I need some help here please!?

Haemoglobin · 17-06-2016 2:53pm #1

Hey everyone, I'm, going into 5th year in August.

I want to study engineering in uni, and then get a masters in Nanotechnology, but I have 1 problem.

I'm not that great at maths, and to do engineering in Uni, I need a minimum HC3 in higher level maths.

A good chunk of engineering is also built around physics, so I'm stuck at should I do physics for the LC even though I'm not good in maths?

I had to get grinds to get me through the JC, and came out with a C in higher maths.
I found it very hard to understand the maths in Transition year, and I'm pretty sure I failed the end of year exam. I was getting lower than 30% on all the class tests I took. But, I did get probably the WORST teacher.

I was going to drop down to pass maths, but then I found out I NEED higher.

And I also *kind of* need physics. My subjects I picked for LC already are: Biology, Chemistry, Home Ec and French. I'm contemplating on switching Home Ec for Physics. BUT I don't know what to do because I find maths so hard to grasp!!

Any suggestions guys?? Please ?

LordHypnos · 17-06-2016 3:09pm

why do you want to do engineering?

Haemoglobin · 17-06-2016 3:14pm

LordHypnos wrote: »

why do you want to do engineering?

I want to be a Nanotechnology engineer, developing new technologies and devices, stuff like that.
I want to be an engineer because I want to develop new things, ideas, help the world, change lives. I want to make a difference, even if it's just one person.

MessIsMine · 17-06-2016 3:21pm

I don't know much about engineering myself, but I know someone doing an undergrad nanotechnology course in DIT and he loves it. I don't think you need higher maths. Would you not look at going straight into nanotechnology if that's what you want to do eventually? I don't even think you need physics.

LordHypnos · 17-06-2016 3:25pm

Haemoglobin wrote: »

I want to be a Nanotechnology engineer, developing new technologies and devices, stuff like that.
I want to be an engineer because I want to develop new things, ideas, help the world, change lives. I want to make a difference, even if it's just one person.

fair enough but you could pursue a career in science if you're not good at maths since you're doing chemistry and biology, don't limit yourself to one pathway. There's a lot of ways to help the world and engineering is not the only choice you've got - you've got loads of options and you're not even in 5th year! You're more than likely going to think differently by the time you fill out the CAO so I wouldn't worry about anything right now, just keep working hard and being a kid!

Haemoglobin · 17-06-2016 3:27pm

MessIsMine wrote: »

I don't know much about engineering myself, but I know someone doing an undergrad nanotechnology course in DIT and he loves it. I don't think you need higher maths. Would you not look at going straight into nanotechnology if that's what you want to do eventually? I don't even think you need physics.

I looked at the nanoscience course in TCD and your need 595 points, I don't think I can get that so I went to look at UCD and its a postgrad nanotechnology course, but you need to have a degree in undergrad physics, chemistry, material science or engineering.

Good point, I'll have a look at DIT. I'm still trying to find the best course to suit.

thanks for your help.

TSMGUY · 17-06-2016 3:33pm

LOL at wanting to do a masters in nanotechnology but hating maths! That's like wanting to be a geriatric nurse but hating old people and having a phobia of germs.

I'm not trying to be mean, I was in a similar situation. I used to want to be a theoretical physicist but then I realized I'm a) lazy as hell and b)good at maths but hate doing it. I realized I preferred the idea of being a physicist to actually doing physics. Make sure you don't just like the idea of being a nanotechnologist (not that it's a glamorous career lol) and that you're actually interested in nanotechnology (which seems unlikely seeing as you don't like maths)

Choose wisely. Just because you get into an engineering course doesn't mean you'll like it. AND IF YOU'RE DOING IT FOR THE MONEY, DON'T!

Haemoglobin · 17-06-2016 3:33pm

LordHypnos wrote: »

fair enough but you could pursue a career in science if you're not good at maths since you're doing chemistry and biology, don't limit yourself to one pathway. There's a lot of ways to help the world and engineering is not the only choice you've got - you've got loads of options and you're not even in 5th year! You're more than likely going to think differently by the time you fill out the CAO so I wouldn't worry about anything right now, just keep working hard and being a kid!

thanks

!

TSMGUY wrote: »

LOL at wanting to do a masters in nanotechnology but hating maths! That's like wanting to be a geriatric nurse but hating old people and having a phobia of germs.

