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Attacks against Jews in Irish Free State.

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  • 20-07-2016 7:42pm
    #1
    BalcombeSt4
    Registered Users Posts: 1,780 ✭✭✭


    Just reading something there on wiki so don't know how accurate it is that 4 Jewish men were shot by far-right extremists killing 2 of them in Dublin in the space of about 2 weeks in November 1923. 2 were shot in St. Stephens Green & another 2 near Portobello. Anyone have any more info about these or know what group was involved and if there was anymore attacks like this directed against Jewish people or business' around this time?

    Never heard about anything like this in Ireland before except for a small boycott of Jewish business in Cork or Limerick (forgot which) in the early 1900's.


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    #2
    BalcombeSt4
    Registered Users Posts: 1,780 ✭✭✭BalcombeSt4


    There's a link https://comeheretome.com/2013/06/03/reactionary-murders-in-ireland/


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    #3
    Arsemageddon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,129 ✭✭✭Arsemageddon


    There is a good article on the pogrom in Limerick here. It may have been quote small, but it was a nasty episode.
    http://www.historyireland.com/20th-century-contemporary-history/the-limerick-pogrom-1904/

    Our current minister for foreign affairs Charlie Flanagan's father Oliver was a rabid anti-Semite. It's often been suggested that Charlie Flanagan's pro-Israel stance is due to him wanting to atone for his father.

    Here's a few quotes from Oliver's first day in the Dail.
    I am very sorry that I cannot associate myself with this Bill or with anything relating to the public safety measures introduced by the Cumann na nGaedheal Government or by the present Fianna Fáil Government because I have seen that most of these Emergency Acts were always directed against Republicanism. How is it that we do not see any of these Acts directed against the Jews, who crucified Our Saviour nineteen hundred years ago, and who are crucifying us every day in the week?
    How is it that there are thousands of well educated young men being forced to take the emigrant ship, not from Galway Bay or Cobh this time to take them to the greater Ireland beyond the Atlantic, but to take them from Dun Laoghaire and Rosslare to the land beyond the Irish Sea, the land of our traditional enemy, to help England in her war effort against Germany? There is one thing that Germany did, and that was to rout the Jews out of their country. Until we rout the Jews out of this country it does not matter a hair's breadth what orders you make. Where the bees are there is the honey, and where the Jews are there is the money.

    http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail1943070900009?opendocument


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    #4
    tac foley
    Registered Users Posts: 5,504 ✭✭✭tac foley


    Quote - 'where the Jews are there is the money.'

    In that case, why am't I rich?

    tac


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    #5
    Jesus.
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,794 ✭✭✭Jesus.


    Why does Tac put his name after every post he makes?


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    #6
    KingBrian2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,363 ✭✭✭KingBrian2


    That guy sounds like a real asshole.


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    #7
    tac foley
    Registered Users Posts: 5,504 ✭✭✭tac foley


    KingBrian2 wrote: »
    That guy sounds like a real asshole.

    You talking about me or Jesus?

    Personal attacks are a no-no on this site, Mr KingBrian.

    tac


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    #8
    jonniebgood1
    Registered Users Posts: 3,577 ✭✭✭jonniebgood1


    KingBrian2 wrote: »
    That guy sounds like a real asshole.

    Infraction for personal abuse.
    Any queries by pm only, otherwise ban may be applied
    Moderator


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    #9
    BalcombeSt4
    Registered Users Posts: 1,780 ✭✭✭BalcombeSt4


    Arsemageddon wrote: »
    There is a good article on the pogrom in Limerick here. It may have been quote small, but it was a nasty episode.
    http://www.historyireland.com/20th-century-contemporary-history/the-limerick-pogrom-1904/

    Our current minister for foreign affairs Charlie Flanagan's father Oliver was a rabid anti-Semite. It's often been suggested that Charlie Flanagan's pro-Israel stance is due to him wanting to atone for his father.

    Here's a few quotes from Oliver's first day in the Dail.





    http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail1943070900009?opendocument

    What I find amazing is that he was a Fine Gael TD up until 1987.


