Two arts at the same time

Zem

Hey i was just wondering what the view consensus is about training in two seperate martial arts at the same time. Myself and a friend were talking about it after training yesterday.

His view was that if you train in two martial arts at the same time, from a beginner level that you would get muddled up, which would stunt your growth in both arts.

I thought that although this may happen i thought that if you have two martial arts that seem to have a similar outlook, as in if it works; use it, you may in fact become more rounded as a martial artist.

I'm not saying my view is right or that my friends view is wrong i was just wondering what all of you think, it might change my mind?

memphis

Though I haven't ever trained in a second MA at the same time I would always have been of the opinion that it'd help make ya a more rounded Martial Artist, though some other part of me has to agree with your friends opinion about getting muddled up.

Its an interesting question, cos as it is I'm getting muddled up with all the theory and patterns I've to learn in TKD, without ever going to train with another MA.

That said, its not uncomman for persons to train in more than one MA. Its down to personal preverence really I guess!!!

kenpo_dave

For the most part ur friend is right. But u r also partly right. In general a novice will get mixed up on things like stances etc. But, as u said, if the styles r relatively close, then it might work. If u r thinking of doing more than one style try looking for a Mixed Martial Arts school. And if u live in Dublin and u r interested in starting Mixed Martial Arts, I am a member of an MMA school that has recently opened in Dublin. The style is called Kyokushin Budokai and is based around Kyokushin Karate. We fight full contact bare knuckle. The only times we wear pads r when boxing (gloves to protect our hands) or grading (head gear to protect our heads as for the White Belt theres 5x 2 min rounds of full contact and up to 30x 2 min rounds for Black Belt). We also do Brazilian Jiu Jitsu, Judo and Sambo. For more information visit our website www.mma-ireland.com or our parent schools website www.kyokushinbudokai.org
There is a small problem though. We r temporarily without a Dojo. This is because the owner of the hall where we were training decided to rent it to some locals instead. But dont let that stop u, we will be up and running again soon.
PLEASE BE AWARE THAT IF U DO DECIDE TO JOIN U WILL GET HURT AND WALK AWAY FROM MOST CLASSES WITH BRUISING.

Clive

Why do people make martial arts so complicated?

Can you learn two physical activities at the same time? Yes.

Can you learn to swim and play basketball at the same time. Yes.

Is there a possibility of getting a wee bit confused if learning two similar things? Yes, so be that bit careful about it.

No problem in doing two MA's at the same.

I wouldn't start two MA's at the same time if you've never done any before. I'd recommend getting a minimal base in one art of maybe 2-3 months, and then starting the second one. It'll prevent confusion. Also at the beginning, most people aren't physically capable of training enough to make progress in two arts.

Im2Lazy

I think it's fine to do as many arts as you want, I'm currently doing 4 - Krav Maga / Thai Boxing / BJJ & Escrima which I've only just started.

I've been doing KM over a year Thai about 5-6 months these 2 are similar enough in their striking so don't have much of a problem with stance etc.

BJJ been doing that about 3 months & Escrima about a month I don't think there is a problem with starting in both of these as they are so different I must admit though when it comes to the stance I have to keep reminding myself to switch my feet as with Escrima if you're right handed like me you have a right lead unlike the rest but it not a major thing.

So my thought on it is, as long as you're enjoying whatever the 2 or more MA's you're doing then I don't think it's a problem.

combat_sombo

I'm an elite mixed martial artist and recently took up amateur boxing and taekwon doe. one of the issues is some of the stuff is contradictiory. i also started bjj a while ago while i was doing judo. some of the stuff complemented each other but i had a few bad habits which messed things up.

for example, in judo, i pull turtle. where as in bjj you should pull guard. lol.

while i was doing wrestling i get trying to use the guys t-shirt as gi which you shouldn't doing.

if you talking about doing wado-kyu and tkd at the same time, i don't think there's a problem. if you're talking about doing karate and judo at the same time i don't think there is a problem. which ma are you thinking of mixing?

Zem

Yeah i agree with pretty much all of you.

kenpo_dave thanks for the offer but im currently training 3 nights a week and am already coming out of most classes bruised but its all part and parcel of the fun of training, hope you find a new dojo soon.

