Vouched access to Soccer forum is stupid

Laguna

I think the process of being able to post in the Soccer forum is laborious and stupid. The whole point of only being given acces if you are vouched by two people is so dumb, what if you don't know anyone who has access to the Soccer forum?, you'd never get access, you'd be resorted to PM'ing random people in there to see if they'd let you in at which point they'd tell you to **** off (and rightly so for harrassing people by PM).

Why's it so exclusive to gain access to the soccer forum anyway?, are the majority of Boards users the great unwashed or something?. I like soccer (I am one of the endagered species known as the Crystal Palace supporter) and would like to voice my opinions on some of the threads in there but as I don't know any of the posters in the forum I'll never be able to do so!, is this really a good system?

parasite

ditto

Asok

Well look at it this way, Take a look at what that forum was like before restricting the access this way and look at it now. In my opinion it works.

mr_angry

The system was put in place to cut down on the horrendous amount of personal abuse that was being hurled around, and has been a tremendous success since it was instigated. Its probably the one reason I continue to visit the forum - I was sorely tempted to give up back in 'the bad old days'.

You've been a member since 2003 - you obviously know one or two other posters on other boards. Find some of them who also use the soccer board, and know you are a responsible poster, and get them to vouch for you. Simple as that. Assuming you are a responsible poster, of course.

Tar.Aldarion

People might sponsor you out of the kindness in their hearts.Jesus if I was in it I would sponsor you because of your avatar....

Hagar

Read your PM's man.
Go to the Soccer Forum Access request.
I'll be your first sponsor.
You won't have trouble getting a second.

Laguna

Yo Hagar, I tried to access the soccer access requests forum but for some reason I'm not allowed to view that forum at all.

Rabies

If you can't access the access requests forum I will be your second sponser here on this thread.

Laguna

Magic!, thanks rabies.

Gordon

Are you still willing to fight your crusade against the Soccer request forum's procedures or shall we lock this and maintain our understanding that the SAR forum's procedures are indeed fine?

amp

Cool, another disgruntled newbie!

rsynnott

Would it be unkind to suggest that the OP's chosen subject line shows exactly why such an access mechanism is a good idea?

20 Times 20 Times

Its a simple system that work. Leave it at that.

RuggieBear

rsynnott wrote:

Would it be unkind to suggest that the OP's chosen subject line shows exactly why such an access mechanism is a good idea?

no...i was thinking the same.

DeVore

3 months from now he'll think its the best thing about the site. Btw, I thought up that system, so... the word "stupid".... you know, its kinda emotive..... care to explain?
*jaws shark music*

DeV.

copacetic

It's not helped by the search function being broken for so long, I got sponsored by a couple of people I don't know, would like to pay it forward but am in no rush to sponsor someone when you can't see their previous posts...

Laguna

Fine, don't give me access to the forum then, I'm OBVIOUSLY another one of those perennial arseholes/trollers by using the word "stupid" in a thread title, plus that and the fact that I'm not a member of any Boards clique clearly demonstrates my general lack of worth. All I wanted was to post a few replies in the soccer forum, simple as, my request was above my station it seems.

The Troll

Laguna wrote:

I think the process of being able to post in the Soccer forum is laborious and stupid. The whole point of only being given acces if you are vouched by two people is so dumb, what if you don't know anyone who has access to the Soccer forum?, you'd never get access, you'd be resorted to PM'ing random people in there to see if they'd let you in at which point they'd tell you to **** off (and rightly so for harrassing people by PM).

Why's it so exclusive to gain access to the soccer forum anyway?, are the majority of Boards users the great unwashed or something?. I like soccer (I am one of the endagered species known as the Crystal Palace supporter) and would like to voice my opinions on some of the threads in there but as I don't know any of the posters in the forum I'll never be able to do so!, is this really a good system?

i agree with this 100%. Its a ridiculous rule. using the logic that it stops flame wars etc, then we should have access requests for all forums. Isn't the whole purpose of having forum moderators to stop the type of people who post crap on the forums. If the mods do there jobs correctly then we won't need access requests, in the same way we don't need access requests for every other forum we use on boards.

Laguna

Careful now The Troll, I was told in a PM that I offended people with the post you quoted, I was obviously being downright offensive and wouldn't want you to associate yourself with my thoughts by quoting me and the depravity I bring to Boards.ie.

