MX-5 Owners Club

clonedmonkey

There's alot MX-5's / Roadsters in the Dublin area these days, I was just wondering is there anyone subscribed to boards who owns/interested in owning one of these classics ?

I have a huge collection of web sites/contacts/owners club information where you can find details on Performance Modifications / Trackracing days / Meets with NI and UK owners clubs and general customisation details.

Anyone intersted gimmie a shout.

ToxicPaddy

WWM is the guy to talk to... he's the proud owner of one..

clonedmonkey

much appreciated, thank you.

WhiteWashMan

as far as im aware, there is no web site up for ireland yet, but there is a club.
you can get pretty much all the details of everything mx-5/raodster in uk and ireland at
http://www.mx5oc.co.uk/

Vexorg

I was looking for a good 1.8 litre mark 1, most of the stuff I looked at was badly looked after and the good ones were very over priced. Ended up with a Del Sol instead... sigh... must start saving again...


Sure slap your links up here, I wouldnt mind surfing a few MX5/Maita sites again.


V.

WhiteWashMan

vex, that mx-5 site above will ive you a load of nice miata sies and stuff.
its pretty comprehensive and gives some nice details on imports etc.

or

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mx5ireland/

or do a search for the miata webring

clonedmonkey

Thanks WWM, ToxicPaddy & Vexorg,

My car:

89' Red Eunos Roadster 1.6
35K miles
15 Alloys & low profiles
mint condition, my pride & joy.

I'm a member of the mx5ireland@yahoogroups.com mailing list. Anything you want to know about the car, these are a really helpfull bunch of people. We've met a couple of times and had up to 20 cars on runs around Wicklow, blessington, rest of Ireland. Some guys have serious modification to their cars. It's all about squeezing the extra bhp out of the machines. Most people are a member of the UK Owners club.

to subscribe to the mail list send a mail to :
mx5ireland-subscribe@egroups.com

Here are my MX-5 / Roadster / Miata links :

If you want to buy, a good place to start is here, prices are quoted in sterling but there's a Dublin base :
http://www.webcars.net/carssale-mazda.htm and
http://www.autolinkuk.co.uk/

other sites for performance addons, rollbars, hoods etc etc and for sale :

http://www.mx5parts.co.uk/
http://www.kayuautos.com/
http://www.donutz.co.uk/
http://www.mx5city.co.uk/
http://www.performancebuyers.com/home.html?carLineID=10
http://www.mx-5.org/ireland/
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mx5ireland/

have a few more if you want.

S.

WhiteWashMan

the problem is that once you start adding to your car, you gotta keep going. its addictive
i want a spoiler,and rear mudgards.

but damn i love my car.
mines a 90 roadster with a dark blue roof and it goes like a hot snot!!!

ive decided recently that once ive finished using it as my main car im going to just keep it and do it up proper and stuff.

you know if you import from japan you can get for about 2 and half grand sterling?????
cheap.

clonedmonkey

wow, who do you use to import through ?
What mods have you added to your motor ?

I'm never selling mine either, some people thinks it's
worth a bit aswell, the chasis no. is NA6CE100233.
one of the first cars to roll of the production line.
It was in storage for nearly 6 years, taken out at
weekends, and has 54Km's on it, 35K in miles.

should last a while :-) have ordered a rollbar for it.
Next comes a cat replacement pipe and Powerstack
Cone Filter.

Where are you based WWM ?

WhiteWashMan

im inn surrey.
i wonder if there are more people out there who would post to a board.
could be worth getting a forum set up.

WhiteWashMan

Originally posted by clonedmonkey
wow, who do you use to import through ?

i wish i did. that just a figure i heard quoted for importing a car worth about 5 grand over here. but its somehing i would seriously look into if i were to get another one.
vasically i think you have to have someone at an auction in japan who will buy it and ship it, so i suppose you would have to have a contact in japan. but it could save a ton if you had three or four people willing to risk it.

Originally posted by clonedmonkey

What mods have you added to your motor ?

absolutely none. i stuck in my own stereo as the jap one sucked and thats about it. well, apart from adding a fog light so it would pass the MOT. i was very close however to buying a beaut for 5000 that was pure black and had full body kit. it looked the dogs. anyway, i didnt get as i would have been hammered on insurance.