I'm not trying to be mean, I was in a similar situation. I used to want to be a theoretical physicist but then I realized I'm a) lazy as hell and b)good at maths but hate doing it. I realized I preferred the idea of being a physicist to actually doing physics. Make sure you don't just like the idea of being a nanotechnologist (not that it's a glamorous career lol) and that you're actually interested in nanotechnology (which seems unlikely seeing as you don't like maths)

Choose wisely. Just because you get into an engineering course doesn't mean you'll like it. AND IF YOU'RE DOING IT FOR THE MONEY, DON'T!

Thanks for that nonsense. I've been interested in technology since I was very, very young. I don't need you here, please go somewhere else. Thanks.

MessIsMine wrote: »

I don't know much about engineering myself, but I know someone doing an undergrad nanotechnology course in DIT and he loves it. I don't think you need higher maths. Would you not look at going straight into nanotechnology if that's what you want to do eventually? I don't even think you need physics.

Haemoglobin wrote: »

I looked at the nanoscience course in TCD and your need 595 points, I don't think I can get that so I went to look at UCD and its a postgrad nanotechnology course, but you need to have a degree in undergrad physics, chemistry, material science or engineering.

Good point, I'll have a look at DIT. I'm still trying to find the best course to suit. thanks for your help.

Thank you so much for pointing out the DIT course! I think it's the way to go! Do you know how many points and what grades he needed for entry? (It's mostly the points I'm stuck at now haha)

cruizer101 · 17-06-2016 4:26pm

Haemoglobin wrote: »

Thanks for that nonsense. I've been interested in technology since I was very, very young. I don't need you here, please go somewhere else. Thanks.

To be fair he is probably not wrong, before deciding to drop to lower maths you need to talk to some people in nano-technology to find out more about what is required, I would be surprised if there is not a lot of complicated maths involved.

DIT and I think some of the other IT's do have options to get into engineering without higher maths, often you can progress from a diploma course which doesn't require it to a degree course if you do well enough. Talk to your Careers teacher about it.

TSMGUY · 17-06-2016 4:39pm

Haemoglobin wrote: »

Thanks for that nonsense. I've been interested in technology since I was very, very young. I don't need you here, please go somewhere else. Thanks.

Jesus, passive aggressive much! Just giving you a real-world insight rather than placating you and telling you everything's gonna be alright. I hope you're more resilient in real when you're forced to do highly abstract and demanding calculus everyday for 4 years, which considering your aversion to hl Leaving maths,, seems like it'll drive you mad.

You're like a guy who watches an episode of Suits and says "I could be a lawyer!" and then gets pissed when someone points out the amount of work involved. Despite your snark, I wish you the best of luck.

unseenfootage · 17-06-2016 4:45pm

The maths that is part of physics is not as hard as the math in engineering. It is probably on par with maths in science.

MessIsMine · 17-06-2016 4:49pm

Haemoglobin wrote: »

Thank you so much for pointing out the DIT course! I think it's the way to go! Do you know how many points and what grades he needed for entry? (It's mostly the points I'm stuck at now haha)

Online it says the points in 2015 were 325, I think they went down from 350. These are very achievable points for most people. It's probably one of the less popular nano science courses, although it's probably just as good as any and it's four years long. The points will most likely go up or down by the time you're doing the leaving, but I wouldn't worry about it.
According to Qualifax you need:

Minimum Grade in:
Maths: OB3
English or Irish: OD3

Other Requirements:
At least Higher Level C3 in one of:
Physics, Chemistry, Physics & Chemistry, Biology, Mathematics, Applied Mathematics, Agricultural Science, Engineering,Technical Drawing, Technology or Design and Communication Graphics.

mordeith · 17-06-2016 4:55pm

unseenfootage wrote: »

The maths that is part of physics is not as hard as the math in engineering. It is probably on par with maths in science.

Physics is science

Zillah · 17-06-2016 4:57pm

Isn't nanotechnology likely to be one of the most mathematically intense fields you could ever go into? The maths governing the behaviour of quantum states and the like is some real mind-melting stuff, and if you are not good at maths at this stage you might be in real trouble for what's coming later.

I really think you need to learn more about what is actually involved day-to-day in learning and working in nanotech before you launch yourself down the career path.

There are lots of ways to contribute to the world.

TSMGUY probably should have been more polite about it, but he's not wrong.

TSMGUY · 17-06-2016 5:03pm

Zillah wrote: »

Isn't nanotechnology likely to be one of the most mathematically intense fields you could ever go into? The maths governing the behaviour of quantum states and the like is some real mind-melting stuff, and if you are not good at maths at this stage you might be in real trouble for what's coming later.

I really think you need to learn more about what is actually involved day-to-day in learning and working in nanotech before you launch yourself down the career path.

There are lots of ways to contribute to the world.

TSMGUY probably should have been more polite about it, but he's not wrong.

