Vegetarian - Yes or No?

JupiterKid · 05-01-2017 08:27AM #1

I was watching a cookery programme last night and I was thinking that no matter now many delicious vegetarian dishes you can make, meat is just too damn tasty.

I know that many people are vegetarian for "ethical" reasons but some just don't like meat, period. My sister is a "pescatarian" - she eats veg and fish but no other type of meat. She will happily cook meat for me when I visit and for her OH and children.

Do you think some vegetarians are very preachy about meat eating? I find these people odious and often hypocritical. Vegans? Are they going too far? No dairy, no eggs, no honey even?

Is it OK to raise your children as vegetarians or are you depriving them of vital nutrients? We humans are omnivores by nature, not vegetarians.

I say live and let live but could you go totally veggie?

Advbrd · 05-01-2017 08:30AM

You just need one word to put this debate to bed: bacon.

KERSPLAT! · 05-01-2017 08:33AM

This should be good

Surreptitious · 05-01-2017 08:34AM

No.
(Eats rare steak, blood rolls down chin)

tomwaterford · 05-01-2017 08:35AM

Advbrd wrote: »

You just need one word to put this debate to bed: bacon.

Lumps of heavily salted fat??

Not a vegiatarian....but do be concious of eating too much meat....

Prefer things in moderation

CianRyan · 05-01-2017 08:38AM

I find it's not the vegans who are preachy but the meat eaters when they discover that someone is vegan.

You'll never deprive a child of vital nutrients as long as you feed them a well balanced diet, there is no nutrient we humans need that can not be sourced from plant matter.

And as for the veg/vegan thing, I see vegetarianism as a half measure. If you're still consuming dairy and eggs, you're still contributing to industrial cruelty.
The term vegan is a bit annoying though, I prefer to live by my own standards of being cruelty free.

For example, a vegan with pet chickens or ducks could not eat the birds unfirtilised eggs because it's not in the "code of ethics", how ever, as long as the eggs were laid naturally and there were no male birds to make babies, I see nothing wrong with eating the eggs.

The_Valeyard · 05-01-2017 08:43AM

CianRyan wrote: »

I find it's not the vegans who are preachy but the meat eaters when they discover that someone is vegan.

You'll never deprive a child of vital nutrients as long as you feed them a well balanced diet, there is no nutrient we humans need that can not be sourced from plant matter.

And as for the veg/vegan thing, I see vegetarianism as a half measure. If you're still consuming dairy and eggs, you're still contributing to industrial cruelty.
The term vegan is a bit annoying though, I prefer to live by my own standards of being cruelty free.

For example, a vegan with pet chickens or ducks could not eat the birds unfirtilised eggs because it's not in the "code of ethics", how ever, as long as the eggs were laid naturally and there were no male birds to make babies, I see nothing wrong with eating the eggs.

And meat eaters are preachy?

CianRyan · 05-01-2017 08:46AM

The_Valeyard wrote: »

And meat eaters are preachy?

It's a thread about vegetarians and someone's not allowed speak about not eating animal products?

Yes, you're annoying as ****.

OldMrBrennan83 · 05-01-2017 08:46AM

This post has been deleted.

The_Valeyard · 05-01-2017 08:50AM

CianRyan wrote: »

It's a thread about vegetarians and someone's not allowed speak about not eating animal products?

Yes, you're annoying as ****.

And so it came to pass,
In the book of Veganism,
Go forth with smugness and claim everyone else is annoying as **** while only you may speak the truth.

Barry Badrinath · 05-01-2017 08:52AM

Someone pass me the popcorn chicken.

This is going to be good.

tomwaterford · 05-01-2017 08:52AM

Loveinapril wrote: »

What if you live near a dairy farm and know that the cows are being treated well so can source dairy that way? Or is it just that they are in a farm at all that is 'cruel'?

Its more or less illegal to sell milk unpasturised in ireland

But that being said...the average irish dairy cow is amongest the best treates farm animal in tge world

Effects · 05-01-2017 08:54AM

Loveinapril wrote: »

What if you live near a dairy farm and know that the cows are being treated well so can source dairy that way? Or is it just that they are in a farm at all that is 'cruel'?

