In laws making my life hell, what options are left?

LegacyUser · 20-02-2017 08:43PM #1

So this is going to be long, sorry in advance.

I have been with my partner for three years. Lived together for two. We are both in our mid twenties.

We had our own issues at the beginning of the relationship, it was the first time he was with someone seriously and didn't handle it very well. There were issues with other girls and lies but never cheating. This is a story for another day.

We sorted that out as soon as it happened and we were in a better place than ever once it was all over with mutual trust and a happy life.

About a month or two after we moved in together, the issues started. Mainly his mother to begin with. She constantly put him down even when he lived at home, saying he was fat and disgusting, stupid, embarrassing and a disappointment.

She never openly said anything against me until maybe a year after the move in. She rang him one night asking why he doesn't visit anymore. He explained he visits as much as possible but we were both working shift work/weekends at the time so any time we did have a rare day off together we would go out and do something for the day. He never stopped contact and if he did have a day to himself he would visit them.

After he explained this she started saying I was keeping him from his family. This was out of the blue as I have never been involved with their issues. I kept well away. She was screaming over to the phone to the point I could hear what she was saying about me so I asked to speak to her to clear things up. I was extremely polite and didn't get angry as I didn't see why it couldn't be resolved. She came on the phone and started screaming that I was a horrible person, our house was filthy (she had visited once and there is nothing wrong with where we lived at the time) that I was a terrible girlfriend and started saying things like I was kicked out of home and school (both of which never happened, I actually sent her my exam results showing I finished school and she has met my mother since who clarified I have never been kicked out of home and this was ridiculous. I know I didn't even have to do that but I stupidly thought it would stop the lies) This went on, screaming for over ten minutes and when I asked her to speak to me with respect instead of shouting and to stop telling lies she said ' I can do what I want at my age and you have no choice but to listen'. At which point I handed the phone back to my partner because it was going nowhere. She the ended the conversation with 'I wont stop until I break you up'

Six months later, I hadn't spoke to her for obvious reasons. I spoke to his dad occasionally when he visited and everytime he did he would say she feels so bad and guilty and she knows she was wrong can you forgive her. I gave in and for my boyfriends sake said yeah forget it ever happened. So she came to the house on xmas day and said 'I'm sorry for what I did I was just saying it out of care and I want us to be friends'

Great. I let it go because what use was it carrying on arguments. I want to be with this man so if I have to grin and bear it this once it's fine.

So a few months on again, she started doing the same thing. It came out of nowhere. The xmas she visited, we had just moved into a new house together (his parents gave him an ultimatum and said if we didn't move into a house that they approved of then they would make sure he comes home. He was 23 at this point to be told this by his parents....)

A lovely house, I paid half the deposit because I had rented on my own for a few years prior, he didn't have a deposit to fall back on so his parents paid his half. Again, their business, I didn't get involved.

So, when this happened she then started saying our new house was filthy. Having just moved in and doing two hours housework every evening, I know it wasn't and no one else visiting had an issue, even his father admitted there was nothing wrong.

So she kept this going for a few months, saying he needed to lose weight and that he looks homeless and he is a failure.

This alone has had such an impact on his self esteem and he got very down about it. I have worked for the last ten years straight, and last year was signed off work for anxiety disorder and agoraphobia. I left work under doctors supervision and I am attending counselling and using medication to hopefully become well again. In this time I have been no means lazy, I am up at 7am each day cleaning or doing things and helping my boyfriend as he works from home. I volunteer and do as many things I can to try and learn how to be out of the house again and a normal functioning person.

In response to this, his mother called me lazy and a waster. When I explained why I was at home she said I was lying and there was nothing wrong with me to 'cop on'. She didn't believe I was seeing a doctor and demanded seeing my medication, which I showed. She then rang my mother behind my back (they had never spoke before, I am from a county a few hrs away. She found her workplace on FB and rang her there telling her I was lying about all these issues. Me and my mother speak daily so naturally she already knew about everything and made her look very stupid.) After this as she was proven wrong once again, she came to our house and apologised and again, said it was out of concern for us.

So ONCE AGAIN I said ok it's done now lets move on. Me and my mother have always talked about this and she always advises me to take the high road and be courteous because it will just give her another reason to hate me if I stand up for myself. So that's what I have done.

Until now. We were invited for dinner two months ago, we were twenty mins late as BF was ill and had fallen asleep on the sofa. He apologised profusely and explained why he was late. To which she turned and started screaming in my face. I simply said thanks for dinner but I'm not staying here to be shouted at and belittled. I left and he followed shortly after.