I assumed being an aspiring engineer he/she'd be more objective/less emotional. Evidently I was wrong.

LordHypnos · 17-06-2016 5:06pm

TSMGUY wrote: »

I assumed being an aspiring engineer he/she'd be more objective/less emotional. Evidently I was wrong.

you're asking quite a bit from a ~15 year old

KCross · 17-06-2016 5:09pm

Maybe there is an alternative route (longer) to getting your preferred masters.

You could drop to lower level maths now and get into a cert/diploma engineering course and then onto a degree and finally a masters. I know folks who have gone that route because they didnt have HL maths for leaving cert. Its a longer more difficult route as you generally need to top your class in the dip to get into the degree and it takes a year longer as well.

Higher maths is not always required for the actual course content, its just used to filter people out in the CAO process.

However, engineering and masters in nanotechnology suggests you might need it.

I think you need to talk to someone in your preferred engineering degree course and look at the actual course content. If it fries your brain then a masters in nanotechnology just isnt for you and you need to look elsewhere.

Its good you are exploring your options at this point. Its better than picking the wrong course and have to switch to something else later.

Best of luck.

unseenfootage · 17-06-2016 5:14pm

mordeith wrote: »

Physics is science

True... I was differentiating it from the other sciences. Poor choice of words..

TSMGUY · 17-06-2016 5:17pm

LordHypnos wrote: »

you're asking quite a bit from a ~15 year old

Well, I'd rather not patronize him. If he's old enough to decide he's gonna do a master's in nanotechnology without even having his JC results, I think he's old enough for some proper advice. I wouldn't tell a 21 year old with a first class degree in maths to do a masters in nanotech if they hated maths. If he's finding maths difficult at this stage, it's unlikely he'll have the propensity or passion for a master's in nanotech. Not being a pessimist, just working off the info he's given us.

Better he gets a few seconds of blunt advice than 5 years of maths he can't stand. Anyway, it's his life. He'll find out in time what he is/isn't capable of and if he doesn't want advice, that's his choice. Shouldn't make a thread asking for the wisdom of elders just to dismiss it scornfully when it doesn't gel with his very skewed notion of reality.

Haemoglobin · 17-06-2016 5:21pm

Thanks everyone for the help so far. I think the reason why I find maths so hard is because I've never actually properly studied for the exams.
I didn't study for the 1st and 2nd year exams, and just a little for the JC and then did nothing again for the TY exams. It's time to knuckle down now and actually study as soon as 5th year starts. I really want this as a career.

TSMGUY, sorry I was just kind of offended at how you approached the matter.

I did understand a good part of physics when we had it as a module in TY. So maybe I'll be ok with a few maths grinds here and there.
DIT is the only college I can find offering the easiest route, it's the only undergrad course I can find.

Anyone know if DIT is good? I don't exactly want to be getting my hopes up.

donegal. · 17-06-2016 5:21pm

will you have a different teacher for leaving cert year than t y?

i dropped down from honours to pass maths about 6months before the leaving .pass is very easy in comparison . It was only later i realised the teacher was terrible , i could have got an honour with any other teacher.

i had no problem with maths in university. I'd stick with honours for now and see how it works out.

also its not easy finding out what is involved in a days work in any field. Do you know what a nanotechnologist does all day ?

TSMGUY · 17-06-2016 5:39pm

Haemoglobin wrote: »

Thanks everyone for the help so far. I think the reason why I find maths so hard is because I've never actually properly studied for the exams.
I didn't study for the 1st and 2nd year exams, and just a little for the JC and then did nothing again for the TY exams. It's time to knuckle down now and actually study as soon as 5th year starts. I really want this as a career.

TSMGUY, sorry I was just kind of offended at how you approached the matter.

I did understand a good part of physics when we had it as a module in TY. So maybe I'll be ok with a few maths grinds here and there.
DIT is the only college I can find offering the easiest route, it's the only undergrad course I can find.

Anyone know if DIT is good? I don't exactly want to be getting my hopes up.

That's cool if it's what you really wanna do, I'm didn't come in here just to sh** all over your dreams and tell you can't do it, I'm just speaking as a guy who planned to far into the future and was brought back to reality.

I read A Brief History of Time when I was 11, I loved reading about all of the famous physicists, I loved the idea of being a physicist, I actually thought I could win a Nobel Prize someday......

And then BAM, reality is I can't even stand learning off constructions, let alone getting my head around string theory or quantum mechanics.

