Metallica vs. Megadeth...

cournioni

Who do you think is better?

I honestly think that some of tallica's early riffs were untouchable. But in the 90's Megadeth hammered Metallica around the place musically. Rust in Peace was way more demanding of guitar skills than that of the Black album in my opinion. And the riffs were unbelieveable. So its a tough one. I think the 'deth is better by a fraction.

Dustaz

I dont know how you can even compare them.

Megadeth never ever came anywhere near to matching Metallicas talent, songwriting and forward thinking. The word innovation does not exist in mustaines dictionary whereas Metallica recorded 3 groundbreaking albums in a row. They almost singlehandedly introduced the concepts of production and engineering into a genre with limited scope.

Regardless of personal tastes you must take the above into account. Its like saying 'Who is better, The beatles or coldplay?'. I prefer listening to parachutes than any beatles album, but i wouldnt for one second consider them better.

Shinji

What Dustaz said. Megadeth had some great tunes and so on, but there's simply no comparison between their contribution to music and what Metallica have done.

When it comes to remembering the great bands of the last decade to two decades, Megadeth will be a very long way down the list. We'll remember enduring names like Nirvana and Metallica for decades. Megadeth will be the preserve of hardcore fans only.

(And Megadeth will never have anything to set the little hairs on the back of your neck standing up like the entire Metallica S&M cd/dvd can...)

lordsippa

I think the issue at hand is which band has better tunes, not which made a bigger contribution...

Metallica have a tendancy to make an album with 2/3 good songs and a load of crap. Megadeth are slightly more consistent....

Then again, Metallica have a few more classics. If it came down to who i'd rather listen to an album by Megadeth, if it came down to a single song, Metallica.

DrunkLeprachaun

I think Megadeth are the better band.
And don't talk about Metallica contributing to Metal. They were weened on Dave Mustane's piss. Lars even said that it was they're plan to sell out.
Regardless of that, though, I still think Megadeth have better songs.

cournioni

Mustaine is a far better guitarist than both Hammett and Hetfield. Alright, I'll give Hetfield the credit for his picking and the riffs he writes... but neither of them have the skill that Mustaine has.

Dustaz

pornapster, you started off this thread with 'which are better' not which you prefer.


here we go again

When you wake up a few years down the line and realise that metal just isnt the holy grail that you think it is (and it will happen) and you start to experience other forms of music and realise theres more contained in a single beatles song than the entire helloween back catelogue, you will be pleasantly suprised to realise that youll still be able to listen to all your metallica albums. megadeth however will bore you to tears, no matter how fast mustaine can play.

also, dont bring up the sell out argument ffs.

Dustaz

Originally posted by lordsippa
I think the issue at hand is which band has better tunes, not which made a bigger contribution...

Metallica write well constructed and accessible tunes that dont solely rely on a formulaic genre. Megadeth dont. ergo, metallica are better and write better tunes.

cournioni

Originally posted by Dustaz
When you wake up a few years down the line and realise that metal just isnt the holy grail that you think it is (and it will happen) and you start to experience other forms of music and realise theres more contained in a single beatles song than the entire helloween back catelogue, you will be pleasantly suprised to realise that youll still be able to listen to all your metallica albums. megadeth however will bore you to tears, no matter how fast mustaine can play.

Metallica are boring me to tears right now as a matter of fact, ...And Justice for all and the Black album have to be two of the most boring of all time. And as as lordsippa says, Metallica are inconsistant. Which happens in all of their albums. And its getting worse.

I've been listening to metal for over 11 years... do you think I'm going to stop now? I don't think so.

also, dont bring up the sell out argument ffs.

I didn't mention anything of the sort.

][cEMAN**

ActuallyI have only 1 Megadeth album but nearly all of the metallica albums.

The way I see it is that the guitar work that megadeth is by far more amazing in solo's and runs but Metallica have better Riffs.

Some of you may think otherwise but then that's down to personal opinion.

When I listen to Megadeth I think - hey, wow, ****ign excellent sound, but I don't come away with anything from the songs. No depth, just mainly words. When I listen to metallica some of their stuff (not all) leaves some kind of impact.

