8 killed on the roads

BrianD3

Anyone who has seen the news will know that 8 people were killed in road crashes this weekend. 6 died in two crashes in Donegal. In all the coverage of the crashes I didn't hear one mention of whether the victims wearing their seatbelts or not . Just looking at the wreckage of the Donegal crashes I would be amazed if everyone killed was wearing their seatbelts. I wouldn't be surprised if at least 3 of the 6 were unbelted. IMO facts about seatbelt wearing need to be brought out in the open. Instead the RTE coverage consists of local people and the parish priest talking about how much of a tragedy it is (which it is) Anyone agree that there should be mention of seatbelt wearing in the coverage. Or would it be counterproductive (as some people watching would then think that they're safe as houses as long as they wear their seatbelt)

IME almost no-one in this country puts on their seatbelt in the rear seat of a car. Obviously the numerous TV ads about seatbelts are having little effect on attitudes.

Squirrel

I think they should include whether a seat-belt is worn or not, that's only my opinion though.

BrianD3 wrote:

IME almost no-one in this country puts on their seatbelt in the rear seat of a car.

When I was younger people started trying to bully me because I wore a seat-belt in my car, one of the most surreal experiences I can assure you, but that changed when I was in a car crash that could have killed me had I not been wearing a seat-belt

cormie

It's funny, I see far more people putting their seatbelts on after coming out of a parking space rather than before starting their engine I'm happy to say 90% of the people I take in my car will put their seat belt on without me having to say "they say the one without the seatbelt did the damage"... A spanish guy I had in my car said he never wears it at home :eek:

mike65

The road death stats for Donegal are appalling, they must be the worst per capita by a country mile. Call me an old fogey but is it incidental that the dead were all young and on the road at 3.30 am?

Mike.

cormie

Squirrel wrote:

When I was younger people started trying to bully me because I wore a seat-belt in my car

What???.... Wha??? ....... WHAT??? Who the hell were these "people" ??

daveirl

This post has been deleted.

Alun

Not only that, they should also mention if alcohol (or indeed drugs) was involved, if the car was in an un-roadworthy condition and possibly a whole load of other things. The problem with mentioning such things is possibly primarily a legal one though. I too get a bit tired of the whole "they were a pillar of the community", "everybody loved them" and "they had their whole life ahead of them" stuff ever time something like this happens. Whilst it is undeniably tragedy, what is more of a tragedy is that these kind of "3 in the morning, no other car involved" accidents never seem to get the real attention they deserve other than the standard sentimental stuff trotted out on the news.

copacetic

when i heard about the crashes, I started wondering why we don't hear more about the outcomes of the investigations. Are these published but not really reported?

Take for instance this one, who was at fault? Was it speeding, bad road design, poor surface.
Why did so many die, was it a car that is known for not faring well in accidents?

Not looking for people to be blamed, but if more people know that whys about these types of accidents surely we would all be better off?

the_syco

Full license, or "L" drivers, who sent off for their license (no different from getting a toy from Kellogs for two tokens and €2 for P&P, tbh)? Many young people die, and I wonder how many of them knew how to drive?

BrianD3

Alun wrote:

Not only that, they should also mention if alcohol (or indeed drugs) was involved, if the car was in an un-roadworthy condition and possibly a whole load of other things. The problem with mentioning such things is possibly primarily a legal one though. I too get a bit tired of the whole "they were a pillar of the community", "everybody loved them" and "they had their whole life ahead of them" stuff ever time something like this happens. Whilst it is[/a] undeniably tragedy, what is more of a tragedy is that these kind of "3 in the morning, no other car involved" accidents never seem to get the real attention they deserve other than the standard sentimental stuff trotted out on the news.

I would also like to see information such as alcohol, roadworthiness, speeding etc. brought out in the open. However this would not really be possible immediately after the accident as it would require accident investigation, coroners reports, engineer reports etc. It would take a while to get all this together by which time the general public has lost interest eg very few pay attention to accident investigation reports on accdents that happend a year ago.

