ucdsu.net asking me for a password! WTF?

breadmonkey

As per title. When I try and go to ucdsu.net, I'm being asked for an admin password or some rubbish. What's going on?

Dave!

Yeah, I think the site's been "hacked" or somethin (ie. somebody guessed the admin's password), cos I went on yesterday and the main forum (can't remember what it's called) was called something to do with Allah, or somethin like that, and there was a picture of Georgey Bush with a target thing on his head.

I guess the password lark is some sort of security thing.

Vainglory

Yeah, we did get hacked....Cheeky blighters.

Site will be up as soon as we sort out what the hell is going on.

JHJ

Tekken5isalive

yeah noticed that just there. silly monkeys got hacked. let that be a lesson to you. THey also deleted all my posts. damn those hackery hacks. actually, which hacks am i talking about the internet ones or the su ones?

panda100

It'd be cool maybe now that the union might have the opportunity to change the layout of the student union homepage a bit-its just a bit to indymedia for my liking.You should make it maybe a bit more colurful-the blue and whites a bit boring and boyish-sure throw a bit of pink in their for the ladies!and maybe tone down the left influence on the newswires to make it more relevant for ucd students and not just for those who want to free the rossport five.

irlrobins

new site coming very soon.... as soon as the guy making gets back from Hong Kong that is.... :-P

breadmonkey

Go and have a look. There's all this "Soldier of Allah" sh!t with a picture of Bush in someones's crosshair's. Pretty much all threads have been deleted. Try and start a new thread, it brings you to some gun website! Weird....

Vainglory

panda100 wrote:

It'd be cool maybe now that the union might have the opportunity to change the layout of the student union homepage a bit-its just a bit to indymedia for my liking.You should make it maybe a bit more colurful-the blue and whites a bit boring and boyish-sure throw a bit of pink in their for the ladies!and maybe tone down the left influence on the newswires to make it more relevant for ucd students and not just for those who want to free the rossport five.

Just on that point..

One of the Rossport 5's has a daughter doing Law in UCD so I'd reckon she'd find a thread on that pretty relevant to her.

panda100

ok shouldnt have taken rossport 5 as an example but just there seems to be a very left political influence in the newswire which maybe is taking the place of more important student news.Its just a comment cos maybe im wrong and a lot of students are intrested in these alternative newstories.Its just that i think that there are other websites such as indymedia that caters for these people.

Pythia

Exactly, but they don't call it 'Red Belfield' for nothing...

pretty*monster

If you want there to be relevant news on newswire you can write some.

That's the whole point of the newswire.

Jonny Arson

Hmmmm I can't get into ucdsu.net at all. Are they so frightend over another potential hacker than they're going to leave the site hack exclusive? Weird.

On the subject of the Rossport 5 I have to very much agree with panda100 I'll sum up her argument in a few words.... WTF have they got to do with UCD? Probably as much relevance as to denying the student consumer the right to choose which soft drink product they wish to purchase and drink. :rolleyes:

Tekken5isalive wrote:

yeah noticed that just there. silly monkeys got hacked. let that be a lesson to you. THey also deleted all my posts. damn those hackery hacks. actually, which hacks am i talking about the internet ones or the su ones?

*waves to Kevin*

pretty*monster

Zane from MTV2 wrote:

Hmmmm I can't get into ucdsu.net at all. Are they so frightend over another potential hacker than they're going to leave the site hack exclusive?

No, they're still fiwing it, they can do that while it's online and open access.

Vainglory

Zane from MTV2 wrote:

Hmmmm I can't get into ucdsu.net at all. Are they so frightend over another potential hacker than they're going to leave the site hack exclusive? Weird.

On the subject of the Rossport 5 I have to very much agree with panda100 I'll sum up her argument in a few words.... WTF have they got to do with UCD? Probably as much relevance as to denying the student consumer the right to choose which soft drink product they wish to purchase and drink. :rolleyes:



*waves to Kevin*

Zane, one of the Rossport 5 has a daughter in Law in UCD. Plus, a lot of people from UCD have been very active in the Shell to Sea campaign so it seems natural for them to publish news about it on an open publishing website, just as you might for anything you're involved in. A lot of the UCD Shell to Sea campaigners are in Global Action which is a UCD society, so there's your relevance right there. And you can still buy Coke in UCD too.

breadmonkey

Zane, please stop setting yourself up for attack

panda100

I dont think zane is setting himself up for attack he's just voicing his opinion for vainglory to take on board.Its just a bit intimidating adding something to the newswire in the ucdsu website cos you feel it is not worthy beside such topics as the rossport five or war in iraq.Thats the good thing about ucd boards.ie u can right something silly like-did you see the free sally posters up -however on the su website theres always such serious political stories up that any little ucd news story just feel insignificant in comparison.Anyways good luck with the new website-i have to admit the i was really hesitant of the student union under james carroll but you are doing a great job-great organisation-been the best student union in a good while

Pythia

Cool, so I can post up anything on the newswire that's relevent to me since I'm a student in UCD, just like the girl who's a daughter of one of the Rossport 5?

