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2016 U.S. Presidential Race Megathread Mark 2.

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Comments

  • #4112
    ebbsy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,266 ✭✭✭ebbsy


    I think what would be very helpful is if those women that Hillary has dredged up release their latest bank statements, to confirm no recent strange lodgements have been made.

    As for the drug test if she has nothing to hide she will take it.


  • #4113
    KingBrian2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,360 ✭✭✭KingBrian2


    Billy86 wrote: »
    Well to be fair Brian has already admitted that Trumps unconstitutional plans to ban all Muslims from entering the US is a reason he supports Trump. Of course that was after months of claiming Trumps call to ban all Muslims was distorted by the media (by which he was referring to Trumps own official website) and that he didn't want to ban all Muslims, despite Trump doubling and trebling down on it.

    Midnight you, his reasoning is that he views Muslims as a problem; the enemy. He let that one slip after weeks of claiming he had nothing against Muslims and didn't view them as a problem.

    Just a heads up on Brian's sense of logic.

    The problem you are having is that those who are voting for Trump are Libertarians and they do not believe in the Imperial presidency and you keep making the same points that Trump will have extreme power when if he is elected it will be Congress & the Judiciary that will perform the duty the constitution already states they have. So far we see only the President making all the decisions with Congress acting as a consulting body.


  • #4114
    Christy42
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,108 ✭✭✭Christy42


    ebbsy wrote: »
    I think what would be very helpful is if those women that Hillary has dredged up release their latest bank statements, to confirm no recent strange lodgements have been made.

    As for the drug test if she has nothing to hide she will take it.

    And those tax returns...


  • #4115
    Overheal
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 86,683 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    KingBrian2 wrote: »
    He is supported by the lovers of the US constitution while Hillary is a war monger and her commitment to America is suspect.

    That is not even a rational argument. This is literally how that sounds,



    Trump has been reported saying some pretty unconstitutional and unethical things, such as a strong desire to commit war crimes (expansion of torture, targeting civilians loosely associated with combatants, indiscriminately bombing "every square inch" of ISIS controlled territory), block people from entering the country based on a religious test, even expressing the desire to make it illegal to report bad things about him - the kind of thing self-absorbed dictators do.

    More to the point though: your rhetoric is dangerous, and creates a climate of "Us vs Them" and is how civil wars start. A rational person will understand that people all over the political spectrum mean well for our country (again, you're an outside observer Brian) but they all have differing viewpoints on how to best meet those goals.


  • #4116
    Pro Hoc Vice
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,087 ✭✭✭Pro Hoc Vice


    ebbsy wrote: »
    I think what would be very helpful is if those women that Hillary has dredged up release their latest bank statements, to confirm no recent strange lodgements have been made.

    As for the drug test if she has nothing to hide she will take it.

    If Trump has nothing to hide he can release his last 20 years of tax returns. Also would be an idea to on live TV do a full medical check up, would make great reality TV! Of course he has nothing to hide!


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  • #4117
    Overheal
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 86,683 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    KingBrian2 wrote: »
    The problem you are having is that those who are voting for Trump are Libertarians
    Pretty sure Libertarians are voting for Libertarians.

    https://www.johnsonweld.com/


  • #4118
    frostyjacks
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,951 ✭✭✭frostyjacks


    Billy86 wrote: »
    Well to be fair Brian has already admitted that Trumps unconstitutional plans to ban all Muslims from entering the US is a reason he supports Trump. Of course that was after months of claiming Trumps call to ban all Muslims was distorted by the media (by which he was referring to Trumps own official website) and that he didn't want to ban all Muslims, despite Trump doubling and trebling down on it.

    Midnight you, his reasoning is that he views Muslims as a problem; the enemy. He let that one slip after weeks of claiming he had nothing against Muslims and didn't view them as a problem.

    Just a heads up on Brian's sense of logic.

    Muslims aren't a problem? Sure. I guess it's a coincidence that virtually every terrorist attack around the world is carried out in the name of Islam.

    It would be suicidal to allow any more of them into a country without ironclad assurances that they won't be a threat. It's putting one's people first, nothing wrong with that.


  • #4119
    Christy42
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,108 ✭✭✭Christy42


    frostyjacks wrote: »
    Muslims aren't a problem? Sure. I guess it's a coincidence that virtually every terrorist attack around the world is carried out in the name of Islam.

    It would be suicidal to allow any more of them into a country without ironclad assurances that they won't be a threat. It's putting one's people first, nothing wrong with that.

