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Son of a Bun: FSAI closure

1246

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,005 ✭✭✭✭Toto Wolfcastle


    I've wanted to try this place for awhile but I've never had the chance when I've been in Cork. We love Bunsen in Dublin who also serve their burgers pink. I wouldn't be put off by the closure, but I am put off by the fact that they're not cooking the burgers medium now. I'd imagine that an awful lot of people ordered them well done anyway but it was great to see a choice for people who like them pink.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,876 ✭✭✭✭the beer revolu


    Funny thing is that the one time I went there, my burger came out well done.
    I was not impressed.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,243 ✭✭✭ebbsy


    Fsai do not close down businesses unless :

    1 There are structural issues
    2 Rodent or insect infestation
    3 Continual non compliance with instructions
    given.

    They don't do it lightly.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 12,132 ✭✭✭✭pwurple


    ROY RACE wrote: »
    I said the majority not everyone -Are you still angry ya mad thing :P

    Try speaking for yourself... That'll be plenty for ya. :p


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,475 ✭✭✭Elliott S


    I still think it's kind of gas. The place made a point of selling a product that is well known to be a risky way of eating meat.

    Well, it's a way of eating meat that can be perfectly fine and safe, but everything has to be in place to ensure this happens. A staff member being lax on hygiene or something in the kitchen organisation that allows cross-contamination for example can easily jeopardise the safety of the product. (not saying these were the case here, it's just a for instance)

    And a restaurant that made a huge deal of their pink burgers really needs to be completely on top of ensuring the safety of those burgers. I was totally trusting on that score. When it opened, I thought "Yeah, they'll not risk anything in serving those burgers because it's their unique selling point". So it's a bit worrying.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,712 ✭✭✭roundymac


    Eating mince beef rare is not safe by any streach of the imagination. It is one sure fired way to get food poisening.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,150 ✭✭✭✭Malari


    roundymac wrote: »
    Eating mince beef rare is not safe by any streach of the imagination. It is one sure fired way to get food poisening.

    Not necessarily though. If the food is prepared and stored correctly, and is cooked to 70 degrees, even if it's still pink, it should be safe.

    Of course, it's not without risk!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,475 ✭✭✭Elliott S


    roundymac wrote: »
    Eating mince beef rare is not safe by any streach of the imagination.

    Well, this isn't true.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,534 ✭✭✭gctest50


    roundymac wrote: »
    Eating mince beef rare is not safe by any streach of the imagination. It is one sure fired way to get food poisening.

    stop, you don't know what yer missing :

    https://www.aldi.ie/en/recipes/recipes-by-category/the-restaurant/steak-tartare-pomme-frites/


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,712 ✭✭✭roundymac


    gctest50 wrote: »
    Well away you so lads. I'm sure you'll get a reduction in toilet paper as well if you buy it in bulk.:P


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,933 ✭✭✭H8GHOTI


    Anyone been in since it reopened?
    What was it like?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 18,966 ✭✭✭✭syklops


    Andip wrote: »
    I love steak tartare, I also like my steaks rare - that's my personal choice and my personal risk. If I'm paying for a meal, either I get the choice of how I have my food cooked or I simply don't eat there.

    Even Aldi list a steak tartare recipe on their website !. I personally wont have a problem eating in Son of a Bun again.

    I was in a restaurant in Blackrock years ago. I ordered a steak and when asked how I wanted it done I said Blue. The waitress came back and said the chef wouldnt serve it blue as it wasn't safe. I said fine, in that case, I won't be having the steak.

    If a chef is buying good quality meat and storing it safely he should be perfectly happy to serve it blue. That this one wasnt comfortable doing that, suggested to me something was up somewhere.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,467 ✭✭✭daveyjoe


    syklops wrote: »
    I was in a restaurant in Blackrock years ago. I ordered a steak and when asked how I wanted it done I said Blue. The waitress came back and said the chef wouldnt serve it blue as it wasn't safe. I said fine, in that case, I won't be having the steak.

    If a chef is buying good quality meat and storing it safely he should be perfectly happy to serve it blue. That this one wasnt comfortable doing that, suggested to me something was up somewhere.

    In fairness, although it's common on the continent, the majority of restaurants in Ireland won't serve a blue steak.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,150 ✭✭✭✭Malari


    daveyjoe wrote: »
    In fairness, although it's common on the continent, the majority of restaurants in Ireland won't serve a blue steak.

    Really? I have never come across that. As in, I've never been told by waiting staff that they don't serve it that way, regardless of whether I actually get a blue steak! :pac:


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,577 ✭✭✭kub


    syklops wrote: »
    I was in a restaurant in Blackrock years ago. I ordered a steak and when asked how I wanted it done I said Blue. The waitress came back and said the chef wouldnt serve it blue as it wasn't safe. I said fine, in that case, I won't be having the steak.

    If a chef is buying good quality meat and storing it safely he should be perfectly happy to serve it blue. That this one wasnt comfortable doing that, suggested to me something was up somewhere.