Originally posted by clonedmonkey
I'm never selling mine either, some people thinks it's
worth a bit aswell, the chasis no. is NA6CE100233.
one of the first cars to roll of the production line.
It was in storage for nearly 6 years, taken out at
weekends, and has 54Km's on it, 35K in miles.

ah, well mines a bit more used :)65k miles
no idea what the chasis is, but i suppose i will have to look as i need it to join the mx-5 owners club over here in england.

Originally posted by clonedmonkey
should last a while :-) have ordered a rollbar for it.
Next comes a cat replacement pipe and Powerstack
Cone Filter.

i have no idea what you just said

clonedmonkey

cool, I'd love do something about importing cars from Japan. It probably just takes the balls to do it, I think I'm ready for a move though, 5 years in Software is already taking it's toll.

have a look at www.mx5parts.co.uk that explains the mods I was talking about.

The cat replacement pipe is just a straight pipe that connects to the main header manifold (located towards the front underside of the car, where the exhaust begins) it replaces the catalytic converter and joins up with the back of the exhaust. This gives you more free reving and more low end torque supposedly.

The Powerstack Cone Filter simply replaces the stock Air Filter in the engine bay and "elps the engine breath more easily" (like the Tunes add). Cold air and better air flow = more power. Supposedly you get around 3 bhp extra for this mod.

Plus you should look into advancing the timing on your car for more power, see http://www.kayuautos.com/Service3.htm scrol down to timing

S.

Colefordkid

You could try www.dandycars.com/ or alternatively look at the http://www.mx5ocforum.co.uk/ forums for alternate UK importers

JHMEG

Vexorg wrote:

Ended up with a Del Sol instead...

A DOHC VTEC I hope (icing on the cake = Transtop) ? I always consider those to be "the thinking man's MX5"

franksm

Lads, FFS how come no-one found this:

www.mx5ireland.com

BTW Del Sol = "the thinking man's MX5" ? What's the reasoning there ? As far as I know, the two cars are completely different (MX5=rear-wheel-drive, Del Sol = front-wheel-drive with drum-brakes at the back)

RobAMerc

Guys - franksm from boards is big in the irish mx5 owners club.
I cannot for the life of me remember the url but if you search boards for his name you should find it he has a link to it at the bottom of his posts.
They meet in the phionix park on a sunday every month (sorry cant remember where or which sunday)

smash

there's a guy just starting up in Bray importing mostly MX-5's his site is www.webcars.net - check it out

RobAMerc

JHMEG wrote:

I always consider those to be "the thinking man's MX5"

Oh my god ! :eek:

I am speechless

BTW : I know where there is a very nice last of the mk1's for sale for only 6.5k ! Its got leather, 6*cd, abs, new tyres, momo wheel and its non jap import.

Stevo11

Steve06 : That is Art McCooey's (spl?) site, v.well respected, lots of cars in great nick, he's been doing it for years.

WWM : I've an OEM spoiler for sale, just had it removed from my car during the respray. Make me an offer..

Still can't believe ya hadn't found the mx5ireland site

Steve

mmenarry

RobAMerc wrote:

Oh my god ! :eek:

I am speechless

BTW : I know where there is a very nice last of the mk1's for sale for only 6.5k ! Its got leather, 6*cd, abs, new tyres, momo wheel and its non jap import.

Yeucchhh! It'll only have 89bhp then. Should have checked the FAQ on www.mx5ireland.com

M.
(only joshing ya, sounds nice)

JHMEG

RobAMerc wrote:

Oh my god ! :eek:

I am speechless

Don't wanna go OT here, but there seems to be a bit of confusion about the CRX/Del Sol specs.

To clarify: The 1.6L dohc vtec CRX VT puts out 160bhp, and its japanese counterpart (Del Sol SiR) is 170bhp, and optionally has an LSD. Good to hit 60 in ~7 seconds, and can go on to ~135mph. 262mm vented discs at the front, 240mm at the rear. Double wishbones all round. FWD.

Add to that the very cool (optional) electric "Transtop" and you have a very desireable and rare 2-seater targa, that goes like bejaysus.


But... Each to their own.

