Vegan parents should be jailed.

Smondie · 12-08-2016 10:37AM #1

According to a bill being put before the Italian parliament forcing your child to be vegan is child abuse as it deprives children of thier nutritional needs and vegan parents should be subject to censure and possibly even jail time.

I think to intentially deprive children of a good steak because of your own beliefs is child abuse

http://www.thejournal.ie/vegan-diet-children-poll-2923955-Aug2016/

The thinking behind the bill is that such a diet isn’t sufficient for a child’s nutritional needs, after a number of high-profile cases in Italy in which children were taken into care after becoming malnourished.

failinis · 12-08-2016 10:40AM

I don't see a problem.

It not saying it is illegal to give your child a vegan diet.
Its any diet that does not meet the nutritional needs (be the child under-weight or over-weight) and is left malnourished.
Some Italian families have children on vegan diets who meet all the nutritional needs and are well nourished - no problem.

GingerLily · 12-08-2016 10:42AM

What is the wording of the bill? (In English)

Shint0 · 12-08-2016 10:48AM

Nowhere in that article does it show that veganism or vegetarianism was a direct cause of the cases of malnutrition. It's a huge leap to make. Meat eaters can suffer from malnutrition too. How exactly are frozen chicken nuggets healthy which seems to be the staple part of the diet for lots of children? The issue is irresponsible parenting not providing an adequate healthy balanced diet meat-free or otherwise.

DEFTLEFTHAND · 12-08-2016 10:49AM

Give the child options and let them decide what they want to eat.

The dumbest one I heard was that stupid trend last year of 'vegancats'. A few very ill house cats later and I think cat owners worldwide have got the message.

The Backwards Man · 12-08-2016 10:50AM

GingerLily wrote: »

What is the wording of the bill? (In English)

What's a matter you, hey!
Gotta no respect
Whatta you tink you do?

It's Italian.

Smondie · 12-08-2016 10:53AM

Shint0 wrote: »

Nowhere in that article does it show that veganism or vegetarianism was a direct cause of the cases of malnutrition. It's a huge leap to make. Meat eaters can suffer from malnutrition too. How exactly are frozen chicken nuggets healthy which seems to be the staple part of the diet for lots of children? The issue is irresponsible parenting not providing an adequate healthy balanced diet meat-free or otherwise.

Infants and children consuming atypical diets: Vegetarianism and macrobiotics
Tanya Di Genova and Harvey Guyda, MD

....Because parents are the principal providers of what their infants eat, vegetarian parents often wean their children onto the family’s vegetarian diet. It is important to note that atypical diets are more likely to cause problems of malnutrition in children than in adults due to their greater nutrient requirements relative to body weight. Thus, without the appropriate care for these children, health issues may arise that could concern health care professionals.
Vegetarianism is a very broad category consisting of diets with varying degree of animal product consumption. This distinction is important because the more strictly vegetarianism is followed, the more difficult it becomes to guarantee an adequate diet for growing infants and children.
-
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2528709/
.

whisky_galore · 12-08-2016 10:54AM

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

Give the child options and let them decide what they want to eat.

A big hape of crisps, sweets and ice cream.

Fabb · 12-08-2016 10:55AM

Getting priorities right and putting the real criminals in jail.

Caoimhgh1n · 12-08-2016 10:56AM

There is nothing wrong with a vegan lifestyle. Some parents do not do it correctly, that is the problem. Of course, most people would much rather feed their child McDonalds and a bunch of other crap, and then bash vegans who are more often than not healthier.

eviltwin · 12-08-2016 10:56AM

My kids eat a mostly vegan diet. Both are healthy are well and in better shape than a lot of their peers. I don't force my children to be meat free but as the main cook in the house I am not going to make multiple meals according to everyone's taste. I cook and they eat what I cook, they like it. When their dad cooks he'll cook meat and they have the option to have it but most times they choose not to have it. They can have meat when we eat out of the home or at someones house. How exactly that is cruel and neglectful I'd like to know.

PaddyWilliams · 12-08-2016 11:00AM

People can eat these diets, yet still consume the proper amount of proteins, fats etc. Hardly an offence to do this, once they allow the children to have their own choice once they come of age and are not forced into it.

Smondie · 12-08-2016 11:05AM

An Italian baby raised on a vegan diet is hospitalized for severe malnutrition and removed from parents
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2016/07/11/italian-baby-fed-vegan-diet-hospitalized-for-malnutrition/

Vegan Breastfeeding Kills Baby
http://www.thehealthyhomeeconomist.com/baby-breastfed-by-vegan-mother-dies/

beach_walker · 12-08-2016 11:07AM

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

The dumbest one I heard was that stupid trend last year of 'vegancats'.

Remember the vegan bloodhound in Shirley Valentine?

failinis · 12-08-2016 11:09AM

Smondie wrote: »

An Italian baby raised on a vegan diet is hospitalized for severe malnutrition and removed from parents
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2016/07/11/italian-baby-fed-vegan-diet-hospitalized-for-malnutrition/

Vegan Breastfeeding Kills Baby
http://www.thehealthyhomeeconomist.com/baby-breastfed-by-vegan-mother-dies/

Yes, and you can see what I said above, some, Italian families can rear children healthily on vegan diets and have no problem with doctors/social services - and some can not such as your links.
I think its great that there is a proposal to introduce the law protecting children from any diet that is not nutritional enough to promote normal healthy growth.

deeks · 12-08-2016 11:12AM

eviltwin wrote: »

I don't force my children to be meat free but as the main cook in the house I am not going to make multiple meals according to everyone's taste.

So, in effect, you do force your children to be meat free when you cook.

