O Connell St

Jim

As uve seen it has already begun. The O connell st "regeneration" project is underway. With them eventually makin the entire st pedestrian wit no cars, the giant "spire". Yes, something that symbolises ireland in the 21st century, a giant needle:rolleyes: . And the bizarre square trees they have in the artist impression. Is the person in charge a total ****in troll? well no shes not, but the corpo certainly is, pack of ignorent ****es:mad:

BuffyBot

I don't know why everyone is so dead set against the spike. Personally I think it's kinda funky and a bit modern - just what the street needs a centrepiece in it's redevelopment.

Qualm

i'm with BuffBot, it shall be an interesting centre piece type thing for the city.

Plus, its going ahead and no amount of complaining or whining is gona stop thme, so i say lets hush!

I'm for the pedestrianising of o'connell st, *if* the dub. corpo can somehow improve public transport and encourage ppl to use it, cos then *hopefully* the whole place will become less crowded and rediculously traffic jammed.

nesthead

i think the spike is a horrible thing. its really dumb, not even artistic. i hear there is gonna be carvings on it up the first few metres which might look nice, but knowing dublin it'll get coverered in dumb scummer graffiti such as...

Jacintah -L- Deco and/or

[insert scummer name x7]
Mates '02

etc.



from the pictures that they have around o'connell st. it looks like it'll be 20 times taller than the gpo, anyone exactly how high its meant to be?

Beruthiel

eyesore is the word I would use to describe the spike

sceptre

Have the workers in the factory making it finally come off their strike then?

Neil3030

from the pictures that they have around o'connell st. it looks like it'll be 20 times taller than the gpo, anyone exactly how high its meant to be?

Twice the height of Liberty Hall or so i heard. I'm not exactly for the "Spire in the Mire" but I'd say we'll get used to it. Wasn't this thing suposed to be finished for the millenium? Typical Irish orginisation. Did you know that 25 years ago there was a proposal to make some kind of rail/light- rail network in Dublin? Good luck to anyone who ever plans to ride the metro in their lifetime!

SOL

I think its kinda stupid, it is probably going to be the easiest terrorist target ever, and heaven help anyone there when a 200 metre spike of solid steel is falling over

p

Originally posted by SOL
it is probably going to be the easiest terrorist target ever, and heaven help anyone there when a 200 metre spike of solid steel is falling over

1) Ireland isn't exactly the focus of any terrorist attacks now is it? And even if it was there'd be plenty of better targets.

2) It's not solid steel.

3) It's not going to fall over unless you have one big f-off bomb. The foundations are really deep.

- Kevin

p.s. Everyone hated the Eiffel tower when it was built.

Makaveli

You cant go up the spire though can you?
That would be kind of cool, stick a lift in the middle and put like windows in it.
I think I should go to bed.

Repli

Originally posted by nesthead
i think the spike is a horrible thing. its really dumb, not even artistic. i hear there is gonna be carvings on it up the first few metres which might look nice, but knowing dublin it'll get coverered in dumb scummer graffiti such as...

I agree with this and it's not exactly gonna be a famous landmark like the eiffel tower. Why exactly is it being built again?

sceptre

Originally posted by Repli
Why exactly is it being built again?

It's a "Millennium" project. After the debacle over the Millennium river clock, the Corpo decided they'd better be sure and have some project done for the Millennium that the whole country could be proud of instead of those useless things going on down the country that aren't even going to be finished for the celebrations*.

They also needed a proper replacement for Nelson's Pillar to act as a focal point for the street (the hoore be the sewer just doesn't cut it, I suppose)

Anyway, we're pleased to say that the spike will in fact be finished on time for one or other of the Millennium celebrations, even if we have to have one every year until that prick is stuck into the centre of Dublin.







*like Cork with its new sewerage system. Paid for in part with government Millennium money and no-one can't say it isn't a step forward. Also not finished, mind you, though they';re getting there.

Winters

I dont really like the Millennium Mickey. Its a bit boring. Unless it was loike the worlds biggest spike then it might be good. You think they might have come up with a good idea. I could make a better one.... a giant server. Think of that. The worlds biggest server on O'Connell Street. That would be great. Would provide heat for homless and most of Dublin City too....Dublin city center would have its own climate.....

/me copyrights the idea before its stolen ...:)

MDR

The centre of Dublin needs a focal point a replacement for nelsons column which was robbed from us. The corporation had a competion, people where able to vote for their favorite design, Dubliners as usual stuck there head in the sand.

