6 Nations 2017 General Discussion Thread

irishbucsfan · 30-01-2017 01:47PM

stephen_n wrote: »

Rugby
In the short time the devices have been used at the club, most of the recorded impacts have been around 10 to 20 G’s, with some up to 40 G’s. The average impact is 22 G’s.

NFL
The average G-force, 25.8, is roughly equivalent to what we would see if the offensive lineman crashed his car into a wall going about 30 m.p.h.

Once again this is only one factor affecting recovery time and not the whole picture of how physically demanding either game is.

I don't understand what this is supposed to show, that the average impact in the NFL is more severe? (In work so didn't read the sources)

stephen_n · 30-01-2017 01:52PM

irishbucsfan wrote: »

I don't understand what this is supposed to show, that the average impact in the NFL is more severe? (In work so didn't read the sources)

The average impact is about 3 G's more than rugby, what bit are you not getting?

irishbucsfan · 30-01-2017 01:59PM

stephen_n wrote: »

The average impact is about 3 G's more than rugby, what bit are you not getting?

No, I get that, but I don't see anything about mitigation or more importantly (to bring it back to the 6 Nations) about intensity throughout the game.

As I said, I think the NFL is not a good example to follow for exactly the opposite reason, injuries play such a huge role in the makeup of teams in that league and I think they could really do with an extra bye week, while the 6 Nations could survive losing one.

Bazzo · 30-01-2017 02:31PM

stephen_n wrote: »

Can't find the video at the moment, it's one of those myth buster type shows. They measured the force of the hits and though the NFL hits are harder, it was mitigated by the protective gear. Also NZ have run a test using a mouth guard to record the impacts through out the game, the NFL used the same mouth guards for their tests but I can't find a comparison with the results, though I'm sure it must exist.

But that's just the hits, apart from the running backs and those that defend outfield, there is a much lower level of intensity than a game of rugby. So the collision damage may be higher but the overall level of exertion isn't.

I think I've seen that video. If memory serves they also had a professional player come in from the NFL to make the hit on a dummy while the rugby tackle was measured using two amateurs from a local Californian team.

stephen_n · 30-01-2017 03:16PM

Bazzo wrote: »

I think I've seen that video. If memory serves they also had a professional player come in from the NFL to make the hit on a dummy while the rugby tackle was measured using two amateurs from a local Californian team.

That's the one alright, which obviously didn't give exact data, but still came to the conclusion that though the hits were harder, the padding mitigated the damage.

Once again though, rugby isn't just physically demanding because of the hits and the recooperation time reflects that.

ScrubsfanChris · 30-01-2017 03:31PM

This thread

jacothelad · 30-01-2017 04:06PM

Former Former wrote: »

Not sure pickarooney, anything I know about the NFL I've learned from Sandra Bullock movies so I'm struggling a bit.

I'll watch it again tonight and come back to you. Purely for research purposes, of course.

Who's the tiny blond with Sandra?:D

pickarooney · 30-01-2017 04:19PM

Zzippy wrote: »

Come off it. They are starting about 2 feet apart, and its mostly pushing, not like massive hits with a lot of speed behind them. Yeah they're huge guys but all that power goes into trying to muscle each other out of the way or stop being muscled out of the way.

Sounds a lot like sumo

irishbucsfan · 30-01-2017 04:23PM

pickarooney wrote: »

Sounds a lot like sumo

Zzippy doesn't really know what's going on I'd suggest. Yes they are colliding from a smaller distance but they are specifically engineering their bodies for explosiveness over that distance. And it happens on every down, not like rugby where contact is illegal off the ball. I know I for one wouldn't want someone capable of this sort of explosiveness who weighs 130kg hitting me 50 times a game.

stephen_n · 30-01-2017 04:24PM

irishbucsfan wrote: »

No, I get that, but I don't see anything about mitigation or more importantly (to bring it back to the 6 Nations) about intensity throughout the game.

As I said, I think the NFL is not a good example to follow for exactly the opposite reason, injuries play such a huge role in the makeup of teams in that league and I think they could really do with an extra bye week, while the 6 Nations could survive losing one.

