Cost of Broadband in other countries

tobi

Interesting thread on sogamed.com, shouldn’t come as a shock but it’s sickening

http://www.sogamed.com/forums.php?forum_id=1&id=13356#308820

Here's a taste

Santiago, Chile - US$ 36,00 - 256k

Curitiba - Brazil - US$ 60,00 - 1Mb

Estonia - US$ 35 - 512/128

Check out the prices for Sweden and Germany

Hannibal_12

I try not to read anything like that anymore as it just serves as a reminder as to what kind of a country I live in. Ireland is probably one of the worst countries in the "developed world" for the net and more than likely for many other aspects of life as well.

Sweden:
2.5mb downstream
0.75 up for $50~€50

Kenshin

Sweden:

10 Mbit full duplex from BBB, $29.50!, $32.00 if u not live in HSB!

I know a guy who has that.... bastard

Even countries like Israel are way cheaper than here

Dangger

Okay I'm going to collect as many prices and details globally for the IOFFL site. The page will be here (I have to tidy it up still I know!)

Can we keep this thread going and lets try and get as many as we can?

LoBo

Originally posted by matthiku
Here is a price comparison: (afair, Eircom charges 99 Euro)
____________________________________________
Selected monthly bitstream charges for 500 Kbps ADSL, November 2001

Operator . . . . . . . ADSL loop rental/month (Euros)

Belgacom . . . . . . . . 33.61
BT . . . . . . . . . . . . 48.86
Deutsche Telekom . 16.84 *
France Telecom . . . 30.18
Hong Kong Telecom 25.91
Telefonica . . . . . . 55.17

Notes
* reference offer only

Source: www.point-topic.com
___________________________________

Matthias

from another recent thread (also someone mentioned that telefonica offered 256k dsl for under €40)

ps, fix the tables in that html page so each row = one line?

Dangger

ps, fix the tables in that html page so each row = one line?

Will do but I think geeklog is stopping the table tags from being used, thats why I've left so I can check it with Dahamsta.

Thanks for all the info .

spongebob

256 or 512 uncapped for €39 including VAT

Note that most of these international offerings are UNCAPPED products.

Eircom only has one uncapped product, (charged by the day if you calculate month/30) this is the i-stream multi at €179 a month (their site is down at the mo so you may correct me) + VAT

they have broken 2 if not 4 european records...following

These anyway.

1. Most expensive entry level product at €99 , istream solo
2. Most expensive entry level uncapped product €179 istream multi

I suspect these records also belong to €ircon.

3. Most expensive basic installation charge in Europe €199 at least + the cost of waiting in for €ircon to show up.
4. Lowest nominal population coverage for broadband (less than 25% ..under 1 million people.... can possibly get ADSL and thats assuming that every line will pass in those exchange areas)

Thats 4 European Records for crap service at inflated prices.

A triumph for the E-Tub or Europe......

M

dahamsta

Fixed.

adam

pork99

Thats 4 European Records for crap service at inflated prices.

A triumph for the E-Tub or Europe......

Yes but what do you expect? We're governed by crooked ignorant boggers who; 1) don't know 2) don't care

spongebob

a bogger, as is tony o'reilly another bogger and that etain doyle wan, the regulator, .....BOGGER supreme!

i noted it years ago meself thanks pork!

M

pork99

I should just clarify that by bogger I dont mean someone from a rural background but someone like the beloved leader Ahern who embodies certain "qualities"

pork99

sorry no hard facts - just letting off steam, expressing my own biased opinions

we are all rightly miffed that internet access here is so bad yet so expensive

but the root cause is that we allow a bunch of sweaty imbeciles like FF run the country

Hairy Homer

Maybe this chart has been seen (publicised already)



....................No of..............%age run by
Country........DSL lines......incumbent telco

Germany.......2,500,000.....100%
France.............692,693......100%
Spain...............600,000........80%
Italy.................518,000........70%
Belgium............362,000........84%
Sweden............338,895........77%
UK.....................290,000........60%
Netherland........195,789......100%
Austria...............128,000........84%
Denmark............110,454......100%
Finland..................85,000.......99%
Portugal..................5,633.......92%
Luxembourg............2,670.......89%
Ireland.......................977......100%
Greece................... .......0........... 0%



It shows the number of DSL lines installed by country in the EU, as reported by the European Competitive Telecoms Association for the end of June.

