Drink Driving

jackofalltrades · 01-08-2016 11:30PM

FrStone wrote: »

We do take it very seriously. We are quite successful at preventing Road traffic deaths.
Just look at the states, where drink driving is way more prevalent and punishment is not as severe. Our road deaths per capita are actually quite low, despite what the rsa like us to believe.

Then why isn't the law changed so the the Gardí can go after motorists breaking the law in dashcam footage thread, without the dashcam owner first having to make a complaint?

Claw Hammer · 02-08-2016 08:51AM

jackofalltrades wrote: »

Then why isn't the law changed so the the Gardí can go after motorists breaking the law in dashcam footage thread, without the dashcam owner first having to make a complaint?

The Guards can pursue any motorist breaking the law in dashcam footage thread. The problem is that aspects of the evidence need to be proved by the person who made the recording. In particular, the location is crucial. There is also the possibility of hoax clips sending the guards on wild goose chases.

kupus · 02-08-2016 09:25AM

Speed kills blah blah blah
Drink driving kills blah blah blah
Phone while driving kills blah blah blah.
Bald tires
Changing radios

All fooking waffle as I see it.

Start building proper roads and you will find the death rate drop.

But this costs too much so the gov and their rsa mouthpiece bleat on about every other excuse they can to take people's focus away that the roads are indeed Sh1te.

Pro Hoc Vice · 02-08-2016 09:35AM

kupus wrote: »

Speed kills blah blah blah
Drink driving kills blah blah blah
Phone while driving kills blah blah blah.
Bald tires
Changing radios

All fooking waffle as I see it.

Start building proper roads and you will find the death rate drop.

But this costs too much so the gov and their rsa mouthpiece bleat on about every other excuse they can to take people's focus away that the roads are indeed Sh1te.

http://www.worldlifeexpectancy.com/cause-of-death/road-traffic-accidents/by-country/

We come number 161 out of 172 we are in the top 10 safest countries in the world.

Pinch Flat · 02-08-2016 09:38AM

kupus wrote: »

Speed kills blah blah blah
Drink driving kills blah blah blah
Phone while driving kills blah blah blah.
Bald tires
Changing radios

All fooking waffle as I see it.

Start building proper roads and you will find the death rate drop.

But this costs too much so the gov and their rsa mouthpiece bleat on about every other excuse they can to take people's focus away that the roads are indeed Sh1te.

Really? any evidence for this. Don't get me wrong - some of our roads are in a shocking condition, with poor surfacing, drainage and alignment. But people still insist on driving on these at completely inappropriate speeds. That (excessive speed) and alcohol make up about 70% of the factors in road fatalities.

Why can't people just accept that speeding and boozed up drivers cause major problems on our roads?

Thoie · 02-08-2016 10:10AM

I'm always taken aback by the attitude of "sure, you're unlikely to run into a checkpoint, you could risk it", as if the only reason not to drink and drive is penalty points.

I'm big enough that I could drink about 4 vodkas in an hour and still be technically under the limit (of 50mg per 100ml of blood) based on http://www.rupissed.com/

I won't even have one drink and drive, not because I'm worried about a checkpoint, but because if anything ever happened I would spend the rest of my life wondering "could I have avoided that if I didn't have a drink"?

Growing up, the nearest disco was 15 miles away. Parents either took it in turns to drop us off or pick us up, and as we got a little older, we'd take it in turns to be the driver. The done thing in our group was that everyone else bought the driver soft drinks all night and paid for their entrance. We didn't leave the car park until everyone had their seatbelt on. To this day I still ask if everyone is belted up before taking off.

I'm finding that people a few years younger than me are far more laissez-faire about drinking and driving. Recently I was faced with a social event that would cost €50 in taxis each way, so I decided to drive. The number of people who said "you won't be driving for ages, have a few drinks" surprised me. It's a bit the same with HIV - growing up the safe sex message was hammered home to us, because at the time AIDS was a death sentence. People a few years younger than me didn't get that message, and seem to have a far more lax attitude to safe sex. Combined with improvements in treatment, they don't seem to see HIV as such a big deal.

Shenshen · 02-08-2016 12:36PM

Pinch Flat wrote: »

Really? any evidence for this. Don't get me wrong - some of our roads are in a shocking condition, with poor surfacing, drainage and alignment. But people still insist on driving on these at completely inappropriate speeds. That (excessive speed) and alcohol make up about 70% of the factors in road fatalities.