After this, she said nothing for a few weeks. She text him at 2am one night to ask him 'if he was alive and why he hasn't spoke or visited' he said sorry I got the impression after the last day you were starting an argument again and I don't want any drama. To which she replied you are a disappointment and I hope you fail at your new job like you do everything else. He replied he was trying to sleep and she abused him with ten messages of the same until morning. He had turned his phone and slept as he was up for work at 7am. Then at 8am when he seen the messages she said he was immature and disrespectful for not replying... He just ignored it.

Fast forward to this weekend. He gets a text from his dad saying he needs to stop acting this way and shutting his family out. He replied with all the things his mother has been saying over the phone and in messages and that we are both adults trying to get on with our life, we do not want drama or arguments over absolutely nothing. His dad then went on to repeat exactly what his mothers messages said 'You are a disappointment to me I'm sorry you turned out like this I am embarrassed to call you my son.

He didn't reply because he drew the line at arguing with his father. He reached out to him for help with his mother once before and his father sat crying saying it was wrong and he was so sorry and he'll try to fix it.

Two hours later when his father got home, he called him saying I can't believe I was upset, you're lying about your mother and making me out to be a fool. We have all of these messages etc saved so it isn't like it was a lie that we made up. He was there when she was screaming in my face and just sat with his head down.

The straw that broke the camels back is when his 20year old sister text him saying ' You're a fat disgusting mess. You have one income in your filthy house and you think you are doing well at 25? You should have more respect.' He replied saying this is nothing to do with her, he has issues with his parents and he would appreciate if she didn't get involved. This ended with name calling and cursing on her end. Not sure if this was actually her or she is being influenced but it's the one thing that broke him because she never speaks to him except in passing, has never been in our house, and would not know our financial situation.

All that being said, EVEN if the stuff they were saying is true, it isn't their business whatsoever. But at the same time, they will visit one month and say the house is so lovely and clean and pretty and then a week later a text will come in the middle of the night calling it damp and filthy.

I don't even know what I'm hoping from posting this here, I'm just at my wits end. I have never once been disrespectful to anyone in the family. I have always been polite and even when I was screamed at those times, I stayed quiet and said ok lets move on and forget it happened. Maybe that was the mistake, if I stood up for myself the first time maybe it wouldn't have gone this far...

We are very happy together, we love our home, and my boyfriend has a very good job which he started last month. His old job was not bad by any means but this is better ours and higher fixed salary. I was working full time up until a few months ago as a manager.

Anyway sorry if you did make it to the end. Any advice would be great but really just needed to get it off my chest. Don't think if I read this myself I would even believe it, it's that insane.

Thanks.

Tokyo · 21-02-2017 06:24AM

I'm not one to recommend turning your back on family, but there's no doubt about it - your mother in law sounds like a terrible person to have to interract with, if not downright abusive. And I suspect that your partner has been subject to this abuse for much of, if not all of his life. If you're looking for reasons why all this is happening, it may be a futile mission. Some people they don't need an actual reason apart from jealousy that their child has someone else who is significant in their child's life, and I suspect that's the case here.

I appreciate that you are going above and beyond in terms of maintaining some form of civility with you mother in law for the sake of your partner, but one thing you need to remember is you don't have to have a relationship with this person. Your partner of course can have a relationship with her, but you don't have to be a part of it. The onus is on her now to make an effort to be a part of your life, not the other way round.

My bigger concern in your situation would be the strain it puts on your relationship, so in that respect it's good that both you and your partner are more on less the same page in terms of a united front against her carry on. That being said, your partner has endured this for many years to the point where it has affected his self esteem, so you may have to accept that you won't always get the immediate support that you want, while he tries to balance his feeling on his mother's actions, coupled witht he guilt of trying to maintain a relationship with his father.

My advice for now would be to leave his mother to him. Simply put, don't have anything to do with the woman. Ignore the abusive phone calls and texts, or hang up on them. Let your partner deal with her - he can choose if he wants you spend time with her or ignore her - you just don't have to be a part of it. Focus on your own relationship, and be supportive to him as he needs it.

One thing I would look into though, for the sake of your financial security, is the details of the deposit for your house. Did your partner sign anything in terms of the money lent to him by them? Or is it just a verbal agreement? My concern is that they might see that money as their foot in the door, and try to use it as leverage to keep him in line, or 'make sure he comes home'...

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groovyg · 21-02-2017 11:09AM

I don't understand why you are engaging with them. Yourself and your boyfriend should focus on your own relationship and future and forget about them. Stop answering calls and block their numbers, that might seem harsh but it might help your physical and mental health and get you off the medication that you need to control the anxiety and stress they are causing you.
One thing I would be worried about which a previous poster mentioned is your financial security and the loan his parents gave your OH for the deposit on your house. I really hope a solicitor was involved in this agreement and that he is paying them back.