Also (and i'm not 100% on megadeth cause I haven't heard too much of their stuff outside of what I own), Metallica have evolved over the years. To all thos who say that they've not been true to their fans or their music - well what about all their new fans, and in the end who says you have to play one style or ahve one sound? You have 4 guys in a band - you think they all think the same thoughts or come up with the same songs? Sure didn't Jason leave there cause he wanted to do his own stuff but James and Lars wouldn't let him?

Megadeth will go down with the greats for guitar work but not for songs - Metallica are too well rounded to even put in the same area as Megadeth.

DrunkLeprachaun

Originally posted by Dustaz
When you wake up a few years down the line and realise that metal just isnt the holy grail that you think it is (and it will happen) and you start to experience other forms of music and realise theres more contained in a single beatles song than the entire helloween back catelogue, you will be pleasantly suprised to realise that youll still be able to listen to all your metallica albums. megadeth however will bore you to tears, no matter how fast mustaine can play.

I'm aware that I might not like metal in 5 or 10 years, but thatdoesn't matter. I do now. The Beatles used to be my favorite band, but I got bored of them. Their songs are a bit samey.
I still think Megadeth are better than Metallica, and I always have.

immort4l

Pornapster, I agree with every word of your thread starting post.EVERY bit!!I agree that 'deth just clinch it in the end though..

Beruthiel

sorry, Metallica for me ma lad, no contest, end of discussion!

Lemming

I agree with Beruthiel and Dustaz on this one.

Now .. speaking from a technical stand point .....

I'll brign up this little nugget for ye. Metallica's music (up until their most recent albums - excluding S&M) consists of a structure closely resembling classical music. Not all, but a great deal of it does. Do you have ANY idea how difficult it is to write music like that? More importantly, do you have ANY idea how difficult it is to write GOOD music like that?

Doesn't matter how many blindingly fast guitar solos you can do - its still one person doing it all.

Classical music is the otehr way around. Technicality is in how every instrument being used relates (granted - this is a very simplistic arguement - I'm keeping it this way deliberately)

So I would disagree with those that say that they (metallica) have been inconsistent in their music. Perhaps YOUR perception of their music, but that's down to personal taste. Nothing more.

In terms of solo work, MegaDeth rule the roost here, but in terms of everything else, ranging from impact to emotional response, Metallica win by a mile.

Dustaz

Its all about the soundscape man

(Mustaine thinks that involves wearing down his 250th plectrum of the week.)

Karl Hungus

Even though Dustaz makes some pretty god damn terrible points, I can see where he's coming from.
Metallica over Megadeth.

/|/)etal)-|ead

I don't like megadeth at all. What happened to mustaine anyway? I heard he couldn't play guitar cos of an accident or something. Anyway, sure, he was a good guitarist, but i think Kirk Hammett is even better, he just doesn't keep trying to show off as much as mustaine, and concentrates on the actual song.

Someone said ...and justice for all was a boring album... wtf??? that and puppets are my favorite albums ever.

ps anyone know if james or kirk write the solos for metallica?

BossArky

the only solo that Hethfield wrote and plays is the Nothing Else Matters one.

Hammett writes and plays the rest...taking suggestions from Ulrich and Hethfield as to the feel and vibe, etc?

Megadeth are a bit more die-hard...but I feel that switching between the two bands allows you to appreciate each style more.

On the whole...I'd have to stand by Metallica tho...better music, more skill, some weighty lyrics...

...where as Mustaine just seems like a skinny 16 year old scum bag with a chip on his shoulder..

DrunkLeprachaun

Mustaine don't have no chip. He's cool. He was on never mind the buzcocks, and he didn't act the dick at all. He is skinny though.

Dustaz

Originally posted by BossArky
the only solo that Hethfield wrote and plays is the Nothing Else Matters one.

Wrong. James hetfield plays a fair few of the solos on Puppets and Justice. not sure about the rest.

cournioni

Originally posted by /|/)etal)-|ead
I don't like megadeth at all. What happened to mustaine anyway? I heard he couldn't play guitar cos of an accident or something. Anyway, sure, he was a good guitarist, but i think Kirk Hammett is even better, he just doesn't keep trying to show off as much as mustaine, and concentrates on the actual song.

LOL... right, I know this was your opinion. But you can't even compare the two. The only member out of Metallica that you can compare to Mustaine is Hetfield because of his down picking ability...