Whereas with seatbelts it is pretty easy for the gardai or rescue services to see from a glance whether the victims were wearing seatbelts or not. This could then be disclosed to the media who would report it immediately and it would have more impact IMO

impr0v

Making detailed information, such as the involvement of alcohol, etc., public might also have a predjudicial effect on any criminal trial that could arise from the crash.

cormie

I read there was a 6 year old (around that age anyway) in critical condition from one of the crashes. This makes it doubtful that it was some young chap trying to impress his friends at 3am. Unusual time for a 6 year old to be in a car. I may be mixing up different stories here by the way

Lafortezza

mike65 wrote:

The road death stats for Donegal are appalling, they must be the worst per capita by a country mile. Call me an old fogey but is it incidental that the dead were all young and on the road at 3.30 am?

Mike.

I'm living in Carndonagh in Donegal and every weekend night is the same. The number of guys (mostly) under the age of 25 with modified cars, Imprezas, GT Turbos, Evos is waaay higher than in Dublin. And because there is no police prescence on the Donegal roads they drive over the limit constantly. I drive over the limit too, since the roads are generally empty.

I've nothing against modifying cars as a hobby. A good mate of mine did up a Civic but was copped on enough not to drive like a loon. But it's rife up here and every friday and saturday night from about 8pm until 5am you'll hear high powered engines roaring up and down the roads. Impressing their mates, girlfriends each other.

I'm not surprised that it's Donegal that has a much higher proportion of car-related fatalities like those this weekend. The attitudes towards driving are really dreadful. The bad side of me pops up every now and then to say it's a crude form of natural selection.

Squirrel

cormie wrote:

What???.... Wha??? ....... WHAT??? Who the hell were these "people" ??

Yeah I know, it was one of the weirdest things ever, especially because they brought it up constantly. Good thing I already had the terrible habit of not giving a **** at that age.

CJhaughey

Looking at the footage of the crash site, there wasn't very much left of the 306.
It was really badly damaged.

Silvera

It's a sad reflection on our govt that they can spend/waste (!!) €150 million on a computer system while the National Safety Council and Garda Siochana/Traffic Corps remain under-resourced :mad:

Also, has there ever been a one-hour programme on RTE (our 'public service' broadcaster!) re road safety ???
Not that I recall !!

It was such a one-hour programme on BBC (ITV?) some years ago that made me wear my seat belt EVERY time I get into a car.

RIP to those crash victims.

MrJoeSoap

A Peugot 306 crashes at 3.30am, with five young people (two female, three male) inside. To be honest, I'm going to jump to a conclusion here and say the only person I sympathise with is the guy they hit.

1

BrianD3 wrote:

I would also like to see information such as alcohol, roadworthiness, speeding etc. brought out in the open. However this would not really be possible immediately after the accident as it would require accident investigation, coroners reports, engineer reports etc. It would take a while to get all this together by which time the general public has lost interest eg very few pay attention to accident investigation reports on accdents that happend a year ago.

Whereas with seatbelts it is pretty easy for the gardai or rescue services to see from a glance whether the victims were wearing seatbelts or not. This could then be disclosed to the media who would report it immediately and it would have more impact IMO

I agree in some ways. I'd like to know what the factors were. Maybe not now after the crash or a crash but at some time. Was it the road? Was it the time of night? or was the driver half drugged/pissed or just decided to over take on a corner?

With all respect to the families I recall an incident where two young fellas were killed and it was quite the tradgedy. But it was only locally known they decided to over take a tanker. din't have the speed/time and hit an on coming car

Both killed.

There are too many crashes and no reasons.

RicardoSmith

lafortezza wrote:

...t 8pm until 5am you'll hear high powered engines roaring up and down the roads.....