Why can't people just accept that speeding and boozed up drivers cause major problems on our roads?

Well, to some extend you can blame whoever sets speed limits, too.
I don't live too far from a small, narrow, windy road that has grass growing down the middle, but the speed limit is 80.

I often wonder is many speed limits are meant to be understood as a dare?

Oymyakon · 02-08-2016 01:33PM

Shenshen wrote: »

Well, to some extend you can blame whoever sets speed limits, too.
I don't live too far from a small, narrow, windy road that has grass growing down the middle, but the speed limit is 80.

I often wonder is many speed limits are meant to be understood as a dare?

It's a 'limit', not a target.

Pinch Flat · 02-08-2016 04:05PM

Shenshen wrote: »

Well, to some extend you can blame whoever sets speed limits, too.
I don't live too far from a small, narrow, windy road that has grass growing down the middle, but the speed limit is 80.

I often wonder is many speed limits are meant to be understood as a dare?

I agree that a lot of speed limits on rural roads require a review - but they are a limiot, not a target. People still need to drive to the prevailing road conditions, layout, visibility etc.

Many a country road I've driven on, marked with a 80 kph limit, and you'll be lucky to do 60 kph. Who knows what you might meet? A farmer herding cattle, someone on horseback a tractor or a group of cyclists.

On better roads, I maintain it's impossible to drive at the speed limit anyway without being overtaken - there's an overtaking gene in a lot of Irish drivers that makes it impossible for them to just sit behind car doing 100kph on a road with this limit.

Jayop · 02-08-2016 04:15PM

The biggest reason for drink driving where I live is that there's not a single taxi to be had at night. It's a smallish village with about 7/8 pubs and there used to be 3 or 4 taxis at the weekend, but now there's only 1 still doing it and you'd have to be blessed to be able to get him so loads of people take the car home even if they didn't plan to when they came out.

Thoie · 02-08-2016 04:17PM

Jayop wrote: »

The biggest reason for drink driving where I live is that there's not a single taxi to be had at night. It's a smallish village with about 7/8 pubs and there used to be 3 or 4 taxis at the weekend, but now there's only 1 still doing it and you'd have to be blessed to be able to get him so loads of people take the car home even if they didn't plan to when they came out.

But why not plan ahead and arrange a designated driver, taking it in turns? If it's know that the likelihood of getting a taxi is slim to none, it's hardly a surprise at the end of the night?

Jayop · 02-08-2016 04:22PM

Thoie wrote: »

But why not plan ahead and arrange a designated driver, taking it in turns? If it's know that the likelihood of getting a taxi is slim to none, it's hardly a surprise at the end of the night?

I know I won't go out and sit in a pub while everyone gets drunk and not take a drink myself. I'd rather sit at home and let them ring me to pick them up. Being in a pub sober is a nightmare and as good an idea as designated drivers are it'll never work on a big scale because of that simple reason.

I'd say most of those who take the car home don't plan to. I know when I go out on a Saturday night I'll drive down then pick up the car the next day. For a lot of people if it's raining or whatever the temptation to get in the car rather than walk is just too much.

Thoie · 02-08-2016 04:31PM

Jayop wrote: »

I know I won't go out and sit in a pub while everyone gets drunk and not take a drink myself. I'd rather sit at home and let them ring me to pick them up. Being in a pub sober is a nightmare and as good an idea as designated drivers are it'll never work on a big scale because of that simple reason.

It worked for a lot of people for years (and still does). I went to the pub to spend time with friends, not to get legless, but to each their own. I've often been sober in a pub, and often been drunk in a pub, and neither were terrible, but perhaps it depends on the people you're with.

Jayop · 02-08-2016 04:40PM

Thoie wrote: »

It worked for a lot of people for years (and still does). I went to the pub to spend time with friends, not to get legless, but to each their own. I've often been sober in a pub, and often been drunk in a pub, and neither were terrible, but perhaps it depends on the people you're with.

By sober I mean not having any drink. Personally I just don't enjoy being around people who have drink taken if I don't too. I worked in bars for years and I think I'm just sick of the rubbish people (even people I really like) talk when drunk.

Look, I'm not trying to justify why some people drink and drive, clearly it's a stupid thing to do, but these are some of the reasons. Also, someone driving a mile home at 1am with a few pints on them in a country road isn't anything like the danger of someone driving flat out pissed, driving on main national roads for miles or driving around a town.