Did you ever see the solo's Hammett does live? He thinks he's Jimi ****ing Hendrix the way he uses the wah wah. He uses it on nearly every solo! And if you look at the tabs on Load, it'll show that some of the solos he plays on there aren't even nu-metal quality. He enhanses the sound on the wah wah. So I think you are very much mistaken, young man.

Someone said ...and justice for all was a boring album... wtf??? that and puppets are my favorite albums ever.

It is, I don't know how you can compare puppets and justice. The only song worth listening to on justice is one.


BTW... the only person that I agree with on this topic that thinks Metallica is better than 'deth is Lemming. He's right about the Classical structures in Metallica's music. But I do have to disagree with the people who say that all Mustaine is good for is wearing down plectrums (looks at Dustaz). You try and play a solo by John Petrucci (blindingly fast) and say that.

Dustaz

Originally posted by PORNAPSTER

But I do have to disagree with the people who say that all Mustaine is good for is wearing down plectrums (looks at Dustaz). You try and play a solo by John Petrucci (blindingly fast) and say that.

Since when does fast = good?

Lemming

Originally posted by Dustaz


Wrong. James hetfield plays a fair few of the solos on Puppets and Justice. not sure about the rest.

Jim plays the first solo in Orion (puppets album) for defo anyway.

Lemming

Originally posted by PORNAPSTER
Did you ever see the solo's Hammett does live? He thinks he's Jimi ****ing Hendrix the way he uses the wah wah. He uses it on nearly every solo! And if you look at the tabs on Load, it'll show that some of the solos he plays on there aren't even nu-metal quality. He enhanses the sound on the wah wah.

Ah, the question is not how technical his solos are, but in context to what I mentioned earlier about classical music style, does it relate to the sound of the other instruments (ie. does it fit) ?? More often then not, it does.

And so what if he uses the wah - that's his style, just like mustaine's is making his fingers move like they're on E.

Deathtobertie

Megadeth turned ****e after rust in peace and metallica went down the tubes after kill 'em all.

In my opinion Megadeth are clear victors.

Bard

I agree with Dustaz.





There,... that was easy.

b20uvkft6m5xwg

Originally posted by Deathtobertie
Megadeth turned ****e after rust in peace and metallica went down the tubes after kill 'em all.

Re: Metallica
I would backdate that "down the tubes" comment to after "And Justice..." It really did go downhill from there-
[like S&M-> WTF... I know Bard will disagree with that;)]

Metallica who once maligned "Arena Rockers" (see "a year and half in the life of Met...") became the afore mentioned with the Black album. Looking forward, I think the resignation of Newsted may give Lars and James a kick in the nads and get them back to writing some old sk00l Metallica riffs- Thats of course if James recovers after rehab.

cournioni

Originally posted by Lemming


Ah, the question is not how technical his solos are, but in context to what I mentioned earlier about classical music style, does it relate to the sound of the other instruments (ie. does it fit) ?? More often then not, it does.

And so what if he uses the wah - that's his style, just like mustaine's is making his fingers move like they're on E.

LOL... Me and a few of the lads that I jam with have wrote a few songs together and we can "make it fit" no bother. You can play a guitar at turtle speed and make it fit. The fella that writes the majority of the music for us thinks that Megadeth songs are harder to write (and play) than any Metallica song. I happen to believe him. Another question for you... who is the better drummer? Lars Ulrich or Nick Menza?

And Dustaz, as I said... play a Petrucci solo. Go on, I'd love to see it. You think its really easy don't you? Well play it. I'll go to watch you play it, wherever it is... Oh thats right you can't. Oh shame.

Lemming

oh FFS!!!!!! :rolleyes:

"My band's better than your band."
"My band plays faster than your band"
wah wah wah.

I heard a beautiful quote from the lead guitarist of Spinal Tap in a guitar magazine article

"if you're not thinking about the last note you played, then why are you playing it?"

I'm sure I could play 500 notes a minute .. just mightened make any sense.

It's not about who plays faster, who can make their fingers move like they're on E. Who's drummer can play 1000000000000000000000000000 beats second per uber-f*cking-alles second.

And quite frankly I'm sick of this absolute tit-w*nk.

if makes you happy, I'll get my sister (degree in music performance) to go and analyse both Metallica and Megadeth muscially (not by taste - she doesn't like metal - so I know she wont be biased).