LoLth · 12-08-2016 11:13AM

I think there is a confusion here between imposing the bad habits of the parents on children and imposing parental beliefs badly.

undernourishment through a vegan diet would be evidence of the latter imho and should not be assumed to be inherently bad through some leap of logic.

Junkyard Tom · 12-08-2016 11:14AM

What if your child is a little bunny rabbit?

eviltwin · 12-08-2016 11:45AM

deeks wrote: »

So, in effect, you do force your children to be meat free when you cook.

No I don't. There is nothing to stop them putting on a few sausages or getting a few bits of meat from the fridge. They aren't babies. They choose not to do that so I can only surmise that means they are happy with what they are given.

ancapailldorcha · 12-08-2016 11:51AM

I knew a vegan mum who cooks meat for her kids and husband. Just because someone is vegan doesn't mean they believe in forcing their beliefs on others. Someone who forces their pet to subsist on a vegan diet for ideological reasons is committing animal abuse though.

josip · 12-08-2016 11:55AM

Our son can strip a chicken drumstick to the bone in under a minute.
No qualms about eating either Larry the Lamb or Babe the Pig in his many forms.
Partial to anything bovine.
Devours salmon like a grizzly.
2 eggs for breakfast with yoghurt and cheese.
He's still around the 5th percentile by weight

m5ex9oqjawdg2i · 12-08-2016 11:59AM

Bullshít sensationalist headline, well done OP, you're on par with the daily mail or the sun, neither of which deserve to be capitalized.

Chuchote · 12-08-2016 12:01PM

More to the point to run municipal nutrition classes teaching vegans how to maintain a balanced, nourishing diet.
Of course, there are people who are immune to science. There was a series of cases in California where malnourished children were taken from their parents, fed up to health and returned to the parents, who put them back on the idiotic macrobiotic diet, and then after a few months the children had to be hospitalised again, etc.

kylith · 12-08-2016 12:05PM

Is it possible to raise a healthy child on a vegan diet? I'm sure it is. Is it orders of magnitude more difficult than raising a healthy child on an omnivorous diet? Yes, it is. It takes lots of planning and research.

I can see people here that I'm assuming are vegan or veggie immediately going for the 'blah, blah, kids eat McDonald's not healthy'. Well, well done for jumping to the opposite extreme, folks; one kind of clueless, stupid parenting for another (talking, of course, about insufficient plant-based diets).

A poor omnivorous diet is not good, but it is nowhere near as dangerous as a poor vegan diet. I would propose a compromise for vegans: that they raise their children vegetarian rather than vegan. Let them have calcium, vitamins, and protein from eggs, milk, butter, and cheese. They can choose whether or not to go full vegan themselves.

biko · 12-08-2016 12:16PM

I suppose the Italians should jail parents that only feed their kids chicken nuggets, chips and burgers too? If so half of all Irish and UK parent will go to jail too..

Of course you can raise a child on a vegan diet. And it probably beats the diet many of us had growing up.

Your Face · 12-08-2016 12:24PM

I like Italy and intend on holidaying there again in the future.

kylith · 12-08-2016 12:24PM

biko wrote: »

I suppose the Italians should jail parents that only feed their kids chicken nuggets, chips and burgers too? If so half of all Irish and UK parent will go to jail too..

If they were dying of malnutrition from it they probably would.

Being a bit fat is a hell of a lot easier to get over than hypocalcemia, nerve problems, and a compromised immune system, or malnutrition.

eviltwin · 12-08-2016 12:26PM

kylith wrote: »

A poor omnivorous diet is not good, but it is nowhere near as dangerous as a poor vegan diet. I would propose a compromise for vegans: that they raise their children vegetarian rather than vegan. Let them have calcium, vitamins, and protein from eggs, milk, butter, and cheese. They can choose whether or not to go full vegan themselves.

Vegans can eat milk, butter and cheese, just vegan versions that are just as good, if not better than their dairy counterparts.

MeatTwoVeg · 12-08-2016 12:30PM

eviltwin wrote:

Vegans can eat milk, butter and cheese, just vegan versions that are just as good, if not better than their dairy counterparts.

Like Soya milk?
Urgh, that stuff is vile.

Jawgap · 12-08-2016 12:30PM

Caoimhgh1n wrote: »

There is nothing wrong with a vegan lifestyle. Some parents do not do it correctly, that is the problem. Of course, most people would much rather feed their child McDonalds and a bunch of other crap, and then bash vegans who are more often than not healthier.

Speaking as a parent of two strapping lads, I'd much rather feed myself the McDonald's and give them the salad from the Big Mac

- it's cheaper!

As a kid one of my best friends was a put upon veggie - his mother was into all that hippy-dippy stuff. I think he only used to hang around with me because my mother would invite him to stay for tea and he could eat all the 'rubbish' he couldn't get at home - even on Christmas Day he'd be round to our place like a shot for a bit of turkey.....the option in his place was nut roast......

......I had tea in his place a few times - always came home starving

Chuchote · 12-08-2016 12:43PM

Jawgap wrote: »

Speaking as a parent of two strapping lads, I'd much rather feed myself the McDonald's and give them the salad from the Big Mac - it's cheaper!

As a kid one of my best friends was a put upon veggie - his mother was into all that hippy-dippy stuff. I think he only used to hang around with me because my mother would invite him to stay for tea and he could eat all the 'rubbish' he couldn't get at home - even on Christmas Day he'd be round to our place like a shot for a bit of turkey.....the option in his place was nut roast......

......I had tea in his place a few times - always came home starving

Mm. But one of my first veggie friends was a strapping lad, fifth-generation vegetarian.

Vegan parents should be jailed.

Comments