say that?

    Just to remind you, YOU said that.

    Didn't you say that system is skewed against men? Show me the statistics that prove that. Not something that is shouted the loudest on social media but actual hard facts.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 23,646 ✭✭✭✭qo2cj1dsne8y4k


    bubblypop wrote: »
    Well, you decided to have sex with him.
    You didn't just let him have sex with you.

    She said she decided to let him have sex with her rather than have an awkward conversation


  • Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Right away after
    "Are you deaf? I said no"
    "No I don't fancy you"
    "Are you listening to me? No!"

    Not whispering no in his ear in between kisses and states of undress.


    This whole thing actually reminds me of someone I was meeting years ago. We stayed over together as just friends. He was kissing another girl at the time and I was kissing another guy. But I still had feelings for him. He was wearing this rape proof belt, impossible to open. We're laying on the bed, kissing, he's saying no we shouldn't, but he was into it. I tried open his belt and failed. He started laughing, opened his belt for me, and let me crack on with what I was doing while telling me what a terrible idea it was. Did I rape him?

    If he said I don't want to have sex with you, and then said no when you tried to keep kissing him, what would you have done?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 66 ✭✭pointelle


    Dude, there's a rape awareness advertisement possibly English saw it years ago, it's the same scenario, WEARING DOWN A WOMAN"S RESOLVE to **** her is coercion. In psychological terms the victim enters a state of denial / self protection and basicly loses their autonomy, for "connoisseurs" of sexual deviancy it's known as droit de seigneur. I don't know how Ireland is ever going to be dragged into modernity with the bloody patriarchal dick wielding ****tard mentality so prevalent in this godforsaken arse of a place


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 23,646 ✭✭✭✭qo2cj1dsne8y4k


    bubblypop wrote: »
    If he said I don't want to have sex with you, and then said no when you tried to keep kissing him, what would you have done?

    I'd have left and banged the other guy I was kissing.
    But he told me "no" but proceeded to kiss me and open his belt for me.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,965 ✭✭✭Help!!!!


    In America Feminists are trying to say its rape if a woman has sex & later regrets it.
    So you meet said woman in a pub/club etc she comes on to you & asks you to take her home to have sex. Next morning you look over shes not the hottie you thought the night before so you give her the brush off ( chewing off own arm is optional ) She gets with mates later crying about what a bastard you are, during the conversation the consensual sex you had is now " RAPE " . Now your life is ended while shes free to go out & do the same " mistake " again. By the same example can I say I was raped?? I've had sex multiple times that I've regretted but you just get on with it & try to learn from your mistakes
    I'm glad I'm married & I dont need to go through any of this hopefully again but the world is so fcuked now. Theres are too many people being told how to feel, need safe spaces, its someone elses fault.
    If Meatloaf was to write " Paradise By The Dashboard Light " now it would be called a rape song, where in the real world its the " game " between a man & a woman.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,447 ✭✭✭Calhoun


    Originally Posted by Rosemary View Post
    I wouldn’t get upset when I encountered mean girls. I found secondary school really tough. I wasn’t in the popular crew – in fact, I think I was probably pretty close to the bottom of the societal rung – and I was really sensitive to any slights, perceived or otherwise. I had curly hair that my mother insisted on brushing for me (frizz ball) and I was that kind of dangerous combination of incredibly self-conscious about my looks, and incredibly self-assured about my intelligence. I was, in short, a massive nerd – and I felt the brunt of it at school.

    If you asked my sixth-year self what would be different about my life in, say, 13 years’ time, she would have told you that I wouldn’t be feeling intimidated and humiliated by groups of girls who thought they were better than me – but she would have been totally wrong. At 31 years of age, I still find myself whimpering, tears welling in my eyes, when “girls are mean to me”. I should know better, but I just don’t.

    Just saw this now, brilliant and it explains so much it. Its like the cookie cooker recipe for social justice, grow up being bullied and then go out to change the world so its one big safe space.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 36,595 ✭✭✭✭LuckyLloyd


    How is it not the case when so many people are saying that "its not rape" "she wasnt raped" etc.

    Someone has been publicly outed as a rapist because after a woman said no mupltiple times, they continued to have sex with her without her consent. That is a rapist.

    It is really that straighforward to me so if you disagree fair enough, its probably not worth arguing about anymore as I see it that simply.
    From the story do you think he deserves a fair trial? Why is it that he is innocent until proven guilty but she is a liar until proven truthful?