Stevo11

Have a read :
http://www.driver.ie/forum/showthread.php?t=33803

RobAMerc

JHMEG : to be fair I had the 1.5 version, but I can tell you this, the MX5 is a far better car all round than the CRX, fast enjoyable motoring is not only about straight line speed, try both over a stretch of road you know and enjoy and you'll see.

mmenarry wrote:

Yeucchhh! It'll only have 89bhp then. Should have checked the FAQ on www.mx5ireland.com

M.
(only joshing ya, sounds nice)

Nope tis the 130bhp 1800i.s. , tis no rocket but one of the most enjoyable engines I have ever sat behind.
As I said above t'aint all about the straight line speed

Ps: Sorry to bring this OT - I simply cannot allow - CRX beats MX5

JHMEG

RobAMerc wrote:

JHMEG : to be fair I had the 1.5 version, but I can tell you this, the MX5 is a far better car all round than the CRX, fast enjoyable motoring is not only about straight line speed, try both over a stretch of road you know and enjoy and you'll see

Again, don't like going off topic (maybe start a CRX vs MX5 thread?!) here, but I drove a 1998 1.6 MX5 (Irish model) for half a day, and felt very underwhelmed after the experience. To me it felt like I was driving a "lite" version of the normally aspirated MR2 (90-99).

The experience for me would be helped by near instant throttle response (which requires power); a howling (stock) induction system from 5,000 to 8,000 rpm and beyond as power builds, that makes the hair on the back of your neck stand up. Having a chassis that talk back, especially when it's on the limit. Having the power to pull the back end in when it goes a little wide helps too. If the MX5 had more power I'd probably like it, and might even be impressed by it. Having never driven a 1.8, I might be missing something but looking at the figures I don't think I am really.

Just my opinion. As I said before, each to their own.

cpoh1

Ive owned both in the past, the del sol SiR with manual roof followed straight afterwards by a mk1 1.8L mx5.

Looking back on it I honestly preferred the del sol, mostly because of the dohc vtec engined that revved happily all the way to 8500rpm and never ever complained about it (remember this engine is close to a slightly detuned civic typeR engine). Its fwd which for the purists is a negative over the mx5 but my del sol had the factory option lsd so the car absolutely ate corners. It was quite a bit faster than the mx5 too and not just in a straight line, the double wishbone suspension an absolute pleasure in the twisties, take the roof off however and its a different story. The del sol had a much bigger boot and hard top roof so safer from theives and was more reliable not giving me a days trouble.

In saying that the mx5 was a really good fun car to own also, cooler looking and the rwd was fun, problem was it was too underpowered to really have some proper fun in. The cockpit was nicer than the del sol but storage was rubbish and security was a nightmare with the softtop. I was expecting a massive step up from the del sol after reading all the hype surrounded by this car but was left totally underwhelmed to be honest, sold up after 6 months. Most of the hype versus the mx5 v's the del sol is based on heresay and reputation. The fact that there are crap models of the del sol doesnt help. for example drive the 1.5L del sol or even the transtop and you'll be disappointed. The same can be said for the 1.6L mx5 which is complete rubbish too though.

All in all the del sol isint as bad as people like to make out and the mx5 is nowhere near as flawless as people like you to believe.

gstonesmx5

for handeling its the mx5 but you are right the performance of the mrk2 1.6l is lacking but still fun. i have a 98 mrk2 1.6l for sale but i dont want to sell it because its great fun. you dont need 1million horse power all the time to enjoy the roundabouts and corners just the right gear and speed. any power/response gains are easy to get from both crx and mx5 for little money.
from driving the crx it is such a letdown because its front wheel drive and that is a big issue for me but not for all.

TempestSabre

IMO Del Sol wasn't a patch on the CRX Mrk II that preceeded it. Its not about about how fast you can get around a corner, its about the purity of the experience.

IMO You shouldn't need oddles of power to enjoy driving a car thats nicely balanced and handles well. I don't get the craving for massive power. Usually it polutes the driving experience. With a slower car you get the same fun just at a slower speed. Sutble mods I don't mind, but too often they end up like a Hot Wheelz toy.

franksm

TempestSabre wrote:

IMO Del Sol wasn't a patch on the CRX Mrk II that preceeded it. Its not about about how fast you can get around a corner, its about the purity of the experience.