EDIT: Don't worry BuffBot, I've revoked my request, I'm truly sorry I don't fit into the pidgeon hole you regard as 'mature and measured'

BuffyBot

Your mature and measured response speaks volumes.

whiskeyman

I personally think its a great idea.
Online soccer forums are notorious for wild flames / "your team is ****" etc.. posts.
I've heard from those on the forum a long while that it has significantly cut down a lot of messing.
There are a lot of people who check the "request access" forum and will give sponsor if they believe its genuine.
I'd check for how long they've been a member.... number of posts, and previous posts (I know searching is down, but you can usually make a good assumption on the first two).

I didnt know anyone on the board, but wrote my application and got sponsored.
I've since sponsored a few others.

If you can think of a better way to keep out messers, I'm sure the mods would like to hear it.

henbane

The Troll wrote:

Isn't the whole purpose of having forum moderators to stop the type of people who post crap on the forums. If the mods do there jobs correctly then we won't need access requests, in the same way we don't need access requests for every other forum we use on boards.

No. Mods are not there to stop constant flaming. If a forum descends in to flame wars on a consistent basis, there is something wrong with the posters, not the mods. Mods give up some of their free time to help out with the site; they don't sign up to read & police the constant stream of childish drivel that was the soccer forum before the current system came in to effect. Read [thread=152971]this thread[/thread] for a bit of relevant history.

The Troll

henbane wrote:

No. Mods are not there to stop constant flaming. If a forum descends in to flame wars on a consistent basis, there is something wrong with the posters, not the mods. Mods give up some of their free time to help out with the site; they don't sign up to read & police the constant stream of childish drivel that was the soccer forum before the current system came in to effect. Read [thread=152971]this thread[/thread] for a bit of relevant history.

No, the mods are there to ban people who post garbage and who start flaming. If people do it in the soccer forum then let the banhammer strike. Police the soccer forum in the exact same successful manner that the other forums are moderated and there won't be any problems.

Someone flames - ban them.
Someone posts crap - ban them.

Not exactly rocket science and there is no need for the ridiculous request system.

rsynnott

The Troll wrote:

Not exactly rocket science and there is no need for the ridiculous request system.

What damage does said system do you, precisely? How would anyone's life be any better if it didn't exist? Do you have a point, or are you just whining randomly?

henbane

The Troll wrote:

No, the mods are there to ban people who post garbage and who start flaming. If people do it in the soccer forum then let the banhammer strike. Police the soccer forum in the exact same successful manner that the other forums are moderated and there won't be any problems.

Someone flames - ban them.
Someone posts crap - ban them.

Not exactly rocket science and there is no need for the ridiculous request system.

Did you read the thread I linked or was that too much trouble? Bitesize version (with no big words): Mods ended up banning several users daily. That's too much hassle to make the forum worth running. Choice was no soccer forum or access requests system.

Laguna

henbane wrote:

Did you read the thread I linked or was that too much trouble? Bitesize version (with no big words)

Now I suppose this isn't trolling?, I also suppose you have access to the soccer forum too, where you can make similar comments like the above.

seamus

The Troll has jumped headfirst into condeming a system without fully understanding it?! No way!

amp

Laguna wrote:

Now I suppose this isn't trolling?, I also suppose you have access to the soccer forum too, where you can make similar comments like the above.

Henbane is merely expressing his abject wonder at peoples ability to completely ignore the reasons why the current system was developed in the first place.

rsynnott

Anyway, you've been offered sponsorship for said forum. Quiet.

Thanx 4 The Fish

The offer has since been rescinded by the people who originally offered it.

20 Times 20 Times

I think the main reason why ive taken a step back from the soccer forum is really for a few reasons.

• The eircom league been nearly finshed
• People who dont do any searches on who they are sponsoring
• People adding pointless comments , just to up their post count

I think people are sponsoring for the wrong reasons and just doing it for the sake of it. I like the scheme where you have to know someone or at least speak some sort of common sense on boards before getting access.

I dont like the usual i support Dundalk FC since i was three sponsor me :rolleyes:

I think there could be improvements made to the sponsorship scheme , where by the sponsor has to me a active member of the soccer forum and for at least 6months before granting sponsorship.