Vainglory

It's open publishing, as long as it doesn't contravene the site guidelines or the Dignity and Respect Policy then knock yourself out.

Mr.Nice Guy

breadmonkey wrote:

Zane, please stop setting yourself up for attack

Giving an opinion is setting yourself up for an attack? Dear oh dear.

I agree 100 per cent with Zane. How about the union actually addresses things relevant to UCD?

Vainglory

We are. What have we done "irrelevant" to UCD this year that has impeded our work on education/welfare etc issues?

Mr.Nice Guy

Vainglory wrote:

We are. What have we done "irrelevant" to UCD this year that has impeded our work on education/welfare etc issues?

I personally take issue with the political nature of this union. I find myself with political opinions vastly different to this union. Now I have no problem having different politcal views to people, indeed many of my friends hold very different political views to me, but when it's my Union involved I find it unfortunate.

For instance, recently there was a protest against former UCD student Michael McDowell telling him that he 'wasn't welcome'.

I am no fan of Mr McDowell or the PDs but I strongly object to this protest.

From reading the Tribune, I understand you yourself were there along with Welfare Officer Dan Hayden and you stated:

"we needed to make this protest, so that the Minister would know that he was not welcome on our campus" and you added "I know we cannot speak for all of the people in the College but it needed to be done."

You don't speak for me and in my opinion it didn't need to be done.

SU President James Carroll said:

"he's [McDowell] not strictly welcome in UCD. He should be getting a good grilling when he does come here, we should be doing that as well."

Perhaps someone could tell me why Mr McDowell should be 'getting a good grilling' and of what relevance this is to UCD students as a whole?

I do like you Jane and we have spoken through PM in the past as you know and I have found you a pleasant person but the reality is, you have very different political beliefs to my own and I personally do not like it when Union representatives are straying from the domain of catering to student needs and are instead entering into the domain of political life.

It's not relevant to me personally as well as other people with political beliefs like mine and I feel it only serves to make the Union seem more out of touch and distant.

I would prefer the Union to stick to matters pertaining to students and to leave aside the political stuff.

All the best.

Jonny Arson

breadmonkey wrote:

Zane, please stop setting yourself up for attack

I'm really sorry about that. I'll make sure in future that I don't have an opinion or voice.

Regards.

A

pretty*monster

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

I agree 100 per cent with Zane. How about the union actually addresses things relevant to UCD?

Things like fighting fees, running the student book shop, five convinence shops, and two bars, ensuring that all students are being kept informed of the collage authorities to modularise and semesterise all students next September and encourage them to make their opinions on the matter heard, organise fun events throughout the campus, and deal with the individual students financial, personal, and educational problems day in, day out.

Yeah, you're right they really should get on top of that stuff :rolleyes:

If you don't like how the union's being run then get involved and do it better.

Mr.Nice Guy

pretty monster,

Nothing to say on the Union getting involved in political matters? I mean, I'd hate it if you were to attack my post and then go and overlook the basic crux of my argument.:rolleyes:

And as for this:

pretty monster wrote:

If you don't like how the union's being run then get involved and do it better.

When I paid my fees, part of that money automatically went to the Union. They're my Union and I want them to represent my needs. Holding political views which I disagree with is, to me, not representing my needs. I appreciate the work they do for students - I just wish they'd leave it at that and not get involved in politics. Understand?

It's amazing how hostile this place is to a difference of opinion! I suppose I'm not allowed question how the Gardai conduct their affairs unless I go and join the Guards myself, eh? Presumably I'm not allowed to comment on politicians unless I go and become a politician myself, is that right?

Slash/ED

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

Giving an opinion is setting yourself up for an attack? Dear oh dear.

I agree 100 per cent with Zane. How about the union actually addresses things relevant to UCD?