Yeah ! I loved the old CRX - so "old school". Wonder where they all went ?

JHMEG

You don't need 500bhp to enjoy a car, true. But adequete power is needed, and with the MX5 I think the RWD is wasted, especially with the 1.6. Not as if there would be any traction problems with that little power, and the difference between RWD and FWD at such low power levels is marginal.

If I wanted RWD with adequete power I would sooner get a late MkII MR2 (early models were underpowered too). Preferably a Beams. (Or an S2000 if money was no object)

franksm

Granted the MK2 MX5 with 1.6 is fairly underpowered but you should try a "proper" MX5, ie. one of the MK1s (pop up lights).

Very lightweight, very good power:weight ratio, 50:50 front-rear balance

The 1.8 MK1 MX5 gained some weight (extra bracing, bigger brakes, bigger diff) but had more power - yet was still the same power:weight as the earlier 1.6. Both would do 0..60 in 7.8 seconds.

You should try a turbo'd MX5 240+ hp and 0..60 in around 5.4 seconds (or less!). Just a normal '5 with some "intake modifications" heh heh

"Each to his own" - I love basic cars of the old school like the MGB, TR6 and so on, which is why I like the MX5

cpoh1

gstonesmx5 wrote:

from driving the crx it is such a letdown because its front wheel drive and that is a big issue for me but not for all.

I absolutely hate this rwd is the be all and end all attitude. For anything under 200bhp its gotta be fwd and a good lsd for me. Just because a car is fwd doesnt mean its any less fun or handles any less well than a rwd car. For me the 1.6L mx5 doesnt have enough power to pull the skin of a rice pudding, rwd or not thats no fun.

TempestSabre wrote:

IMO Del Sol wasn't a patch on the CRX Mrk II that preceeded it. Its not about about how fast you can get around a corner, its about the purity of the experience.

IMO You shouldn't need oddles of power to enjoy driving a car thats nicely balanced and handles well. I don't get the craving for massive power. Usually it polutes the driving experience. With a slower car you get the same fun just at a slower speed. Sutble mods I don't mind, but too often they end up like a Hot Wheelz toy.

I bought a mk2 SiR after the mx5. Absolutely great fun to drive, came with the optional torsion lsd from the factory also, glass roof, uk leather seats etc. stunning car. Problem was it eventually fell apart with rust. Engine again bullitproof. Had it on a few tracks (owned it when I was in the uk) and in my opinion this was where it outshone its new brother the mk3. On the road there was genuinely no difference in handling between the two cars, straight line the same both neck and neck. The only time you will notice the mk2's superior handling is when you are pushing that last 3% out of it on a track, other than that they are identical. Remember both the mk2 and mk3 are based on their equivalent civic siblings so have virtually the same chassis, brakes and suspension setup as the civic and each other. The difference was the slight increase in weight (80kgs) and the roof. I still miss her!

TempestSabre

For me theres a big difference in feel between FWD, RWD, and MR. If you don't think there is, then that tells its own story. Lots of modern cars are over damped, over tyred and with dull power steering. Lots of mods achieve the same effect. Lots of power and grip does not make a good handling car, simply a fast one, even if it stuck like glue in corners.

For me the Del Sol bodyshell doesn't have the rigidity of the Mrk II CRX. Which made all the difference in feel. Even the MrkII isn't all that stiff compared to something like a Mr2 Mrk1. Mind you finding one of any of these that hasn't been meddled with is hard. A modified car can often feel nothing like the original. My own CRX was an Irish one. Not a spec of rust after 10yrs. But like most of them was badly damaged in an unsuccessful theft attempt. All of the MX5, (dunno about the latest) are lovely to drive. Theres better traffic light dragsters if thats what you are into.

cpoh1

TempestSabre wrote:

For me theres a big difference in feel between FWD, RWD, and MR. If you don't think there is, then that tells its own story. Lots of modern cars are over damped, over tyred and with dull power steering. Lots of mods achieve the same effect. Lots of power and grip does not make a good handling car, simply a fast one, even if it stuck like glue in corners.