Hey memphis how long have you been doing TKD?, one of my friends has recently decided to stop doing TKD and take up another martial art because he found that TKD (the one which he had original started) limited himself when he was doing another art. I'm not saying TKD isn't good or you can't do another art with it just he felt for himself it was restricting him.

combat_sombo

kenpo_dave wrote:

For the most part ur friend is right. But u r also partly right. In general a novice will get mixed up on things like stances etc. But, as u said, if the styles r relatively close, then it might work. If u r thinking of doing more than one style try looking for a Mixed Martial Arts school. And if u live in Dublin and u r interested in starting Mixed Martial Arts, I am a member of an MMA school that has recently opened in Dublin. The style is called Kyokushin Budokai and is based around Kyokushin Karate. We fight full contact bare knuckle. The only times we wear pads r when boxing (gloves to protect our hands) or grading (head gear to protect our heads as for the White Belt theres 5x 2 min rounds of full contact and up to 30x 2 min rounds for Black Belt). We also do Brazilian Jiu Jitsu, Judo and Sambo. For more information visit our website www.mma-ireland.com or our parent schools website www.kyokushinbudokai.org
There is a small problem though. We r temporarily without a Dojo. This is because the owner of the hall where we were training decided to rent it to some locals instead. But dont let that stop u, we will be up and running again soon.
PLEASE BE AWARE THAT IF U DO DECIDE TO JOIN U WILL GET HURT AND WALK AWAY FROM MOST CLASSES WITH BRUISING.

i was considering trainng with you guys but the more i look into it the more i think you're cowboys.

giddy up.

pma-ire

Zem wrote:

Hey memphis how long have you been doing TKD?, one of my friends has recently decided to stop doing TKD and take up another martial art because he found that TKD (the one which he had original started) limited himself when he was doing another art. I'm not saying TKD isn't good or you can't do another art with it just he felt for himself it was restricting him.

thats down to the approach of the assoication or the instructor more to the point!

any martial art school or association that restricts a students development is not being true to the martial art sprit that was forged in Okinawa. where mentors would tell students to go out and train with as many people as possible to advance there skills and abilty.

pma-ire

combat_sombo wrote:

i was considering trainng with you guys but the more i look into it the more i think you're cowboys.

giddy up.

Why do you think they are cowboys??

What makes someone a cowboy these days??

Zem

pma-ire wrote:

thats down to the approach of the assoication or the instructor more to the point!

any martial art school or association that restricts a students development is not being true to the martial art sprit that was forged in Okinawa. where mentors would tell students to go out and train with as many people as possible to advance there skills and abilty.

yeah but TKD wasn't forged in okinawa was it? i know there can be a common spirit in different martial arts but as a person who hasn't trained in TKD nor plans to i can't really comment on TKD i just wanted to see what memphis felt about it

combat_sombo

pma-ire wrote:

Why do you think they are cowboys??

What makes someone a cowboy these days??

no i haven't trained with them and no i don't know them personnaly however:

they claim to teach a combo of judo and karate. mma is a the current buzz word in the ma community. they've seen a niche and are attempting to fill it.

they claim to teach judo, but last time i checked they had no mats. (is this what all the bruising is about?) and they currently have no gym. i'm not even slightly familar with the guys coaching. where did they learn judo, what rank are they, who have they trained with?

they seem to put a lot of emphasise on bruising each other. cowboys/nutballs all the same to me.

Cake Fiend

Zem wrote:

His view was that if you train in two martial arts at the same time, from a beginner level that you would get muddled up, which would stunt your growth in both arts.

Has he tried it? Sounds like he's passing on second-hand information.

I've trained in multiple MAs, as I'm sure many of the posters here have, and I don't see any reason for it to be a problem, particularly if they are as different as basketball and swimming (to nick Clive's analogy). If anything, I think - for e.g. - karate and jujutsu would complement each other. Or TKD and BJJ. Whatever. The only situation I'd expect there to be problems would be learning two very similar arts (ironically enough), as you'd probably get mixed up between them more easily. There's no way you're going to mix up a judo throw with a karate kick (obviously), but you could easily do a TKD technique or stance the 'karate way' and vice versa if you weren't paying attention. Or you mightn't get used to either of them properly, and always do a kind of hybrid of them, to your instructors' eternal frustration...