2RockMountain · 02-08-2016 07:38PM

Jayop wrote: »

Also, someone driving a mile home at 1am with a few pints on them in a country road isn't anything like the danger of someone driving flat out pissed, driving on main national roads for miles or driving around a town.

Unless of course, the lads who they were drinking with and who didn't decide to break the law happen to be walking home on that country road.

Jayop · 02-08-2016 07:45PM

2RockMountain wrote: »

Unless of course, the lads who they were drinking with and who didn't decide to break the law happen to be walking home on that country road.

I think you may slightly overplay the risks of someone driving with a few pints a mile out their own road. Not talking about people being hammered here.

2RockMountain · 02-08-2016 07:57PM

Jayop wrote: »

I think you may slightly overplay the risks of someone driving with a few pints a mile out their own road. Not talking about people being hammered here.

Risks? What risks? Shure it'll be grand, nay bother;

http://www.rsa.ie/en/RSA/Road-Safety/Campaigns/Current-road-safety-campaigns/Drink-Driving/Drunk-Driving-Myths--Facts/

Pinch Flat · 02-08-2016 08:18PM

Jayop wrote: »

I think you may slightly overplay the risks of someone driving with a few pints a mile out their own road. Not talking about people being hammered here.

Can you explain to me how that particular stretch of road is immune to other things you might encounter? Like pedestrians / other cars, or is there an omertà in place that keeps the roads free while a p!ssed driver finds his way home?

And why would you drive a mile when drunk - it takes about 15 minutes to walk.

Jayop · 02-08-2016 08:24PM

2RockMountain wrote: »

Risks? What risks? Shure it'll be grand, nay bother;

http://www.rsa.ie/en/RSA/Road-Safety/Campaigns/Current-road-safety-campaigns/Drink-Driving/Drunk-Driving-Myths--Facts/

None of that is really relevant.

Pinch Flat wrote: »

Can you explain to me how that particular stretch of road is immune to other things you might encounter? Like pedestrians / other cars, or is there an omertà in place that keeps the roads free while a p!ssed driver finds his way home?

And why would you drive a mile when drunk - it's takes about 15 minutes to walk.

I didn't say I do, did I? I said that's what people do and I didn't excuse it. But at the same time I'm not going to go nuts over stating the risks of someone with 3/4 pints driving a mile or so home from the pub at night on a quiet country road. It's stupid, it's against the law and they shouldn't do it but I don't think that they're likely to go careering into another car.

The real risk when only having a few is driving long distance with drink where concentration becomes an issue or driving recklessly. That's not what I'm referring to here, nor is it people who are hammered.

Faux outrage on boards, who would have thought it possible?

2RockMountain · 02-08-2016 08:57PM

Jayop wrote: »

None of that is really relevant.

Apart from the bit noting that the 'just a few pints' is still a significant risk factor: "1 in 5 drivers killed on our roads, where alcohol was present, were under the old legal limit (80mg) when they died"

Jayop wrote: »

I didn't say I do, did I? I said that's what people do and I didn't excuse it. But at the same time I'm not going to go nuts over stating the risks of someone with 3/4 pints driving a mile or so home from the pub at night on a quiet country road. It's stupid, it's against the law and they shouldn't do it but I don't think that they're likely to go careering into another car.

The real risk when only having a few is driving long distance with drink where concentration becomes an issue or driving recklessly. That's not what I'm referring to here, nor is it people who are hammered.

Strange that I'd have to spell this out, but 'careering into another car' isn't the only or major risk. Careering into a pedestrian (who may well be walking home along the same road, from the same pub, after the same few pints that may impact their ability to stay upright and judge their position) is another risk. Careering into a ditch or a tree is also a risk.

Jayop wrote: »

Faux outrage on boards, who would have thought it possible?

Denial about impacts of drink driving in Ireland? Who'd have thunk it...

Wigglepuppy · 02-08-2016 09:46PM

kupus wrote: »

Speed kills blah blah blah
Drink driving kills blah blah blah
Phone while driving kills blah blah blah.
Bald tires
Changing radios

All fooking waffle as I see it.

Start building proper roads and you will find the death rate drop.

But this costs too much so the gov and their rsa mouthpiece bleat on about every other excuse they can to take people's focus away that the roads are indeed Sh1te.

So safer roads (plenty of roads here are excellent - it is misrepresentative to say the roads are sh1te as if all of them are) would render drink driving, excessive speeding and not having your eye on the road no longer dangerous?