For me the Del Sol bodyshell doesn't have the rigidity of the Mrk II CRX. Which made all the difference in feel. Even the MrkII isn't all that stiff compared to something like a Mr2 Mrk1. Mind you finding one of any of these that hasn't been meddled with is hard. A modified car can often feel nothing like the original. My own CRX was an Irish one. Not a spec of rust after 10yrs. But like most of them was badly damaged in an unsuccessful theft attempt. All of the MX5, (dunno about the latest) are lovely to drive. Theres better traffic light dragsters if thats what you are into.

I never said there wasn't any difference between a fwd, rwd car, im saying that a fwd car with 170bhp and a decent lsd is much better fun to drive than a slow rwd car (with no lsd). You say lots of grip and power doesnt make a decent handling car but having barely 100bhp in a rwd 2 seater is scraping the barrel imo.

Of course the del sol doesnt have the rigidity of the mk2 crx, the mk2 crx doesnt have a convertable roof! Having owned both cars the only times I noticed the handling differences between the two was pushing the mk2 on a track. With the roof on (and this is the key point here) on a public road the difference was negligable, at the end of the day the crx mk2 and 3 and civic all have the same suspension, brakes and underlying chassis, it comes down to weight and like was mentioned the rigidity of the mk3's roof especially when off.

As for the mx5 v's del sol thing, honestly have owned the mx5 (mk1 1.8L jappo) I was dissappointed. It has a reputation that had won me over but when it came finally to driving the thing in the end I felt a little short changed. As someone said badly its in need of turbo power, then you would have a real performer to do justice to the cars chassis. She was nippy enough and did handle fantastically but coming from the del sol there really was no step up in power and performance (and thats not just in a straight line either). For all the hype it really wasn't the step up I was expecting. For the engine alone in the del sol I have fond memories.

As for the point of modifying id disagree to an extent, I had the final drive from an integra typeR and lightened flywheel in my crx, went like stink! After having the car for 6 months I changed to tein coilover suspension, really transformed the car especially on the good british roads.

TempestSabre

cpoh1 wrote:

I....having barely 100bhp in a rwd 2 seater is scraping the barrel imo.....

Its apparent you're idea of fun and enjoyment comes from high speed and power. Once you had good handling without it, you weren't happy. The original Elise only had 118bhp but didn't need oodles of power because of the light weight. Personally I get as more enjoyment driving a slow car if its nice to drive as I do a fast one that isn't. You'd hate something like a Boxster S. Handles really well, so well that theres no drama at road legal speeds. Well unless you drive it like a FWD with a heavy right foot and then (Like a 911) it will entertain. :eek: Its not a fizzy engine, like VTEC. Whereas in a VTEC its essential to keep it on the boil. To be honest even something thats slow is fun to hussle it along, if you get a rythmn going. Some cars are just lifeless though.

My CRX was a 16v 1.6i, no power steering or all the weight extra stuff. I felt it was sweeter to drive, more feedback in the steering than the ones with all the kit that I drove. Maybe that why I like the MR2 mrk1 so much too.

cpoh1

TempestSabre wrote:

Its apparent you're idea of fun and enjoyment comes from high speed and power. Once you had good handling without it, you weren't happy. The original Elise only had 118bhp but didn't need oodles of power because of the light weight. Personally I get as more enjoyment driving a slow car if its nice to drive as I do a fast one that isn't. You'd hate something like a Boxster S. Handles really well, so well that theres no drama at road legal speeds. Well unless you drive it like a FWD with a heavy right foot and then (Like a 911) it will entertain. :eek: Its not a fizzy engine, like VTEC. Whereas in a VTEC its essential to keep it on the boil. To be honest even something thats slow is fun to hussle it along, if you get a rythmn going. Some cars are just lifeless though.

I genuinely think youre taking me up worng, the original elise weighed about 800kgs combined with its chassis and engine it was a hum dinger of a car, the mk1 1.6L mx5 weighs in at 1050kg's, sure its rwd and has a decent enough chassis but a raspy noisy 100bhp engine just never does the car any justice. I agree that fun is not all about speed, but trying to push this car into corners at well below the speed limit was no fun at all, no lsd, no low down torque. a good handling car is nothing without having the torque to pull it through a corner. Put a 1.6L vtec engine in an nsx and it stops being a great handling car simply because it doesnt have the engine to do the car justice on a tight twisty road or track. It all depends on what your definition of good handler and fun is though, if a 1.6L mx5 makes you happy then fair play

Stevo11

heheh don't even try Franksm... the MX5 is lost on some people

if it looks like a shopping trolly, sorry, Civic, drives like a Civic, etc etc

franksm

What this all boils down to, is that it's the Civic that is the thinking-man's Del Sol.