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    #10
    BalcombeSt4
    Registered Users Posts: 1,780 ✭✭✭BalcombeSt4


    jonniebgood1 wrote: »
    Infraction for personal abuse.
    Any queries by pm only, otherwise ban may be applied
    Moderator

    Eh, I think he was talking about Charlie Flanagan's farther.


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    #11
    jonniebgood1
    Registered Users Posts: 3,577 ✭✭✭jonniebgood1


    Im Open to clarification by poster in question.


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    #12
    Ascendant
    Registered Users Posts: 196 ✭✭Ascendant


    BalcombeSt4 wrote: »
    What I find amazing is that he was a Fine Gael TD up until 1987.

    Including a term as Minister of Defence in the '70s under Liam Cosgrave.

    Amazing, indeed, that a man who was obsessed with the idea that Jews and Freemasons were contriving to screw everyone else over - 'cos we're just that damned special - should not only continue in public life but rise so highly.

    Different times, I suppose, but still... o_O


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    #13
    riffmongous
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 12,629 Mod ✭✭✭✭riffmongous


    Took good care of his constituents I guess. Nothing more on the story in the OP? I thought I knew every major incident in our history


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    #14
    Ascendant
    Registered Users Posts: 196 ✭✭Ascendant


    BalcombeSt4 wrote: »
    There's a link https://comeheretome.com/2013/06/03/reactionary-murders-in-ireland/

    No murders involved this time, but three years later, in 1926, there was the IRA campaign against moneylenders which, as you can imagine, was accused of having certain dubious connotations:

    The 1926 IRA campaign against Moneylenders.
    In the summer of 1926 the IRA launched a campaign to rid Dublin of the scourge of moneylenders. The IRA was forced to defend these activities against accusations of sectarianism, they insisted that it was in the interests of the poor of the city and was in no way anti-Semitic. The operation involved armed raids on the homes of known moneylenders and the confiscation of their ledgers, record books and documentation. The campaign, which resulted in the arrest of several members of the IRA, reflected a change in IRA policy away from the national question towards social issues.


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    #15
    tac foley
    Registered Users Posts: 5,504 ✭✭✭tac foley


    I'm reminded of the one Irishman who became President of Israel - Chaim Herzog.

    He did quite well for himself, eh?

    tac


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    #16
    Jesus.
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,794 ✭✭✭Jesus.


    jonniebgood1 wrote: »
    Infraction for personal abuse.

    What?!!


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    #17
    Ascendant
    Registered Users Posts: 196 ✭✭Ascendant


    riffmongous wrote: »
    I thought I knew every major incident in our history

    The more one learns, the more you realise how little you know...

    (yes, a cliche but true)


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    #18
    tac foley
    Registered Users Posts: 5,504 ✭✭✭tac foley


    A recent gubmint minister [of justice?], Alan something, is Jewish.

    tac


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    #19
    davycc
    Registered Users Posts: 9,019 ✭✭✭davycc


    tac foley wrote: »
    A recent gubmint minister [of justice?], Alan something, is Jewish.

    tac

    alan shatter is the guy your thinking of . erotic novelist in his downtime:pac:

    i have italian jewish bloodline myself ,g-grandad coming over to ireland and marrying an irish lady over a century ago in munster. hope they didnt experience any hassle from these clowns. im an athiest myself ex catholic.


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    #20
    tac foley
    Registered Users Posts: 5,504 ✭✭✭tac foley


    Hmmm, well, unless you have a female Jewish person in your direct line, then you are not Jewish. It's a matriarchal thing, I'm afraid, not a fatheral.

    tac


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    #21
    riffmongous
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 12,629 Mod ✭✭✭✭riffmongous


    Ascendant wrote: »
    The more one learns, the more you realise how little you know...

    (yes, a cliche but true)

    Well it's just this topic comes up fairly often, often with an agenda attached whenever Israel-Palestine kicks off, so if there was any more muck to be raked I thought we would have heard it already.


