I've been contacted by Eircom regarding Errorcom.com

DeVore

I've been contacted by Eircom and asked (quite politely) to give them the contact details of the person behind the errorcom.com
site or contact them on their behalf.

I've told them I dont know who is responsible (true) and that
if I DID know I wouldnt tell them (also true).

For legal reasons I cant paste their mail here, but I *can* paste mine.



**************************************************

No, I dont know, we have no involvement or part in this though
apparently the person involved is a Boards.ie visitor.

However if I *did* know ... I wouldnt tell you.

Thank you for your interest.

Tom Murphy
Boards.ie

**************************************************


Stay tuned, this one is gonna run and run...

DeV.

adnans

and the saga continues... hehe. good one tom. P45.net has lined the gem that is errorcom.com here

adnans

Trojan

Keep an eye on ILUG-Social, there's a lot of mails bouncing around on the subject, have a look at:

http://www.linux.ie/pipermail/social/2001-October/thread.html (sorted by thread, look at "My favorite telco" mails)

http://www.linux.ie/pipermail/social/2001-October/date.html (sorted by date obviously enough).

Interesting --> http://www.linux.ie/pipermail/social/2001-October/001901.html

Yesterday, around the time the site went down, I contacted the owner and
asked why it had come down and if he minded mirroring. I received an
answer this morning. I'm not going to include the entire response
here, just the highlights.

visiting a friend...borrowed his dads credit card...This morning...his dad...call from eircom saying the site was very "offensive" and that
they "will be taken further action". I want to arrange it re launch the site...I don't want my mate to get into
trouble...As for posting mirrors of the site, thanks for the offer, but can I please ask you and your friends to sit still on it for a week or so until I get everything sorted.

Mods feel free to remove above quote if the site author requests.

Al.

spanner_head

why don't they have a sense of humour?

Do they not realise that if they kick up over this people will hate them even more that before - if thats possible!!!

The site I have to say is really witty.

Shiminay

Nasty - fluck 'em - nothing on that site is untrue (well, maybe a little).

b20uvkft6m5xwg

If this confirms anything...It is that:

The IrelandOFFline Board is being monitored by €ircoN.

So here I go....

Hello €ircoN,
Why not lighten up? What do expect when you have treated customers so badly for yonks(thats the nicey nice version of events:p). Maybe if you paid a little more attention to the invaluable market research the members of IrelandOffline are proving on these boards we could all be buddies and not be so hostile to one another. Most every major company worldwide has had sites poking fun at their business and most laugh it off.- Maybe you should TOO:)

yours sincerely 80p.

BTW Tom/DeVore Good on Ya;)
and of course to the developer of errorcom...such a LOL site;)

Kix

Well done DeV. You're not the type to be easily imtimidated, I feel.

I'm glad to see that this site ranckles them. They usually appear impervious to public opinion.

I sincerely doubt that their copyright has been infringed in anyway by this site. They might claim that it's libelous though. I'd imagine that there has to some protection under the law for parody and satire. Perhaps some legal eagle out there might know?

Perhaps a person could even could set up a limited company and host the site in the company's name. If they persisted with legal threats you could simply represent yourself in court, appeal to the judge's sense of fair play. If you lost, declare the company bankrupt. I think that would work and it wouldn't cost any more that setting up the company. Mind you, I'd like professional legal advice before embarking on such a course.

K

Shad0r

plyd, plyd and plyd.

Eirc0n brought it on themselves and deservedly so imho.

Bard

Well done DeV, - I still get a "Directory listing denied" page, when trying to visit www.errorcom.com, however.

pork99

To the Eircom people monitoring this board

What sort of evil brain damaged Nazi B*s*a*d* are you? Despite yourselves you have ensured that this board is mirrored several times over and many more people will see it

Who or what do you think you are? How dare you attempt to deny peoples rights to free comment and expression. You obviously think that having the money (which you got from us) to hire battalions of lawyers gives you the right to do as you please.

