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Child refugees -majority to be males aged 17???

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Comments

  • #542
    gitzy16v
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,093 ✭✭✭gitzy16v


    alastair wrote: »
    They don't have any requirement to make their claim in a first safe country they travel through. They entered all the other countries illegally too - why the fixation with entering the UK illegally?

    I dont know,you would have to ask the young men who set up an illegal settlement right next to the port of Calais.


  • #543
    alastair
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,309 ✭✭✭✭alastair


    Mary63 wrote: »
    What are you getting at Alastair.Anyone in France is no longer fleeing from a war zone so they are not refugees.They are people in a safe country so thats where they should stay while the host country decides what to do with them.The host country grants them asylum or they deport them, why have you a problem understanding this.

    It's not me with the difficulty understanding. The asylum seekers are entitled to make their asylum application wherever they want - that state can refer them to a different state if they have evidence that they could have made a safe application there, but there's a straightforward problem with applications in France - they're demonstrably not providing a safe and secure environment for asylum applications - they haven't been able to provide basic shelter for thousands of migrants. Every 'legitimate' refugee in this state has had to transit safe states in order to get here - and yet that's not proven to be a legal impediment to attaining asylum status. The minors in question are not being deported by France - the French are liaising with the Irish government on a mutually agreed basis.


  • #544
    alastair
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,309 ✭✭✭✭alastair


    gitzy16v wrote: »
    I dont know,you would have to ask the young men who set up an illegal settlement right next to the port of Calais.

    I'm not asking about their intent - it's clear they want to enter the UK. I'm asking why you are fixated on the illegality of their entering the UK rather than any other state they've already entered illegally? The illegal/irregular entry into any state for the purposes of seeking asylum, is of course, a penalty-free act under international law.


  • #545
    Widdershins
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,633 ✭✭✭✭Widdershins


    If the rape statistics someone claimed are actually Conviction statistics then they need to realise that's not representative. For numerous reasons many rapists aren't convicted..or even caught.


  • #546
    gitzy16v
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,093 ✭✭✭gitzy16v


    alastair wrote: »
    I'm not asking about their intent - it's clear they want to enter the UK. I'm asking why you are fixated on the illegality of their entering the UK rather than any other state they've already entered illegally? The illegal/irregular entry into any state for the purposes of seeking asylum, is of course, a penalty-free act under international law.

    Honest answer....because the hooligans are ripping the curtains on my truck,smashing my mirrors and generally making my job more difficult with they way they carry on in Calais.
    If they are so needy,vulnerable and looking for help,why are they doing everything to evade the authorities,why are they not doing things the way its supposed to be done.
    Whats all the sneaking around for?
    And why after the jungle was razed are they starting to arrive back?


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  • #547
    Mary63
    Closed Accounts Posts: 801 ✭✭✭Mary63


    If that was the case the UK authorities would have had to keep the ones that slipped in.The UK has been firing them back across to France for the last number of years.Isnt part of the Dublin convention the rule that they first country they land in has to take them.Why are the poor Greeks and italian having to take what the Irish navy is bringing to them on a daily basis.What the hell are our Irish navy doing in this drop off nonsense anyway,if they have nothing better to be doing we should be asking ourselves what we have a navy for.

    I can't understand either actually why France put up with the economic migrants for so long.Why didn't they let them make their way to Dover and then its Britains problem to deal with the hordes.


  • #548
    alastair
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,309 ✭✭✭✭alastair


    gitzy16v wrote: »
    Honest answer....because the hooligans are ripping the curtains on my truck,smashing my mirrors and generally making my job more difficult with they way they carry on in Calais.

    Wouldn't the transfer of the Calais migrants make your life less difficult? Leaving them all in limbo in Calais certainly isn't going to help you, is it?


  • #549
    alastair
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,309 ✭✭✭✭alastair


    Mary63 wrote: »
    If that was the case the UK authorities would have had to keep the ones that slipped in.

    Nope - you're still not getting it. An asylum claim is no guarantee of a successful outcome.


  • #550
    gitzy16v
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,093 ✭✭✭gitzy16v


    alastair wrote: »
    Wouldn't the transfer of the Calais migrants make your life less difficult? Leaving them all in limbo in Calais certainly isn't going to help you, is it?

    I edited my post to include the fact that they are all arriving back after it has been cleared.


  • #551
    alastair
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,309 ✭✭✭✭alastair


    gitzy16v wrote: »
    I edited my post to include the fact that they are all arriving back after it has been cleared.

    You're expecting the 20 / 200 coming here to make their way back to Calais?


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  • #552
    gitzy16v
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,093 ✭✭✭gitzy16v


    alastair wrote: »
    You're expecting the 20 / 200 coming here to make their way back to Calais?

    No.
    The ones relocated in reception centres in France are making they're way back to Calais.


  • #553
    Widdershins
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,633 ✭✭✭✭Widdershins


    alastair wrote: »
    They don't have any requirement to make their claim in a first safe country they travel through. They entered all the other countries illegally too - why the fixation with entering the UK illegally?

