Time.....is never time at all....v2

tomwaits48 · 19-06-2016 06:39PM

Race Report - Dunshaughlin 10k - 41.52

A full two minutes slower than last year, which is hard to take really but it is what is is.

Had a good chat with AulmanKing pre race about his advice posted during the week, but to my own fault, I failed to heed his advice. Adrenaline got the better of me at the start line and once again I tried to maintain a 6.20 pace.....here's the splits

6.23
6.35
6.42
6.39
7.03
6.48

A sad sorry affair, with a familiar fade and stitch to boot.

Back to the drawing board for me.....don't think I have the confidence to follow the Jack Daniels plan now so I may enter the warm familiar embrace of P & D 55/18 and go right back to basics. Recent races have at least given me good tempo workouts in preparation for those LT sessions.

tomwaits48 · 22-06-2016 08:27AM

Decision made : P & D 18/55 it is. There are too many variables involved with trying to fit a plan around the 2 groups I train with so I’m going to go back to the plan that has given me my current marathon PB of 3.17.

I will need to make a couple of tweaks to it fit around my schedule -

Some General Aerobic runs may need to be split in two - AM and a PM. Reading the book I think this is ok as these runs are mainly to build overall volume.
The LT sessions may have to be at lunch which means only getting the actual tempo miles - I’ll need to fill in the other miles at other times in the week, probably on the commute.
I will incorporate some additional MP sections in the longer MLRs towards the end of the plan

To keep it simple and to focus the mind on the key sessions I’ve put together a condensed version of the schedule.

Week Long Run Q1 Q2 Total
20th June 17 12 9 4 LT 33
27th June 16 13 w 8 @ MP 10 36
4th July 15 14 10 4 LT 40
11th July 14 15 10 42
18th July 13 16 w 10 @ MP 10 5 LT 45
25th July 12 12 8 37
1st Aug 11 18 11 5 LT 50
8th Aug 10 20 12 6 LT 54
15th Aug 9 16 w 12 @ MP 14 48
22nd Aug 8 14 8 5 x 800 43
29th Aug 7 20 12 7 LT 55
5th Sept 6 17 12 5 x 600 55
12th Sept 5 18 w 14 @ MP 12 5 x 1000 52
19th Sept 4 17 11 5 x 600 53
26th Sept 3 20 11 4 x 1200 52
3rd Octt 2 16 6 5 x 600 45
10th oct 1 12 5 3 x 1600 32
17th Oct 0 7 with 2 @ MP 22
24th Oct

I’ve started this week to give me a 1 week buffer. Will probably need this as I have work travel in September.

Let's see how I get on - If I can get 90% of the sessions in the table done I'll be happy.

tomwaits48 · 27-06-2016 07:55AM

Monday - Recovery - 4.5 miles @ 8.55

A gentle start to the plan which was needed as legs were quite stiff. When I got home I did a flexiblity DVD I had been ignoring for months. I was amazed at how restricted my flexibility was in certain areas, which leads me to believe my stride has no doubt suffered in recent races owing to poor form. I’m also nearly half a stone heavier than last summer which came as an awful shock!! Bit of a wake up call, I’ll be scheduling flexibility and stretching sessions as often as possible on recovery days

Tuesday - General Aerobic 3+6 miles = 9 @8.40

These are the bread and butter miles in the P&D plan. I will need to split these runs up at times, like today. I did three on the way to work in the morning and the 6 in the evening. Felt grand throughout.

Thursday - Lactate Threshold - 6.5 miles @ 7.38

I headed out Thursday evening with a sense of foreboding as I was poorly hydrated and very tired owing to a late night watching the Ireland match on Wednesday. Having said that, once I got stuck into the session I was fine.

I purposely picked a very familiar and flat route to do this, to build confidence. My HR monitor wasn’t working so I ran by feel....”comfortably hard” the book says...Splits are below

6.51
6.50
6.58
6.45

Some of these miles are faster than what I managed in recent 5mile / 10k races so I am happy with the effort. In fact, I found the session perversely enjoyable and took a great deal of satisfaction from finishing it at a consistent pace. I was wilting certainly during the 3rd mile to be fair but I hung on in to finish strong. Actually looking forward to the next LT session.