As you can see, Ireland has the second lowest no of DSL lines after Greece, which, er, doesn't have any at all yet.

You might expect Germany, France, UK etc to have more lines than us, given their larger populations. Have a look at Denmark (pop 5.35m), Finland (pop 5.18m). They have 11 times and 9 times more lines than us respectively and similarly sized populations.

To really make you sick, look at Luxembourg. It has a population of about half a million people, and three times as many lines as us.

Nor does the unbundled loop issue apply. The rightmost column shows the percentage of these lines that are operated by the incumbent national telco. All of Germany's DSL lines are operated by Deutsche Telekom. All of France's by France telecom and so on.

The only good news is that at least this issue seems to be moving up the national news agenda. The day after PBH's programme some guy from IBEC was on Morning Ireland complaining about the lack of broadband.

For too long the media, Dunphy in particular, were whinging about Eircom's share price, wondering about the poor widow woman who had splurged her pension on a stock market punt and what was Alfie going to do about it.

Now at last attention seems to be turning to the quality of services they provide. Not before time too.

PS Formatting that chart was a pain and it hasn't come out too well on the preview. Anybody know how to use VB tags to present tab or space delimited tables?

tobi

Looking at all the facts and figures it seems telecoms companies in other countries are managing to turn a profit from reasonable priced broadband. Makes you wonder what Eircom strategy is?

Here’s more

Mexico
adsl 256/128 = $49 us dollar
adsl 516/256 = $80
adsl 2mpbs/516 = $200
cable 128 = $30
cable 256 = $40

Portugal
Cable 640/128 = 35 Euros month
ADSL 512/128 = 38 Euros
ADSL 768/128 = 68 Euros
ADSL 1mbps/256 = 106 Euros

Kenshin

Originally posted by Muck
Telefonica's offering
256 or 512 uncapped for €39 including VAT

The 512 offer is a bit more expensive than €39


Dangger, on your webpage it says that Ireland has 512/256. I thought Eircom's offer was 512/128... have they changed that recently, or is it a typo?

Dangger

Fixed now. Thanks.

spongebob

am I not correct in saying that all of Telefonicas products are uncapped ........

...I stand corrected on the €39 euro a month always on product, its only 256k if you say so.

M

Kenshin

Yes, Telefonica's service is completely uncapped... I signed up for their ADSL last September? and it cost 6.500 pesetas a month. I think the instalation + 4 port ethernet router + network card cost around 30.000 pts. I still use it when I'm in Spain and it works great...

Telefonica in Spain has a similar history to Eircom. They have had a monopoly for a lot of years, and kept refusing to have a flatrate offer... We had groups of people like IrelandOFFline organising blackouts and such... Spain's internet access was always pretty bad compared to that in the rest of the world, but Eircom is infinitely worse

So the point of my post is that... uhmm yeah

matthiku

Example from Germany:
Arcor offers an ISDN flatrate 64 of €24.95/month: http://www.privat.arcor.net/produkte/arcor_online/ao_preise_flatrate_isdn.shtml
Minimum contract 3 months and in connection with transferring your ISDN line to Arcor at €19.95/month (but here you are bound to a 12 months minimum) but there is no connection/installation fee.

DSL 768 flatrate from €56.85 all incl. and DSL 1500 from €66.80 all incl. (i.e. ISDN): http://www.privat.arcor.net/produkte/arcor_online/ao_preise_flatrate_dsl.shtml

Basically, if you want DSL, you always have 3 different monthly fees:
1. ISDN line rental: > €20 (your existing phone line)
2. DSL line rental: > €8 (usually includes DSL modem and splitter)
3. DSL flatrate: > €20
Theoretically, each could be from a different provider. But often there are incentives to bundle them to one provider.
Some companies however rely on a certain service provider; for instance AOL DSL flatrate (128/768, for €20, no caps, but may disconnect after 8h) relies on ISDN and DSL from the Deutsche Telekom (T-DSL) (http://www.tariftip.de/Tarife-flatrate.asp?ID=2706)

Canadian

Originally posted by Hannibal_12
Ireland is probably one of the worst countries in the "developed world" for the net and more than likely for many other aspects of life as well.

MDR is probably going to flame me, but I think you should be careful about calling Ireland part of the 'Developed World'.