This might seem like extra work for the mods but really I and im sure other people would be prepare to help out that extra bit to unsure that my favorite forum doesnt suffer from trolls / muppetts etc.

The way it stands there is a trend to the people actually willing to sponsor other people , it seems like the same people all the time.

All said above , i think the mods do a great job and take a firm and fair policy with the forum and again ill say thank you because it really is my favorite forum.

Lets look for ways to improve the sponsorships scheme , its a great thing but at this stage i think its broke and needs fixing.

Talliesin

In fairness to newbies, without knowing the context for it, it does seem pretty stupid.

To those who remember the situation that led to it being put in place it's such a clear improvement on the way things were that complaining about it also seems pretty stupid.

Trust me, those were bad days.

20 Times 20 Times

Talliesin wrote:

Trust me, those were bad days.

Again I agree with you but i feel at this time that the scheme can only improve.

Thanx 4 The Fish

Can't only improve ? Does that mean it's okay as it is ??

Anyway, I agree with the active member thing but some people are active members without posting 15 posts a day and the like. Some people on the forum post once a week but read every word that is written ( I know I was when I joined originally) and I go through phases of not posting on any threads because I have nothing of worth to add to them or feel that other people have expressed my sentiments in said threads.

The other problem with the active poster thing is that it is a bit hard to enforce when search is down. In fact it would be nigh on impossible to do so. If perhaps there was a soccer post count that was maintained then that would work but TBH i like the system as it is, people can sponsor whoever they like some take a risk on it, others put a lot of effort into delving into background, there is a good mix on the forum at the moment, and hopefully we can maintain that going forward with some hardcore Modding

20 Times 20 Times

Thanx 4 The Fish wrote:

Can't only improve ? Does that mean it's okay as it is ??

Anyway, I agree with the active member thing but some people are active members without posting 15 posts a day and the like. Some people on the forum post once a week but read every word that is written ( I know I was when I joined originally) and I go through phases of not posting on any threads because I have nothing of worth to add to them or feel that other people have expressed my sentiments in said threads.

The other problem with the active poster thing is that it is a bit hard to enforce when search is down. In fact it would be nigh on impossible to do so. If perhaps there was a soccer post count that was maintained then that would work but TBH i like the system as it is, people can sponsor whoever they like some take a risk on it, others put a lot of effort into delving into background, there is a good mix on the forum at the moment, and hopefully we can maintain that going forward with some hardcore Modding

Sorry was actually a typo , what i meant to say was i feel the current system CAN only improve, this making the forum more enjoyable for its members.

I think Most people on the soccer forums understand who is a active member and who isnt even if they dont post that often , its when they do its worth the read and you know that they are reading every single word in the thread.Hence i think that the active idea could work.

I just think that when the search function is back up people should use it instead of looking to see whom the poster supports and how long they have , who cares ? You cant judge people and how they will behave by who they support just look at gimmrick he supports cork

I cant stress enough how important it is for the forum and for the members that read and post there that every tom/harry isnt allowed in and the way the current system is , its enabling people that have never posted on the soccer forum ever to still grant access to people.

Like i said i think this area could be looked at futher and be more then willing to help as im ssure other guys in the forum would be.

Thanx 4 The Fish

To say it can only improve is incorrect, it could disimprove quite dramatically.

There is not alot of extra work on the mods side in what you propose I mostly just look at threads that have enough responses in the most case and that would still continue to be the case as you should not be posting on the requests forum unless you are sponsoring somebody. Also as we spend most of our boards time on soccer anyway and know who posts and in or abouts how often we would have a fair idea. I disagree with the active member bit though as it could be used as a reason for lots of spam to be posted. I need to get to one hundred posts before I can sponsor, well lets get to 100 posts then. There are a number of other reasons that I think the system you propose is flawed and if you wish we can go into them some more. But TBH, the system is working as long as the membership of the soccer forum do as they are supposed to, ie reporting posts and sponsoring users based on whatever criteria the deem fit. I am happier with the way that it is going now than I was 18 months or so ago and am happy to see that civil discussion can now be maintained where signal is by far > noise.

Draupnir

The soccer forum was a steaming pile of shìte until the sponsorship system came in. I contributed my fair share of "Ashley Cole is brutal" and "I hate Arsenal cos they are teh ghey" type comments, so I am more than aware of the improvement.