Millionaire

kenpo_dave wrote:

For the most part ur friend is right. But u r also partly right. In general a novice will get mixed up on things like stances etc. But, as u said, if the styles r relatively close, then it might work. If u r thinking of doing more than one style try looking for a Mixed Martial Arts school. And if u live in Dublin and u r interested in starting Mixed Martial Arts, I am a member of an MMA school that has recently opened in Dublin. The style is called Kyokushin Budokai and is based around Kyokushin Karate. We fight full contact bare knuckle. The only times we wear pads r when boxing (gloves to protect our hands) or grading (head gear to protect our heads as for the White Belt theres 5x 2 min rounds of full contact and up to 30x 2 min rounds for Black Belt). We also do Brazilian Jiu Jitsu, Judo and Sambo. For more information visit our website www.mma-ireland.com or our parent schools website www.kyokushinbudokai.org
There is a small problem though. We r temporarily without a Dojo. This is because the owner of the hall where we were training decided to rent it to some locals instead. But dont let that stop u, we will be up and running again soon.
PLEASE BE AWARE THAT IF U DO DECIDE TO JOIN U WILL GET HURT AND WALK AWAY FROM MOST CLASSES WITH BRUISING.

Hey I vouch for Kenpo Dave on this and the Sensi Shane Thomas. Both top guys. I sparred me and dave and shane bare knuckle and man it is very tough in body and soul!

unfortuantely soem work problems I cannot go t back!

Dave regard to shane for me keep in touch ok!

these guys are great attitude..and shane a top teacher....hard...but a good soul!!!!

pma-ire

Zem wrote:

yeah but TKD wasn't forged in okinawa was it? i know there can be a common spirit in different martial arts but as a person who hasn't trained in TKD nor plans to i can't really comment on TKD i just wanted to see what memphis felt about it

TKD comes from early Shotokan Karate taught by Funagoshi.

Who was an Okinawan trained in Kara-Te! So we can claim a very strong link to Okinawan Karate

pma-ire

Sico wrote:

Or you mightn't get used to either of them properly, and always do a kind of hybrid of them, to your instructors' eternal frustration...

That would be their problem

You could have come up with a much better version or more close to the original?

pma-ire

combat_sombo wrote:

they claim to teach a combo of judo and karate. mma is a the current buzz word in the ma community. they've seen a niche and are attempting to fill it.

They could well train both and mix them together? What they call it don't really matter? MMA or cross-training??

combat_sombo wrote:

they claim to teach judo, but last time i checked they had no mats. (is this what all the bruising is about?)

Having no mats may be a funds problem? But it don't have to stop you training in judo or that type of work. I think they get the bruising from punches not the judo?

combat_sombo wrote:

and they currently have no gym.

We all go through a rough patch

combat_sombo wrote:

i'm not even slightly familar with the guys coaching. where did they learn judo, what rank are they, who have they trained with?

As them! Can you claim to know everyone training in MA in Ireland? Come on!! Ask the question directly man.

combat_sombo wrote:

they seem to put a lot of emphasise on bruising each other. cowboys/nutballs all the same to me.

Have you ever seen Kyokushinkai sparring?

memphis

Zem wrote:

Hey memphis how long have you been doing TKD?, one of my friends has recently decided to stop doing TKD and take up another martial art because he found that TKD (the one which he had original started) limited himself when he was doing another art. I'm not saying TKD isn't good or you can't do another art with it just he felt for himself it was restricting him.

I'm not sure what exactly you expect me to say here, but the truth is that everyone is an individual and unique in their approach to learning, and attitudes to their development in an MA. As paul said above (pma-ire) limitations can occur in many ways, and it is possible that it was down to the instructors way of teaching, I don't know!!!! It could also be down to training styles, be it with ITF (more traditional in its teaching) or WTF (more sports focused, such as the Olympics etc.)