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LynnGrace · 21-02-2017 11:24AM

Agree with previous posters - I'm not sure why you and he are engaging with them. It's none of their business what medication you are on, just to pick one example.
They sound very messed up, tbh. I suggest as pp have said, block calls and texts, don't allow them past the door if they arrive.

Focus on your own health. Rest, relax, focus on your well being. You both are using a lot of energy on them, and really the best thing all around would be to have nothing to do with them.

You mention a deposit, I'm not sure of this is a deposit for a rental? I hope so, for your sake. You both need to get these people out of your lives, so hopefully your finances are not in any way entwined with theirs. If he has a better job now, I would be doing my utmost to get whatever money they gave, back to them ASAP.

Seriously, give yourselves a break from them. They are adding nothing positive to your lives.

LegacyUser · 21-02-2017 12:18PM

Hi everyone thanks for your replies

I know it sounds insane. He has always contacted them back because when he didn't in the past, I got blamed for manipulating him or they acted even worse after. He had felt guilty for a while because it is his family and it upset him but he does know how toxic and abnormal this is.

On the financial front, he had saved 10,000 in his course of working at home. When he still lived there they suggested he put it in their account in case it ever affected him (?) and it is now in savings bonds without his permission. Yes he was stupid to sign it over but he was still living there at the time and believed it was in his interest. When we moved out he asked for this to use as a deposit (rental) and his parents said oh don't mind that we will lend it to you, keep that for the future.

So he is independent as he has allowed to be I suppose. He has accepted he probably will never see this money again and can't do anything legally because he was silly enough to trust them.

If we don't contact them they show up at our door at all hours / tell lies about us like before. I know it seems crazy about the exam results etc but I naively thought if I could prove she was lying everyone would see what was going on...

Thanks again for replies and sticking through the long post....

LegacyUser · 21-02-2017 12:31PM

Oh yeah, I didn't get my mother actively involved at all, I wouldn't bother her with it.. She was contacted by his mother and they had never spoke before. His mother quizzed her on these things because she didn't believe me..

The Princess Bride · 21-02-2017 12:57PM

I would recommend your boyfriend attend counselling sooner rather than later.
These people could eventually wear him down with their behaviour, if he continues to interact with them.
And they're not going to change any time soon.
No adult should "have to" move into a house just because their parents say so.
Seriously - not only is this bullying, but to call their son and brother disappointing, fat, an embarrassment, stupid, disgusting ? And repeatedly?
Fair play to him that he has any self esteem.

Look after yourself and I hope your health improves.
Life is too precious to spend it with negative people like these.

B0jangles · 21-02-2017 01:21PM

It sounds like you have a healthy relationship with your own parents which has left you very much at a loss when it comes to dealing with a manipulative, abusive and toxic parent. You cannot deal with a person like that in a calm, reasonable fashion and expect to receive a similar response. At this stage it sounds like the relationship between your partner and his mother is pretty much beyond repair and the only option for his and your mental health is to have as little contact as possible.

I should say I have no personal experience with this kind of person but I have read many people's accounts of growing up with parents like this; they don't change. They will use every and any emotional tool to manipulate and control those around them.

I know there is a book that is very widely recommended for people who grew up with this kind of parent as a guide to recognising and dealing with their situation, I think it's this one but I'm not 100% sure:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0553381407/

On re-reading your OP it is clear that she is trying to establish the same abusive control over you too - stay away, tell her nothing, do not justify yourself to her; everything you tell her will be turned into a weapon against you.

Emme · 21-02-2017 01:39PM

The Princess Bride wrote: »

I would recommend your boyfriend attend counselling sooner rather than later.
These people could eventually wear him down with their behaviour, if he continues to interact with them.
And they're not going to change any time soon.
No adult should "have to" move into a house just because their parents say so.
Seriously - not only is this bullying, but to call their son and brother disappointing, fat, an embarrassment, stupid, disgusting ? And repeatedly?
Fair play to him that he has any self esteem.

Look after yourself and I hope your health improves.
Life is too precious to spend it with negative people like these.

I agree 100%. I think you both need counselling to deal with his family's behaviour. His mother sounds like a toxic narcissist and his father is enabling him. His sister is backing them up so they don't give her a hard time.

If your boyfriend has been subjected to this abuse all his life he is doing extremely well to be ALIVE let alone hold down a job. I hope you are just renting because you need to get as far away from these people as possible. This may not happen today or tomorrow because your boyfriend needs a lot of help. He is like a soldier who has lived with hostile fire and he still isn't out of the battle zone even though he is slightly further away.

His mother seems to have a vested interest in abusing him and keeping him as her verbal punchbag.

Is it possible for you both to block his family's numbers on your phones. They will probably still be able to leave messages and you will know when they called. I had to do this with some members of my family.