The mitigation comes from the video I was referring to. Also the assumption the padding must give some protection.

pickarooney · 30-01-2017 04:27PM

Whoah, I don't know that I've seen anyone carry 130kg and look relatively slim before.

Is there a decent video explaining all the positions with clips of them in action?

irishbucsfan · 30-01-2017 04:52PM

pickarooney wrote: »

Whoah, I don't know that I've seen anyone carry 130kg and look relatively slim before.

Is there a decent video explaining all the positions with clips of them in action?

Yes, certainly, but if we continue talking about it Swiwi will hurt us.

Buer · 30-01-2017 04:56PM

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Yes, certainly, but if we continue talking about it Swiwi will hurt us.

What G-Force does he hit at?

Former Former · 30-01-2017 05:03PM

Stephen's stat of an average force of 25.8 G is interesting, because that's an average of 62 hits.

Now, if you're getting hit with that amount of force and not getting steamrollered, it's because you're generating the same amount of force in return. 62 times in one game.

Consider the amount of energy you would need to expend to generate that amount of force. Imagine how physically demanding that must be, to move 140 kg with that momentum, over and over.

I have no idea which side of the argument that puts me on, but it's fascinating.

irishbucsfan · 30-01-2017 05:11PM

Former Former wrote: »

Stephen's stat of an average force of 25.8 G is interesting, because that's an average of 62 hits.

Now, if you're getting hit with that amount of force and not getting steamrollered, it's because you're generating the same amount of force in return. 62 times in one game.

Consider the amount of energy you would need to expend to generate that amount of force. Imagine how physically demanding that must be, to move 140 kg with that momentum, over and over.

I have no idea which side of the argument that puts me on, but it's fascinating.

To bring it back to the discussion though, it's completely insane that they're doing it every week (except their one week off). The greatest team in the history of sports has an offensive lineman called Ali Marpet who did 1200 snaps this season.

They get very long offseasons however which makes it feasible whereas rugby players do not. However I do agree that the 6 Nations could probably survive dropping down to 1 week off in the middle.

There is another compositional element to the breaks which is that it elongates the tournament which increases the chances of players returning before the tournament is over, so maybe an off the wall suggestion could be to have a multi-week break in the middle (IE have 3 weeks off but put them all together and allow players to return to clubs during that period).

EG it'd be like:

4th February: Scotland v Ireland
11th February: Italy v Ireland
18th February: Ireland v France
25th Febuary: Club Rugby
4th March: Club Rugby
11th March: Club Rugby
18th March: Wales v Ireland
25th March: Ireland v England

razorblunt · 30-01-2017 05:38PM

Decent interview (if not short) with Jim Telfer by Tom English here. A great man to call a spade, a spade.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/38777496

30-01-2017 11:59PM

Final day of 2015 Six Nations which is also the last time we won it. Maybe the best day of Rugby I've ever watched. From the dismay after the Wales game and the realisation that we had no hope of making up the difference, to then go and do the unthinkable against Scotland and edge in front only to have France go out of their way to be incredibly French about the final game. It was absolutely amazing.

razorblunt · 31-01-2017 08:10AM

Deleted User wrote: »

Final day of 2015 Six Nations which is also the last time we won it. Maybe the best day of Rugby I've ever watched. From the dismay after the Wales game and the realisation that we had no hope of making up the difference, to then go and do the unthinkable against Scotland and edge in front only to have France go out of their way to be incredibly French about the final game. It was absolutely amazing.

I still get cold sweats over the French, the magnificent bastárds. Huget running the ball from his own 22 on a penalty nearly gave the country an árse collapse.

thomond2006 · 31-01-2017 08:14AM

Never forget.

b.gud · 31-01-2017 09:04AM

razorblunt wrote: »

I still get cold sweats over the French, the magnificent bastárds. Huget running the ball from his own 22 on a penalty nearly gave the country an árse collapse.