Friday - Recovery 3 miles @ 8.40

Standard commute to make up the easy miles.

Sunday - Medium Long Run - 12 miles @ 8.55

After a day’s rest and six 16miles+ long runs in the bank already I was expecting the first long run of the plan to be easy. How wrong I was! For whatever reason the legs just weren’t in the mood for this so I had to grind these miles out. Glad to get it done in the end, I will need to nudge the pace up next time.

tomwaits48 · 28-06-2016 01:44PM

question...

I'm in Achill next weekend and was planning to do the Half Marathon as my Long Run which is conveniently enough 13 miles with 8 @ MP. Kind of tempted to race it all out instead now.....

Which is the better training stimulus?? Race or just do the prescribed MP session?

belcarra · 29-06-2016 05:15PM

The Achill HM is very hilly so if you are going to race it you will be working at an even more intense level than for a flattish HM.
I would leave the decision down to how tired you feel, as if you race it you could well be wiped for the following few days and that will eat into your subsequent training. Plus, you are unlikely to PB on that course.
If you stick to plan you should have no such issues.

However, then again, sometimes it's just fun to race and you are at the very beginning of the plan so the schedule should still be quite manageable for you.

I signed up for DCM last week so will be interested to follow your progress. I'm currently about 14lbs heavier than where I wanna be so hopefully I manage to shift a couple of pounds a week over the next couple of months! PBs have not been on the horizon for the past 18 months so time to focus at last!

tomwaits48 · 07-07-2016 01:20PM

Week 2

Monday - Recovery - 4 miles @ 9.00 + Flexibility DVD
Tuesday - General Aerobic - 10 miles @ 8.32
Wednesday - Recovery - 3 miles @ 8.58
Thursday - 3 miles easy with 10 x 100 strides @ 9.00
Saturday - Marathon Pace - 13.1 miles @ 7.17 at the Achill Half Marathon (35th place)

A solid week which ended with the Achill Half Marathon. I was caught between two stools in so far as I wanted to race it and felt I could get more bang for my buck in a race environment than the scheduled session of 13 with 8@MP. In the end I settled on not racing it, do the first 8 miles at MP and if feeling ok continue on at MP. That’s how it worked out. I am aiming for a marathon pace of around 7.10-7.15 all going well so that's what I targeted.

I’d rank this course alongside the Connemarathon in terms of difficulty, but also, sheer beauty. The race begins from a small coastal village and by miles 2 and 3 you are running into a significant climb. The weather was quite muggy and windy and I was soon feeling rather hot, thirsty and uncomfortable. Miles 1-3 : 7.09 , 7.24 , 7.41.

Thankfully there was ample water tables which enable me to cool down and re-hydrate. Around mile 4 the route goes downhill and in the process we were greeted with spectacular views of the surround sea, mountains and island. I kept the effort levels consistent and the pace began to naturally increase on the declines - Miles 4-6 : 6.48, 6.42, 7.01

Around the half-way point and after a change in direction things became trickier as rolling hills emerged alongside a nasty headwind. The heat in the air had disappeared and now I was suddenly very cold. Miles 6-9: 7.25, 7.38, 7.33, 8.00

Although tired I was feeling in the zone so I opted to continue at existing effort and close out the MP session. Around Mile 10 the 10k participants rejoined the route which I found helpful as I had been running solo for the entire race. Zipping by the back end of the 10k field helped put a spring in my step and I ended up finishing the race strongly, which maded for a nice change!
Miles 10-13 6.59, 7.34, 6.57. Finish time of 1.35.30

An excellent race, one which I would highly recommend. I noted afterwards that my half PB would have earned me a Top 10 finish so perhaps I’ll return next year to race it flat out, only 9 people got under 1:30 which shows how challenging the course is.

tomwaits48 · 10-07-2016 01:29PM

Week 3:

Tuesday - 4 miles recovery @ 9.00
Wednesday - 6.5 miles w/ 4 Lactate Threshold - 6.43, 6.47, 7.05, 6.46
Thursday - 10 miles general aerobic @ 8.59
Friday - 3 miles recovery AM, 3 miles recovery PM @ 8.42
Saturday - 14 miles long run at 8.52

I had to dig deep to complete this week's schedule, cramming it all into 5 days owing to real life commitments.