Nominate me 5 songs from each band and I'll end this f*cking argument by getting her to sit down and take a look at it. Her analysis papers are sh*t hot and very thorough.

Oh .. and give me a reason for choosing each song. Why you think it should be analysed - its strengths, and why you think it pisses all over everything else

Quigs Snr

What it comes down to is the songs. People vote with their dollars, Metallica outsold Megadeth many times over, therefore a majority of people would prefer Metallica.

I have all albums of both bands.

My tuppence worth. Megadeth. Loved Rust In Peace, after that, it didn't quite go downhill, but it changed. Coutdown to Extinction was Megadeths response to Metallica's Black album. I quite liked it. It had more structure etc.. and more radio friendly, the riffs were more memorable too, albeit simpler (symphony of destruction). However, youthanasia etc.... (although being a fan I still liked them) was the begining of the end.

Metallica, I have fonder memories off. Kill Em All was unique, ride, puppets etc... were like a double album really, and justice... was heavier and less musical, I still loved it. They went a little Bon Jovi on the Black Album, but the quality of the songs was undoubted, not as 'woven' or complex as previous releases, but brilliant nonetheless.

Load, was a huge dissappointment. Quite like Until it sleeps and a few others, but couldn't make myself feel quite the same about that album as the rest, reload, a little more like their old selves, but still well below par (the par they set themselves).

Anyway, Maiden with their middle england, pagan semi mystical twaddle rock were better than both of them. So there.

Arguments, about faster blah blah are redundant. Techical details, do not make a great song. If that were the case Tesla would be better than both of them (Paradise). And we don't want that now do we ?

cournioni

No need Lemming. The fella that writes the majority of the music for our little jamming sessions has a degree in Music also. (I'm not sure which college he went to, but it was in London).

I'll mention a few songs for you to give analysis on scene as youre so eager to prove me wrong....

Megadeth
In My Darkest Hour
Holy Wars
Hangar 18 (got to love Freidman's sweep picking solo at the start)
Symphony of Destruction
A tout le Monde

Metallica
Seek and Destroy
Fade to Black
Damage inc.
One
Enter Sandman.

Karl Hungus

You know, technical ability *IS* part of the music.

If you'd listen to any of the crap by Linkin Park, you'd realise that long held out powerchords are about the dullest thing ever. And you could blurt about how technical prowess doesn't mean anything untill you go bezerk in the head, but it wouldn't negate the fact that it's total dross.

Ironically, I'd pick Metallica over Megadeth any day.


But it's all part of the whole picture.

As anyone will tell you, the ability to do 50 hammer-ons a second, and 'Widdle-squidle' like Satch is USELESS without having a good song.
But what if you didn't have the skill to do what you wanted properly?

One of my favorite bands is Opeth.
Now they write some of the most complex music on earth.
AND they are brilliant songwriters.

So, it's all part of the package, I say.

Lemming

Originally posted by PORNAPSTER
I'll mention a few songs for you to give analysis on scene as youre so eager to prove me wrong....

*sighs*

I@m not eager to prove you wrong Pornapster. I'm jsut sick of this "my band is better than your band" and "this guy can play faster than this guy so he MUST be better" etc etc

It's absolute tit-w*nk.

I'll say this. Anyone who has done L.C. music up to say, 6 years ago. Mention the words "Buckley" and "Violin Concerto" together, and watch them recoil in absolute horror frmo the flashbacks.

This is an extremely technical concerto written for a then principal violinist of either the NSO (national symphony orchestra) or the RTE SO (which I can't remember) to show off his virtuoso talents.

Incredible skill required to play it - but absolute TORTURE to listen to. One of the most hideous and f*cking disgusting musical works to actually listen too though. It wasn't about the music - it was about shownig how good this musician was with their instrument.

Draw the connection .....

cournioni

Originally posted by Lemming


*sighs*

I@m not eager to prove you wrong Pornapster. I'm jsut sick of this "my band is better than your band" and "this guy can play faster than this guy so he MUST be better" etc etc

Did I say that? All I said to Dustaz was try and play a Petrucci solo and tell me that isn't hard to write and play and quite sensably he didn't reply... I think you yourself will agree with this if you have any Dream Theater albums that they are amazing musicians and songwriters. Well do you?