Agreed, there's no need for this wannabe political activist nonsense. They should be focused 100% on the students, not that I'm dismissing all the good work they actually do for the students, it should however be their only concern bar none.

breadmonkey

Giving an opinion is setting yourself up for an attack? Dear oh dear.

It wasn't an opinion, it was a mis-statement of fact. :rolleyes:

Vainglory

Hmmm.

First of all I don't take any offence to debates like this. I actually quite like them as people might have noticed. So I don't think there's any need for people getting personal etc and Mr Nice Guy definitely hasn't. All's rosy in the garden as long as we behave like adults. Which I'll do.

To say that you have an issue with the "political nature" of this union is something of a misnomer. The SU is a political entity ; all five sabbatical officers were elected on policy, which makes their work political.

You can, of course, disagree with something we do, for example the McDowell protest. But some other students, as I'm sure you'd agree, would be annoyed if we DIDN'T protest about McDowell coming out here. So it seems we are caught in the middle. Some people agree, some people don't (as is the case with almost every issue imagineable).

So are we stuck in stalemate and unable to move on any issue because some people will agree with what we do and some won't? Of course not. There has to be an additional factor which decides what position we take. And that factor is mandate.

As I said to the Tribune reporter (but wasn't printed), UCDSU has democratic mandate to oppose McDowell's deportations, and peaceful student protest is a reasonable form of opposition. I am accountable to that mandate, and that mandate is something that can be changed if enough people want to change it. If it changes, I will still be bound by it, no matter what my personal views are.

However, on the subject of personal views, I don't accept that once you're an elected SU officer you need to put all your opinions and preferences aside for fear of pissing off some/none/all students. I'm certain that no other elected representative does. Bertie definitely doesn't. However, personal views only become a problem if I use them as justification to break mandate given to me by referendum, by Council, or by Exec. And I can assure you I would never do that. As you say, I am a representative, and I represent those who care enough to mandate me to act a certain way.

If a mandate was in impossible conflict with my own principles (eg if Council mandated me to write a letter to George Bush praising him for his role in liberating the Iraqi people) then I would resign rather than break mandate because if I did then I would not be representing the people who gave me that mandate. But at the moment, I am not doing anything which makes me unaccountable, unreasonable, unrepresentative or undemocratic.

Anyway, this whole thing has been somewhat blown out of proportion. Me taking 15 minutes out of my day to go outside and peacefully (silently I might add) hold a placard doesn't stop me doing everything else that I do during the day that I'm sure you would consider relevant to students. It would be unrealistic to expect to agree with everything your elected representatives do. You'd be hard pushed to find a Fianna Fáiler that has never once disagreed with Bertie Ahern. But in my case, as long as I feel I am acting in accordance with direction given to me by Class Reps in SU Council, then that is all the justification I need.

Mr.Nice Guy

Vainglory wrote:

You can, of course, disagree with something we do, for example the McDowell protest. But some other students, as I'm sure you'd agree, would be annoyed if we DIDN'T protest about McDowell coming out here. So it seems we are caught in the middle. Some people agree, some people don't (as is the case with almost every issue imagineable).

I take your point but the point I have been making (and I think Zane and Slash/Ed would take a similar view), is that if you took a neutral stance on political issues there would be no problem whatsoever.

On the issue of a mandate, I don't recall issues such as having an anti-McDowell stance as being part of any of the campaigns so I don't think it's fair to say that things like the protest were justifiable on the grounds of a mandate.

If political matters were not a feature of the campaigns to elect representatives in the first place, how then can one justify having political matters be a feature of the Union?

As I say, I've no problem with people holding anti-McDowell views but if people hold these views and at the same time are members of a Union which claims to represent students as a whole, I fail to see how it can be seen as a positive.

Politics is a divisive part of life and if the Union seeks to represent students as a whole, surely they should leave the political stuff out of it?

AngelofFire

Giving an opinion is setting yourself up for an attack? Dear oh dear.

I agree 100 per cent with Zane. How about the union actually addresses things relevant to UCD?

Oh no not another ''the union does not do anything relevant to UCD'' thread, the term ''relevant to UCD'' is highly subjective and open to misinterpretation. UCDSU is a representative body of the students. There are issues other than education issues which affect the students whether they are issues on campus or issues in the wider world. Government policy affects students, clampdowns on civil liberties affects students, deportations affect students, there are former UCD students who have been deported. If you can point out an area of union policy which is not relevant to UCD students i will be happy to entertain it.