I've been training in TKD for about 18 months or more and will be going for my blue tip (5th Kup) grading in a few weeks. I have had my ups and downs with TKD, have at times felt fustrated with not getting techniques or patterns correctly, but the truth is I love TKD. Its made me step back and take a good look at my life, it's given me confidence, and thought me right from wrong, given me courage to persevere at things, etc etc. Sorry, But unless you persevere at it, you'll get nowhere. You really only get out of MA what you put into it!!!

Hope that answers a few question. If you wanna ask me any further question don't hesitate.

memphis

Zem

thanks memphis that did answer it, i realised now when i've reread over the posts that i just didn't write everything i thought i did (i'm an idiot) but thanks.

pma-ire: cool i didn't know that there was that link, you learn something new everyday.

dlofnep

Can you take two arts at the same time? Yes, sure. Infact, I advise it. Just don't take two similar arts that will make each other redundant. One art should cover one area, let's saying ground/clinch/whatever and the other should cover your stand-up (kick boxing, boxing, whatever). This way, you are giving enough time to both areas and not double time to one area.

kenpo_dave

Combat_Sombo...firstly i gotta ask, elite martial artist? A bit of ego going on there perhaps? And secondly and more importantly, y do u think we r cowboys? We havent really gotten off our feet yet in Dublin. And quite frankly we dont want to have a big school. I think that Kyokushin Budokai is possibly the most realistic MMA being taught in Ireland. Now, I dont know much about other schools, but it seems that the way MMA is going in Ireland and indeed America, is the bull**** sporting MMA. If the main focus of the training is for competition, then u r losing out, u r gonna be restricted by the rules of competition, which inhibits the development as a "real" fighter. Now we do train for competition, but it is not the main focus of our training. After debating with many sport MMA'ists on Yahoo, Ive come to realise that theres an entirely different mentality between the mainly sports MMA people and the people who train in MMA to be great all-round fighters regardless of the situation. Id also like to point out that the Kancho of Kyokushin Budokai, Jon Bluming, is one of the only Westerners to be awarded a high grade (9th Dan) in Judo from the Kodokan in Japan.
Please understand that my attitude towards sporting MMA comes from a hatred of the bastardization of the Martial Arts into money making entertainment events, which is exactly what UFC, Pride, K-1 etc r..
Basically Combat, if u really want to know what we r like, come down and train with us when we get back on our feet. Just remember that bare knuckle fighting can cause severe injuries, and yes I know that normal full contact fighting does too, its just bare knuckle does it more easily.

Im this post will stir up an argument

kenpo_dave

Sorry, Gerry. I didnt see ur response there. I jumped so quickly to respond to Combats post. I appreciate what u said man. Shane has been trying to contact u. He wants to know if ur still on for training. Were going to see if we can get the hall for one night a week. At least it will be something. And sorry if my post offends u in anyway, as u can see im very opinionated about Martial Arts. Its just ive come across so many people who have ideas about trad styles but actually have no experience in trad styles to base their ideas on. It just really annoys me.
Anyway, I hope to train with u again.
Good luck.

Tim_Murphy

Now we do train for competition, but it is not the main focus of our training

I haven't heard of anyone from your club competing on any of the MMA shows in Ireland, or am I mistaken? Perhaps you should wait until you've had a chance to compete against others here before you start putting down how they train, esp when you admit you don't know much about the other clubs.

Just remember that bare knuckle fighting can cause severe injuries, and yes I know that normal full contact fighting does too, its just bare knuckle does it more easily.

Putting on MMA gloves at the very least would seem to be the smart thing to do.

kenpo_dave

Hey, Ive seen John Kavanagh put down how other people train. So if he can do it y cant I.

Cabelo

I think training in 2 or more is beneficial for most, though I can't do it myself

Now, to continue with the theme; I believe that all martial arts are inferior. Inferior to EVERYTHING. That's right, all of you, and you, and you. Next time you're in paintball qwan do, you think of me and you remember, if you really lose your hat, it's all over.

kenpo_dave

About the mats. The only reason y we dont have any is because we literally just opened shortly after Shane came to Ireland. We dont have them cos we dont have the money yet. Of cors we will use mats. We do a few ground techniques, but we havent started throwing yet. The bruising comes from the conditioning. We punch eachother in the solar plexus and kick to the thighs. When I do a roundhouse kick to Shanes thighs it hurts my shins. This is cos when I kick he tenses his thighs and drives them forward into my kick, so it conditions both his thighs and my shins. When Shane goes to Germany to train with his instructor he does 200 of each of the conditioning techniques, plus more that I havent been introduced to yet. As for the Judo. As I mentioned previously, Jon Bluming, President of Kyokushin Budokai, has a 9th dan in Judo, awarded to him by the Kodokan. Name me anyone in Ireland who has a grading that high from the Kodokan.