    This is a pure toxic, regressive and frankly dangerous point of view. The presumption of innocence and entitlement to due process fundamentally underpins our societal structure. Louise O'Neill's "rape culture" documentary strayed into the same territory - an argument for the presumption of guilt in rape cases.

    This must be fought and viciously decried at every opportunity.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,447 ✭✭✭Calhoun


    pointelle wrote: »
    Dude, there's a rape awareness advertisement possibly English saw it years ago, it's the same scenario, WEARING DOWN A WOMAN"S RESOLVE to **** her is coercion. In psychological terms the victim enters a state of denial / self protection and basicly loses their autonomy, for "connoisseurs" of sexual deviancy it's known as droit de seigneur. I don't know how Ireland is ever going to be dragged into modernity with the bloody patriarchal dick wielding ****tard mentality so prevalent in this godforsaken arse of a place

    So are you saying women are weaker than men and need more protection because they are helpless? What would you suggest we put in place to stop this?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 398 ✭✭SpillingTheTea


    bubblypop wrote: »
    Last Sunday morning LMII was looking for the ride. We were in a hotel, nearing check out time. I said no, we don't have time. He followed me to the shower and we ended up having sex anyway. Do you think he raped me?

    'We ended up having sex'
    That's the difference lexie, you changed your mind you didn't just lie there & let him do it.

    If I'm kissing a fella & he says he doesn't want sex, then I'm off, straight away!

    I think this is a double standard on your stance tbh. I read Rosemary's blog post and through this whole thread and I agree with the majority that it wasn't rape.

    On one hand you are saying that Lexie changed her mind and didn't just lie there and let him do it. Well, Rosemary also changed her mind. She chose to have sex with this guy instead of having an awkward conversation. If that's what is considered rape, then the majority of the population both male and female are rapists.

    You can't just pick and choose and twist things to make it agreeable to what you believe. She consented, therefore it isn't rape. In her own words she even said that she initially didn't consider it to be rape.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,039 ✭✭✭✭retro:electro


    In her own words:
    " I would believe you if you told me he didn't think he was doing anything wrong"
    "He didn't realise how far he was pushing things"
    "I don't think he would ever consider himself a rapist"
    "It seemed easier to lie there and disassociate"
    "Would it be rape to a court of law? Probably 1%"

    But I'll still continue to shame him and call him a rapist because I *feel* I was raped.

    I completely accept that's it's not always easy to report a rape, I totally get and sympathise with that. However, it's not okay to fcuking slander someone on a blog post 15 years later because you decide you were raped and allow him to be call a rapist when you know full well he isn't one and would never be convicted.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,476 ✭✭✭neonsofa


    This thread has confused the hell out of me. In the LON thread a few weeks back I was discussing implied consent and how people can read body language and explicit consent doesn't need to be given, we can read situations etc. In this case, the woman gave an explicit no, but it seems that her body language and the context (kissing, top off etc) gave a different message to the guy. So my two stances are conflicting.

    If she hadn't said no I would think it wasn't rape, the fact she said no makes me think why didn't he just ask, did he not care? Or was her body language and participation saying otherwise? It's hard to know as it is her version of events, she is staying she let him. We don't know if this is a case of her lying there allowing him to work away or if she actively engaged (i read people saying she did continue kissing him?) On one hand I am saying that implied consent is consent but then in this case he may have seen her "allowing him" as implied consent. But then her "no" should have been taken as her withdrawing consent and the point at which he should have clarified.

    Then there is the question of how he read the situation. Did he hear her no as a playful no and carried on. Or did he know she didn't want to have sex but continued anyway because in the end she "let him". People were saying it wasn't fear that made her comply, which does happen in cases of rape. But is he aware that she wasn't afraid. We know her thought process as to why she gave in. But if he wasn't aware that she didn't want sex from the get go then how do we now he wasn't aware of the fact she wasn't afraid. There is just so many questions.

    This leads me to think that rather than these proposed consent classes telling men "ask the vulnerable woman if she wants to have sex" it should be more about both parties being clear on where they stand, and the need to verbalise if you are uncomfortable in a situation. That both people need to take ownership of the situation and clarify any ambiguity.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 62 ✭✭LightlyGo


    pointelle wrote: »
    Dude, there's a rape awareness advertisement possibly English saw it years ago, it's the same scenario, WEARING DOWN A WOMAN"S RESOLVE to **** her is coercion. In psychological terms the victim enters a state of denial / self protection and basicly loses their autonomy, for "connoisseurs" of sexual deviancy it's known as droit de seigneur. I don't know how Ireland is ever going to be dragged into modernity with the bloody patriarchal dick wielding ****tard mentality so prevalent in this godforsaken arse of a place

    What?
    So are you saying that women have no responsibility at all for what happens to their body? What sort of message is that? By that logic none of us are safe, we're just sitting ducks waiting for rapists to whisper sweet nothings in our ear because we are incapable of resisting.