I work here for a Canadian company and I am paid an addition to my salary because I don't live in a modern country. This particular bonus is only paid to employees in Ireland, India, and Malaysia. (India and Malaysia have DSL available).

Don't get me wrong - I don't mind living here and Ireland is a lovely country with friendly people - but anyone calling it 'developed' has learned marketing skills from Eircom.

Hannibal_12

Originally posted by Canadian


MDR is probably going to flame me, but I think you should be careful about calling Ireland part of the 'Developed World'.

I work here for a Canadian company and I am paid an addition to my salary because I don't live in a modern country. This particular bonus is only paid to employees in Ireland, India, and Malaysia. (India and Malaysia have DSL available).

Don't get me wrong - I don't mind living here and Ireland is a lovely country with friendly people - but anyone calling it 'developed' has learned marketing skills from Eircom.

Dont worry man I'm not going to flame you because I wholeheartedly agree with you hence the developed countries in quotation marks in my original post.
Unlike you I have been resident here my whole life and know first hand why I do not class it as a developed country. I have suffered the hour long bus journeys to travel two miles, I believe we are now ranked with Calcutta for average journey times in Dublin. The complete lack of any transport infrastructure i.e Only city in Europe that has no rail link from its main airport but dont worry we'll have one in 2007.
On a more positive note it seems to be improving and I think the national development plan will yield some results but its really going to be a matter of years before any noticeable improvement comes to fruition.
Canada or America are most definitely two countries I would like to live in and most likely will within the next few years, circumstances permitting of course.

Canadian

You have hit on what should be the biggest concern for the current government - how to keep this countries kids from leaving.

People with big families and people over 30 generally don't move around too much. It's the young with the potential (and the ability to pay for the social welfare system in the next 40 years) that are at risk of leaving.

Most countries invest in children via education and expect a good return from them during their earning years because it will have to pay again when they reach old age.

If the recently educated, high potential earners leave, the country will be left with more takers than givers, and the standard of living will decline.

Canada has this problem with the USA (America charges high earners less tax and therefore Canada loses most of them). Ignoring the language issues of europe, Ireland, Greece and Portugal will lose these people too. In fact, the Irish have a real advantage because they already speak english, and therefore can easily relocate to a lot of very nice places..... not quite as easy for the greeks...

Roads are expensive. Trains are very expensive. Broadband should be easy.

Dangger

Excellent point Canadian. I'm not planning on sticking around this place much longer to put my state sponsored Masters in Technical E-Commerce to use.

This government has been warned and warned about keeping knowledge workers in Ireland.

timod

Are you leaving us Dave?

sceptre

Some more prices listed in this thread for reference

pork99

Just found this

http://www.saix.net/ADSLletter.htm

might be of interest to whoever is compiling lists of international price comparisons etc

(I don't know what the Rand - euro rate is)

mofu

BTW. 1€ = R10 (approx.)

LoBo

amusingly from that link:

"Guarantee: nothing"

under features of their ADSL service
At least their being honest!

If mofu's right about the exchange rate it works out as around €68/month inc vat for 512k ADSL. I'd buy that.

Dustaz

Thread moved and old thread stuck.

Keep em coming.

Canadian

You'll love this:

Cable 1.5 MB/s... 29 EUR/month*
Cable 128kb/s ... 16 EUR/month*

*Before discounts offered depending on the cable package you get.

DSL 128kb/s ... 16 EUR/month
DSL 1.5 MB/s ... 29 EUR/month
DSL 3.0 MB/s ... 45 EUR/month

Unlimited Dialup ... 14.5 EUR/month***

When I left Canada in 2001, no one I knew used dialup anymore.... now even the most un-computer literate people I know have wireless LANs in their house and they keep sending me huge photos that take forever to download.... I always retort that I'm only 1 hour from Paris and 2 hours from Italy...

**FX rate at 1.55 CAD per EUR

***Almost forgot to mention that unlimited local phone calling (day/night/whenever) is about 15 EUR/month and for the Toronto area, there are about 4 MILLION people in the local calling area. This makes the total cost of unlimited dialup to be about 30 EUR per month but then you can use the phone as much as you want for voice calls too. (day and night)

And Levi Jeans go for about 38 EUR. And a nice family home in Toronto is about 150,000 EUR.

And all this from one of the least densely populated places on the planet.