    No they aren't. They really aren't except in right winger's head.

    http://www.globalresearch.ca/non-muslims-carried-out-more-than-90-of-all-terrorist-attacks-in-america/5333619

    http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2015/01/14/are-all-terrorists-muslims-it-s-not-even-close.html


  • #4120
    KingBrian2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,360 ✭✭✭KingBrian2


    Overheal wrote: »
    That is not even a rational argument. This is literally how that sounds,



    Trump has been reported saying some pretty unconstitutional and unethical things, such as a strong desire to commit war crimes (expansion of torture, targeting civilians loosely associated with combatants, indiscriminately bombing "every square inch" of ISIS controlled territory), block people from entering the country based on a religious test, even expressing the desire to make it illegal to report bad things about him - the kind of thing self-absorbed dictators do.

    More to the point though: your rhetoric is dangerous, and creates a climate of "Us vs Them" and is how civil wars start. A rational person will understand that people all over the political spectrum mean well for our country (again, you're an outside observer Brian) but they all have differing viewpoints on how to best meet those goals.

    What is more dangerous is not being honest with the people on the seriousness of the threat posed by jihadists and politicians having a sane foreign policy. Of course what is also counterproductive is calling everyone an Islamophobe who is aware of the Jihadist extremists and disagrees with the political elite.


  • #4121
    Pro Hoc Vice
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,087 ✭✭✭Pro Hoc Vice


    frostyjacks wrote: »
    Muslims aren't a problem? Sure. I guess it's a coincidence that virtually every terrorist attack around the world is carried out in the name of Islam.

    It would be suicidal to allow any more of them into a country without ironclad assurances that they won't be a threat. It's putting one's people first, nothing wrong with that.

    http://www.globalresearch.ca/non-muslims-carried-out-more-than-90-of-all-terrorist-attacks-in-america/5333619

    According to this data, there were more Jewish acts of terrorism within the United States than Islamic (7% vs 6%).

    Of course that study must be wrong according to you.


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  • #4122
    Overheal
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 86,683 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    KingBrian2 wrote: »
    What is more dangerous is not being honest with the people on the seriousness of the threat posed by jihadists and politicians having a sane foreign policy. Of course what is also counterproductive is calling everyone an Islamophobe who is aware of the Jihadist extremists and disagrees with the political elite.

    Well there's a correlation between islamaphobia and an uptick in terrorism. Who would have thought being discriminated against would tend to make someone bitter and uninvested in their society?


  • #4123
    KingBrian2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,360 ✭✭✭KingBrian2


    Overheal wrote: »
    Well there's a correlation between islamaphobia and an uptick in terrorism. Who would have thought being discriminated against would tend to make someone bitter and uninvested in their society?

    Yeah those secular Muslims are being targeted by the same terrorists while the liberals choose to see them all as one community. Their are as many divisions within Islam as their is in Christianity. I don't expect either candidate to be familiar with the nuances of Islam.


  • #4124
    Overheal
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 86,683 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    Breaking News: the NC GOP Headquarters was firebombed

    http://breaking911.com/breaking-n-c-gop-headquarters-firebombed-atf-responding/

    Cu6WORuVMAI75c5.jpg
    The building, located at 347 Ja-Max Drive in the Shops at Daniel Boone, was struck overnight with hate graffiti and with a flammable material thrown through a front window of the headquarters. The graffiti — which included a swastika and the words “Nazi Republicans leave town or else” — was spray-painted in black on the side of an adjacent building, Balloons Above Orange, 353 Ja-Max Drive. The damage was discovered this morning by another business owner, who reported it before 9 a.m.

    The cynic in me would not be surprised to discover this was friendly fire. The GOP has been losing ground in NC since the trump tapes broke, there was no earthly reason for opposition voters to commit this kind of act, given it will do nothing but boost the GOP turnout at the polls.


  • #4125
    Overheal
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 86,683 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    KingBrian2 wrote: »
    Yeah those secular Muslims are being targeted by the same terrorists while the liberals choose to see them all as one community. Their are as many divisions within Islam as their is in Christianity. I don't expect either candidate to be familiar with the nuances of Islam.

    Well seeing how one of them has actually been overseas multiple times in a political context and has seen the middle east events for herself over the last 30 or so years, I'm willing to bet she does.