Dustaz

Originally posted by PORNAPSTER


And Dustaz, as I said... play a Petrucci solo. Go on, I'd love to see it. You think its really easy don't you? Well play it. I'll go to watch you play it, wherever it is... Oh thats right you can't. Oh shame.

I give up. You give any form of music a bad name.

Lemming

Originally posted by PORNAPSTER

I think you yourself will agree with this if you have any Dream Theater albums that they are amazing musicians and songwriters. Well do you?

No I don't have any of their stuff, to answer that particular question.

cournioni

Originally posted by Dustaz
I give up. You give any form of music a bad name.

Now, now Dustaz... no need to be disappointed. I was just taking the piss outta you, but in fairness you were asking for it.

You were more or less saying its ok to play at turtle speed and saying its talented.

cournioni

Originally posted by Lemming


No I don't have any of their stuff, to answer that particular question.

Well go out and get some! You don't know what you are missing...

BTW... if youre planning to buy "Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence" (double cd), be prepared to pay up to €40. Well worth it though.

Dustaz

Originally posted by PORNAPSTER

Now, now Dustaz... no need to be disappointed. I was just taking the piss outta you, but in fairness you were asking for it.

You were more or less saying its ok to play at turtle speed and saying its talented.

OK, now i reckon your taking the piss. Thats exactly what i was saying.
Eric Clapton must be devastated that you think this way. I think i can hear carlos santana crying a river as well.

Please cop on.

Lemming

Originally posted by PORNAPSTER
You were more or less saying its ok to
play at turtle speed and saying its talented.

Erm .. some of THE greatest riffs/ guitar solo's are played at "turtle speed" and f*ck are they talented


GnR - November Rain, Sweet Child of Mine
Eagles - Hotel California
Thin Lizzy - Parisienne Nights
Queen - It's a kind of magic
Clapton - Layla
Led Zepplin - Stairway to Heaven

and I'm sure there's a bucket load others I'm missing.

Last time I checked - pretty much all of the riffs/solos in those songs are played at what you would consider "turtle speed"

Speed does not equal Great. It most certainly implies technically capable, and I will not dispute that. But youre missing what it is that makes great music GREAT.... the "music". Stop showing off and try to express yourself through the music. Your instrument becomes an extension of your emotions, of your soul. Let it sing. THAT is what stops so many technically capable people writing music that is out of this world.

(and no .. Im' not stoned or drunk)

Karl Hungus

I'm going with Lemming on this one...

I mean, has anyone here ever heard Children Of Bodom's cover of The Trooper?
It's played about 4 times the speed of the original, and it's ****E!!!

/|/)etal)-|ead

I know this isn't really stickin to the subject, but Angel, don't diss Children of Bodom. They rule!!! I only got into them a few months ago, but the guitarist is almost as good as friggin Yngwie Malmsteen, and the keyboard player is unbelievably good.
plus, all their songs are really well written in a sort of classical fashion.

Jim plays the first solo in Orion (puppets album) for defo anyway.

yeah, i know he plays a few of the slower solos here and there, but i was wondering who wrote them.

p.s. apparently Dave Mustaine will eventually be able to play guitar again after his injury

Lemming

Originally posted by /|/)etal)-|ead
yeah, i know he plays a few of the slower solos here and there, but i was wondering who wrote them.

Well, afaik, Cliff taught Jim and Kirk about harmony, counter-point, etc. - all classical music stuff.

So i would imagine that he had a serious input into the guitar work for Orion

cournioni

Originally posted by AngelWhore
I'm going with Lemming on this one...

I mean, has anyone here ever heard Children Of Bodom's cover of The Trooper?
It's played about 4 times the speed of the original, and it's ****E!!!

Yeah... I see your point there. But you must not class all speed metal as ****e because of Children of Bodom's cover! And anyway, thats an opinion, not a fact. The fact that it was a cover song was why they speeded the song up so much, they didn't actually write the song if you know what I'm talking about.

P.S. I would like to add that I prefer "Hangar 18" by Megadeth over any Metallica song. And yes that is an opinion.

cournioni

Originally posted by Lemming


Erm .. some of THE greatest riffs/ guitar solo's are played at "turtle speed" and f*ck are they talented


GnR - November Rain, Sweet Child of Mine
Eagles - Hotel California
Thin Lizzy - Parisienne Nights
Queen - It's a kind of magic
Clapton - Layla
Led Zepplin - Stairway to Heaven

and I'm sure there's a bucket load others I'm missing.