    Blackrock in Cork or Dublin?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,876 ✭✭✭✭the beer revolu


    daveyjoe wrote: »
    In fairness, although it's common on the continent, the majority of restaurants in Ireland won't serve a blue steak.

    I've never heard of a restaurant refusing to serve a blue steak.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,262 ✭✭✭beer enigma


    I've never heard of a restaurant refusing to serve a blue steak.

    Trust me it happens, I changed my order to fish last time only because the rest of the party had ordered.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,994 ✭✭✭Cool_CM


    roundymac wrote: »
    Eating mince beef rare is not safe by any streach of the imagination. It is one sure fired way to get food poisening.

    Don't get me wrong, I like my steaks rare and enjoy the odd steak tartare, but I once watched on in horror as an Austrian colleague of mine got hungry on a commuter train journey, opened up her raw mincemeat (the pre-packaged Dunnes one) and proceeded to casually eat the whole thing with bread. Apparently, in her eyes, such behaviour was completely normal and she was grand the next day. I'd imagine that, like most things, people build up a bit of a tolerance towards it. :eek:


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,475 ✭✭✭Elliott S


    Cool_CM wrote: »
    Don't get me wrong, I like my steaks rare and enjoy the odd steak tartare, but I once watched on in horror as an Austrian colleague of mine got hungry on a commuter train journey, opened up her raw mincemeat (the pre-packaged Dunnes one) and proceeded to casually eat the whole thing with bread. Apparently, in her eyes, such behaviour was completely normal and she was grand the next day. I'd imagine that, like most things, people build up a bit of a tolerance towards it. :eek:

    Now, that's bad. I'd only eat freshly mince beef raw. Like within a few hours. Anything longer than that, no way.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,876 ✭✭✭✭the beer revolu


    I passed SOAB yesterday at around 7.30. I'm pleased to say it appeared to be as busy as ever - no one waiting for tables but pretty much every table occupied.
    It would appear that 'the majority' of people in Cork aren't half as hysterical as some of the posters here;)


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 9,614 ✭✭✭Padraig Mor


    I passed SOAB yesterday at around 7.30. I'm pleased to say it appeared to be as busy as ever - no one waiting for tables but pretty much every table occupied.
    It would appear that 'the majority' of people in Cork aren't half as hysterical as some of the posters here;)
    I don't think it's "hysterical" to raise questions about eating in a restaurant whose food safety management has been proven to be so inadequate that eight people were apparently infected with a potentially fatal bug.

    Let's be clear here - this isn't just a 'pink burger' issue. I'd happily eat a pink burger if I was confident in the restaurant's processes. I sure as hell wouldn't be confident in SOAB's. Cooking thoroughly is just one of a number of hurdles that a bug must overcome to pose a threat to health - in fact, cooking is the 'last resort' hurdle if others fail. In this case, presumably you have an issue of their meat supply being inferior AND poor hygiene practices AND undercooking. For a restaurant which advertised themselves on the basis of their pink burgers not to ensure strict supplier quality and robust hygiene and training in house beggars belief and attests to very lax management - the same management which is still in place AFAIK. That they seemingly openly lied about HSE approval for cooking pink raises further questions. As I said, I'd eat a pink burger, but not in SOAB.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,475 ✭✭✭Elliott S


    I passed SOAB yesterday at around 7.30. I'm pleased to say it appeared to be as busy as ever - no one waiting for tables but pretty much every table occupied.
    It would appear that 'the majority' of people in Cork aren't half as hysterical as some of the posters here;)

    Many of the posts haven't been "hysterical", many have been quite measured in this thread. A lot of the people expressing worry seem happy to eat safe raw mince. Restaurants aren't closed willy nilly.

    And if there was nobody waiting for tables, that might indeed be a sign that it is less busy than it was.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,876 ✭✭✭✭the beer revolu


    [quote="Elliott S;100351671".

    And if there was nobody waiting for tables, that might indeed be a sign that it is less busy than it was.[/quote]

    It was 7.30 on a Wednesday.
    Maybe ever so slightly down on previous business but nothing like what you might expect from the attitude from some on this thread.

    After what has happened (and yes, it is serious) I genuinely believe that from a food safety point of view SOAB is probably the safest kitchen in Cork. Their business depends on it and they know that they're going to be closely monitored.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,475 ✭✭✭Elliott S


    After what has happened (and yes, it is serious) I genuinely believe that from a food safety point of view SOAB is probably the safest kitchen in Cork. Their business depends on it and they know that they're going to be closely monitored.

    Maybe it will make them the safest place to eat but as said two posts up, the fact that they didnt ensure the safety of the food after heavily advertising their pink burgers (all the pre-opening marketing was centred on this), doesn't inspire confidence. This was their USP. Shoddy stuff. It is most certainly not hysterical to point this out. A handful of posts in the thread were over the top, that's all.

    Time will tell whether this will affect them. Anecdotes about how busy they looked from the outside doesn't tell us much yet. Hopefully they've got their act together.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,400 ✭✭✭Nonoperational


    I don't think it's "hysterical" to raise questions about eating in a restaurant whose food safety management has been proven to be so inadequate that eight people were apparently infected with a potentially fatal bug.