No different in Dublin. If you put a speed camera in our estate you catch about 10-20 every night doing 70-80mph through the estate. But no, they have speed cameras on the dual carraige ways, and other big roads around checking tax and what not. Of course the cops still haven't done anything about the untaxed, un NCT'ed car sitting on our road for two weeks. :rolleyes:

Dizzyblabla

MrJoeSoap wrote:

A Peugot 306 crashes at 3.30am, with five young people (two female, three male) inside. To be honest, I'm going to jump to a conclusion here and say the only person I sympathise with is the guy they hit.

Who's to say that it's not the driver of the other car that hit them??

The people were in their twenties, not all that young, and I'm sure had more cop on that you think they had. It's still a terrible accident and an awful loss of life, what ever the cause of the crash.

5500

cormie wrote:

It's funny, I see far more people putting their seatbelts on after coming out of a parking space rather than before starting their engine

Id normally do this when reversing from a car space,it gives you a better view when you cant judge by mirrors or trying to look over your shoulder,it was also drilled into my head for the driving test so that could be a reason why.

junkyard

Firstly, I think the speed limits are unrealistic, the're too low! In my opinion the limits are that way as an excuse for poorly maintained and badly designed roads. Secondly I think that any major accident is caused by excessive speed, inexperienced drivers and cars with modified engines, but no modifacations to brakes and suspensions. I think that seatbelts have the're limitations too, in the event of a major accident I don't think they save anyone, if anything they trap you in the car and this is a major problem if the car catches fire.

MrJoeSoap

Dizzyblabla wrote:

Who's to say that it's not the driver of the other car that hit them??

I'm willing to bet you a hell of a lot of money it was their fault. I'm just guessing and speculating, obviously I don't know more than most other people. Just going on what I've heard and the country we live in today.

Watch this and tell me who you think was to blame.

Dizzyblabla wrote:

The people were in their twenties, not all that young

Early twenties, the same age as most of the "boy-racers" in this country.

cormie

MrJoeSoap wrote:

Watch this and tell me who you think was to blame.

Does anyone know the speed limit for that particular stretch of road the crash took place on? That Puegeot looks like it was doing at least 110km by the state of it.

MrJoeSoap

From one of the views it looks like the road had a serious dip and bend, so I would seriously doubt if it was even 80kph.

Our man in Havana

I see they took the other guy out of the jurisdiction for treatment. Not a good move as they will need to extradite him back if charges are brought.

Capt'n Midnight

impr0v wrote:

Making detailed information, such as the involvement of alcohol, etc., public might also have a predjudicial effect on any criminal trial that could arise from the crash.

Simply release the info after the court case / inquest. I hate the way there is exactly the same amount of news every day. So on slow news days you could do that so people could know how the story ended, because far too much news today is about how the story starts. There are enough deaths every year to do a series on it, maybe naming and shaming might help.

Eye

Cormie, with regards to the little girl, you are correct, in the accident just outside clonmel the driver of the car had her 8 year old sister in the car with her at the time of the accident, and i believe it was the passenger that was killed.

The driver of the car is know in the area for speeding around in the car with her younger sister, have met her several times on around town doing such, her toyato celica is for all intense purposes a little "girl racer" car, with her loud exhaust, stickers etc... it was only a matter of time before something like this happened.

The stretch of road between clonmel and kilsheelan was closed off from the time of the accident around 10:30 or so on the friday night until sometime well into the afternoon on saturday, i got divereted going too work that morning. having seen the pictures on the news and looking at the paint markings left on the road by the cops i can only assume speeding was a "Major" factor in that incident, there were some rather long skid marks on the road there and from the markings on the road the two cars involved ended up quiet some distance from each other and in a very bad state. Aparrantly (from what i've heard) the cars were so badly messed up that nobody even knew that the 8 year old girl was in the car for some time until she started crying.

Lots of stories flying around here in the small town where they are from, the most frequent one i've heard seems to be that she may have been street racing, dunno if that's true or not, it would sorta fit her profile alright and that particular stretch of road would indeed be the sort of place i could see something like that happening.