Wednesday's LT session was tough - some of Achill's efforts were still in the legs so the pace on this session was a shade slower than Week 1's session.

Thursday's general aerobic effort was a slow slog. I had to do this directly after a very busy day at work and I was shattered as I set out to the Poolbeg Lighthouse from the city centre. I collapsed onto the couch when I got home and watched the football in a almost comatosed state.

Friday required doubles if I was to make the weeks mileage target. 3 in to work, 3 out of work, job done.

Yesterday's long run was tough. I headed to the Phoenix Park in the afternoon and I knew within 5 minutes I was in for a rough ride. Sore shins, residual tiredness, heat, humidity and wind made for a hard run. I resorted to listening to music and promising myself 2 drink stoppages to get through the session. Got there eventually.

40 miles done, all sessions complete....just about!!

adrian522 · 10-07-2016 02:28PM

Should your recovery pace be slower or should your GA pace be quicker?

tomwaits48 · 10-07-2016 04:59PM

adrian522 wrote: »

Should your recovery pace be slower or should your GA pace be quicker?

ga pace would ideally be quicker really

adrian522 · 10-07-2016 05:31PM

Was thinking that, I would have thought the recovery the day after the session would work better with the GA on the Friday.

tomwaits48 · 18-07-2016 01:13PM

DCM 2016 Week 4

Monday - Recovery 5.5 miles @ 8.45
Tuesday - Recovery 5 miles @ 8.46
Thursday - General Aerobic 10 miles @ 8.51
Friday - Recovery 2 miles @ 9.10
Saturday - 3 miles including 10 x 100 strides.
Sunday - Medium Long 15 Miles @ 8.10

A good week, I managed to get all my miles in despite an overnight in Brussels for work. I made a conscious decision to increase the effort level on this week's long run which is reflected in +30 seconds in pace, which is satisfying. I am starting to notice the benefit of those mid week General Aerobic 10 milers, they are tough if already tired, but not too tough that you can't complete them.

If anyone has a spare number for the Fingal 10k drop me a line. I can offer a lift in return.

AuldManKing · 18-07-2016 10:03PM

Your going well there, Mr D.

tomwaits48 · 19-07-2016 08:03AM

AuldManKing wrote: »

Your going well there, Mr D.

cheers pal, I have you to thank for putting me on the straight and narrow after our chat in Dunshaughlin.

tomwaits48 · 25-07-2016 08:47AM

Week 5 :

I’m in a good space at the moment, the momentum that arises from the progressive element of the plan is driving me forward, stretching me each week in a good way. I avoided the temptation to do the Fingal 10k to remain faithful to the plan which worked out well in the end.

Monday - 3 miles recovery @ 9.15
Tuesday - 10 miles general aerobic @ 8.53
Wednesday - 3 miles easy @ 8.31
Thursday - Lactate Threshold 9 with 5 @ 6.55
Friday - 3 miles recovery @ 9.00
Sunday - Marathon Paced Run 16 with 10 MP @ 7.24

The MP run was a highlight. I did these miles over the last 10m miles of the DCM course which is the ideal way to train with race specificity in mind. I had to dig deep in the usual sections we are all familiar with...coming up through Clonskeagh....Roebuck hill and for me, the stretch on Merrion Road always feels like it takes forever...I had a pace range of 7.10-7.25 in mind and happy to come in on average at 7.24, which is almost identical to the pace I achieved on my marathon PB, so I am in good shape for this stage of the plan. I collected 5/6 strava PB’s on this run which is always pleasing considering I’ve ran this route many times in the past 3/4 years.