Mr.Nice Guy

AngelofFire wrote:

Oh no not another ''the union does not do anything relevant to UCD'' thread,

Yeah God forbid some of us actually air our opinions.:eek:

AngelofFire wrote:

There are issues other than education issues which affect the students whether they are issues on campus or issues in the wider world.

It should not be the job of the Student Union to try and save the world. They are there for the students as a whole. When they start taking on board political issues which split opinion straight down the middle, they stray from their primary objective - catering for the students as a whole.

Issues like the war in Iraq and Michael McDowell being at UCD are not relevant to students as a whole. I'd prefer the Union to stick to issues pertaining to UCD such as fees, modularisation etc. Staying neutral on political matters would be the best course of action.

Slash/ED

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

Staying neutral on political matters would be the best course of action.

Exactly. It's none of the SUs concern, they weren't elected to be political activists and try and make themselves look good by trying to save the world. Their focus should be entirely on the students, not on what some of their political opinions may or may not be. It shouldn't be part of it.

AngelofFire

It should not be the job of the Student Union to try and save the world. They are there for the students as a whole. When they start taking on board political issues which split opinion straight down the middle, they stray from their primary objective - catering for the students as a whole.

To be quite frank if the democratic mandate to take a stance on such issues is there than the union has every right to do so. If they union are there for the students as a whole then it is only right that they take a stance on issues that students support. I dont believe the argument that if the union takes a stance on issues like war or deportation it deviates from its role in representing students on education matters. From my experience UCDSU is by far the best at standing up for students on bread and butter issues like grants, fees and cutbacks. Whilst at the same time other unions who abstain from taking stances on national issues do very little to stand up for students on education and welfare issues.

Mr.Nice Guy

AngelofFire wrote:

To be quite frank if the democratic mandate to take a stance on such issues is there than the union has every right to do so.

But as I pointed out before, there was no overtly political stance taken at the time of the Student elections so the 'mandate' argument is spurious. I don't recall it being a feature of James Carroll's campaign. Furthermore, money from paying our fees automatically goes to the Union so how are they representative of people with political views like mine when they are adopting politcal principles which people like myself object to?

AngelofFire wrote:

If they union are there for the students as a whole then it is only right that they take a stance on issues that students support.

Eh? Students as a whole do not support their political beliefs. That is the whole point! They are taking a stance on issues that only some students support.

AngelofFire wrote:

I dont believe the argument that if the union takes a stance on issues like war or deportation it deviates from its role in representing students on education matters.

Interesting seeing as your first contribution on this thread was to say:

AngelofFire wrote:

Oh no not another ''the union does not do anything relevant to UCD'' thread

I'm interested to know whether or not you accept the point that I and Slash/Ed have been making on this thread that by the Union taking a stance on issues like war and deportation, they create a split amongst students as a whole...

AngelofFire wrote:

From my experience UCDSU is by far the best at standing up for students on bread and butter issues like grants, fees and cutbacks. Whilst at the same time other unions who abstain from taking stances on national issues do very little to stand up for students on education and welfare issues.

What does that mean? Are you actually implying that by the Union taking stances on national issues, this improves their chances of standing up for students on education and welfare issues? I don't see the logic in that at all.

pretty*monster

Mr. Nice Guy, you seem to be suggesting, by your constant refrence top the student body 'as a whole', that the union should not take any action that any individual student does not suppost. I'm sure you've heard that you can't please all of the people all of the time.

I'm sure many of us would be utterly disgusted to see such a potentially powerful force as the union take no action of political issues.

If you don't like it, vote for someone else, complain to your class rep, etc, etc.

Mr.Nice Guy

pretty*monster wrote:

Mr. Nice Guy, you seem to be suggesting, by your constant refrence top the student body 'as a whole', that the union should not take any action that any individual student does not suppost. I'm sure you've heard that you can't please all of the people all of the time.

What I and Slash/Ed and others have been suggesting (and it's a pretty basic concept to grasp) is that the Union should stay neutral on political matters which are likely to prove divisive to students. Yes I have heard the saying you can't please all of the people all of the time but considering that ALL students have contributed towards the Union, I think they ought to do their best to please students as a whole.

pretty*monster wrote:

I'm sure many of us would be utterly disgusted to see such a potentially powerful force as the union take no action of political issues.

You would be 'disgusted' at the Union taking a neutral stance on poltiical issues? Why? They're primarily there for the students. As for their power, a few students telling McDowell he's not welcome is not power.

pretty*monster wrote:

If you don't like it, vote for someone else, complain to your class rep, etc, etc.