<discuss>

Ernie Ball

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't there only about 20bhp between a 1.8l MX-5 and a Del Sol SiR? They weigh about the same, so how much difference can there be?

Surely if it's that great a difference a few mods on the MX-5 (intake, header, exhaust, chip) could make up most of it....

prospect

I am gonna step in here and vote MX5 aswell.

Lets not forget the best selling roadster in history is the MX5.


P.S.
Hi Frank.
Hi Steve.

cpoh1

franksm wrote:

What this all boils down to, is that it's the Civic that is the thinking-man's Del Sol.

<discuss>

Or how about this one frank, the mx5 is the poor mans s2000

I think ignorance is bliss sometimes, the civic suffers for its reputation as a knacker mobile. When I was in the uk a few years back there was many a civic on track with me that would embarrass the sh*t out of way more expensive and powerful cars. I know a few fellas with tuned civics over here who would make an eejit out of any n/a mx5 on a track, come to think of it I also know a few fellas with del sols who would too.

I hate stereotypes, just like someone mentioned the word "shopping trolley" about the civic (haow sad?), im sure mx5 owners would be equally indignant about its "hairdresser's car" tag, another unfair critiscism.

As much as the mx5 was a good car for me at the time, it wasn't enough of a step up for me, same but mostly less power than the del sol, little or no difference in driving around town or on short commutes and less space than the del sol again. All these made this car a short stop one for me.

TempestSabre

cpoh1 wrote:

I genuinely think youre taking me up worng, the original elise weighed about 800kgs combined with its chassis and engine it was a hum dinger of a car, the mk1 1.6L mx5 weighs in at 1050kg's, sure its rwd and has a decent enough chassis but a raspy noisy 100bhp engine just never does the car any justice. I agree that fun is not all about speed, but trying to push this car into corners at well below the speed limit was no fun at all, no lsd, no low down torque. a good handling car is nothing without having the torque to pull it through a corner. Put a 1.6L vtec engine in an nsx and it stops being a great handling car simply because it doesnt have the engine to do the car justice on a tight twisty road or track. It all depends on what your definition of good handler and fun is though, if a 1.6L mx5 makes you happy then fair play

The Elise was there because of your comment which I quoted.

I don't think more power improves your handling. I suspect you are used to using FWD cars to drag yourself around a corner faster. RWD or MR requires a different technique.

cpoh1

Ernie Ball wrote:

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't there only about 20bhp between a 1.8l MX-5 and a Del Sol SiR? They weigh about the same, so how much difference can there be?

Surely if it's that great a difference a few mods on the MX-5 (intake, header, exhaust, chip) could make up most of it....

40ps as standard difference on the mk1, I see your point on the modifications, but throw all these on the del sol along with integra typeR cams (300 euro) and youre talking 190bhp+

Stevo11

TempestSabre wrote:

The Elise was there because of your comment which I quoted.

I don't think more power improves your handling. I suspect you are used to using FWD cars to drag yourself around a corner faster. RWD or MR requires a different technique.

heheh just what I was thinking Bit of driver ed might go a long way.

"I know a few fellas with tuned civics over here who would make an eejit out of any n/a mx5 on a track"

God, ya think??? LOL


Jeez cpoh1 you need to chill ... its a sad day when someone can't take a comment like mine in jest! :rolleyes:

Steve (prop. Hair-o-Dyenamix, Mane Attraction, Hi-de-Hilites, Hairlucinations, Curl Up & Dye, Deb ‘n’ Hair, Short Cuts and ShortNCurlies)

JHMEG

Stevo11 wrote:

if it looks like a shopping trolly, sorry, Civic, drives like a Civic, etc etc

I can see this debate is heading the wrong way.

prospect wrote:

Lets not forget the best selling roadster in history is the MX5.