That brings an end to cycle 1, I’m due a recovery week this week. However, as I am away next week I am going to swap the weeks around and get stuck into week 1 of cycle 2 this week and take the recovery next week, which is more natural break for me. Cycle 2 looks a little daunting in terms of getting all the workouts/sessions done (particularly the mid week ones) but I’ve managed a 100% success rate so far so long may it continue

tomwaits48 · 29-07-2016 08:03AM

Week 6 :

Outside my usual weekly update, I want to update seperatly on my 2 sessions so far this week:

On Tuesday I ran 11 miles medium long run @ 7.47. This is noteworthy for a couple of reasons. Firstly I am usually quite tired heading into the mid week longer runs, my legs usually feel heavy, and the run is a bit of slog with the average pace in this training cycle being arounxd 8.30-9.00. This Tuesday was completly different, I went out with the same effort levels in mind but I felt really light on my feet, the run itself felt effortless, form was good, and i generally had a rather fantastic run. Great. Spilts below:

1. 7.47
2. 7.32
3. 7.52
4. 7.55
5. 8.19
6. 7.33
7. 7.13
8. 7.35
9. 7.37
10. 8.05
11. 8.11

Last night I did 10 miles with 5 miles Lactate Threshold @ 6.33. I've been enjoying these LT runs with my pace in the 4 LT sessions so far hovering around 6.50-6.55. Last night's pace was 6.33 - 5 miles in 32:54. To put that into context that's a faster time than my Irish runner 5 mile race a few weeks back where I ran full tilt. Just like Tuesday, my legs felt great, really light in my feet, form was good and I actually felt like I was running really fast but at similar effort levels as before. Splits

1. 6.31
2. 6.36
3. 6.24
4. 6.48
5. 6.25

I could just be having a one off good week but the signs bode well. The Frank Duffy 10 mile in a couple of weeks will be a good barometer of where I truely am fitness wise but it feels like I am getting back to my peak of summer 2014. Who knew sticking to an actual plan would work?

AuldManKing · 29-07-2016 08:47AM

Delighted to see the progress.

My coach always tells us (and I dont listen) that the time to look after yourself with S&C stuff and massage is when things are going very well. We always do it when things are going bad (injury) but rarely when its going well.

they are super splits for the 2 runs last week - great effort on the tempo.

As I'm currently in between recovery from injury and starting a plan - reading your log makes me want to do P&D!

tomwaits48 · 29-07-2016 10:13AM

AuldManKing wrote: »

Delighted to see the progress.

My coach always tells us (and I dont listen) that the time to look after yourself with S&C stuff and massage is when things are going very well. We always do it when things are going bad (injury) but rarely when its going well.

they are super splits for the 2 runs last week - great effort on the tempo.

As I'm currently in between recovery from injury and starting a plan - reading your log makes me want to do P&D!

cheers pal, if you want to hook up for a long run in the PP some Sunday morning give me a shout.

tomwaits48 · 05-08-2016 09:08PM

Finished off week 6 with 18 miles long run @ 8.18. I ran 10 miles of this with the club at a decent clip of 8.06 which again is about 30 seconds per mile faster than normal. One thing to note though is that I've had sore shins and pretty bad doms for 3-4 days since. Thankfully I am into the recovery week this week.

Only found out afterwards that my comedy hero bill burr was also in the park Sunday morning before his gig that night, would have loved to have stopped for a chat. The gig was unreal.

AuldManKing · 06-08-2016 09:36PM

I've noticed my glutes recently playing up. Guess we need to do more S&C work as the miles increase (......that's not Scotch & Coke btw)

tomwaits48 · 08-08-2016 12:17PM

Week 7 was my first recovery week and it was certainly needed.