These days a lot of people realise the issues surrounding removing calfs from cows in order to take their milk. They choose not to partake in an animals suffering. The animal reacts in a similar way to taking a new born child away from a human mother.

fg1406 · 05-01-2017 08:54AM

Tried vegetarianism for about 3 months and ended up sick from it. Missed meat too much so used tofu/soy/quorn substitutes which gave me severe cramps, so back to the meat I went.

Shenshen · 05-01-2017 08:57AM

I've been vegetarian for just under 10 years now, my husband has been for some 30 years.

The only preaching I ever come across is online, and then it does tend to be omnivores preaching to vegetarians and vegans for the most part. There are some exceptions, but not all that many.

As for the "meat is tasty" - I think what you eat influences your taste. I grew up in a household where meat was served 3 meals a day, 7 days a week. It took a while to learn enough recipes to be able to cook a nice variety of food, but these days that's not an issue any more. I even cook lunches for a number of colleagues once a month (proceeds go to charity), and have had very good feedback on taste and variety.

I did, however, fall off the wagon at some point around 3 years ago and had a meat dish. I ended up leaving half the meat and just eating everything else, I just didn't find it nice at all any more. I also have a bunch of cousins and a number of acquaintances who grew up without meat and find it simply revolting in texture and taste.

Effects · 05-01-2017 08:57AM

fg1406 wrote: »

Tried vegetarianism for about 3 months and ended up sick from it. Missed meat too much so used tofu/soy/quorn substitutes which gave me severe cramps, so back to the meat I went.

That's completely your own fault. I could decide to eat nothing but steak, and when I got sick from that, blame a meat based diet.

CianRyan · 05-01-2017 08:58AM

Loveinapril wrote: »

What if you live near a dairy farm and know that the cows are being treated well so can source dairy that way? Or is it just that they are in a farm at all that is 'cruel'?

Dairy cows, even those who have the luxury of open grasing, are constantly artificially inseminated because, like all other mammals, they only produce milk to feed their young.
Once their calfs are born, they are instantly taken away, females to go on as dairy cows and makes to be killed for their meat.
Disregarding the slaughtering of baby cows for a moment, just separating them like this is traumatic for both mother and child as cows are extremely social animals and have parental bonds similar to our own.

The dairy cow is then few hormones to keep her producing milk until the can be impregnated again, all the while suffering infections and growths of her udder from over production of milk.

And what happens when she can't produce milk anymore?
Well after about 5 years of hell, the cow is sent to slaughter.
That's 5 years into an expected 25 for a healthy animal.

So I wouldn't say even a local dairy farm is ethical.

Dravokivich · 05-01-2017 08:58AM

I don't see the point in this bit at all:

"Not Vegetarian but would be interested in becoming one"

I eat vegetables anyway. I'm not losing out by eating meat too. Nor would I expect to gain much of anything, by not eating meat.

Tom Mann Centuria · 05-01-2017 09:00AM

I follow an animal rights advocate, a doctor, on twitter and he posted a picture of a dog with paper hat on. Just placed on its head, and he looked like he wasn't bothered, he looked like he was waiting for a treat. Cue a vegan telling him he is disgusting "dressing up" his dog and that only vegans could really care about animal welfare. Not just one tweet, a bombardment.
So, so smug that she was righteous and he was just playing at it.

So not a fan of preachy vegans, or preachy meat eaters, same as I'm not a fan of preachy atheists or preachy Christians or the word preachy.

fg1406 · 05-01-2017 09:00AM

Effects wrote: »

That's completely your own fault. I could decide to eat nothing but steak, and when I got sick from that, blame a meat based diet.

It may be so but when I went back to my normal diet the cramping stopped and I'm fine. I am a fussy eater so I found I missed meat too much and the meat substitutes weren't worth it.

Shenshen · 05-01-2017 09:02AM

Dravokivich wrote: »

I don't see the point in this bit at all:

"Not Vegetarian but would be interested in becoming one"

I eat vegetables anyway. I'm not losing out by eating meat too. Nor would I expect to gain much of anything, by not eating meat.