Why do you think you can behave like some little fascist police state? If people like me disliked you before we loathe you now.

muchos_bongo

Pork99> How stupid are you? It's an obvious copyright infringment. I don't necessarily agree with the current timeframes for rollout of broadband in Ireland but Eircom as a company have the right to do business without infringment of their corporate logos and brands.

pete

Originally posted by muchos_bongo
but Eircom as a company have the right to do business without infringment of their corporate logos and brands.

Such as?

a man dressed as a mouse?

Maybe someone should tip off Disney's lawyers....

pork99

1. Copyright does not cover quoting material for review purposes (ok this was not a review but its in a similar area)

2. The errorcom logo is as much copyright infringement as eircoms own logo which looks suspiciously like that of a pre-existing American telecom company.

3. It is a obvious satire, which in any democracy people have the right to do. muchos_bongo you seem to have the same mentality as Charles Haughey who in the 1980s used the threat of legal action to restrict the distribution of "Private Eye" magzine in this country because as we all know now they told the truth about him.

4. It is an obvious satire. You could never ever mistake it for an official eircom site. I'm no expert but wheres the copyright infringement there?

5. Are you from Eircom's monitoring crew, muchos_bongo?

oscarBravo

Originally posted by muchos_bongo
It's an obvious copyright infringment.

Looks like a parody to me.

If I rip off Eircom's graphics etc. and use them in an attempt to suggest that my product or service is endorsed by Eircom, that's copyright infringement, or more likely trademark infringement.

Put it this way: if Martyn Turner (www.ireland.com/cartoons/turner) decided to do an Eircom cartoon, and used a similar "claw" device (albeit with a different part of the anatomy!), do you think Eircom would have sent in the lawyers to the Irish Times?

SkepticOne

Originally posted by muchos_bongo
Pork99> How stupid are you? It's an obvious copyright infringment.

That is a matter for the courts to decide.

I don't necessarily agree with the current timeframes for rollout of broadband in Ireland but Eircom as a company have the right to do business without infringment of their corporate logos and brands.

Nobody is stopping them using the 'claw' logo.

pork99

Well muchos_bongo check these out

http://www.twtelecom.com

http://www.eircom.ie

View them side-by-side* Take your time. Enjoy.

"Let he who is without sin cast the first stone" as I believe it says in the good book (The Blue Peter Annual 1981 I think)

(*I am endebted to whoever pointed out how alike these logos are in a post on this board about 3-4 months ago)

hmmm

Wow never saw that before (must have been sleeping). *evil thoughts* Has any helpful soul here contacted Time Warner?

Chief

Jaysus!.. Blatant aint the word for it!....




__________________

"LOSE me.. Hate me.. SMASH me..
ERASE me.. KILL me.."

nine inch nails - eraser

|Chief|...

muchos_bongo

Originally posted by pork99
5. Are you from Eircom's monitoring crew, muchos_bongo?

No I am not. Paranoia may be healthy though.

adnans

im sure, somewhere in dublin, a graphic designer is shaking in his/her boots.

adnans

muchos_bongo

Originally posted by adnans
im sure, somewhere in dublin, a graphic designer is shaking in his/her boots.

adnans

Aren't they the reason we need broadband anyway?

pmccourt

Ones blue and the others Orange!

Lenny

Ah well, just hang about.. Eircom won't be around in 2 weeks time

fisty

lol. lol. lol.
I remember I had to ring DeVore over a little hiccup before and Eventually I got a "nicety" from him...
Eircom didn´t.
Well played.
I´m enjoying my dutch DSL line - it aint mine but im enjoying it, i hope you lads will soon.
Fisty (the cock).

Bard

Originally posted by OJ
Ah well, just hang about.. Eircom won't be around in 2 weeks time

ehhh?

What is it you know that we don't that could cause a company like that to wind up in 2 weeks???

Boston

Bard, i think hes talking about the fact that eircom should be under new ownership within a matter of weeks

rymus

Originally posted by Bard

What is it you know that we don't that could cause a company like that to wind up in 2 weeks???