Tuesday - 4 miles recovery @ 8.49
Thursday - 5 miles recovery @ 8.41
Friday - 8.5 miles general aerobic @ 7.36 :eek:
Saturday - 4 miles recovery with 10 x 100 strides
Sunday - 14 miles medium long run @ 8.17

So looking at the pace on Friday and Sunday it appears my recent improvement was not a fluke. I won't get too carried away yet until I see how I get on in the Frank Duffy Saturday week. As my HR monitor is not working I've been running the sessions mostly on effort gauge and the pace is hitting the right spots. Let's see. My legs are very sore and tight at the moment so I spent a good hour on Sunday in my local gym sitting in the sauna, jacuzzi and steam room.

This week I am into a heavy week including a 12 mile MLR, 6 mile LT and 20 mile long run. I am a little apprehensive about the long run as I haven't hit 20 miles in one run since 2014. I will take it slow and handy.

By the way, on Sunday as I headed to the park for my long run, I couldn't get by the Rock n Roll race traffic in Kilmainham so I just joined in with the race and ran the course from miles 5 to 11 milking the unwarranted kudos and water stations, hehehe....there was some carnage at the back end of the field where I was....cues for portaloos! people texting! people taking pictures! and some really awful, awful rock bands for 9am of a Sunday morning. Was very windy out there which must have made it very difficult for those racing

tomwaits48 · 10-08-2016 08:10AM

First session of this week done without issue : 12 miles medium long run @ 7.34

Ran this on my preferred medium long run route, down from Kimmage into Rathfarnam, lap of Marlay Park, and back up again to Kimmage via Rathgar and Terenure. Nice wide roads in most spots.

Splits look nice and consistent:

7.37
7.27
7.30
7.38
7.31
7.25
7.25
7.39
7.20
7.35
7.50
7.47

I've a new watch on order which comes with a built in HR monitor on the wrist which will give me a good indication of my actual effort levels during sessions at the moments. Truth be told I'm probably now doing them too fast for my marathon goal. Great fun though :-)

tomwaits48 · 12-08-2016 07:59AM

can't say the same about my second session this week, certainly not straightforward.

So far in this training block I've done every LT session on a local 1.8m loop - this has been great as in my head I usually just have "3-4" loops to do and I'm done. I've been doing these on Thursday evenings after 8pm when the roads and paths are less busy.

I had an idea this week to try and fit 6LT miles at lunchtime on the track. My reasoning was that it might be easier on an enclosed track (as it's been windy this week) and the grass surface would be kinder on my tender shins. Also, getting it done at lunch would give extra recovery time ahead of the all important 20 miler on Sunday morning.

It didn't go to plan. I got to the track alright and got stuck into the session but soon found repeated 400m loops irratating. Also, my legs were stiff and sore so my form was off - this must be due to running too hard on Tuesday. I got 2.5 miles into the session and I pulled the plug, just wasn't feeling it all, went back to the office tail between my legs.

When I got home in the evening I tried again - legs were a littler looser and I was determined to right the wrong. I headed back to the usual 1.8m loop and finished the final 3.5 miles at LT effort with no issues.

So I got the miles in but it was poorly executed.

lesson learned : 1) dont go to hard on the Tuesday MLR 2) stick to what's working!

2.5 miles @ 6.47
3.5 miles @ 6.37

AuldManKing · 12-08-2016 08:32AM

Wouldn't be too hard on yourself - you got it done in the end.
The thoughts of doing 6m @ LT on a track is daunting to say the least and worse if your a bit tired.

Regarding the Tuesday MLR, I'd say only the early miles of that were too fast. As per P&D the 1st few miles should be a lot slower and the latter miles faster (MP+10%).

Do you think you'd have finished the 6m LT had you of done it later in the day in 1 go?

tomwaits48 · 12-08-2016 08:42AM

AuldManKing wrote: »

Wouldn't be too hard on yourself - you got it done in the end.
The thoughts of doing 6m @ LT on a track is daunting to say the least and worse if your a bit tired.

Regarding the Tuesday MLR, I'd say only the early miles of that were too fast. As per P&D the 1st few miles should be a lot slower and the latter miles faster (MP+10%).