I'm making myself homesick......

edove

I used to pay £25 a month for 512k always on, broadband through NTL. The installation cost £50.

{weeping} I've just ordered eircom i-stream

Yoda

Heavens help us. Is anyone from the government reading this thread? It seems to me that our economy is threatened by the shameful state we are in.

gurramok

Our fellow europeans in Iceland pay $40 per month for 512/256 adsl

just look at the numbers on the link...no translation needed

here

currency converter at here

drrnwbb

hey....

i just payed my final bill to eircom a few weeks ago... 185euros for 7 weeks dial up.....

here in finland (helsinki) i pay about 46euros for a cable modem access: ( welho )

"Welho 525 has the maximum speed of 525 kbps downstream and 200 kbps upstream" life is good.

as the previous post said, iceland is pretty cheap too.. ive friends there and all of them have asdl etc.. the leave their connections on 24/7

dw

fabien

Translated with Altavista, hope it's readable, anyway ADSL for 29.99 per month...sickening.

Fixed price ADSL: Free breaks the prices the ADSL is the hot file of the re-entry. The supplier of access Internet (FAI) Free strikes a great blow, by preceding the offers with differentiated flows, and thus less expensive, than its competitors for mid-October prepare. It breaks the prices and proposes a fixed price ADSL with 512 kpbs in reception, and 128 kpbs in emission, for 29,99 euros per month. All the existing offers until now remained confined in the neighbourhoods of the 45 euros per month. Only exception, Club Internet proposes since the re-entry a fixed price ADSL starting from 35 euros. But the Net surfer will pay this sum during the first six months of his subscription (one two years minimal duration), then will be invoiced with the "traditional tariff". Free thus goes further, and inserts the nail by providing free the modem and by taking responsibility for its the expenses of access to the service. Moreover, no duration of engagement is imposed. The FAI, subsidiary of the group Proxad/Iliad (Societe.com, 3617 Annu, etc), "wishes to make benefit its subscribers from the best qualité/prix report/ratio on access Internet high flow and will make evolve/move its tariff (...) with the fall as soon as the operational conditions and techniques allow it." The company can be allowed to propose such prices because it is the first to be profited, as an alternate operator, of the fall of the tariffs the large one set up by France Telecom within the framework of the deblocking.

See their site: http://adsl.free.fr /

fabien

LoBo

"Free breaks the prices the ADSL is the hot file of the re-entry. "

When the prices of ADSL around here "break free" it will certainly be the hot file of the re-entry for Eircom.

Hahaha though: best - translation - ever

pork99

http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/22/27218.html

lets eat dust!!!!

netman

$20 in BULGARIA !??!?

and 99% of that probably goes to bribe the local politicians.
christ, can't believe ireland is worse than bulgaria!

eircomtribunal

We are putting up a page on eircomtribunal.com which compares the internet pricing of different countries.

Anybody who has tried to do comparisons like these knows how treacherous it can be: How to compare like with like? Do it very exact and detailed and the info will quickly get too convoluted to make sense.

We've opted to publish the pricing in generalised terms, but still strive to give a correct overall picture.

We would like you to help us fill in missing information, correct inaccurate information and of course we are interested in suggestions and your opinion in general.

Check it out here.

Please mail your info and suggestions to info@eircomtribunal.com with a subject line "Internet pricing".

Peter

spongebob

Hannibal_12 brought the following link to my attention where ADSL is offered for £12 a month, thats Cypriot Pounds now not the nearby ones. 640k uncapped as well from the look of it.


mmmmmmm and the weather is much better there too and the food and the gargle and the weather (dry-ish ISTR) means the provisioning ADSL is not a problem......unless the feck1n termites eat the poles along the road during a heatwave.

M

De Rebel

Originally posted by Canadian

Forgive me if this makes you feel bad, but Ireland is NOT a developed country. It is firmly in the SECOND world and compares with places like Greece, Poland and Brazil.

First world 'developed' countries are those of the G7+Australia, NZ, Nordic, Germanic and the Benelux countries.

As a matter of interest, are these statements an expression of your humble opinion or are they based on an objective measures?

fabien

From a press release:

"Significant observation: the accounts of permanent broadband connection, by cable or ADSL, went from 351,000 to 884,000, that is to say a progression record of 152% in one year. In terms of shares of market, broaband connections account for 11% of the total of opened accounts, "that's in the European average", specifies the AFA. "

11% European Average?? Not here anyway...