Which is much to do with marketing as anything else. A sort of RWD roadster for the masses.

Ernie Ball wrote:

20bhp between a 1.8l MX-5 and a Del Sol SiR? They weigh about the same, so how much difference can there be?

A bit more than 20bhp, but it's the difference between too little and enough.

Stevo11 wrote:

don't think more power improves your handling. I suspect you are used to using FWD cars to drag yourself around a corner faster. RWD or MR requires a different technique.

When you have the power available you have the choice to use it or not. True, RWD pushes the car, but it doesn't mean to say a car will corner better just because its RWD.

cpoh1 wrote:

but throw all these on the del sol along with integra typeR cams (300 euro) and youre talking 190bhp+

I think we'd better keep this to as the manufacturer intended, otherwise this could go on indefinitely!

cpoh1

JHMEG wrote:

I can see this debate is heading the wrong way.

Well said! Whether it was meant in jest or not doesnt make the tone any less condesending, i suffered from the hairdresser jibes when I had the mx5 years back and suffer from the car modifier image now because i drive an r32 gtr skyline (i hope this clears the whole not understanding anything other than fwd comment).

When it comes to any car and its handling, decent levels of power are always a pre-requisite be it fwd or rwd. While a decent fwd car with lsd looks to push itself out of a corner a rwd car is no different if you ask me, the difference is in the way it reacts under full load to their repective wheels. A rwd car will snap out a fwd with no lsd will understeer. If you are hitting a sequence of corners and dont have the power to push through them then you will lose momentum after the first corner no matter whether its fwd or rwd, hence why small power (on a car with anything but anorexic weight-elise, vx220 etc.) even with rwd is no fun. Rwd is there so that you dont have to drive too much power through the front wheels, when there's feck all power there in the first place whats the point? Think bmw e36 316i for example.

Dont be under the assumption that just because a car is rwd its better than fwd. Like I said with a car with reasonable weight and under 200bhp fwd with a limmo is the way to go.

Stevo11

"Like I said with a car with reasonable weight and under 200bhp fwd with a limmo is the way to go."
You are entitled to your opinion but in my opinion its not. Having had both FWD & RWD I much prefer RWD, especially in a Sports car (actually.. can you buy a sports car with FWD?).
We could debate all day on the merits of each, but its all been done before, see : http://www.google.ie/search?hl=en&q=%22RWD+vs+FWD%22&meta=


Anyways, back on topic ..

More links :

www.flyinmiata.net (the bomb!)
www.ilmotorsport.de
www.hairsalonsearch.co.uk/index.asp
Plus LOADS more here : http://www.miata.net/marketplace.html

Steve

cpoh1

Stevo11 wrote:

"Like I said with a car with reasonable weight and under 200bhp fwd with a limmo is the way to go."
You are entitled to your opinion but in my opinion its not. Having had both FWD & RWD I much prefer RWD, especially in a Sports car (actually.. can you buy a sports car with FWD?).

Considering I own a car that has rwd (well until the rear wheels lose traction then were in 4wd territory!) i know all about what rwd can do. Over 200bhp id have rwd because this is when you see the best of a decent rwd car, frankly its wasted on a car under 200bhp imo. You might not have fwd on any sports car out there but you definitely have fwd on loads of "performance cars" out there, not all sports cars are performance, far from it in fact. Sports cars are for balding old men anyway. Maybe you think the mx5 is a better car than the integra typeR and focus rs among others? Name a rwd car with the same power to weight ratio that handles and drives better than these cars! These are the perfect example to all the groupies out there who thinks rwd is the be all and end all.

Ernie Ball

cpoh1 wrote:

Considering I own a car that has rwd (well until the rear wheels lose traction then were in 4wd territory!) i know all about what rwd can do. Over 200bhp id have rwd because this is when you see the best of a decent rwd car, frankly its wasted on a car under 200bhp imo.

That is meaningless unless you take the weight of the vehicle into account. You only need 200bhp if you're driving some sort of behemoth.

Sports cars are for balding old men anyway.

I resemble that remark.:D

Weren't you the one saying that labels like "hairdresser's car" are stupid? So why indulge in it here? No vehicle is "for" a particular group of people.