I wouldn't be surprised if that one got most of the votes in the end. One of the standard reactions I get when people find out I'm vegetarian is "Oh, I want to become vegetarian, too... but I love meat too much/sometime in the future/I don't know what else to eat/etc"

So it does seem to be a frequent sentiment

Shenshen · 05-01-2017 09:03AM

I suspect this threat might turn into my first experience of preachy vegetarians/vegans actually outnumbering preachy omnivores.... should be interesting.

El_Duderino 09 · 05-01-2017 09:04AM

The_Valeyard wrote:

And meat eaters are preachy?

A meat eater started this thread and had a pop at vegans. So yes, some meat eaters are obviously preachy

Lovely Bloke · 05-01-2017 09:23AM

Not a vegetarian, but my mrs is.

She started off a happy Clappy "won't someone think of the animals" type of hippy, but that was 25 years ago, now she just doesn't eat meat because it makes her sick.

She sometimes might eat a tuna sandwich.

Doesn't stop her from cooking meat for me or our son.

JupiterKid · 05-01-2017 09:24AM

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

A meat eater started this thread and had a pop at vegans. So yes, some meat eaters are obviously preachy

I started the thread and please tell me how I had a "pop" at vegans? I opined that I couldn't understand veganism but I did opine "live and let live."

If someone is vegan, that is perfectly fine. I just can't ever see myself becoming one.

Shenshen · 05-01-2017 09:31AM

JupiterKid wrote: »

I started the thread and please tell me how I had a "pop" at vegans? I opined that I couldn't understand veganism but I did opine "live and let live."

If someone is vegan, that is perfectly fine. I just can't ever see myself becoming one.

I don't know... putting ethical in quotation marks to indicate irony, pointing out that vegetarianism is somehow against human nature (we're omnivores. If there's enough food, we can decide what to eat, by nature), asking if vegetarians might be depriving their children, calling vegetarians and vegans odious and hypocritical...

I've developed a thick skin to things like that, but I can see that people may well be offended.

andekwarhola · 05-01-2017 09:49AM

Wife has been (a non-militant) vegetarian for a long time and is pretty knowledgable about the nutrition side of it. I'm not a veggie; I enjoy eating decent meat, especially when eating out, but I'd definitely be happy enough eating vegetarian most of the time.

We have a meal balance for our young kids (meat, fish and veggie) over the week. They can make up their own mind about eating meat when they're older.

quickbeam · 05-01-2017 09:50AM

Not sure what to chose in the poll. I am about 98% vegetarian, but I do eat fish about once a week and I'm not strict about things like eating cheeses with only vegetable rennet in them.

andekwarhola · 05-01-2017 09:54AM

Shenshen wrote: »

As for the "meat is tasty" - I think what you eat influences your taste. I grew up in a household where meat was served 3 meals a day, 7 days a week. It took a while to learn enough recipes to be able to cook a nice variety of food, but these days that's not an issue any more. I even cook lunches for a number of colleagues once a month (proceeds go to charity), and have had very good feedback on taste and variety.

I did, however, fall off the wagon at some point around 3 years ago and had a meat dish. I ended up leaving half the meat and just eating everything else, I just didn't find it nice at all any more. I also have a bunch of cousins and a number of acquaintances who grew up without meat and find it simply revolting in texture and taste.

So liking the taste of meat is down to draconian social conditioning whereas liking the taste of kale smoothies and bean stew is simply manifest destiny?

El_Duderino 09 · 05-01-2017 09:56AM

JupiterKid wrote:

I started the thread and please tell me how I had a "pop" at vegans? I opined that I couldn't understand veganism but I did opine "live and let live."

I know. And when a vegan or vegetarian states their position they're usually branded as preachy. So it must be the same when an omnivore states their position too, right?

Shenshen · 05-01-2017 09:57AM

andekwarhola wrote: »

So liking the taste of meat is down to draconian social conditioning whereas liking the taste of kale smoothies and bean stew is simply manifest destiny?

Not sure where you're getting that from - I said what you eat shapes your sense of taste. Essentially, all our tastes are down to draconian social conditioning, otherwise why would people be squeamish about eating insects, or brain?
I can't stand kale smoothies, personally.

Vegetarian - Yes or No?

Are you Vegetarian or Vegan? 425 votes

Comments