Last time I checked - pretty much all of the riffs/solos in those songs are played at what you would consider "turtle speed"

Speed does not equal Great. It most certainly implies technically capable, and I will not dispute that. But youre missing what it is that makes great music GREAT.... the "music". Stop showing off and try to express yourself through the music. Your instrument becomes an extension of your emotions, of your soul. Let it sing. THAT is what stops so many technically capable people writing music that is out of this world.

(and no .. Im' not stoned or drunk)

I would not consider any of them turtle speed as a matter of fact, I'm on about slower than that. LOL. I mean slow enough so that you can hear the change of chords. Last time I played like that it sounded terrible come to think of it.

I never said that speed = great either. I just like fast music, I have nothing against slow music... I was just arguing with the people that started saying that fast music was more or less sh*t, and that I should start listening to different types of music. Personally, I have nothing against Metallica other than their image at this current time. And if you look at the "what metal song are you listening to now?" thread, you'll clearly see that I still very much like the old school stuff. It's just that personally I think Megadeth are better on their instruments because of some of the excellent riffs and solos they play. And most of the solos they play aren't even one tenth of the speed of other bands I listen to. I'm not saying that they are any better or any worse than Megadeth because of their speed. I judge them by their writing and technical ability. And as I said, I prefer Megadeth because of that.

Karl Hungus

Originally posted by /|/)etal)-|ead
I know this isn't really stickin to the subject, but Angel, don't diss Children of Bodom. They rule!!! I only got into them a few months ago, but the guitarist is almost as good as friggin Yngwie Malmsteen, and the keyboard player is unbelievably good.
plus, all their songs are really well written in a sort of classical fashion.

Oh, don't get me wrong!
CoB are a fantastic band!
I'm just saying it was a terrible cover.

I'd actualy say that Alexi (Guitarist) is BETTER than Malmstein.
Considering that he's about a third of his age, and he writes far better music, he's extremely impressive.

king of fifa

mettalica sound better (first four albums only) .i can't stand mustaines singing bit i will always have a thousand times more respect for deth cause they didn't sell out.i suppose it would have been hard; dave mustaine doing whiskey in the jar anyone?

/|/)etal)-|ead

heh sorry for accusing u of not liking COB Angelwhore ^_^
I didn't realise u just meant that particular song ( i haven't even heard it!). I wonder how the hell he got so brilliant so young- I think he played the violin when he was a child or something so maybe that helped lol.
Yeah, i agree that alexi writes much better music than Yngwie

Dustaz

Originally posted by king of fifa
mettalica sound better (first four albums only) .i can't stand mustaines singing bit i will always have a thousand times more respect for deth cause they didn't sell out.i suppose it would have been hard; dave mustaine doing whiskey in the jar anyone?

Megadeth did the Anarchy in the USA cover before Metallica recorded Whiskey in the Jar. Of course Metallica had done lots of covers before that one.
Doing a cover does not make you a 'Sell out' you mong.

Is it possible that Metallicas personal musical preference brought them forwards and made them write differently? Not eveyone is a raving 'DAETH TOE FALES METAL' all their life you know.

Anyway, selling out is not the topic of this thread, so ill leave it now (i dare someone to start a thread on it, it would be very amusing.)

smiles

For me Metallica have real depth and feeling/emotion in their song, which means i enjoy them more.

<< Fio >>

Karl Hungus

Originally posted by /|/)etal)-|ead
heh sorry for accusing u of not liking COB Angelwhore ^_^
I didn't realise u just meant that particular song ( i haven't even heard it!). I wonder how the hell he got so brilliant so young- I think he played the violin when he was a child or something so maybe that helped lol.
Yeah, i agree that alexi writes much better music than Yngwie

The guy must have been playing since he was able to walk.

But in a lot of scandinavian countries, the government give grants for kids to buy musical instruments, and get lessons. So you'll find that a lot of the musicians are EXTREMELY well trained. Take a look at Ihsahn from Emperor! On the last album, he played almost every single instrument except for the drums.

On the Diabolical Masquerade album "Death's Design", Blakkheim played all the guitars/bass/drums/Keyboards and vocals, aswell as conducting an entire Orchestra! Now that's musicianship!