Maybe you think the mx5 is a better car than the integra typeR and focus rs among others? Name a rwd car with the same power to weight ratio that handles and drives better than these cars! These are the perfect example to all the groupies out there who thinks rwd is the be all and end all.

Best of all is, of course, mid/rear-engined RWD.

The answer to your question, though, is: any generation of MR2.

cpoh1

Ernie Ball wrote:

That is meaningless unless you take the weight of the vehicle into account. You only need 200bhp if you're driving some sort of behemoth.


I resemble that remark.:D

Weren't you the one saying that labels like "hairdresser's car" are stupid? So why indulge in it here? No vehicle is "for" a particular group of people.


Best of all is, of course, mid/rear-engined RWD.

The answer to your question, though, is: any generation of MR2.

Apologies for the stereotype

Like I said earlier, any car with any reasonable amount of weight (more than 1100kgs)and under 200bhp and I honestly think the rwd front engined setup is wasted. As for the mr2 comment I know you meant that in jest, there's a reason they intrdouced the revision 3 model of the mk2 mr2 turbo with a completely new suspension setup. Its handling was nothing short of atrocious and dangerous the way it stepped out on bends. couldnt live with either the rs or the typeR in gt format either.

mmenarry

RWD, WWD, MR, 4WD is generally all a matter of personal preferance, in the same manner that power Vs. handling is.

I've a slightly modified MX5, with a whopping 113 BHp (14 years old now). Doesn't matter how much power you throw into a MR or WWD car and I still won't like it. I just don't like the feedback that I get from those setups. I drove a friend's MR2 Turbo, and found the feedback practically non-existant compared to a FE-RWD setup. I've had a spin in an Astra OPC recently, and that was just as bad. It seems to me that in a WWD setup, as soon as you start to have enough power to force the car to do it's stuff, torque steer starts getting in the way, further ruining the feedback from the wheels.

But that's what I prefer. Different strokes for different folks. I do a lot of country driving, and the MX5 is perfect for that. Capable A2B car as well, and it's my only car. I love revving to the redline, and so does the car (practically encourages it )

In fairness to "modern" MX5's the Mk1 is the driver's car of the bunch. Weight actually started out at 890kg (910-950 with PS/AC/etc). There is a saying among a lot of enthusiasts "The Mk2 is the better car, but the Mk1 is the better miata/MX5".

In fairness to the Hondas of this world, the vtec engines are little crackers, and very reliable. I almost bought a Del Sol, but they all looked a bit too small (I know the boot's bigger, but even so!). Even the MR2 feels a little cramped in the cockpit compared to the MX5.

In fairness to the handling of the MX5 though, you'd have to go a long, long, long way to beat it. Autocar ranked it higher in handling terms than a Porsche GT2 for a reason (winning the title "best handling car" - as well as "best handling cheap car"). And that was a 1.8 Mk2, certainly not the best MX5 of the bunch in handling terms.

It depends what you want from a car. The Del Sol & MX5 are too different in their driving characteristics to warrant comparison. Sure they're both small, "sporty" cars. That's about as close as it gets though.

Having said that, if you want the best of both worlds, turbo an MX5, and go fishing (Eh Frank/Steve? ). "Fixing" the handling on a WWD car is a much more expensive route.

M.

ps. WWD is not a typo, and LOOS doesn't happen in WWD. Just my viewpoint

cpoh1

WWD :rolleyes: looks like youre one of these drifting followers who thinks if its not jap its scrap aswell are you :rolleyes:

I drive an r32 gtr skyline genuinely one of the best performance cars of any wheel drive type ever made and even I dont have that narrowminded condesending tone towards fwd cars. I think its fairly sad that you would write off absolute classics like the focus rs, typeR integra etc when all youre driving is a 115bhp mx5???

I dont think youve ever heard of a limited slip differential either? What it does is allow the front wheels of a fwd car to spin independently at different rotational speeds and as a result eliminate torque steer and understeer. Just because a fwd car is driven by the front wheels doesnt make it less fun and slower around bends either. As i said your entitled to your opinion and all that, one bit of advice though, take an integra typeR for a drive on your country road and you wont be long opening your eyes to a real drivers car and dropping the whole "WWD" rubbish, you'd probably sell the mazda after it.