If I don't like it I'll air my views just like I am doing now.

Sangre

Students vote on a bunch of people who they think are the best for their respective titles. The majority of the elected turnout to be of a certain political persuasion e.g. lefty. They all notice that they're lefties...wow...the student body must WANT a lefty movement! Let us fight for the lefty cause because we represent the STUDENT BODY and they VOTED for us!!


Yeah, I voted for you to stop fees increasing not to fúcking further your political career or spew your liberal bull**** to the student body masses.
Now do your fúcking job and leave everything else alone because it has nothing to do with UCD or us AT ALL!!

God I hate them so much....

AGHAGHAHGAHG!!!!!!


(lefty/liberal was an EXAMPLE)

Slash/ED

pretty*monster wrote:

Mr. Nice Guy, you seem to be suggesting, by your constant refrence top the student body 'as a whole', that the union should not take any action that any individual student does not suppost. I'm sure you've heard that you can't please all of the people all of the time.

Then stop trying on issues that have nothing to do with the students. It's not your feckin' job to try and further your political careers and look good by trying to save the world, it's your job completley and soley to look after the students and their interests as students and nothing more.

Pythia

The Commie SU types are never gonna concede a thing. So there's no point arguing really...

Jonny Arson

In agreement with Mr. Nice Guy, Slash/ED and Sangre, I also strongly disagree with the political aspect of the UCD Students Union.

Yes there will always be a political aspect to any Students Union in terms of campaigning to the the Government about fees, funding etc. but I do feel that this is exploited by many union members in order to fuel their personal political agendas.

Politics in the Student Union should only relate to student or educational issues not issues like the Rossport Five which completely has no relevance to the education system of our college.

Yes the Student Union has every right to put up what they like on their site but this should only happen when it has relevance to us the eveyday average student. I'm all for free speech but only when it's relevant and topics like the Rossport Five have no place in the Union end of.

We all know the union has a ''hack culture image'' which IMO is exaggerated to a degree but non-UCD politcal agendas will only make this image worse.
The Union I feel is distancing itself from the normal student due to their politcal agendas and political division.

The Union should be about us the students and nothing else.

Mr.Nice Guy

Well said ^. Actually if someone ran for election and promised to stay neutral on political matters, they'd get my vote and I imagine the vote of quite alot of people.

panda100

AngelofFire wrote:

From my experience UCDSU is by far the best at standing up for students on bread and butter issues like grants, fees and cutbacks. Whilst at the same time other unions who abstain from taking stances on national issues do very little to stand up for students on education and welfare issues.

Have to agree with you here.Before paul dillion and the leftys took over the union did little to really help the plight of students.I do think dan and Jane were fully in their rights to attend that protest as the deportations instructed by minister mc dowell did affect a small minority of students in UCD.I think them protesting shows they have compassion for students no matter how small the minority.

Jonny Arson

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

Well said ^. Actually if someone ran for election and promised to stay neutral on political matters, they'd get my vote and I imagine the vote of quite alot of people.

Exactly. There shouldn't be any obvious ''I'm a lefty'' and ''I'm a righty'' portrayed amongst anyone involved the Union. This isn't the Dail. I would have loved to have been involved in the Students Union in some capacity over the last year and a quarter in order to improve our education and to make a our college a better place but I came to the decision that I wouldn't as I'm not an overly political person and any political views or opinions I do have swing between left and right. The Union sends a signal to students that to get involved you need to have a political affiliation and msut be strongly politically minded and I'm not one of those people since I have no political affiliation and my political views are a result of my individual opinions and are not dictated by an affiliation.

Syth

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

Well said ^. Actually if someone ran for election and promised to stay neutral on political matters, they'd get my vote and I imagine the vote of quite alot of people.

It would be funny to see a candidate satirise all the political rubbish that goes one.

rainbow kirby

I want to run a banana for SU president

panda100

Well stranger things have happened-gaymus O'Monaigh as welfare officer anyone?

irlrobins

A banana would prob get more people to vote at least...

pretty*monster

Were you lads asleep last march? Paddy Carroll ran for president on a pretty much non-political platform.

panda100

Yeah but theres a difference betwwen running with no political agenda and having absolutley no agenda at all!He hadnt any experience with any societys,being class rep or with the union.The only experience he thought he had was being a rugby referee?!People would vote for someone who is apoltical but they have to have some experience or at least knowledge of what being student union president entails.