I genuinely hope you can succeed where I didn't, maybe I'm just too lazy for STEM. Actually only on boards right now cos' I'm sick of studying for my physics exam on Monday

unseenfootage · 17-06-2016 5:42pm

TSMGUY wrote: »

And then BAM, reality is I can't even stand learning off constructions, let alone getting my head around string theory or quantum mechanics.

Not a good example.
Most quantum physicists go mad trying to solve quantum mechanics problems.

TSMGUY · 17-06-2016 5:45pm

unseenfootage wrote: »

Not a good example.
Most quantum physicists go mad trying to solve quantum mechanics problems.

I know, the 11 year old TSMBOY thought he'd unify relativity and quantum theory. The 19 year old me struggles to unify simultaneous equations with one linear and one quadratic component. Such is life......

enya kenny · 17-06-2016 6:20pm

I sounded like OP when i was sixth year and wanted to do electronic engineering. I love technology, computers and loved the idea of building circuits and designing systems. It also sounded cool.

Put it down as my first choice in Maynooth. Needed a C3 in higher level maths. It was 320 points at the time and knew Id get it so only really bothered studying Maths for the leaving cert and crammed Home EC and biology two months before hand and the rest two weeks before. I got 375 points and a B3 in higher level maths. Had no interest in studying languages and the likes.

Anyway started the course and every module was maths and physics associated with it. Building circuits was complete calculus. After a month i thought to myself why the hell did i pick this course. I continued with it for six months and just said to myself f$$$ this. This is mind numbling boring and I couldnt give a fiddlers fart if a circuit is working right and if the wattage and amps , ressidtance are correct and working out physics problems. I am good at maths but doing it everyday just wrecked my head and lost interest in the course very quicky. The maths in the course was a step above high for the leaving cert. Course leader tried to persuade to stay at it and got a final year student to speak with me about what there doing and thier modules and it was the same crap as first year but much much more complex.

Dropped out anyway in February got a lovely job in Dunnes Stores and saved like mad for next year for something i would enjoy doing. I ended up doing plenty of research and decided to Computer Science and spoke with a few people and sent me on tips and also practiced programming which i was quite good at. We did do programming in the engineering course and really enjoyed that. Graduated with a 2.1 hons anyway and am now working away.

My advice to anyone thinking of doing engineering, Computer Science, General Science is to do plenty of research on the course your picking. There is a reason they have the highest drop out rates in the country. Make sure you will actually enjoy and just want to do it as it sounds "COOOL"

Zillah · 17-06-2016 6:33pm

unseenfootage wrote: »

Not a good example.
Most quantum physicists go mad trying to solve quantum mechanics problems.

I believe it is actually a requirement at this point.

"You see...I think I have it: reality is composed of countless trillions of vibrating one-dimensional strings...or, maybe three-dimensional space is actually a pair of two-dimensional universes colliding with each other and we exist at the intersection..."

Sure buddy.
*finger-to-temple-twirly gesture*

TSMGUY · 17-06-2016 6:38pm

enya kenny wrote: »

I sounded like OP when i was sixth year and wanted to do electronic engineering. I love technology, computers and loved the idea of building circuits and designing systems. It also sounded cool.

Put it down as my first choice in Maynooth. Needed a C3 in higher level maths. It was 320 points at the time and knew Id get it so only really bothered studying Maths for the leaving cert and crammed Home EC and biology two months before hand and the rest two weeks before. I got 375 points and a B3 in higher level maths. Had no interest in studying languages and the likes.

Anyway started the course and every module was maths and physics associated with it. Building circuits was complete calculus. After a month i thought to myself why the hell did i pick this course. I continued with it for six months and just said to myself f$$$ this. This is mind numbling boring and I couldnt give a fiddlers fart if a circuit is working right and if the wattage and amps , ressidtance are correct and working out physics problems. I am good at maths but doing it everyday just wrecked my head and lost interest in the course very quicky. The maths in the course was a step above high for the leaving cert. Course leader tried to persuade to stay at it and got a final year student to speak with me about what there doing and thier modules and it was the same crap as first year but much much more complex.

Dropped out anyway in February got a lovely job in Dunnes Stores and saved like mad for next year for something i would enjoy doing. I ended up doing plenty of research and decided to Computer Science and spoke with a few people and sent me on tips and also practiced programming which i was quite good at. We did do programming in the engineering course and really enjoyed that. Graduated with a 2.1 hons anyway and am now working away.

My advice to anyone thinking of doing engineering, Computer Science, General Science is to do plenty of research on the course your picking. There is a reason they have the highest drop out rates in the country. Make sure you will actually enjoy and just want to do it as it sounds "COOOL"

see, this guy right here has real-world experience. Just wanted to save OP the time of going to uni, hating his course and then changing it. Optimism is good but you have to be realistic at the same time.