I voted for the design I liked, it won, grand, I am happy democracy wins again over apathy. Providing food and heat for the homeless is a worthy cause, and perhaps the money would be better spent on it, however the majority of Irish Tax Revenue is earned in Dublin. Dubliners deserve an inner city they can be proud of, the monument in international terms is not that dear, wieghing in at 13 million. This is what the public asked for by democratic means, if you didn't vote, nuts to you, I look forward to the day I can walk down O'Connell street in piece, free from traffic and admire the architectural masterpiece that will be the 'Monument of Light'.

This is a symbol of the change in Dublin, similar to the glass pyrimad at the louvre in Paris (link) , a marring of the old and new. Dubliners or the Irish in general are a self depreciating bunch and will always exaggerate the negative in anything they do as a nation (save maybe in sport). I remember when the M50 bridge was being built about 10 years ago, Dubliners scoffing at the waste of money and that it will never be used, they said something similar about Anna Life, and then shed a tear when she was forced to move, they moaned endlessily when Grafton Street was pedestrianised. Now I hear similar things about the spire and the port tunnel, and I don't argue that their hasn't failures such as the Time in the Slime etc. But God loves a trier and I will be f**ked if I begrudge the Spire because it is something different.

I am sure 100 years ago Dubliner reviled Nelsons Column, and now its absence has left a gapping hole in our city. Funny how things change.

Wook

good post MDR

valid points and could not agree more.

Dr. Loon

Well said, I agree with ya also MDR.
And could the rest of ye shut the fúck up moaning like abunch of bitches? Jesus!!! :rolleyes:

Typedef

I think the spike is phallic.

/me thinks some corpo eurocrat somewhere wants to kill his father and marry his mother.

MDR

I think the spike is phallic.

The 'Monument of light' design was submitted by a london based design company ... eh so, it might well be inspired by someones phallically obessed subconsious but it would be either that of the london based designer or the dublin citizens that voted for it, any phallically obessed civil servants didn't get a look in ... poor them ...

MDR

FYI Irish-architecture.com monument of light section

EvilGeorge

Its a bit like the Eifle Tower (if thats how u spell it) no one liked it when it first went up - now its always associated with Paris.

Still I'm sure someone will give us a laugh later by trying to climb it or somthing!

Nevyn

I'm not thrilled with what it will look like but what really disgusts me is the € 4 million being spent on it when there are so many homeless in the city and there is only 1 hostel for kids ( under 18's) in the city with far too few beds.

How many of the new flats int he dock lands could have been bought with that money and then turned into shelter accomidation ?

MDR

How many of the new flats int he dock lands could have been bought with that money and then turned into shelter accomidation ?

I'm not being funny, as I have already said the money may have been better spent, however €4 million will buy you around around 16 X 1 bedroom flats or 12 X 2 bedroom, so thats around 24 beds in the docklands, leaving no money to employ peeps to look after the kids, which incidentily is quiet expensive too.

The building of the Spire is nothing to do with social services, people only begin to talk in terms of how the money could have been better spent, when they don't value what is currentily spent on. The spire doesn't enjoy many supporters, but ask yourself this, it is costing around €13 million including the regeneration of O'Connell st, which most will agree is badily needed, especially when you consider the tourism industry and quality of life issues.

However when compared to the national stadium project, which still enjoys around 70% popularity, and is likely to cost €600 million or the the regeneration of Croke park at €45 million or how about ramps in my neighbourhood at €18,000, are these really essential things, however they all continue to be relatively popular. I rarely hear, 'nuts to football lets give the kids somewhere warm to sleep'.

Looking after are children and our vunerable citizens is important, more important than anything else, more important than a stadium, more important than ramps, more important than a spire. However if you want to cull money and plough it back into social services or any other worthy cause. There are plenty of places to start before the spire. I don't consider it to be a waste of money, I value it, I think its important, more important than ramps and more important than a stadium.

Therefore when I think of terms of things I can sacfrice I look elsewhere first, thats just me, I have different values after all €600 million would only buy you a few more beds.

Xterminator

Originally posted by Thaed
How many of the new flats int he dock lands could have been bought with that money and then turned into shelter accomidation ?

And just on the moaning issue, can you imagine the moans from the residents of the apartment blocks if they learnt a homeless shelter was to be in or near there buildings?

The whole 'not in my backyard' pathetic attitude, where they will say ... whaaa the property prices will be affected' etc etc ... all the same tired excuses we hear each time a traveller site is proposed etc.

Hehe might be worth doing just to piss em off!

X

Nevyn

Well I would say nuts to football
but apparently there is now no state funding it is going to be comercially built. As for regenerating the city centre it is not something I am worried about. Personally the city centre is not somewhere I go even once a mnth.

And when i say home less I do not mean the the ideal that springs to mind of the drunk/druggie in the door way but there are a hell of a lot more people then that with out a safe clean non hazzards place to call home in this city.