NSFW language

https://www.instagram.com/p/BPe-FHrByTN/

Losty Dublin · 31-01-2017 11:35PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Final day of 2015 Six Nations which is also the last time we won it. Maybe the best day of Rugby I've ever watched. From the dismay after the Wales game and the realisation that we had no hope of making up the difference, to then go and do the unthinkable against Scotland and edge in front only to have France go out of their way to be incredibly French about the final game. It was absolutely amazing.

I would have gladly bought a DVD of all three games, and paid jolly stupid money for it as well.

Bridge93 · 31-01-2017 11:49PM

I don't know if it was mentioned elsewhere but Faletau and Charteris are out of Wales' first game

01-02-2017 01:07PM

Six Nations 2014 Highlights. Another good year with some great games. Mike Brown stands out certainly from this reel and he really was excellent. I can't post something complementary about Mike Brown with the chip on my shoulder I have about him so his World Cup Interview is posted directly below:

Bazzo · 01-02-2017 01:16PM

Kruis has picked up an injury for England. Rumour is Eddie Jones has been sneaking in to the Connacht training sessions disguised as a WAG and stealing drills and ideas. Bundee happened to be coming out of the gym and caught him the other week and laid in to him, which is where he picked up his "falling in the bathroom" injuries.

thomond2006 · 01-02-2017 01:28PM

Questa la formazione dell’Italia:

15 Edoardo PADOVANI (Zebre Rugby, 6 caps)*
14 Giulio BISEGNI (Zebre Rugby, 5 caps)
13 Tommaso BENVENUTI (Benetton Treviso, 37 caps)*
12 Luke MCLEAN (Benetton Treviso, 84 caps)
11 Giovanbattista VENDITTI (Zebre Rugby, 38 caps)*
10 Carlo CANNA (Zebre Rugby, 15 caps)
9 Edoardo GORI (Benetton Treviso, 56 caps)*

8 Sergio PARISSE (Stade Francais, 121 caps) – capitano
7 Maxime Mata MBANDA’ (Zebre Rugby, 3 caps)*
6 Abraham STEYN (Benetton Treviso, 6 caps)
5 George BIAGI (Zebre Rugby, 14 caps)
4 Marco FUSER (Benetton Treviso, 16 caps)*
3 Lorenzo CITTADINI (Aviron Bayonnais, 53 caps)
2 Ornel GEGA (Benetton Treviso, 8 caps)
1 Andrea LOVOTTI (Zebre Rugby, 9 caps)*

a disposizione
16 Leonardo GHIRALDINI (Stade Toulousain, 82 caps)
17 Sami PANICO (Patarò Calvisano, 6 caps)*
18 Pietro CECCARELLI (Zebre Rugby, 5 caps)
19 Joshua FURNO (Zebre Rugby, 36 caps)*
20 Francesco MINTO (Benetton Treviso, 31 caps)
21 Giorgio BRONZINI (Benetton Treviso, 3 caps)
22 Tommaso ALLAN (Benetton Treviso, 27 caps)
23 Michele CAMPAGNARO (Exeter Chiefs, 25 caps)*

13 of the starting XV are Treviso or Zebre. Best of luck COS...

wp_rathead · 01-02-2017 01:31PM

Campanaro not starting for Italy is a surprise

Buer · 01-02-2017 01:49PM

wp_rathead wrote: »

Campanaro not starting for Italy is a surprise

He's generally been in and out of the team since he came through due to both injuries and patchy form. Gets very little game time with Exeter too.

zambrotta11 · 01-02-2017 01:52PM

When will the Irish team be announced?

CatFromHue · 01-02-2017 02:02PM

Luke McClean at 12? I thought he was a winger

Yeah_Right · 01-02-2017 02:02PM

Buer wrote: »

He's generally been in and out of the team since he came through due to both injuries and patchy form. Gets very little game time with Exeter too.

I admit that I haven't seen a lot of him because I'm not a frequent watcher of Treviso, Exeter or even Italy but any time I've seen him, I've been impressed. Obviously there's issues with his game (or attitude) but if he could sort them out he could be top class. Potentially the best Italian centre since Cristian Stoica.

6 Nations 2017 General Discussion Thread

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