Whatever the cause of that particular accident, it is indeed tragic that a young girl lost her life and that the 8 year old girl is such bad shape after it.

With regards to the media coverage and the whole seatbelt wearing topic. Personally i think that as much detail as possible about each accident should be released, it is only then that people will begin to realise the severity of the small things like seatbelts that people go without on a daily basis and realise how much impact they can have on the outcome of such and accident.
Also i'd like to see the cars looked at in more detail, how many are caused by little boy racers flying around in there little starlets with stupid exhaust or mitsubishi lancers with a light aircraft wing attached to the back of it?
I could be wrong but the accident in donegal today/lastnight where 1 young man was killed, that car when i saw it on the news just screamed boy racer to me :-\

RicardoSmith

junkyard wrote:

...I think that seatbelts have the're limitations too, in the event of a major accident I don't think they save anyone, if anything they trap you in the car and this is a major problem if the car catches fire.

..... and your mad theory is based on what exactly?

celica140bhp

In my opinion, as soon as you sit in a car, even if it's not turned on, you should put on your seatbelt.

Our man in Havana

I dunno if it would help.

I was personally involved in a case where a lorry, ran over the top of 2 people and killed them. At the inquest it was revealed that the lorry had no brakes and had failed the MOT. The tacograph revealed that the lorry was speeding at the time of the collision and for some time previously.

No charges were brought against the driver who was allowed to escape back to norn iron. Made me mad! :mad:

MrJoeSoap

I could be wrong but the accident in donegal today/lastnight where 1 young man was killed, that car when i saw it on the news just screamed boy racer to me

Not the greatest image ever but I'm inclined to agree.

69 mustang

If Government really cared about the loss of life on the roads speed traps would be on back roads. With our grey weather and lack of good roads lights should be fixed on dips at all times [not like cars you see at dawn with maybe 5watt side lights on ] as most of our road deaths are head on usually over taking miss judged.
As 2cars traveling at 40KPH meeting head on is the same as hitting a wall as 80kph.

RicardoSmith

True. There make a show and dance about it, but they take little real action.

Capt'n Midnight

junkyard wrote:

Firstly, I think the speed limits are unrealistic, the're too low! In my opinion the limits are that way as an excuse for poorly maintained and badly designed roads. Secondly I think that any major accident is caused by excessive speed, inexperienced drivers and cars with modified engines, but no modifacations to brakes and suspensions. I think that seatbelts have the're limitations too, in the event of a major accident I don't think they save anyone, if anything they trap you in the car and this is a major problem if the car catches fire.

Holy crap, I didn't think anyone still believed that jibberish.

Speed limits too low
99% of drivers break the 30mph limit in some areas, it's a fact of life that too many drive above a safe speed considering their capabilites and the conditions - changing the legal limit won't change the behaviour of the worst offenders unless the law is enforced.


causes of crashes
Read your own post - you say that you think that excessive speed is a contributory factor in accidents just after saying you want the limits upped !

400 people a year die on our roads, not to mention the number of other incidents where cars are written off. Basic forensics like looking at skid marks and the car itself would have figured out that by now and made it highly illegal and the insurance companies would have premiums to match on modded cars.

seat belts]/b]
Lobby groups might complain about seat belts but I defy you to find a similar attitude amongst the people who pick up the pieces. If you find any government site or independent national road safety organisation or the AA or RAC suggesting that seat belts don't save lives please feel free to post.

If a car catches fire - then a non wearer if they haven't banged thier head and rendered them selves unconcious or injured themselves or got jammed down in the seat well might get out 1-2 seconds faster than someone wearing a seat belt, as long as the car hasn't rolled.

As for Airbags - they are designed to be used WITH seatbelts, not as a replacement for them. In fact if you arent properly seated when it goes off there is a small chance it will do more harm than good. - perhaps wire the airbag to only go off if the seat belt is fastened. Oh yeah air bags take longer to deflate than it takes to take off a seat belt - so I wouldn't worry about the fire.