Colm_OReilly

I haven't heard of anyone from your club competing on any of the MMA shows in Ireland, or am I mistaken?

Nice dodging of Tim's question there.

kenpo_dave

Firstly, theres no competitors in Ireland cos were the first Kyokushin Budokai school in Ireland. And I cant say y there hasnt been any of the foreign crowd in comps. But as for international events, check this out, thought this is Kyokushinkai not Kyokushin Budokai.

http://www.mmaringreport.com/k1/k1_ichigeki_review.htm

And no Jon Bluming doesnt teach Judo without mats. We here in Dublin dont have mats cos weve just opened and we cant afford them yet. And MMA doesnt have to be competitive. U might aswel ask wots the point in non competitive martial arts. We train to be tough all-round fighters. If we want we can train for competition.

dlofnep

Too many arguments on here IMO. Not that I don't find them entertaining..

pma-ire

njo wrote:

i do. the answer i get is hobbyism. i equate non competive ma with painting.

And some people like that!

Folk do MA for lots of different reasons!!

All reasons are vaild, as they are the choice that person had taken.

Issus

Just an FYI on this.

Who was an Okinawan trained in Kara-Te! So we can claim a very strong link to Okinawan Karate

Karate is Okinawan. It originated there and was 'exported' to mainland Japan in the early 20th century.

Also as someone else said, training in two MA's that are fundimentally different, i.e. striking vs grappling/throwing is pretty easy. Training in the same style can mess with your head as a beginner, although doing Karate and Muay Thai at the same time for a while did improve my front kick 300% (at least or so the survey says...:p ) .

njo

njo wrote:

speaking of "bare knuckle boxing" seeing as my club is a pack of scabby students we also fight without pads/gloves. and to be honest, i'm going to get a couple of pairs soon because i'm a bit black and blue already.

Bears can be dangerous when angered

pma-ire

Issus wrote:

Just an FYI on this.



Karate is Okinawan. It originated there and was 'exported' to mainland Japan in the early 20th century.

i don't see what you said was different to what i said??

Issus

Don't write posts when your tired!!!!

Sorry, mate, totally mis-read a basic grammar point!!! Thought you asked if there was an Okinawan who did Karate... Not stating that the person was an Okinawan... My bad...

Must re-read... re-read before posting at all times!!!

pma-ire

Issus wrote:

Don't write posts when your tired!!!!

Sorry, mate, totally mis-read a basic grammar point!!! Thought you asked if there was an Okinawan who did Karate... Not stating that the person was an Okinawan... My bad...

Must re-read... re-read before posting at all times!!!

No Sweat

Tim_Murphy

We train to be tough all-round fighters. If we want we can train for competition.

So you put down other MMA clubs but you admittedly don't know much about them and you or your team mates have never actually done any MMA fights. Do you expect to be taken seriously?

kenpo_dave

I dont know if the guys abroad fight in competitions, i assume they do. And Tim please read wot i post before replying, it saves me repeating myself. As i said, our school hasnt really gotten off the ground yet in Dublin. We have had at best 6 or 7 people down to take a look at the class. We simply dont have the numbers to enter competitions. As time goes on and the school grows, we will most likely enter competitions. And when i was putting down training, it was for sporting mma in general. NOT any particular school. i said that i dont know about other mma schools cos im sure there r those that teach both sporting mma and practical self defense training in equal amounts.

kenpo_dave

I dont know if the guys abroad fight in competitions, i assume they do. And Tim please read wot i post before replying, it saves me repeating myself. As i said, our school hasnt really gotten off the ground yet in Dublin. We have had at best 6 or 7 people down to take a look at the class. We simply dont have the numbers to enter competitions. As time goes on and the school grows, we will most likely enter competitions. And when i was putting down training, it was for sporting mma in general. NOT any particular school. i said that i dont know about other mma schools cos im sure there r those that teach both sporting mma and practical self defense training in equal amounts.

kenpo_dave

Sorry about the double post :mad:

Tim_Murphy

I've a bad feeling THE STREET is going to be mentioned sometime soon.:rolleyes:

And when i was putting down training, it was for sporting mma in general. NOT any particular school

OK, but...