Some decent discussions over there these days, regularly interesting reads and top notch videos and stats from the goldmine that is Eirebhoy.

20 Times 20 Times

Yeah i understand where you are coming from and the way your looking at it . "if its not broke dont fix it".
But the biggest flaw surely is that someone that has never posted in the soccer forum can still sponsor someone. Explain how that benefits me as a member and you as a mod ?

RuggieBear

Sarge wrote:

Yeah i understand where you are coming from and the way your looking at it . "if its not broke dont fix it".
But the biggest flaw surely is that someone that has never posted in the soccer forum can still sponsor someone. Explain how that benefits me as a member and you as a mod ?

if that said someone gets banned so does the person who has never posted in soccer.

Thanx 4 The Fish

These people who do not post often, still read the board and contribute when they feel strongly enough about something. As a mdo I appreciate these people, they are less likely to start flame wars, be abusive to others and often offer an insight that may not have been formerly been made. Why should this person who posts one good post a week or month or day be stopped from sponsoring while somebody who posts 10 posts a day which are in the main, OOOh isn't roy keane great or quote great chunks of others posts and type ROFL or some other similar sh1te.

Also who is to say what is a valid contribution, if you do not agree with something tha somebody says do you take a point off their valid contribution score or revoke their right to sponsor for a month for not maintaining the Sarge standard of good posting or somesuch ?

WhiteWashMan

well, i know why the access request forum was put in place, but does it still fulfill the needs that it was put in place for?

im not so sure. im all for change when its needed or wanted, but im not for change for changes sake.

i dont agree with the 2 sponser rule. i think its a bit silly.

onthe other hand, i do like the idea of gaining access through request, becuase then you can still control who posts!

perhaps an idea of reducing the access measures to a simple request in the access forum could be tried.
after all, the idea of these boards is to allow discussion and communication for everyone.
the mods are sensible, im sure they can give access without the need for other people to vouch, and if the new posters act the fool, then its just as easy to take that access away.

i do however think its unfair for new posters to need 2 sponsers, because we all know that sometimespeople just cant be arsed or bothered, or people just dont know you, and the threat of banning becuase one of your sponsers is an idiot would certainly put me off giving my support to people.

so, maybe an idea we could try out for a month or two to see if it should be implemented full time, or relegated to the large pile of stupid ideas?

WhiteWashMan

Thanx 4 The Fish wrote:

for not maintaining the Sarge standard of good posting or somesuch ?

sarge and standards in the same sentence.
hehehehehe

Thanx 4 The Fish

They say that the pile can be seen from space..

20 Times 20 Times

Ah now i thought i made some valid points

Thanx 4 The Fish

Sarge wrote:

Ah now i thought i made some valid points

I agree that there were some valid points made, but it would be unfair to implement them at the moment. Is like Labour and the conservatives.

Tony Blair, the soccer forum should be free for use for all.

Michael Howard, only allow those people who contribut to the soccer society should be allowed to decide who the other members are that contribute, and what's more they should all pass a test.

Charles Kennedy, I am going to decapitate everybody.

amp

wAN THE LIB DEMS!

talla

I was wondering when one of these threads were going to appear, its been a while.
I think a lot of what WWM has suggested makes sense. Maybe its time to take this offline T4TF?

Thanx 4 The Fish

Maybe it is, to the batcave.


Can I be batman, i like the cut of his jib and also the cut of his superhero costume, BTW does he really have that large a package or is he just overcompensating, answers on a postcard.

WhiteWashMan

Thanx 4 The Fish wrote:

Maybe it is, to the batcave.

its the car.


chicks dig the car....

20 Times 20 Times

Im going to shoot myself in the foot and say that i really like Mr WWM suggeston would get rid of people sponsoring just for the sake of it.

I Have great belief in the mods of the soccer forums as i personally think they do a great job there , they should make the decesion who they think is sensible enough to make a post , without all the spam and the trolls.

Thanx 4 The Fish

Does lead to the, he wouldn't let me in because he does not like my team stuff though and I can assure you that more people would be on here every week saying how come I am not allowed to play with everyone else etc etc.

As has already been said, Talla and I will have a chat, see what we come up with and whether we agree that it is a workable system and determine if it will require another mods help and make an announcement on the board if we are going to trial a change.