  • #4126
    Billy86
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,495 ✭✭✭✭Billy86


    frostyjacks wrote: »
    Muslims aren't a problem? Sure. I guess it's a coincidence that virtually every terrorist attack around the world is carried out in the name of Islam.

    It would be suicidal to allow any more of them into a country without ironclad assurances that they won't be a threat. It's putting one's people first, nothing wrong with that.
    We're not going to derail this thread with your absurdly incorrect assumptions, I was pointing out Brian's incredible propensity for double think.


  • #4127
    ancapailldorcha
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 42,972 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    frostyjacks wrote: »
    Muslims aren't a problem? Sure. I guess it's a coincidence that virtually every terrorist attack around the world is carried out in the name of Islam.

    It would be suicidal to allow any more of them into a country without ironclad assurances that they won't be a threat. It's putting one's people first, nothing wrong with that.

    This thread is about the election. You're welcome to start a new thread if you want to discuss terrorism.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • #4128
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 23,016 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    KingBrian2 wrote: »
    Yeah those secular Muslims are being targeted by the same terrorists while the liberals choose to see them all as one community. Their are as many divisions within Islam as their is in Christianity. I don't expect either candidate to be familiar with the nuances of Islam.

    I expect any well educated person standing for office to have a decent understanding of the nuances of Islam.
    If not the finer detail, at least the knowledge they exist and are varied.

    I would expect anyone running for POTUS to be very well informed of the above. You can bet your bottom dollar that Hillary is.

    Call me crazy, but I expect a candidate for POTUS to very well informed on a wide range of subjects. Trump simply isn't.

    they/them/theirs


    The more you can increase fear of drugs and crime, welfare mothers, immigrants and aliens, the more you control all of the people.

    Noam Chomsky



  • #4129
    KingBrian2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,360 ✭✭✭KingBrian2


    Brian? wrote: »
    I expect any well educated person standing for office to have a decent understanding of the nuances of Islam.
    If not the finer detail, at least the knowledge they exist and are varied.

    I would expect anyone running for POTUS to be very well informed of the above. You can bet your bottom dollar that Hillary is.

    Call me crazy, but I expect a candidate for POTUS to very well informed on a wide range of subjects. Trump simply isn't.

    You also expect a President to not be Intune with the wishes of the electorate.


  • #4130
    Overheal
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 86,683 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    KingBrian2 wrote: »
    You also expect a President to not be Intune with the wishes of the electorate.

    Are you part of the electorate?


  • #4131
    Zubeneschamali
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,644 ✭✭✭✭Zubeneschamali


    Brian? wrote: »
    I would expect anyone running for POTUS to be very well informed of the above. You can bet your bottom dollar that Hillary is.

    I think it is obvious that Trump had no notion of being the Republican candidate when he entered - he was just going for some publicity. Now he's like a dog that chased a car and caught it - he has no plan for what to do next.

    Seriously, look at his speeches. There is nothing concrete in there about what he wants to do as President, because he never wanted to be President. He just thrives on attention.

    Unfortunately for him, a yuge number of people are watching him flounder. His entire brand is going to suffer when Hillary brands a giant L for Loser on his forehead next month.


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  • #4132
    ancapailldorcha
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 42,972 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    Zubeneschamali wrote: »
    Unfortunately for him, a yuge number of people are watching him flounder. His entire brand is going to suffer when Hillary brands a giant L for Loser on his forehead next month.

    I wouldn't worry about his brand. If anything, it'll be more lucrative than ever.

    What I am worried about is the fact that we are now living in a global world with global threats such as terrorism and climate change. Such threats necessitate international cooperation and the USA is a key player in this. With someone as isolationist as Trump as the GOP nominee, it bodes very poorly for the rest of the world.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • #4133
    Zubeneschamali
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,644 ✭✭✭✭Zubeneschamali


    ancapailldorcha wrote: »
    With someone as isolationist as Trump as the GOP nominee, it bodes very poorly for the rest of the world.

    When he is beaten by an unprecedented margin, not just beaten but utterly humiliated, thrashed, trounced, beaten into next week by a woman, the most disliked woman in America, this may have a sobering effect on the Republican party.

    Or it may just herald the impending death of the Republican party. Either one bodes well for the rest of the world.


  • #4134
    jobbridge4life
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,759 ✭✭✭jobbridge4life


    ancapailldorcha wrote: »
    If anything, it'll be more lucrative than ever.