Now, I dont know much about other schools, but it seems that the way MMA is going in Ireland and indeed America, is the bull**** sporting MMA.

I think that Kyokushin Budokai is possibly the most realistic MMA being taught in Ireland.

Surely you must have some particular clubs in mind when making these statements, otherwise what exactly are you basing your comparision/opinion on?

dlofnep

kenpo_dave wrote:

I think that Kyokushin Budokai is possibly the most realistic MMA being taught in Ireland.

Send some of your guys into the MMA league and prove it. If all this stupid brazilian jiu-jitsu, wrestling, and muay thai stuff is non-realistic - Then I don't want to waste my money with it. Standing in the same spot with bare knuckles punching a guy in the chest 307 times in 7 minutes sounds like a great way to train for me.

kenpo_dave wrote:

Now, I dont know much about other schools, but it seems that the way MMA is going in Ireland and indeed America, is the bull**** sporting MMA. If the main focus of the training is for competition, then u r losing out, u r gonna be restricted by the rules of competition, which inhibits the development as a "real" fighter.

Sporting MMA? MMA is a sport, genius. "Sporting MMA" is redundant. If you think that all these techniques won't translate into a NHB enviroment then you are sadly mistaken. Anybody can punch someone in the nuts and bite but I'd like to see you try bite someone when they have their hooks sunk in and are choking you unconcious.

Please I can understand you wanting to blow up the name of your club but what you have said is utter tripe. If you want to prove it, enter the MMA league.

Cabelo

I can't see why not having enough people should figure in entering competitions. Surely if someone were interested they would enter regardless of whether or not others from the club were to go?

kenpo_dave

Well, my opinion isnt based so much on indivdual schools, but more the crap i see in UFC, which most MMA schools seem to consider to be the "holy grail" of martial arts competition. Take a look at the Tank Abbott clip on this page http://www.cory-a-johnson.com/images/BikeMovies/ Its very sloppy and the opponents seem to be crap. Most of them cud have gotten knees in at anytime. Its this sloppy fighting that ive mainly seen in UFC, which partly leads to my opinion. Although, saying that, the UFC KO's clip is pretty good, but mainly cos theres alot of Muay Thai, and the CroCop clip on this site is pretty good too - http://www.draven.hu/download.html I havent seen too many Pride fights and from wot ive seen of K-1 its pretty entertaining. Now back to where my opinion of sporting mma comes from. Ive have had endless amounts of discussions with mma people online and it cud be the same person everytime. They all repeat the same drivel about styles theyve barely even heard of. And this all comes from wot theyre being taught in their schools. They also have attitudes which do not belong in the Martial Arts world. They r basically walking egos. But wot i really hate is,as i said before, the bastardization of Martial Arts to make something thats ring compliant. The MMA and indeed MA schools that only, or mainly focus on the sporting aspect of fighting r cutting away wot cannot be used in the ring, and they think wot they r doing is still effective for anything other than competition. This and the commercialization of the events almost sickens me.

Anyway, Ive said too much so Im gonna stop talking now. Im sure there will be plenty of comments made about this post.

kenpo_dave

All the Martial Arts training I have done up to now has been to end fights very quickly. No messing around. Because of this I never reached a high level of physical fitness. So, as it stands I am in not condition to enter competitions. However, as I progress in Kyokushin Budokai, and become fitter, I will enter competitions, but I think only all-round competitions or stand up competitions. I am not a grappler, and I think it wud be futile for me to enter a purely grappling competition. Understand this though, my interest in competing is solely to gain experience. Titles dont mean anything outside the particular competion, just as belts dont mean anything outside of a particular school.

Tim_Murphy

You’re using random Tank Abbott clips to back up the opinion that the UFC is crap? Really?