    Let's be clear here - this isn't just a 'pink burger' issue. I'd happily eat a pink burger if I was confident in the restaurant's processes. I sure as hell wouldn't be confident in SOAB's. Cooking thoroughly is just one of a number of hurdles that a bug must overcome to pose a threat to health - in fact, cooking is the 'last resort' hurdle if others fail. In this case, presumably you have an issue of their meat supply being inferior AND poor hygiene practices AND undercooking. For a restaurant which advertised themselves on the basis of their pink burgers not to ensure strict supplier quality and robust hygiene and training in house beggars belief and attests to very lax management - the same management which is still in place AFAIK. That they seemingly openly lied about HSE approval for cooking pink raises further questions. As I said, I'd eat a pink burger, but not in SOAB.
    Elliott S wrote: »
    Maybe it will make them the safest place to eat but as said two posts up, the fact that they didnt ensure the safety of the food after heavily advertising their pink burgers (all the pre-opening marketing was centred on this), doesn't inspire confidence. This was their USP. Shoddy stuff. It is most certainly not hysterical to point this out. A handful of posts in the thread were over the top, that's all.

    Time will tell whether this will affect them. Anecdotes about how busy they looked from the outside doesn't tell us much yet. Hopefully they've got their act together.

    Agree completely. There are only a handful of places per year closed down immediately. They dropped the ball big time. Not just in layout and food safety, but in members of staff having faecal bacteria on their hands. I thought the discussion was for the most part reasonable, but to be honest if I got 0157 and my servers were serving me with dirty hands, well its pretty terrible, and shows complete contempt for the customers.

    Anyway, hope people enjoy their well done burgers now.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,262 ✭✭✭beer enigma


    Agree completely. There are only a handful of places per year closed down immediately. They dropped the ball big time. Not just in layout and food safety, but in members of staff having faecal bacteria on their hands. I thought the discussion was for the most part reasonable, but to be honest if I got 0157 and my servers were serving me with dirty hands, well its pretty terrible, and shows complete contempt for the customers.

    Anyway, hope people enjoy their well done burgers now.

    Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't thing there was an issue of meat quality or supplier ?. I agree that unclean hands are a huge issue, but let's face it, I'm sure there are restaurants out there that just haven't been caught so far. I've been unlucky enough to get food poisoning from a couple of Cork restaurants over the years, ok I'm a big shellfish eater, but I don't think SOAB were/are the worst offenders. I would wonder moving into such an old building, there must have been sign off from health inspectors, my worry is more that the authorities may have dropped the ball as well as the restaurant.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,288 ✭✭✭✭Water John


    Andip, I'm wishing SOAB the best for the future. But they did spoof on having an HSE licience for pink burgers.
    The level of food security for this should be very high. Ecoli 157 is not simple food poisoning. A bit of the trots.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,262 ✭✭✭beer enigma


    Water John wrote: »
    Andip, I'm wishing SOAB the best for the future. But they did spoof on having an HSE licience for pink burgers.
    The level of food security for this should be very high. Ecoli 157 is not simple food poisoning. A bit of the trots.

    Yep, sorry my point was more that given the age of the building and previous use, the change to a restaurant should have given to hse crawling all over it. For such drastic changes within a relatively short time of opening to be demanded now, implies a lack of inspection.

    Lack of cleanliness can never be excused, simple hand washing can cure a multitude of sins, I too wish them all the best and will indeed eat there again, but the owners naivety has shown through and again, whilst not excusing their responsibilities, the fact that they were new should again have required more inspection.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,288 ✭✭✭✭Water John


    They have a previous restaurant in Bandon, plenty experience.
    Summer time is a major problem with casual staff.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 9,614 ✭✭✭Padraig Mor


    Andip wrote: »
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't thing there was an issue of meat quality or supplier ?. I agree that unclean hands are a huge issue, but let's face it, I'm sure there are restaurants out there that just haven't been caught so far. I've been unlucky enough to get food poisoning from a couple of Cork restaurants over the years, ok I'm a big shellfish eater, but I don't think SOAB were/are the worst offenders. I would wonder moving into such an old building, there must have been sign off from health inspectors, my worry is more that the authorities may have dropped the ball as well as the restaurant.

    Beef contamination with E coli O157 rarely results from human carriers spreading it to meat - it's generally due to faecal contamination at slaughter. O157 doesn't really make cattle ill, and they can carry it without symptoms. Mincing the meat makes the problem acute - the bacteria are now spread throughout the meat, rather than just being on the surface where they should be killed by brief cooking.

    Cross contamination between raw and cooked meat is another big problem - I imagine inadequate separation of the two is the reason for the 'structural' work. Worst of all is keeping minced O157 contaminated meat at elevated temperatures for extended periods - although I'm not suggesting that was the case here.

    My reading of the reports suggests that staff weren't found with O157 on their hands, rather 'normal' E coli instead, an indicator of faecal contamination - ie they had traces of poo on their hands.


This discussion has been closed.
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