If you do plan to go away I would advise you both to keep quiet about it for as long as possible. Otherwise his mother or father will get ill and you will be able to go nowhere. Illlness is used as a chain to stop people from getting away in families like this. I have personal experience of it and every day I regret not leaving the country when I was younger because I am trapped now. I don't live with my parents but they are both getting older and I cannot leave ailing elderly parents even though one is extremely abusive.

The abuse impacted on my health (I have chronic fatigue and autoimmune disease), my career (I was not able to forge ahead because of my parents needs over the decades) and relationships (nobody would stick around because of the way my parents demanded my time and the way the family situation upset me).

You are an angel for standing by your boyfriend in this situation - very few people would have done so. He needs to be gently guided away from his family into a safer and healthier space. It needs to be done for your sake as well - it would not surprise me if the stress of his family has contributed to your illness.

Narcissism in families is a bit of a hobby horse for me but I have experienced it first hand and can see it a mile off. Here is a link that you might find helpful.
https://narcfamilyoutsider.wordpress.com/2013/12/20/the-narcissistic-family-structure/

Here are some links about how such families use money as a tool for manipulation:
https://narcfamilyoutsider.wordpress.com/2014/07/21/family-narcissists-and-financial-manipulation-part-1/
https://narcfamilyoutsider.wordpress.com/2014/07/21/family-narcissists-and-financial-manipulation-part-1/
https://narcfamilyoutsider.wordpress.com/2014/11/22/family-narcissists-and-financial-manipulation-part-3/

Take care, both of you.

valoren · 21-02-2017 01:41PM

She constantly put him down even when he lived at home, saying he was fat and disgusting, stupid, embarrassing and a disappointment.

Let me take a wild guess. Is the MIL; overweight, unkempt, not the brightest, socially awkward, unprofessional?

My immediate reaction is that this is about possessive control.

The only way to deal with toxic people is to not deal with them.
The mother in law is a bully. Of your boyfriend, of you, of her doormat of a husband, of her family.

From what you have written this is absolutely crazy behaviour.
She has a vendetta to split you both up.

The key to dealing with such people is to cut ties permanently.
To not give her the oxygen. 10 abusive texts late at night?
If he can't see how deranged that is then he needs your support.

Your MIL is not going to change. Stop placating her abuse.
The key here is your boyfriend. He has had his self esteem stripped away over the years.
He either continues to be a doormat for her or he can confront it.
He knows that once he confronts it then it will effectively mean that his relationship with his family is over.
That's never easy. But from reading your post he must accept that reality for his own mental health.

Again, the MIL will never change. She will twist, manipulate, exploit everything. You will both be at fault.
You will be the one who broke the family apart, it will be you who is the abusive bully etc.

He must stand on his own two feet. He needs to grow a pair and confront it. He'll thank himself in the long run because once you rid yourself of toxic people, life becomes much more bearable and enjoyable.

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Emme · 21-02-2017 01:50PM

inthedumps1 wrote: »

Hi everyone thanks for your replies

I know it sounds insane. He has always contacted them back because when he didn't in the past, I got blamed for manipulating him or they acted even worse after. He had felt guilty for a while because it is his family and it upset him but he does know how toxic and abnormal this is.

On the financial front, he had saved 10,000 in his course of working at home. When he still lived there they suggested he put it in their account in case it ever affected him (?) and it is now in savings bonds without his permission. Yes he was stupid to sign it over but he was still living there at the time and believed it was in his interest. When we moved out he asked for this to use as a deposit (rental) and his parents said oh don't mind that we will lend it to you, keep that for the future.

So he is independent as he has allowed to be I suppose. He has accepted he probably will never see this money again and can't do anything legally because he was silly enough to trust them.

If we don't contact them they show up at our door at all hours / tell lies about us like before. I know it seems crazy about the exam results etc but I naively thought if I could prove she was lying everyone would see what was going on...

Thanks again for replies and sticking through the long post....

This is financial abuse and I would advise him to get legal advice on it. How much did the parents "give" him for the deposit? He owes them nothing, in fact they owe him the balance of the €10,000 if the deposit was less than that.

It will be difficult for your boyfriend to "grow a pair" and stand up to his family overnight. He has been subjected to crippling abuse all his life and he is only taking baby steps forward now. Instead of supporting him and encouraging him like normal parents, his parents have sabotaged him at every step including taking his money to ensure he didn't travel or go too far away. If the situation is bad enough he may have to cut his losses with the money and get as far away from them as possible and never contact them again. In this case the money lost could be the best money he ever spent.