But wot i really hate is,as i said before, the bastardization of Martial Arts to make something thats ring compliant. The MMA and indeed MA schools that only, or mainly focus on the sporting aspect of fighting r cutting away wot cannot be used in the ring, and they think wot they r doing is still effective for anything other than competition

You don’t actually seem to have much interest in the sport of MMA. If that’s the case with the others in your club as well why do you call yourselves MMA? Referring to Tank Abbott fights as evidence of the poor standard of the UFC would suggest to me that you haven’t actually seen that many MMA events.

All the Martial Arts training I have done up to now has been to end fights very quickly. No messing around. Because of this I never reached a high level of physical fitness.

Why?

but I think only all-round competitions or stand up competitions.

Seeing as you train in an MMA club, why not just do a MMA fight? I’m sure you’d be able to get on the Ring of Truth show or one of the ones up north. Pro rules are fairly non-restrictive in my experience.

Millionaire

kenpo_dave wrote:

Sorry, Gerry. I didnt see ur response there. I jumped so quickly to respond to Combats post. I appreciate what u said man. Shane has been trying to contact u. He wants to know if ur still on for training. Were going to see if we can get the hall for one night a week. Good luck.

Yo Dave

I was away in USA there, and I have few few things re work..that has really affected free time :-(

so I am not going to be able to get down for a while. will drop Shane a mail. pass on regards..and keep training hard.

Serious lads on boards...this is tough training and its the real deal!!!!!!

Sissies need not apply!!!! LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Millionaire

i think Shane said Bas Rutten was a member of this organisation in holland??

When I was down there in MMA Ireland, there was Judo and grappling done too and bjj ground stuff.

I tell ya lads....this is a tough club.

Ok ya might not agree some of ya with what the lads are doing down there.

But if you want to test yourself and you mental bottle...go down and give it a shot.

Its bloody tough. ya sort of be dreading going into to the class...but when you finish the class...you feel pretty proud of yourself.

I would guess....that this may be the toughest training in Ireland.

kenpo_dave

Well, the reason I never got into serious physical fitness is cos ive never had the need for it. All the fights ive been in ended relatively quickly. And as for the reason y we call ourselves an MMA school is cos we r a mixed martial arts school. We do more than one style. It seems the sporting people think that an MMA school has to do competitions. Let me remind u that MMA is a tag developed by the sporting people.

And for dlofnep

dlofnep wrote:

If all this stupid brazilian jiu-jitsu, wrestling, and muay thai stuff is non-realistic - Then I don't want to waste my money with it. Standing in the same spot with bare knuckles punching a guy in the chest 307 times in 7 minutes sounds like a great way to train for me.

Tell me where i said BJJ, wrestling and Muay Thai were non-realistic. If u knew anything about Kyokushin Budokai and if u had read other posts ud know that apart from Karate, theres BJJ, Judo, Boxing and Sambo. My point was that the way they r being taught in most sporting MMA schools in non-realistic for anything other than their competitions. Take Muay Thai for example. Traditional Muay Thai has forms - aka Kata - hell traditional Muay Thai even has chants. The "Standing in the same spot with bare knuckles punching a guy in the chest 307 times in 7 minutes" is called conditioning. It means when in sparring someone punches u in the chest its going to have little effect. U guys seem to think that the only training needed to be done is the sparring. Its cos of this mentality that I say sporting MMA is non-realistic.

dlofnep wrote:

Sporting MMA? MMA is a sport, genius. "Sporting MMA" is redundant. If you think that all these techniques won't translate into a NHB enviroment then you are sadly mistaken. Anybody can punch someone in the nuts and bite but I'd like to see you try bite someone when they have their hooks sunk in and are choking you unconcious.

Mixed martial arts schools have existed for a long time, longer than the tag MMA or even the term mixed martial arts. There is a Wing Tsun school near Dawson Street that also teaches Escrima. Technically they r teaching mixed martial arts. The tag MMA is just convenient to use. And just because someone is choking u it doesnt mean that theres no way out of it. Infact theres plenty of ways to get out of chokes. So just because someone doesnt do them in NHB it doesnt mean they dont exist. By the way NHB is still sports fighting, just has less rules. Anything that enters a ring can be considered a sport. And the fact that u said "try bite someone when they have their hooks sunk in and are choking you unconcious" suggests to me u know very little about fighting. Of cors im not going to try and bite someone in that situation. For ur education, biting is mainly used when caught in a side headlock...u take a chunk out of the side of the guys.