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    #22
    MK64
    Registered Users Posts: 1 ✭MK64


    If you are really interested in this and prepared to do a bit of digging then you should go to the Military Service Pensions website and search for two guys William Roe and James Patrick Conroy. Have a read of the descriptions and then download their files.

    Basically Conroy, a pro-Treaty National Army officer, 1916 veteran with major service with the IRA in Dublin during the War of Independence, seems to have been one of those who shot Ernest Kahn and a second man referred to as Goldberg or Goldenberg. Amazingly Roe, who was a senior anti-Treaty IRA man in Dublin - and also a 1916 veteran - claims that Kahn was shot in a case of mistaken identity because whoever killed him thought he was Roe!

    Whatever the truth I do remember reading somewhere – the Irish Times I think - that these shootings were considered so serious and so embarrassing for the government that Kevin O’Higgins and possibly others had to issue statements reassuring an understandably nervous Jewish community in Ireland.

    Meanwhile Conroy legged it to the USA from 1924 until 1932 by which time it was found impossible to convict him of the killing. It took him a couple of years more and a visit to the Supreme Court for him to finally get his service pension from a reluctant government.


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    #23
    BalcombeSt4
    Registered Users Posts: 1,780 ✭✭✭BalcombeSt4


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/100489701#Comment_100489701

    That's some pretty wild & controversial stuff.

    The government & church did a good job of keeping it out of the history books.



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    #24
    Peregrinus
    Registered Users Posts: 26,060 ✭✭✭✭Peregrinus


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118232585#Comment_118232585

    I await with interest your evidence that either the government or the church had any hand, act or part in keeping this out of the history books.



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    #25
    BalcombeSt4
    Registered Users Posts: 1,780 ✭✭✭BalcombeSt4


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118243103#Comment_118243103

    Well it' not in the history books. You know Ireland was one of the worst countries in Europe for censorship in the 20th century, and I include the eastern Soviet buffer states. And like their Soviet counterparts they were very good at hiding evidence.

    This state since the 1930's - late 1980's had been run like a Catholic Theocracy, nothing could be done with the Bishops or a Cadinals approval. Dev himself felt that the arts in Ireland were to be promoted only when they observed the "holiest traditions", but should be censored when they failed to live up to this ideal. Section 31, what they were doing there was what Chomsky called "manufacturing consent".

    And people wonder why Protestants didn't want to live a Priest Ridden state.

    When you think about it, how the local priest would get info on pretty much your whole life, and if he thought you would be a threat to the state, because you might be a republican communist, socialist, anarchist etc... he reports you to a Bishop. The Church pretty much controlled large aspects of your life that's pretty totalitarian stuff,



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    #26
    Peregrinus
    Registered Users Posts: 26,060 ✭✭✭✭Peregrinus


    That's your evidence?



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    #27
    MakersMark
    Registered Users Posts: 613 ✭✭✭MakersMark


    Interesting Guardian article, wasn't just De Valera who missed Hitler.


    https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/world/2005/dec/31/secondworldwar.ireland




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    #28
    Peregrinus
    Registered Users Posts: 26,060 ✭✭✭✭Peregrinus


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118498083#Comment_118498083

    Your link isn't working for me. Can you check it?



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    #29
    iwasliedto
    Registered Users Posts: 83 ✭✭iwasliedto


    There were a few free state officers knocking around in the early 20's who didn't think twice about murdering whoever got in their way. They left a trail of bodies around South Dublin. I suppose they saw these guys as a problem for whatever reason or none and knew that they could get away with it like the other officers who were at the same business.



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    #30
    Snickers Man
    Registered Users Posts: 5,301 ✭✭✭Snickers Man


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118498127#Comment_118498127

    Try this:

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2005/dec/31/secondworldwar.ireland




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    #31
    BalcombeSt4
    Registered Users Posts: 1,780 ✭✭✭BalcombeSt4


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118497938#Comment_118497938

    Are you denying the Catholic Church played an unusually high role in Irish politics in the last 150 years?



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