Jayop · 02-08-2016 09:58PM

2RockMountain wrote: »

Apart from the bit noting that the 'just a few pints' is still a significant risk factor: "1 in 5 drivers killed on our roads, where alcohol was present, were under the old legal limit (80mg) when they died"

Strange that I'd have to spell this out, but 'careering into another car' isn't the only or major risk. Careering into a pedestrian (who may well be walking home along the same road, from the same pub, after the same few pints that may impact their ability to stay upright and judge their position) is another risk. Careering into a ditch or a tree is also a risk.

Denial about impacts of drink driving in Ireland? Who'd have thunk it...

Were those 1 in 5 driving under the scenario I said is relatively safe or were they driving under the scenarios that I said weren't safe. In those 1 in 5 cases was the alcohol to blame?

I could say 1 in 5 drivers were listening to Joe Duffy so Joe Duffy is dangerous. It's clearly not true but you have to look further into things to see if they are relevant.

I'd say no one has died or killed anyone driving a mile up the road with 3 or 4 pints on board. There's no stats to back that up for or say it's wrong though.

2RockMountain · 02-08-2016 10:20PM

Jayop wrote: »

I'd say no one has died or killed anyone driving a mile up the road with 3 or 4 pints on board. There's no stats to back that up

Thanks for the clarification.

Jayop · 02-08-2016 10:31PM

2RockMountain wrote: »

Thanks for the clarification.

None to say I'm wrong though, thanks for the selective quote, great debating talents always do that.

Thoie · 02-08-2016 10:33PM

Jayop wrote: »

I'd say no one has died or killed anyone driving a mile up the road with 3 or 4 pints on board. There's no stats to back that up for or say it's wrong though.

I have one dead friend who'd like to differ. But he's dead, so he can't. Walking home from country pub after one or two pints. Driver who'd also had one or two pints and only lived "a bit down the road" hit him, killed him.

Now, the alcohol may not have played a part, but do you think the driver doesn't wonder every day if it would have happened if he hadn't been drinking? Do you think the rest of us don't wonder? It might all have played out exactly the same, but we'll never know.

I didn't drink and drive (even just for a mile down the road) before then, and I still won't do it now. Nor will I get into a car with a driver who's been drinking, no matter how plastered and tired I am, even if these high heels are killing my feet and I just want to get home.

Edit:
But look, Jayop has said he doesn't defend it, but is trying to explain it. I get that, but his explanations may make it seem like a good idea to someone else. "Sure everyone does it".

ED E · 02-08-2016 11:21PM

I've a cousin without the use of his right eye that'd also like to disagree with you Jayop.

Ask anyone from the part of the country I have ties to (rural, god awful roads) and they'll have an example of somebody DD and crashing on a short trip home for every digit on both hands.

2RockMountain · 02-08-2016 11:23PM

Jayop wrote: »

Were those 1 in 5 driving under the scenario I said is relatively safe or were they driving under the scenarios that I said weren't safe. In those 1 in 5 cases was the alcohol to blame?

I could say 1 in 5 drivers were listening to Joe Duffy so Joe Duffy is dangerous. It's clearly not true but you have to look further into things to see if they are relevant.

I'd say no one has died or killed anyone driving a mile up the road with 3 or 4 pints on board. There's no stats to back that up for or say it's wrong though.

Jayop wrote: »

None to say I'm wrong though, thanks for the selective quote, great debating talents always do that.

It's nothing to do with 'debating talent'. There is 50+ years of research showing that alcohol impairs driving ability. There is not years of research showing that listening to Joe Duffy impairs driving ability. But you're choosing to ignore this, 'cos the lads need want to get home from the pub.

Jayop · 02-08-2016 11:43PM

2RockMountain wrote: »

It's nothing to do with 'debating talent'. There is 50+ years of research showing that alcohol impairs driving ability. There is not years of research showing that listening to Joe Duffy impairs driving ability. But you're choosing to ignore this, 'cos the lads need want to get home from the pub.

I see you're making a habit of saying I said things that I didn't so I'll not bother to discuss with you anymore.

2RockMountain · 03-08-2016 12:22PM

Jayop wrote: »

I see you're making a habit of saying I said things that I didn't so I'll not bother to discuss with you anymore.

That wouldn't have anything to do with the fact that your utter BS has been exposed by the other two lads who pointed out the impact of the drink-driving that you're enabling?

The Backwards Man · 03-08-2016 12:35PM

My oul lad always said that if even only half a pint doesn't impair your driving it couldn't have been very bright to start with.

Drink Driving

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