And as for entering the MMA league...all in due time.

dlofnep

kenpo_dave wrote:

Well, my opinion isnt based so much on indivdual schools, but more the crap i see in UFC, which most MMA schools seem to consider to be the "holy grail" of martial arts competition. Take a look at the Tank Abbott clip on this page http://www.cory-a-johnson.com/images/BikeMovies/ Its very sloppy and the opponents seem to be crap. Most of them cud have gotten knees in at anytime. Its this sloppy fighting that ive mainly seen in UFC, which partly leads to my opinion.

Please, your absurdity is about to make me puke. Tank Abbott is famous for not actually posessing any skill. Anytime he went up against anyone with skill, he was dismantled. He made his name in earlier UFC's against hand picked opponents that he could throw his heavy hands at. Using him as a UFC example is typical. If you want to talk about examples of fighters who have fought in the UFC, use examples like Matt Lindland, a former olypmic silver medalist in wrestling, Pete Spratt, a man who could disect anyone in a standup battle with precision strikes and kicks, the BJ Penns, The Bang Ludwigs, The Genki Sudos, The Chuck Liddells..

kenpo_dave wrote:

And for dlofnep
The "Standing in the same spot with bare knuckles punching a guy in the chest 307 times in 7 minutes" is called conditioning. It means when in sparring someone punches u in the chest its going to have little effect. U guys seem to think that the only training needed to be done is the sparring. Its cos of this mentality that I say sporting MMA is non-realistic.

I don't need to take 300 punches to the chest to condition me.. Standard sparring will condition me. Nobody in an MMA fight is going to walk up to me and Eddie Honda from street fighter 100 hand slap me. Why should I condition myself for something that will actually not happen?

And the fact that u said "try bite someone when they have their hooks sunk in and are choking you unconcious" suggests to me u know very little about fighting.

And as for entering the MMA league...all in due time.

Firstly, my comment about biting when someone has you in a choke was to point out the fact that although MMA has a strict set of rules, you wouldn't be able to accomplish alot of these "secret street fighting" techniques or whatever it is you guys do these days that makes you better than MMA fighters. And secondly, if you dispute my ability - What weight are you? I'd be more than happy to compete against you in the MMA league if you can weigh under 70KG. I'm 60KG BTW.

Millionaire

juststoptalking wrote:

Usually millionaire i've no problems with what you post but.......

i totally agree with tim and with his line of reasoning. secondly, millionaire/kenpo_dave i don't think you have any right to undervalue the toughness of a couple of people's training on this board. .

WAIT NOW!!!! I have not made any comment on this thread to undervalue the toughness or anything else about anyones training on here. so take that comment back please!

As for the toughness thing. And I have seen over the years in a few MAs I have studied be it in kickboxing, TKD and even Krav Maga!!! Some people I have some across (not people on the boards...but people I have come across in my own trainings) strutt about as if they are the reincarnation of Bruce Lee, full of attitude...posing , showing off etc etc , and if a sparrow as much as farted in their direction...they would be away whinging and moaning.

These sort of people in MA , I detest, they strut about with the chest out like a peacock or poseur and then they get a slap sparring or something....there away whinging and bitching like a sissy.

people do NOT have to be tough, MA is not about that, but if someone wants to act that part , and then cannot walk their talk...then IMO F THEM!!!

Me where ever I train, I keep my mouth shut, have respect, ask intelligent questions, train hard and try to learn.

On this thread all I am saying is these guys in MMA Ireland, train hard, they push themselves to a level than 90% of people cannot do.

Personally I can not make the training anymore re work and personal commitments, KM and Thai is my thing.

But if someone , of their own free choice wants to push themselves to hard levels...maybe this is the place to try. its good training.

Thats all I m saying re this.

Good Luck to the Lads, their trying to build up a new club and I am sure with next year or 2 they will have some good fighters out there.