A lot of these are families with small kids that are trying to live out of B&Bs cos there is now where currently they can afford to live, or worse crashing in hostels . Yes i know ideally you shoudl not have kids until you are set up for it.

But th elikes of the spire and all teh other frivolties the government ok in the face of this and other matters makes my blood boil.

Now if only i couldt somehow seize control of the country just long enough to change how the money is spent.

Borzoi

Originally posted by Xterminator


And just on the moaning issue, can you imagine the moans from the residents of the apartment blocks if they learnt a homeless shelter was to be in or near there buildings?

The whole 'not in my backyard' pathetic attitude, where they will say ... whaaa the property prices will be affected' etc etc ... all the same tired excuses we hear each time a traveller site is proposed etc.

Hehe might be worth doing just to piss em off!

X

I don't know, a lot easier to sell your place with a homeless hostel around the corner than whith a homeless person across the doorstep. (a freinds apartment block reqularly has someone homeless sleeping in the lobby)

But this is rapidly turning into a humanities thread.

I am glad to see the regeneration of O'Connell St, but that Spire is a little boring for my taste, it could have been something a lot more creative. Nevertheless we're stuck with it know.

MDR

But th elikes of the spire and all teh other frivolties the government ok in the face of this and other matters makes my blood boil.

I don't agree entirely, just because you don't pass down O'Connell street regularily you feel the money wasted. How many Dubliners (who pay tax) walk down it daily.

I often get a similar argument from friends from the country, because the money isn't being spent on their local priorities, it is being wasted (why waste money building something in Dublin ?).

Don't get me wrong you have a valid point, social justice is important, the government by cancelling the stadium spending I hope is also demonstrating this priority.

The only point I wish to reiterate is, 'the regeneration of O'Connell street IS also important'. It has been 10 years in the planning, and its not something Dubliners should be robbed of at this late stage.

Corega

Personally I don't see the point in sticking a 100ft dildo in the middle of O'Connell street, I reckon we should have a 300ft bronze statue of DeVore. Far more intersting imo

Shazbat

We could use the spike for sticking the heads of corrupt politicians on, just like in the olden days. That would be far more effective than any tribunal.

Thats about the only purpose it would serve.

I'd like half an hour alone with it and a hacksaw.

Turner

As part of the regeneration project I think they should get rid of all the dark/badly maintained shops/amusement arcades/ chippers /pharmacies.
Make O Connell st more like grafton street. Places like Dr Quirkeys and that other hellhole darky kellys or whatever its called should be given the boot. They attract the wrong type of people into town to basically hang about and look dirty.

On grafton street every shop has a nice shopfront, there are no arcades and generally no scangers hanging around doin fuk all. Im not saying that i shop on grafton street but it is nice to walk down a well maintained street. Generally the standard of shops on the street will reflect the standard of people walking down that street.

MDR

As part of the regeneration project I think they should get rid of all the dark/badly maintained shops/amusement arcades/ chippers /pharmacies.

a percentage of the money will go towards grants to shopkeeper to improve their shop frontage ...

MDR

well its finally going up ...

SantaHoe

Hmmm, I didn't think the first section would be quite so large.
Looks like it's going to be a mosterous yolke by the time it's finished
Yeah it's a waste of money... they could have given the money to me, but it's nice to have something to gawk at and say "jeyasus look at de bleedin' soiz oh dah!"... innit.

sceptre

Originally posted by MDR
well its finally going up ...

When, today?

(didn't notice anything yesterday when I was wandering around the big schmoke)

MDR

first section is already up ... the second section goes up today.
there are nine sections in all.

BeatTun

lmfao @ that millenium clock in the liffey

what the fukk was that all about?

Zachary Taylor

a marring of the old and new.

freudian.

Wasn't one of the conditions of the original project that the monument would fit in with the existing buildings, monuments etc... which the Monument of Light certainly doesn't. I think that in a city with such gaping ommissions in the immortalisation of historical figures that the spike is meaningless. The point of the Eiffel Tower was that it reflected the industrial age in which it was built. My main objection is that the monument doesn't really represent anything positive - that the connection between the spike and a syringe or stiletto is much more natural than between the spike and anything positive. Also, it will make Daniel O' Connell look like there is a giant luminous spike growing out of his head.

MDR

There was a competition, it won, love it or hate it, its democracy in its finest form.

Wether the Spire fits in with the rest of O'Connell street is all a matter of taste. Theoritically we could re-building nelson's column but who would we put on top of it (assuming we won't want to put nelson back) DeValera, Collins, Butt, Lemas, Wilde, Yeats ... The Pope. Of course you could dedicate the monument or any alternative you would find appropriate to a more absract cause, such as World Peace etc ...