Do you think you'd have finished the 6m LT had you of done it later in the day in 1 go?

yeah defo - if I had kept to the usual 8pm Thursday on my normal loop I would have finished it no problem - I even contemplated doing the full 6 in the evening as was feeling fine after the first 3 miles but played it safe.

There seems to be a big mental difference (for me anyway) in trying to hold 6.40ish continious pace on a track versus the road.

tomwaits48 · 15-08-2016 08:29AM

Sunday - 20 miles long run @ 8.23

Thrilled to get this done. I had mentioned I was little apprehensive about this week's training - one of the peak weeks of mileage in the plan with 3 meaty sessions, culminating in the first of three 20 milers.

I started out very slowly - took a while for the legs to thaw out after a tough week. Got going properly after about 30 minutes. I headed out to the Waterworks in Bohernabreena which has a few trickly little hills and climbs. My form was good and strong, happy with how I executed the run. I've ran this route many times so it was great to see that I hit another 6 or 7 Strava PB's along the way.

Feeling very confident now in general - I've nothing to fear from the rest of the plan.

1. 9.07
2. 9.05
3. 8.56
4. 8.47
5. 8.40
6. 8.43
7. 8.23
8. 8.10
9. 8.01
10. 7.40
11. 8.05
12. 7.58
13. 8.08
14. 7.52
15. 8.04
16. 8.23
17. 8.13
18. 8.37
19. 8.55
20. 8.02

56 miles for the week.

PaulieC · 15-08-2016 11:34AM

Nice week. With those kind of miles in the bank this early, you'll be flying on the day

tomwaits48 · 16-08-2016 08:40PM

I could do with a bit of input regarding the next two weeks in the plan : the key sessions are 14 MLR + 16 with 12@mp this week and next week is a recovery week of 5x800 + 14MLR. I am doing the frank Duffy this week, racing all out so need to rejig a little

I am thinking I'd do the 5x800 tommorow, drop one of the 14MLRs and next week do a 14MLR and the MP session. That sound reasonable? Truth be told my legs are in bits since the 20 miler on Sunday so I don't think doing a 14MLR tommorow would be a good idea, a short 800s session sounds ok....leaves 2 days easy before Saturday's race.

adrian522 · 17-08-2016 09:53AM

What is the purpose of the race? If you want to give it a good go it may be worth dropping the 800 session. Given your legs are already feeling the effects of the training you could probably do with the extra days recovery.

If you are not that bothered by the time on Saturday and just want a good hard workout then the session would probably be ok. Also I think that session is 5-10k pace rather than flat out is that correct?

AuldManKing · 17-08-2016 10:10AM

tomwaits48 wrote: »

I could do with a bit of input regarding the next two weeks in the plan : the key sessions are 14 MLR + 16 with 12@mp this week and next week is a recovery week of 5x800 + 14MLR. I am doing the frank Duffy this week, racing all out so need to rejig a little

I am thinking I'd do the 5x800 tommorow, drop one of the 14MLRs and next week do a 14MLR and the MP session. That sound reasonable? Truth be told my legs are in bits since the 20 miler on Sunday so I don't think doing a 14MLR tommorow would be a good idea, a short 800s session sounds ok....leaves 2 days easy before Saturday's race.

If your legs are in bits the 800's might be a bit much as well.
take a look at week 6 of the plan - it caters for a race that week. Although you are a day out, do the 600's today and a recovery run tomorrow. Leave out the MLR as the race will be a super session either way.

tomwaits48 · 17-08-2016 10:10AM

yes the session is @ 5k pace so for me that would be 6.10 or so which I should be ok with. The race is just a bonus / mental sharpener but I do want to see if I can hit a decent time to see what shape I am in. The only other race I have planned is the race series half & Athone 3/4 as an easy run.

Did a good bit of foam rolling, stretching & hot/cold therapy via the sauna & jacuzzi yesterday evening. Legs feel better this morning.

Time.....is never time at all....v2

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