Fergus

Just ordered this week in Detroit, Michigan, USA..

ComCast cable:
$31 install (within 5 days)
$5/month for cable modem or buy your own.

$37/month for 80-channel cable TV
+ $39.95*/month for uncapped internet, 1500k down/128k up

(at present the Internet access is actually $19.95/month for the for the first six months)

TheDuke

it is quite obvious the we are all whining the same song...

does anyone have any idea how to get the Eircom off of the fat backsides and pressurise them into doing something... or is this just the island life... big fish in a very small pond!!!!

The Duke

eircomtribunal

Originally posted by TheDuke

does anyone have any idea how to get the Eircom off of the fat backsides and pressurise them into doing something

The Duke

Targets the EU countries have agreed on: eEurope Targets 2001/2002:
"Achieve significant reductions in Internet tariffs towards the lowest levels in the world by enforcing competition and clear benchmarking at European and national levels."
"Cheaper faster Internet is one of the preconditions for Internet uptake."

If you want to help with the benchmarking, which our government and the ODTR are not doing, go through our price comparison section and help to fill the missing parts.

Regards

Peter

De Rebel

Originally posted by TheDuke
does anyone have any idea how to get the Eircom off of the fat backsides and pressurise them into doing something...

No. There is no way. Eircom is a private company that may do as it pleases. It's obliged to provide certain services in its role as incumbant, but thats about it. There is almost no way it can be forced to introduce a new product/service. The ODTR is there to regulate not to mandate new products/services. And unfortunately Ericom has such a strangehold on the market that competitors cannot create the business volumes necessary to cover expenses.

Its a pretty hopeless situation. The only way anything much can happen is if the politicians take control. They created the mess in the first place, by mis-managing Eircom and its predecessors for many years and then handing it to a bunch of quick buck merchants.And they are showing no signs of swallowing their pride and tackling the issue. None.

I genuinely think that telecoms in this country is a lost cause. And so are the industries which are based upon it. Its as well that we have the low tax based pharmaceuticals handing us billions of tax dollars, because there is almost no chance for the ICT industries in the medium term.

sorry if this is off topic but the question was asked.

Tom Dunne

Slightly off topic, but does anybody have some web links that compares Ireland to other countries in matters such as cost/no. of lines or any other statistics?

I am doing a college report on the alleged broadband market in Ireland and am looking for some meaty statistics. I already have the quarterly report from the ODTR, (not too much there) and I have some stuff from the OECD (ironically, I searched the OECD website for 'Ireland broadband' and it returned nothing - say no more).

TIA,

TD.

eircomtribunal

Originally posted by tom dunne
Slightly off topic, but does anybody have some web links that compares Ireland to other countries in matters such as cost/no. of lines or any other statistics?
TD.

Tom,

There is some stuff on our Internet Price Comparison part of our website, which might be of help.
Will you update us with whatever you are finding out?
Do not hesitate to contact us about your specific questions.

Peter

MDR

I could let you have a comprehensive comparision of Ireland and Norway, I prepared about a month ago ... it should be exactily what you are after.

Its not finished yet, so I haven't release it, but if you PM your mail addy I will forward it on to you.

Lookout

I think that it is intresting to read all the price comparisons that are available in other countries in Europe, but you don't have to look outside this country to find a cost effective, always on, high speed internet access provider.
I heard of this cable company in Dungarvan, Co. Waterford that are providing Internet access via cable modems for €36.00 a month , no limits. And I believe that it is not limited to the southside of the town either !!!

www.cablesurf.com

I think the offering is 256K.... ( which is not bad.)

And just slightly off the point , their basic TV offering is about 40 channels and costs less that NTL.

So if a small town in Ireland can find scales of ecomomy that are equal to the vast markets of Germany , France, etc... What the hell is going on with eircom and Dublin !!!!!
nuff said. I'm movin' south.

LoBo

if they are a genuine actual product, make a new thread about them in the forum. Looking at their site I couldn't even find a mention of WHERE they are based or where the offer is available. Just the title of the page "Cablesurf, Dungarvan, Co. Waterford".

If they are genuine why are they only trading in this tiny part of ireland? Also couldn't find any technical details on the site (eg the figure you mention, 256Kb).

Anyone on boards ever hear of them before?