The Monument of Light I suppose is the ultimate abstraction, its a light in the dark, its a pillar of strenght, a beacon in the night, or a giant herion needle. I don't know, I think its appropriate in a way that its left to the citizen to decide what it represents ... the absraction doesn't bother me ... don't ask what its for, let it just be.

Zachary Taylor

Democracy in its finest form? I don't mean to be argumentitive (you are right in saying that it is a matter of taste) but to say that the decision was democratic is ridiculous. Apart from the fact that the monument is contraty to one of the conditions of the competition ( as I have stated earlier), it was not selected by popular vote. To quote Dublin City Council:

"The winning design was chosen from an original international field of 205 entries. The majority of the entries were from Ireland but were also received from Europe, America and even Iran. The field was shortlisted to three, Jonathan Bennett, Dublin based architect, Ian Ritchie Architects of London and Hunt McGarry, Architects, also based in London.

The panel of assessors were the Lord Mayor of Dublin, Clllr. Senator Joe Doyle, Joan O'Connor, Architect and Chairperson Jim Barrett, Dublin City Architect, Henri Ciriani, Parisian based architect, Dick Gleeson, Dublin Corporation, , Tom Rae, Dublin Chamber of Commerce, Vivenne Roche, Sculptor."
http://www.dublincity.ie/planning/monument2.html

schrodinger

I don't like the spike at all. I really think they should have left the flussie in the jacuzy. As others have said already it's just going to be covered with graffitti and the police are going to spend their time arressting idiots who believe they're spiderman nad try to climb it.

^CwAzY^

It can't be graffitied to the best of my knowledge. It was pounded with steel pellets to give it a surface that can't be vandalised

GuanYin

Mneh, I think its a gross misuse of money.
4 million euros plus upkeep for a large shiney stick?

I'm sure it will make O'Connell street look nicer, sure, but then so would spending for million on a project targeted at giving shelter and food the to vast number of homeless people that I see around town at night.

It might also be money more morally spent.

MDR

True .... but as I have said before ...
you can always find 'what the money may have been better spent on'.

Money spent on Broadband infrastructure perhaps could have been better spent on hospital, that is if you don't value Broadband. It has alot to do the value you place on something.

If you ask the older generations of Dubliners what O'Connell street was like during the 60's. They will go all starry eyed and talk about the metropole dance hall et al . O'Connell street has gone to rack and ruin since.

People don't relise the effect living in a squad neon ridden town has on the quality of life/moral of its people. However they run out of Dublin the first chance they get, and say Jasus I am glad I got out there, what about the people who are left ?

Can a 120 metre steel spire improve the quality of life of the people ? not by itself, but it is only the start of the €400 milllion regeneration of O'Connell street and surrounds. Dubliners deserver a city to be proud of, they deserve a modern city.

Some excellent work has been done on the regeneration of the city on the southside over years, now its times to tackle O'Connell street and the unholy mess it has become. The Spire is a very modern daring piece of art, it was always gonna be contraversal, but all the contraversey has been useful in putting attention back on O'Connell street.

If you want to rebuild the town you are gonna have to be daring and you are gonna have to spent money. Do Dubliners not deserve to live in a town as pretty as say 'Kilkenny' ?.

BTW ... the council is building homeless shelters at the moment ... in association with one of the groups which tries to look after them. A couple of mate of mine are site foreman at the construction of 2 homeless shelters. Propbabily OT because the money could have been better spent on thing X instead, but I though it worth letting you know ... I do dispare at the homeless situation myself also ....

Lafortezza

Originally posted by sykeirl
Mneh, I think its a gross misuse of money.
4 million euros plus upkeep for a large shiney stick?

I'm sure it will make O'Connell street look nicer, sure, but then so would spending for million on a project targeted at giving shelter and food the to vast number of homeless people that I see around town at night.

It might also be money more morally spent.

If every person going out on the town next weekend bought 1 less drink over the night and it was all counted and spent on something more "moral", how much do you think the final figure would be?

What if this was done every weekend? And what if it was done for cigarettes and other stuff, just one pack a week less by everyone who smokes, money going to worthy causes...

The money is always there, just that we're spending it on different things

GuanYin

Originally posted by lafortezza
If every person going out on the town next weekend bought 1 less drink over the night and it was all counted and spent on something more "moral", how much do you think the final figure would be?

Where did the money from the spire come from in the first place? either directly from tax money or from an EU fund that directly or indirectly came from taxes initially.

What people do and how much they contribute to charity is a matter of personal choice and that sort of thing can't be pushed on the masses.

However, any argument about making Dublin City centre look nicer or improving morale of Dublin city that ignores the city's poor and impovrished is seriously flawed.

A cosmeting thing is grand, but I for one would have a higher morale if I wasn't concerned about some poor 15 year old freezing to death on a doorstep on the quays.