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This is a bit harsh. He does not know any different. He has been subject to relentless abuse all his life and cannot see a way out at the moment. He does not realise that he has the right to live a peaceful autonomous life of his own choosing. He needs counselling to see that. He also needs a loving supportive environment. He has that with the OP at the moment but his mother is hell bent on destroying his relationship so she can have him all to herself to abuse without any interruption. There may be lulls and breaks in the abuse but that is only to give him a false sense of security so he'll talk to them again or worse, go back to them so they can abuse him more. Think of a cat playing with a mouse before killing it only in this case the cat doesn't want to kill the mouse, just keep it around for the fun of torturing it. Putting his money into savings bonds is also a tactic to keep him from leading his own life. This family is dangerously toxic.

LegacyUser · 21-02-2017 03:29PM

Thank you everyone

We just read through the replies together and honestly some of them brought us to tears. I think the sheer relief of knowing we aren't going crazy and hearing it from an outside perspective really helps.... The deposit was 650 thereabouts, he was paid the majority back as far as I'm aware if not all. He was paying 100 a week to them for a while and they would definitely make it known if anything else was owed....

He does stand up to them and he doesn't choose to interact they just corner him into a position that he eventually gives up because fighting it has cost us both our mental health and he just gets to the point that he doesn't want to deal with it... He is on the waiting list for his counsellor at the moment and I have been going for a few months. It is helping and I am eager for him to get started.

I have helped as much as possible to build his self esteem back up, and he has gotten a lot better, but as soon as something happens it's gone straight back to zero again. It really isn't fair on him, to hear this from anyone... No one has a right to speak to another like that especially a parent. That's why it hurts him so much because if it was just a friend or something it wouldn't matter but I can imagine your own mother and father saying those things is horrible to deal with...

He has never rebelled against them in the past, he was a great student, always done what he was told at home, never got into trouble with anything. Then when he moved out after a while, and after visiting home with me and seeing how his other friends are treated by their parents he kinda seen it wasn't normal... Then when he did start telling them where to go she associated it with me and he kinda just went with it for peace sake as we both had enough on our plates...The wrong thing to do but we know that now.

I was only allowed to see parts at first because his mother is VERY obsessed with image. Not particularly in a vain way, just things like why are you wearing that? Why have you gained weight? imagine if someone seen you and knew you were our son, it reflects on us so badly. Again, he doesn't be out partying or causing trouble or doing drugs or murdering anyone, we have a relatively quiet life see friends regularly but don't go out drinking often and not into partying. I would understand if he was doing something actually bad and she said this but it's always over stupid things. She once sat me down and gave me makeup samples in her house, I said I didn't want them as I don't wear a whole lot of makeup daily and it would be wasted on me but thanks. Her response was women should always look beautiful...Her two daughters wear a lot of makeup ie full contour and fake eyelashes everyday. I was never and never will be like that and I'm fine with that.

She called me a slut when we first met because I had a boyfriend before him. One boyfriend, long term. I was young and stupid, granted, but none of her business in the first place. He was with a lot of girls before me but never in a relationship. When I said this she said well that's what young lads do...But called me a slut for having one boyfriend.

She said it would reflect badly on their family for him to be with 'someone like me from my background' . What she means by this is both my parents have always been employed with a trade, they never went to college. I got accepted to a course in university and because we are from a tiny rural area, college was hours away, so I moved out at 18 and got a job. I have applied through cao this year and really want to go, but she has always said I am not good enough because of this. Him, and his sisters, have all had their fees paid etc by the family. They are in extremely lucky place and I wish they knew not everyone has that privilege......

Her answer to everything is 'if people saw you and knew you were our son they'd be horrified' There is nothing wrong with either of us, I am proud of how much he has grown since we met and also myself because I'm trying my best to get better. They don't see it that way....

Sorry if this is going on its just I never really told anyone about everything and now that it's started coming out it wont stop..

LegacyUser · 21-02-2017 03:39PM

Oh and I forgot to say on the college front, he did go to college for three years but absolutely despised it and didn't finish his final year. They picked the cao course for him and they gave him an ultimatum they would only help him with fees if he picked that course...

They have always held that against him so I guess that adds to the 'disappointment'

LegacyUser · 21-02-2017 05:00PM

Sorry to hear about the problems you are having with your in laws. I have similar issues with my mother in law. She acts slightly different, overly nice when anyone visits. She was like this with me for the first few years. But I knew the truth. For years she physically and mentally abused my husband and his brother. So I could never be too friendly with her. She knew I didnt like her so turned out she was complaining about me all this time to my father in law.

It came to a head after I had a baby when they complained I intentionally delayed my return home with the baby from the hospital just to inconvenience them. Also had an issue with his sister (I posted about it at the time when she lived with us) they accused me of insulting his sister by asking her to wash her hands before holding the new baby. Then she intended to live with us two weeks after we had the baby which I said couldnt happen as I was breastfeeding and she also never asked just assumed she could come and go in our house as needed, she hadnt even text to say congrats on the baby!