Zillah · 17-06-2016 6:44pm

Yup, I did something similar. Loved science as an idea, lasted a few months in a science degree once the actual lived experience of doing science turned out to be brain-churningly boring. Did a media degree instead and now work in film.

I adore space and science, I want us to throw funding at it like confetti, I love seeing our new achievements; documentaries with Hawking, de Grasse Tyson, or Brian Cox - all that stuff, but just like accounting and staff in restaurants, I am super glad someone else is willing to do it, cos I aint. To paraphrase a comic from the Oatmeal: I don't love science, I like to look at science's ass as it walks by.

The point - albeit laboured - is that you should definitely try to find out what sort of stuff you'll actually be doing a normal day in the course before you decide it is for you, because right now you'll be relying on a very idealised vision of all of the best and most exciting bits. Maybe it will turn out that you find it super exciting, and then you know it is for you, or maybe you'll realise your idea of it wasn't right at all, and you'll feel like you dodged a bullet.

spurious · 17-06-2016 7:38pm

Don't fall for the lie that you have to go straight from school to a university course. You're much better getting out in the world and finding out what you actually have a passion for.

TOEJOE · 17-06-2016 8:11pm

Haemoglobin wrote: »

I looked at the nanoscience course in TCD and your need 595 points, I don't think I can get that so I went to look at UCD and its a postgrad nanotechnology course, but you need to have a degree in undergrad physics, chemistry, material science or engineering.

Good point, I'll have a look at DIT. I'm still trying to find the best course to suit. thanks for your help.

The course in Kevin st was the first undergraduate level eight course in nano in Ireland .The staff support and facilities are excellent and they are about to move to a new campus in Grangegorman so it's looking good.

Haemoglobin · 17-06-2016 11:15pm

enya kenny wrote: »

I sounded like OP when i was sixth year and wanted to do electronic engineering. I love technology, computers and loved the idea of building circuits and designing systems. It also sounded cool.

Put it down as my first choice in Maynooth. Needed a C3 in higher level maths. It was 320 points at the time and knew Id get it so only really bothered studying Maths for the leaving cert and crammed Home EC and biology two months before hand and the rest two weeks before. I got 375 points and a B3 in higher level maths. Had no interest in studying languages and the likes.

Anyway started the course and every module was maths and physics associated with it. Building circuits was complete calculus. After a month i thought to myself why the hell did i pick this course. I continued with it for six months and just said to myself f$$$ this. This is mind numbling boring and I couldnt give a fiddlers fart if a circuit is working right and if the wattage and amps , ressidtance are correct and working out physics problems. I am good at maths but doing it everyday just wrecked my head and lost interest in the course very quicky. The maths in the course was a step above high for the leaving cert. Course leader tried to persuade to stay at it and got a final year student to speak with me about what there doing and thier modules and it was the same crap as first year but much much more complex.

Dropped out anyway in February got a lovely job in Dunnes Stores and saved like mad for next year for something i would enjoy doing. I ended up doing plenty of research and decided to Computer Science and spoke with a few people and sent me on tips and also practiced programming which i was quite good at. We did do programming in the engineering course and really enjoyed that. Graduated with a 2.1 hons anyway and am now working away.

My advice to anyone thinking of doing engineering, Computer Science, General Science is to do plenty of research on the course your picking. There is a reason they have the highest drop out rates in the country. Make sure you will actually enjoy and just want to do it as it sounds "COOOL"

woah, thanks for that insight. Really should research as much as I can while I have the chance

TOEJOE wrote: »

The course in Kevin st was the first undergraduate level eight course in nano in Ireland .The staff support and facilities are excellent and they are about to move to a new campus in Grangegorman so it's looking good.

Cool! Thanks!!

TOEJOE wrote: »

The course in Kevin st was the first undergraduate level eight course in nano in Ireland .The staff support and facilities are excellent and they are about to move to a new campus in Grangegorman so it's looking good.

Cool! Thanks for this info!

donegal. wrote: »

will you have a different teacher for leaving cert year than t y?

i dropped down from honours to pass maths about 6months before the leaving .pass is very easy in comparison . It was only later i realised the teacher was terrible , i could have got an honour with any other teacher.

i had no problem with maths in university. I'd stick with honours for now and see how it works out.

also its not easy finding out what is involved in a days work in any field. Do you know what a nanotechnologist does all day ?

I hope I'll get a differnt teacher, there are only around 3 or 4 honours maths teachers in my school. If I get the bad one again, I might ask to move class.

I need some help here please!?

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