    I'm not sure if you can see this reply, Alastair, but I think you're wrong there.
    An Iraqi boy who is deaf, is being deported from Britain, because amongst other things, his family failed to seek asylum in previous, safe countries. His family say they originally left Iraq after Isis threats to the disabled.

    http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-derbyshire-38308753


  • #554
    alastair
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,309 ✭✭✭✭alastair


    gitzy16v wrote: »
    No.
    The ones relocated in reception centres in France are making they're way back to Calais.

    All the more reason for you to welcome the transfer of 200 to Ireland then?


  • #555
    Mary63
    Closed Accounts Posts: 801 ✭✭✭Mary63


    I know an asylum claim is no guarantee of a successful outcome and thanks be to god for that even though it seems to take nine years for people to be eventually deported when their claim here fails.This is ridiculous, claims should be dealt with finally within a year with no appeal and those unsuccessful put on a plane back to wherever they came from.Steps should be taken to make are they are registered so the next time they try to get in they are put straight back onto a plane.


  • #556
    alastair
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,309 ✭✭✭✭alastair


    Mary63 wrote: »
    I know an asylum claim is no guarantee of a successful outcome and thanks be to god for that even though it seems to take nine years for people to be eventually deported when their claim here fails.This is ridiculous, claims should be dealt with finally within a year with no appeal and those unsuccessful put on a plane back to wherever they came from.Steps should be taken to make are they are registered so the next time they try to get in they are put straight back onto a plane.

    There's no 'should' about it. All asylum applicants are registered here. Nobody is able to make repeated applications - and that applies across the EU - fingerprints are shared by all EU immigration bodies. That it's taken up to 9 years to process claims and appeals is not the fault of anyone but the system here. Migrant advocacy bodies and asylum seekers themselves have long lobbied to speed up the process.


  • #557
    gitzy16v
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,093 ✭✭✭gitzy16v


    Widdershins wrote: »
    I'm not sure if you can see this reply, Alastair, but I think you're wrong there.
    An Iraqi boy who is deaf, is being deported from Britain, because amongst other things, his family failed to seek asylum in previous, safe countries. His family say they originally left Iraq after Isis threats to the disabled.

    http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-derbyshire-38308753

    He can see it now:)


  • #558
    gitzy16v
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,093 ✭✭✭gitzy16v


    alastair wrote: »
    All the more reason for you to welcome the transfer of 200 to Ireland then?

    More will arrive,and no I dont want any of them from Calais my experience with them has not been good.
    Ive no problem giving the refugees in camps like Jordan a chance,they deserve it much more than a bunch of thugs intent on getting what they want by any means possible.


  • #559
    alastair
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,309 ✭✭✭✭alastair


    gitzy16v wrote: »
    More will arrive,and no I dont want any of them from Calais my experience with them has not been good.
    Ive no problem giving the refugees in camps like Jordan a chance,they deserve it much more than a bunch of thugs intent on getting what they want by any means possible.

    Understandable that you'd be at your wits end. Well, 200 are coming here regardless of your personal view. I hope that there's a better resolution to Calais, for the sake of the migrants, as much as the hassle it's causing for truckers.


  • #560
    gitzy16v
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,093 ✭✭✭gitzy16v


    alastair wrote: »
    Understandable that you'd be at your wits end. Well, 200 are coming here regardless of your personal view. I hope that there's a better resolution to Calais, for the sake of the migrants, as much as the hassle it's causing for truckers.

    I just hope they behave better than when they were camped out in Calais.


  • #561
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 19,178 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Mary63 wrote: »
    If that was the case the UK authorities would have had to keep the ones that slipped in.The UK has been firing them back across to France for the last number of years.Isnt part of the Dublin convention the rule that they first country they land in has to take them.Why are the poor Greeks and italian having to take what the Irish navy is bringing to them on a daily basis.What the hell are our Irish navy doing in this drop off nonsense anyway,if they have nothing better to be doing we should be asking ourselves what we have a navy for.

    Well thankfully the Irish navy has more compassion than you, they are saving people's lives.
    And we do take refugees from those camps in Greece and Italy.


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  • #562
    Mary63
    Closed Accounts Posts: 801 ✭✭✭Mary63


    Cant see any of the Middle Eastern countries coming to rescue me should I need them.

    What in the name of God is our Irish navy doing,seriously what would they be doing if they weren't fishing for migrants.Obviously nothing so maybe we should get rid of the navy.

    The poor Greeks tourism industry is ruined.I wouldn't go to Greece on holidays, I have no wish to see immigrants swimming for the shores while I'm trying to relax.


  • #563
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 19,178 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Nothing like humans fleeing from war, trying to save themselves and their families to put one off a holiday destination!


  • #564
    Timberrrrrrrr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,872 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    Mary63 wrote: »
    Cant see any of the Middle Eastern countries coming to rescue me should I need them.

    What in the name of God is our Irish navy doing,seriously what would they be doing if they weren't fishing for migrants.Obviously nothing so maybe we should get rid of the navy.

    The poor Greeks tourism industry is ruined.I wouldn't go to Greece on holidays, I have no wish to see immigrants swimming for the shores while I'm trying to relax.