So they rang my husband and basically told them I was the biggest b***h in the world and had disrespected them all and they wanted to never see any of us again. It caused massive arguments between myself and my husband as he loves his dad and always wants contact with him. So just as he was coming to realise she was toxic and he should stay away they get in contact again.. after six weeks. And pretend nothing happened at all and wanted to see the baby. So I had to watch this horrible woman hold my baby and pretend to be a great grandmother.

The only reason I am writing all this is I think you will have the same problems as me. My husband knows life would be better without ever speaking to his mother again. It is what his brother has done, but he lives abroad so its easier done. But he can't leave his father. Even though his father is partly to blame for their treatment as children by standing by and letting it happen.

I was very upset that he was willing to allow her near our baby after what happened but I had no choice. It had to be his decision whether to stay in contact with his family or not.

We will never leave our child alone with her and their visits are limited but as long as his father is alive our lives will be affected by her and her actions. She obviously suffers from a narcissistic personality.

The main thing I have realised is as much as it make me anxious and upset to have to deal with his family, I am doing it as an adult. He had to deal with when he was a child. So the best I can do as his partner is to support him. He cannot change who is parents are. What ever way it affects me or you is minor compared to what they are going through.

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The Princess Bride · 21-02-2017 05:40PM

As a parent of adult children reading this, I can tell you the vast majority of parents do NOT treat their children like this.

For the record, I think you both tell them far too much. Not to mention if anyone dared call me a slut, I'd never ever engage in conversation with them again.

It doesn't matter how they see you, what matters is how you are together and how you see yourselves going forward.
If you continue to let her -as she seems to be the ringleader here -treat you like this, you could be posting on here in a decade with the same issues.

Time to make serious changes.

B0jangles · 21-02-2017 05:42PM

Never ever let yourself believe that you need to justify anything about yourself to this woman, nothing you or he can do will make her stop - she'll just find some other perceived flaw or failure to beat you down with. She does not want either of you to be happy or successful or independent.

One thing, is the house in the same rural area you grew up in and is it near his parents? If so, it may be more difficult to maintain the kind of distance you'll need for your partner to start to recover from what he's had to endure

If it's any help at all, this internet stranger is rooting for you both - stand together and get out of this awful situation!

Big Bag of Chips · 21-02-2017 05:48PM

I agree, you give this woman far too much rope. She has you and your mother dancing to her tune and you barely know her. What chance has her poor son got who has this bred into him and has lived his entire life thinking this is "normal"?

He has grown up with this woman and her madness his whole life. She's his mother and he still has a loyalty to her and a trust in her. You don't. Humouring her when she called you a slut? Sending her your leaving results? Moving house to where she decided? Trying to reason with her? You're trying to reason with an unreasonable woman. And it doesn't matter whether you talk to her or not, she will spread sht and lies about you. So why bother?

At least if you just ignore her, block her, refuse to be in her company then it won't matter what she says about you, you won't hear it. Don't listen to abusive calls from any of his family. Ignore / delete / block texts from them. Tell your bf not to pass on messages. He will deal with this in his own way, and someday might tell her to f off. But that's up to him, and a lifetime of this behaviour. You have no ties or loyalty to her, so cutting her off will be easier for you. Don't visit her. Ask your bf to not have her in your house, or at least not when you are there.

He needs to deal with her his way, and you need to support that. But you need to deal with her your way, and he should equally support that he. He can continue to have a relationship with her. You can decide not to.

CowboyBillyBob · 21-02-2017 09:52PM

So many different angles and opinions to approach this from, must have written the first sentence half dozen times at this stage but time to dive right in.

From the original post to all the replies there are many different views but only one consensus.. that their behavior is extremely malicious and unfounded for the extent for whats happened previous.

I myself am asking why? Im sure many rush to the profanity corner of the dictionary for adjectives and while many might feel appropriate I still ask why? As had been pointed out its possibly obsessive control which I agree with but with a bad family history, when she sees others succeed where she has failed she is lashing out. If you (this relationship) turned him into a well rounded member of society, even tuned him into a noticeably happier person. It could have been taken as an attack on her ability to be a mother, and what do you do when you feel threatened, you lash out. Food for thought.

I believe there is no issue that cannot be solved with communication you just need to to find the right form, and as I write this many readers may think I am a naive idealist, I say... let me finish.

I am not saying your methods have been in anyway wrong, as from what I have read the patience level is to be commended but logic never wins against emotion. Or rather an emotional person isn't gonna wanna listen to logic. She is taking random facts and putting a spin on it so that you fit into her image of you, what she wants you to look like in her minds eye. And Im sure your boyfriend will agree living with that is not easy, so whats the easiest thing to do when your surrounded by that, if you can beat em join em, that would at least somewhat explain the families response, even taking the family bond out of the equation.