Its all these errorcom mirrors you see.. they get rid of one and thirty more appear out of nowhere.. must be driving all the eircom execs mental.. so presumably in 2 weeks time they will have all committed themselves to various funny farms and psycho wards. Thats the overall plan anyway, or so it seems.

ElNino

De Vore I can't understand why they contacted you as there are other much easier ways of getting the contact details of the genius who put the site up.

Anyway, thankfully, because there are so many mirrors up now they would only be wasting their time.

dahamsta

De Vore I can't understand why they contacted you as there are other much easier ways of getting the contact details of the genius who put the site up.

Actually there aren't - the WHOIS information appears to be fake, and the site is hosted by Interland in the US, where free speech is much more important to citizens and businesses aren't keen to invade users privacy.

Anyway, thankfully, because there are so many mirrors up now they would only be wasting their time.

The wise thing to do now is to keep the head down, but Eircom are far from wise.

adam

smokin' an'chewin' man

Originally posted by muchos_bongo
Pork99> How stupid are you? It's an obvious copyright infringment. I don't necessarily agree with the current timeframes for rollout of broadband in Ireland but Eircom as a company have the right to do business without infringment of their corporate logos and brands.

I don't see ANY court coughing up an injunction. The logo is marginally similar if anything and there doesn't seem to be any mention of Eircom on the site.
There's nothing abusive or threatening - just very original satire.

With no mention of Eircom.

Digi_Tilmitt

Let them send their warnings, more publicity for the cause.

Shinji

Eircom haven't a leg to stand on concerning copyright issues.

It's parody and any similarity to Eircom's own corporate branding comes under the heading of fair use.

They could, of course, cause legal hassle, but it wouldn't get them anywhere... And if you've got a whole pile of people hosting mirrors, it's not exactly going anywhere at ALL. The US government and recording industry can't keep the DeCSS source down, I somehow doubt Eircom (a company which for years was incapable of installing ISDN lines without píssing about for six months) are capable of shutting down an easily mirrored website.

If they can't accept criticism and parody - and apparently they can't - that's their problem, because it isn't about to go away any time soon, and this is just the tip of the iceberg.

Rob

dahamsta

Heh, maybe if we *all* put up mirrors, €ircon could sue the lot of us, and we could have our next public meeting in the Four Goldmines, at €ircon's expense!

adam

ekehoe

Just to let y'all know, I've a friend who is a barrister up at the Four Courts, and she's asking around up there what the legal implications are. Once I hear back from her, I'll post her opinions on here...

E

IKiigan

Originally posted by dahamsta

Actually there aren't - the WHOIS information appears to be fake, and the site is hosted by Interland in the US, where free speech is much more important to citizens and businesses aren't keen to invade users privacy.

Hmm you clearly aren't aware of DMCA then. That kinda ****s all over their glorious First Amendment.

Ian

dahamsta

Hmm you clearly aren't aware of DMCA then. That kinda ****s all over their glorious First Amendment.

Ah, someone must have told you how much I love being patronised, eh?

Yes, I'm very much aware of the DMCA, however that relates to completely different issues, primarily the circumvention of copyright protection systems. So unless by some odd course of events the specific "Ireland By The Bollocks" logo was compiled directly into a closed source application, or perhaps encrypted into a propriety format only accessible by a closed source application, and of course copyrighted to Eircom, it has absolutely no bearing in this instance.

I trust this clarifies my understanding of the DMCA.

adam

IKiigan

Don't get your knickers in a twist, Adam. My point was simply to point out that the US's self-perception of their great freedom of speech isn't all it's cracked up to be. The point was off-topic anyway.

I don't think I was being patronising.

My, aren't we testy ...

Ian

dahamsta

Awww I hurt dahamsta's feelings

Patronising.

Don't get your knickers in a twist, Adam.

Patronising.

My, aren't we testy ...

Patronising.

I don't think I was being patronising.