    I dunno how you manage to pluck up the courage to leave the house Mary what with the half billion Muslim men lining up ready to rape any woman they see alone, you're a shining beacon to us all :rolleyes:


  • #565
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 22,819 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    Mary63 wrote: »
    Cant see any of the Middle Eastern countries coming to rescue me should I need them.

    What in the name of God is our Irish navy doing,seriously what would they be doing if they weren't fishing for migrants.Obviously nothing so maybe we should get rid of the navy.

    The poor Greeks tourism industry is ruined.I wouldn't go to Greece on holidays, I have no wish to see immigrants swimming for the shores while I'm trying to relax.

    They have som neck alright Mary. Imagine ruining your holiday while trying to flee a civil war, ha? Pure cheek.

    As for the Navy! Shower of wasters, they do nothing except save people's lives. Useless. They should be at home protecting you from Muslim rapists.

    they/them/theirs


    The more you can increase fear of drugs and crime, welfare mothers, immigrants and aliens, the more you control all of the people.

    Noam Chomsky



  • #566
    dissed doc
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,489 ✭✭✭dissed doc


    bubblypop wrote: »
    Nothing like humans fleeing from war, trying to save themselves and their families to put one off a holiday destination!

    Calais might have turned into a rough illegal settlement for the wandering hordes of stateless migrants, but I wouldn't call it a warzone (yet) - even with the rapes, violence, etc., . That is just the society that formed among the migrants in Calais.


  • #567
    Widdershins
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,633 ✭✭✭✭Widdershins


    Brian? wrote: »
    They have som neck alright Mary. Imagine ruining your holiday while trying to flee a civil war, ha? Pure cheek.

    As for the Navy! Shower of wasters, they do nothing except save people's lives. Useless. They should be at home protecting you from Muslim rapists.

    While that comment you quoted did come out sounding awful I think it's fair to say tourism must be badly affected in Greece, and a small country in turmoil with refugee camps is no longer a holiday destination for anybody. I'd give the poster the benefit of the doubt.


  • #568
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 19,178 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    dissed doc wrote: »
    Calais might have turned into a rough illegal settlement for the wandering hordes of stateless migrants, but I wouldn't call it a warzone (yet) - even with the rapes, violence, etc., . That is just the society that formed among the migrants in Calais.

    I was replying to Mary and her comments on refugees swimming up onto the beach in Greece.
    Dunno where Calais comes into that!


  • #569
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 22,819 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    Widdershins wrote: »
    While that comment you quoted did come out sounding awful I think it's fair to say tourism must be badly affected in Greece, and a small country in turmoil with refugee camps is no longer a holiday destination for anybody. I'd give the poster the benefit of the doubt.

    After some of the vitriolic posts she has produced, I wouldn't give her any benefit of the doubt.

    they/them/theirs


    The more you can increase fear of drugs and crime, welfare mothers, immigrants and aliens, the more you control all of the people.

    Noam Chomsky



  • #570
    Widdershins
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,633 ✭✭✭✭Widdershins


    Brian? wrote: »
    After some of the vitriolic posts she has produced, I wouldn't give her any benefit of the doubt.

    That was the only really bad one I've noticed tbh. She's right about cultural treatment of women, being blunt or rude if you perceive it that way doesn't make her wrong. Sorry for butting in, just wanted to say that.


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  • #571
    Mary63
    Closed Accounts Posts: 801 ✭✭✭Mary63


    Im not too happy about the vitriolic comments about rape, its ok for men to make jokes about rape, women never do.Im not complaining though, its the internet.

    Why shouldn't I say I wouldn't go on holidays anywhere the Irish navy is landing economic migrants who nobody has any records for, we don't know how many are dangerous sexual deviants but based on the numbers that congregated in Cologne we can guess a fair few.I have heard that the women taken on board the Irish navy vessel have to be separated immediately for their own safety.I don't know is this true because any footage of these economic migrants seem to show all men and most seem to be the same age.

    http://www.irishtimes.com/news/world/europe/cologne-police-accused-of-heavy-handed-new-year-s-eve-security-1.2923563

    A repeat of what happened in Cologne was prevented by the German police which is a mercy.

    Its all very well for us to say aren't the Irish navy doing a good job, they aren't landing these people in Dunlaoghaire, if they were the navy ship would be back tied up in Ireland.This whole exercise is just ridiculous, does it go on indefinitely and the longer it does the more non paying passengers it is going to pick up.Are the Germans paying the bill for this, Angela Merkel should be because she was the one who effectively told the whole of North Africa she would take them in if they came to Europe and its to Germany these people want to get to.

    I feel so sorry for the Greeks whose economy is in tatters and I didn't see Angela Merkel rushing to help the Greeks out.She said we have a duty to illegal migrants, what about her duty to help Greece, a fellow EU member out.Now Greece is going to be overrun by these migrants and Greece hasn't the resources to cope with them, it will have even less now that its tourism market has been destroyed.Turkeys tourism market is destroyed too now that the lunatics have taken over the asylum, thank god Turkey wasn't admitted into the EU.


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