Many people have said cut ties... cut them off... put distance. And this could very well be the best course, but I for one don't think that its necessarily an ideal outcome. as the method of communication that could be necessary may be more damaging in the long run. I know I have never found cutting family to not have had a bad effect either. And at the very least will only fuel the fire of these manipulation they believe your up to.

In an ideal world you would sit down, speak from the heart and all would be well and good, obviously never gonna happen. All you can hope for is be honest and hope the other person listens. You cant make them listen.

In my book when you make a decision as long as you feel it is right by you, and your not hurting anybody then your doing ok, thats almost impossible in this situation so it just boils down to do what you think is right.

If it were me, I would do some sort of variation of the following.

Arrive at the house, ask to come in, ask to speak to the whole family, ask to speak without interruption and simply say exactly how this situation has made you fee the damage, it has caused. You are tired of fighting, feeling like crap and just the general stress it has caused. Tell them you are the verge of cutting ties completely if this continues the way it does. Any communication that is in anyway abusive will be met with silence. I do not want any reply I want everybody to think about it and you can all decide how you wanna handle it as a group or individually and you can feel free to invite me back here to further discuss. And then leave.

If at any point someone interrupts you say if I am interrupted again I would like to leave and I will send a letter detailing what you were going to say. If it does leave obviously.

Obviously vary on however you feel is appropriate to your family.

Again I fear being called an idealist but you know to me thats reasonable last ditch effort that you can then walk away from them without feeling like you could have done more. At least that will settle any doubts you may have.

I will stop here as I am not the best at writing and have been in and out of paragraphs trying to get my thoughts across.

Just my two cents...

In 758 words....

21-02-2017 10:04PM

That sounds lovely above except you're not dealing with reasonable people. And after the insults op has received its just telling them you can be treated this way.
The mother is obviously some kind of narcissist. There is no reasoning or communicating with them and while they might play nice for a while it'll soon be back to old tricks.
Cut them off, stop humouring them, leave it at that. If you can't do that at least stop giving them info! Everything is grand, no news, talk to you, bye

Fakediamond · 21-02-2017 10:04PM

Hi OP, I completely echo all of Emme's comments. Unless you've ever experienced it, it's hard to explain the chaos that ensues when dealing with a narcissistic parent.

It's easy to say cut all ties, but that means cutting ties with siblings too, as well as the other parent, which can be lonely and distressing. As Emme says, creating the distance takes time, counselling, support and bravery.

For you, I would agree that you should interact with her as little as possible and crucially, tell her nothing. Unfortunately, this applies to his Dad and siblings too, as she will cajole the information out of them, if you confide in them about your plans. And definitely don't criticise her to them, she'll find out and everything will just get worse. Years of mind control can leave family members totally brainwashed and unable to see the real culprit.

I also have experience of such a person, though not a parent thankfully, and know how hard it is to make sense out of the chaos. The narcissist can lie, charm, manipulate, threaten, all in the same day! It's head-wrecking and confusing and it took me years to figure out what was going on and how to distance and protect myself. Everyone in the family will deal with it differently, hence the lack of support from his sister, they're all just trying to survive as best they can. Also, from my own research and observations, there can be a genetic component so his sister may have the same traits (sadly).

Keep learning about the condition and you'll be better able to withstand and understand what's really going on. Good luck to both of you.

The Raptor · 22-02-2017 12:41AM

Reading the start of the thread, I knew it wouldn't end well.

It's a typical dysfunctional family. There is nothing you can do or say to these types of people. The issues were there long before you came along, it has nothing to with you. Your boyfriend is the scapegoat of the family, the sister sounds like the golden child who learned that she can put him down. There is absolutely nothing that can be done with these. They have to want to change their behaviour but they don't see anything wrong with their behaviour and they never will. You already found out that apologising means nothing to these people, they will keep it up. It's too late for the sister, she can do no wrong, her temperament has been set.

It's your boyfriend that needs help to move on from his family. He needs to get counselling and consider cutting them out because they don't offer anything good to him, just constant put downs.

LegacyUser · 22-02-2017 01:28AM

My feeling is that his mother would always want things her way and would not like the neighbours talking about her. Sit down with your boyfriend and tell him he needs to get this €10,000 back from his parents - it is his money not therse and they are controling him.
Figure out among her friends/family would tell the world that your boyfriend parents made them give up his savings to them. If his mother and father won't give this money back I would say to his mother I must tell x about this.
If they still refuse to give back this money I would get legal advice.