You mightn't think you were, or you mightn't have intended to, but you were. Or at least I perceived you as being patronising, and I'm sure many others would too. The written word is difficult to work with when it comes to expressing emotion, or attitude, therefore it should be used with care. Something like "What about the DMCA?" would have been much more appropriate.

My point was simply to point out that the US's self-perception of their great freedom of speech isn't all it's cracked up to be.

Speaking personally - and this is not an attempt at a flame - I disagree with what you're saying, or more particularly the way you phrase it. For the most part, Americans are much more proud of their Constitution than other countries, including Ireland. More importantly, they're much more aware of the rights guaranteed under their Constitution, in particular Free Speech.

You're right in what you're really trying to say though (gah! now you have me at it!) in that their perception of the facts related to those rights is not particularly accurate. They use a particularly broad definition of free speech. But then so does the legal system quite often, for example the hate sites which proliferate in the US, some of which I genuinely believe should be removed.

The point was off-topic anyway

Sure it was, but that's half the fun of it, eh?

adam

CoNfOuNd

This is a very interesting thread. I agree with oscarBravo and I don't think Eircom have any rights in this case.

DeVore

From the immortal words of Star Wars:

"Stay on target.... stay on target!!"

DeV.

R. Daneel Olivaw

And also in keeping with Star Wars and the new meaning of ADSL:

"Almost there......almost there......"

Urban Weigl

Oops... Double-post, please delete.

Urban Weigl

Just a quick note to say that there's another mirror of errorcom up at:

http://www.avara.utvinternet.ie/

:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

Note to errorcom: Do what you must to take this down, but please note that if you do, there will be 30 more to take its place.

exiztone

http://www.eircon.net/
Wow, that already gone
They have there ways.. lol

popinfresh

Eircom, have sunk to a new low, (previosly thought to be impossible). How can them stupid thick cúnts live with themselves.

gurramok

hehe more publicity

just a few IT ppl in holland, germany, norway, peru, NZ, uk, HK know about THAT site now

just playing my bit....

ooops....can £ircon be possibly offended at that ?....LOL

P R O F A N I T Y

ive posted it at every site i go to, theres quiet afew confused americans out there now

Q_Ball

I've just come back from the canaries. While there i had an interesting little conversation with a girl from dublin who worked with eircom up until last week or there abouts. Apparently she was under employment with eircom for over a year, but eircom wouldn't offer her a permanent contract. They (presumably) have had to employ someone new to replace her who has had over a year's experience.

So it seems that it isn't just we the consumers who are being done over...

disConnected

Hehe, that parody is really funny...
Fair play to the creator, to all people who mirror it and to DeVore for not bending under Eircom's pressure...

Will do my part and post the link on to my friends.
Hey you guys at Eircom! Why are you upset all for a sudden?
Just look back at the very recent history to see what an unfair player in the telecommunications market you have been. So how do you expect from people to treat you with silk gloves???
If you would have treated your customers (and shareholders) with some respect the above mentioned site would probably not be in existence at all.
Here my suggestion: Instead of threatening people - what about an excuse for all the crap the customers have had to take from you? And what about an honest promise to change to the better???

disConnected

wormhole

a chap put up a site called www.crappytire.com
to poke fun at the Canadian tire company, they tried to take
his domain by going to WIPO saying "crappy tire why thats a
term of affection our customers use for us so we should have this
domain" dont be suprised if eircom attempt the same thing.


if you want to see how it turned out The Register
(the font of all knowledge) has the full story
http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/archive/20197.html

www.crappytire.com no longer works so presumably he woke
up with a horses head next him ;-)


wormhole

wormhole

a chap put up a site called www.crappytire.com
to poke fun at the Canadian tire company, they tried to take
his domain by going to WIPO saying "crappy tire why thats a
term of affection our customers use for us so we should have this
domain" dont be suprised if eircom attempt the same thing.


if you want to see how it turned out The Register
(the font of all knowledge) has the full story
http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/archive/20197.html

www.crappytire.com no longer works so presumably he woke
up with a horses head next him ;-)


wormhole