    That ad you saw was made by someone who needed a dictionary.
    Coercion by dictionary and legal definition is the action or practice of persuading someone to do something by using force or threats...FORCE OR THREAT.
    Wearing down resolve is persausion by enticement, an entirely different and entirely legal act. We are on the receiving end of it all day from sales people to tv ads to well meaning mammy's offering us cups of tea. It's completely different. If women are not capable of resisting temptation that's on them.

    The idea that are so weak minded that we would need to be protected even from temptation is so insulting to our entire sex is absolutely anthethical of what feminism should be.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,476 ✭✭✭neonsofa


    LightlyGo wrote: »
    What?
    So are you saying that women have no responsibility at all for what happens to their body? What sort of message is that? By that logic none of us are safe, we're just sitting ducks waiting for rapists to whisper sweet nothings in our ear.

    That ad you saw was made by someone who needed a dictionary. Coercion by dictionary and legal definition is the action or practice of persuading someone to do something by using force or threats...FORCE OR THREAT. Wearing down resolve is persausion, an entirely different and entirely legal act. We are on the receiving end of it all day from sales people to tv ads to well meaning mammy's offering us cups of tea. It's completely different. If women are not capable of resisting temptation that's on them.

    The idea that are so weak minded that we would need to be protected even from temptation is so insulting to our entire sex is absolutely anthethical of what feminism should be.

    A lot of so called feminists seem to think that men are so weak minded that they are unable to control themselves from temptation, that they all have the ability to rape and that rape culture reinforces this, which is insulting to all men. Both sides of that coin are ridiculous.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,039 ✭✭✭✭retro:electro


    LightlyGo wrote: »
    What?
    So are you saying that women have no responsibility at all for what happens to their body? What sort of message is that? By that logic none of us are safe, we're just sitting ducks waiting for rapists to whisper sweet nothings in our ear because we are incapable of resisting.

    That ad you saw was made by someone who needed a dictionary.
    Coercion by dictionary and legal definition is the action or practice of persuading someone to do something by using force or threats...FORCE OR THREAT.
    Wearing down resolve is persausion by enticement, an entirely different and entirely legal act. We are on the receiving end of it all day from sales people to tv ads to well meaning mammy's offering us cups of tea. It's completely different. If women are not capable of resisting temptation that's on them.

    The idea that are so weak minded that we would need to be protected even from temptation is so insulting to our entire sex is absolutely anthethical of what feminism should be.

    100%. Nail on the head. This post needs to be stickied. Fcuk that it needs to be copied and pasted and reproduced throughout this thread continually.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 398 ✭✭SpillingTheTea


    What completely irks me about this whole situation is the entrapment aspect of it all.
    We are basically 'forced' to believe her story (and by forced I mean socially) because she said so. If we don't agree with her then we are MRA's and misogynistic.
    But what about the guy in the situation? Well he has the unfortunate position of being the sitting duck so to speak. He will know that it's him that she's talking about and he can't defend himself because if he were to say 'Yep that's me, it isn't true' he'd be lynched by all the people who believe her side.
    I thought people were innocent until proven guilty in this country?!

    What's worse, if he really IS a rapist. She's allowing that to potentially happen to other women. So which is it? He's a rapist and the scum of the earth or he's not because in her words, 'He's not a bad guy'.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,965 ✭✭✭Help!!!!


    LightlyGo wrote: »
    What?
    So are you saying that women have no responsibility at all for what happens to their body? What sort of message is that? By that logic none of us are safe, we're just sitting ducks waiting for rapists to whisper sweet nothings in our ear because we are incapable of resisting.

    That ad you saw was made by someone who needed a dictionary.
    Coercion by dictionary and legal definition is the action or practice of persuading someone to do something by using force or threats...FORCE OR THREAT.
    Wearing down resolve is persausion by enticement, an entirely different and entirely legal act. We are on the receiving end of it all day from sales people to tv ads to well meaning mammy's offering us cups of tea. It's completely different. If women are not capable of resisting temptation that's on them.

    The idea that are so weak minded that we would need to be protected even from temptation is so insulting to our entire sex is absolutely anthethical of what feminism should be.

    Its great to see that there are still some women in the world that are not looking to play the victim :D


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