My feeling is that his mother won't want her friends/family or local gossips finding this out.
One of my friends has a mother who is a bit obessed with what other people think of her so at times my friend has used this in her favour this by saying - I must tell x what you said/did.

I watched a friend of mine trying to deal with her husbands toxic mother (Mary) who would be very like your boyfriends mother. She spent years trying to be nice to Mary.

One day my friend heard Mary saying a few nasty things about her and her family. She told her husband what she heard. He realised that it was time to speek up for himself, his wife and their children.
He went to Mary house and her told her to get lost. She was told not to contact him or his wife and that she was no longer welcome in their home.

Today Mary is now in her early 70's. She has no realtionship with any of her children or grandchildren. She has no friends left either. Her relatives cross the street to aviod her. Even her neighbours won't talk to her due to what she said and did various people over the past few years.

My advice to you is to stay away from your boyfriends mother. If possible try and move away from the area you live in at the moment. Encourage your boyfriend to go to counselling as he needs this to move on with his own life.
My feeling is that in time he will realise just what she is like. He may tell her to get lost in the future.

I know that you did not get a chance to go to college at 18 but you have applied now. At least you and him are willing to work hard and put in the work to improve things long term for you both. From what you told us your parents did not get a chance to go to college but they both worked hard.

Ask your boyfriend for his mother maden name and where she came from. If you know an older person from the same area just ask about her. I feel you will find out something in her past that she would not want people to know about ie she was poor growing up, she came from a rough area ect.

The next time she make a nasty comment you could let her know what you found out. You could always ask her where did she go to college - she could have left school at 14/15 with just the intercert (the old junior cert).

pointelle · 22-02-2017 04:22AM

wow, poor you, I know all about being treated by people in a way that simply beggars belief. It sounds as though the mum could have some problems she should really try to face. You seem grounded and strong, I hope you can all find some peace, he must be a great fella altogether!

Bambi985 · 22-02-2017 04:29AM

good god. is she actually a real human being? She sounds like something out of a children's book, the cartoonishly evil old witch. what an absolute dose.

i'd have to echo others when they ask why are you humouring her? and by humouring i mean even engaging or communicating with her at all. that in itself is giving her enough oxygen to continue in her mental ways. quit it, right now. no more house visits, no more trying to reason with her down the phone, no more being controlled by her by fearing what she'll do if you don't engage.

just. stop. engaging. anyone with a brain cell in their head can see she's mad as a box of badgers. let her tell her lies and ostracise you and try to poison your bf against you. he's well used to her by now. tell him he can do as he pleases but that your relationship with her is over because you're not going to take any more abuse or bullying. she might be his mother, but you didn't sign up for that and have your own mental health to protect.

that's what she is. a big fat self-obsessed sad old bully.

D0NNELLY · 22-02-2017 04:40AM

Change your numbers.

valoren · 22-02-2017 10:24AM

What seems to be happening here is that she has taken on a vendetta against you. She needs to get rid of you. She perceives you as a threat to her control on her son and her family. He is as others have said, a punching bag for them. A doormat for their abuse. Possessively, she sees him as hers. She is in effect bullying you out of the picture here. But don't for one second think of yourself as a victim. Or weak enough to be bullied. A bully will focus their ire on those they perceive as strong. In your case, you are confident, social and enjoy civil relationships with your family. He too sounds like an honest, hardworking guy, trying his best to placate his dangerous family. You have the power to enlighten him. And she must destroy that power you have.

You're not weak. You are a target. She will do whatever she has to do, say whatever she has to say to manipulate a split between you and your boyfriend. You threaten her control on him. She can plainly see you have the total capacity to enlighten him about her and her abusive behavior. He in all probability knows no better. He might think her treatment of him is not abnormal. That it's just typical family 'drama'. You come from a different family dynamic. A loving, supportive, sane one. He's never experienced that. And the more time he spends with you, and the less time he devotes to them, then the quicker he will become enlightened. It won't be anything you are doing yourself to turn him against his family. It will simply be him realizing for himself, where he is in an environment where he is treated with respect exactly how toxic his own family is.

My point here is that you must go. She will continue to abuse and bully you both until he is manipulated into breaking up with you or that you walk away in despair. It really is that black and white when dealing with malignant narcissists. There is never a middle ground to be reasonable with people with such personality disorders. He should not look to his immediate family for support. The know too well themselves that if they don't participate and champion her vendetta then their lives will be made miserable as she bullies them in retaliation, for having the audacity to undermine her power and control. He's on the right path here with you. He needs to follow through. It will be tough going, they will make you doubt yourself and harass and intimidate you both, but trust me, it will be worth it in the end when he comes to realize the true extent of this and is free to enjoy his future with you. You'll both become stronger for it.

In laws making my life hell, what options are left?

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