    Reports indicate that his brand is already tanking.

    http://www.politico.com/story/2016/10/donald-trump-brand-229768


  • #4135
    Black Swan
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 47,769 CMod ✭✭✭✭Black Swan


    Zubeneschamali wrote: »
    Unfortunately for him, a yuge number of people are watching him flounder. His entire brand is going to suffer when Hillary brands a giant L for Loser on his forehead next month.
    Methinks that Donald Trump is attempting to secure his brand from harm (advance damage control) by constantly claiming publicly that the election is "fixed" or "rigged" against him, that the news media is predominantly anti-Trump and helping to fix the outcome, that the GOP "establishment" has turned against him (Paul Ryan, et al), that some of the state election sites may be tampered with against his election, and that the 7 October released Trump groping tape was innocent "locker room" talk and that the dozen women claiming he assaulted them were part of a "conspiracy," with all these things combined "stealing" the election from him. His hard core followers believe most of these UNSUBSTANTIATED claims at his rallies, as do the odd sort of extremist media sites that have been promoting him this presidential campaign cycle, especially the one that he hired the CEO from to help him with his campaign.


  • #4136
    K-9
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43,313 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    KingBrian2 wrote: »
    You also expect a President to not be Intune with the wishes of the electorate.

    You are the one supporting Trump though, not Brian?

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



  • #4137
    Zubeneschamali
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,644 ✭✭✭✭Zubeneschamali


    Black Swan wrote: »
    His hard core followers believe most of these UNSUBSTANTIATED claims at his rallies

    Well, yes, but they are bonkers.

    He can't run hotels and golf resorts if only the 27% of Americans who are barking mad will set foot in them.


  • #4138
    Overheal
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 86,683 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    He'll expatriate to Dubai where we can belittle woman and shield his money from the IRS more.


  • #4139
    meepins
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 447 ✭✭meepins


    Zubeneschamali wrote: »
    I think it is obvious that Trump had no notion of being the Republican candidate when he entered - he was just going for some publicity. Now he's like a dog that chased a car and caught it - he has no plan for what to do next.

    Seriously, look at his speeches. There is nothing concrete in there about what he wants to do as President, because he never wanted to be President. He just thrives on attention.
    It's simply not true that it's a ploy for publicity. He has been a well know public figure for decades, had a television show for many years that apparently was very popular. If it was publicity he was after there is no end to things he could have done that didn't include putting his business empire and, I'm reticent to say, his life in jeopardy.
    Trump has talked about running for office for many years and has judged that now is the best chance he will ever get of being elected. He's up against a widely unliked and untrusted candidate and despite the relentless offensive by the entire establishment - I still think he will be president and it will be a remarkable achievement.
    As for him having no concrete objectives.. it doesn't get more concrete than a big wall on the border with Mexico.


  • #4140
    Black Swan
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 47,769 CMod ✭✭✭✭Black Swan


    ancapailldorcha wrote: »

    What I am worried about is the fact that we are now living in a global world with global threats such as terrorism and climate change. Such threats necessitate international cooperation and the USA is a key player in this. With someone as isolationist as Trump as the GOP nominee, it bodes very poorly for the rest of the world.
    Indeed ancapailldorcha. If the Americans elect Donald Trump as their president, then it appears that they agree with all the statements he has made against NATO, Middle Eastern nations, China, Belgium, Mexico, religion, race, ethnicity, gender, etc., as well as his favourable statements regarding Russia and Putin (obvious aggressors towards former USSR WWII occupied nations), which puts America at a diplomatic disadvantage. And if he loses, there will still be some damage resultant from acknowledging that there were millions of Americans that agreed with Republican nominee Donald Trump's ignorant breach of protocols, discriminatory, and insulting statements.


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  • #4141
    KingBrian2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,360 ✭✭✭KingBrian2


    K-9 wrote: »
    You are the one supporting Trump though, not Brian?

    Yes as I regard him to speak for the majority of working Americans who are disillusioned with the est and want to pursue policies that are well and truly overdue. I consider this a worthwhile cause to fight for. It was the Democrats & Republicans that caused all this corruption well before Trump entered the stage. Neglecting working class ghettoes in the Midwest and the damage done by abusive gvt. Trump has appealed to the evangelicals on one extreme to the Sanders supporters on the other. From traditional Republicans to anti-war Democrats so a coalition of American voices share the sentiments that Trump speaks for. The comparison could be drawn with Jeremy Corbyn in the UK. A personality that enjoys a huge amount of grassroots support but disliked by the Labour party.


This discussion has been closed.
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