Oh yeah have you ever been to a junkyard or seen many crashed cars ?
Strangely enough for those used to watching US cop shows, most of them aren't burnt out. Most of the burnt out cars you see were probably set alight by joyriders / thieves. - so the chances of being in a burning car are very slim, so slim that car fire extinguishers tell you to put them in the boot not in the passenger area.

pontovic

Who here thinks that having a speed limit of 100km/h on small country roads is absolutely crazy ?? I do for one. I think that 60km/h should be the max on the smaller country roads. I was driving up in Donegal recently, around Glenties and Ardara, and if I matched the speed limit there I would have killed myself !!

Alun

pontovic wrote:

Who here thinks that having a speed limit of 100km/h on small country roads is absolutely crazy ?? I do for one. I think that 60km/h should be the max on the smaller country roads. I was driving up in Donegal recently, around Glenties and Ardara, and if I matched the speed limit there I would have killed myself !!

Depends on what you mean by "small country road", but in case you hadn't noticed all "R" roads are now 80km/h, effectively by default, although it is within the powers of local councils to set lower, or even higher, limits where they see fit (not that they do, mind you).

Anyway, remember that it's a maximum speed, not a target to be attained, and there may well be sections of the road where it's perfectly safe to drive at (or in many cases, even above) the limit and others where even half that would be suicidal. That's what the large lump of grey matter in between your ears is for.

Hagar

There will be thread exactly like this next Monday and the Monday after that...

Ann Elk

I know that it's not a catch-all solution, but I really believe that if the Government were to take the step of banning modifications that it would definately have a positive affect on the road-deaths toll. Week after week I see the wreckage of modified cars in the papers - it can't be all coincidence surely? Now, I'm not naive enough to think that this measure would solve the problem, but I do think that if you take a 1ltr Corsa, designed for town driving at reasonable speeds, attach a performance exhaust, a set of wheels too wide for the arches, a dump valve, lowered suspension etc you upset the fundamental dynamics of the car and make it an accident waiting to happen.

Generally speaking, cars are modified for one reason only - so that they can be driven faster - this alone should be enough for the government to find reasonable grounds for banning them.

seamus

Capt'n Midnight wrote:

Oh yeah have you ever been to a junkyard or seen many crashed cars ?
Strangely enough for those used to watching US cop shows, most of them aren't burnt out. Most of the burnt out cars you see were probably set alight by joyriders / thieves. - so the chances of being in a burning car are very slim, so slim that car fire extinguishers tell you to put them in the boot not in the passenger area.

Aye. Just over 10 years ago, I was in a crash with my parents and one of my brothers. The car had just done 70 miles at 60mph, and it was a fairly hard collision - 30mph+. The car eventually went on fire, but we would have had up to ten minutes to get out of the vehicle before being overcome. Cars don't spontaneously burst into flame, without some very specific circumstances. In our case, the crash had burst a fuel line, which begin pouring petrol onto the superhot engine block. And it still took ages to go up.

I know that it's not a catch-all solution, but I really believe that if the Government were to take the step of banning modifications that it would definately have a positive affect on the road-deaths toll. Week after week I see the wreckage of modified cars in the papers - it can't be all coincidence surely? Now, I'm not naive enough to think that this measure would solve the problem, but I do think that if you take a 1ltr Corsa, designed for town driving at reasonable speeds, attach a performance exhaust, a set of wheels too wide for the arches, a dump valve, lowered suspension etc you upset the fundamental dynamics of the car and make it an accident waiting to happen.

Generally speaking, cars are modified for one reason only - so that they can be driven faster - this alone should be enough for the government to find reasonable grounds for banning them.

I have to disagree. If you get into the realm of banning modified vehicles, then you have to ban all vehicles over a certain HP. After all, a man would only buy a Porsche becaue it goes fast, right?

Once again, it all boils down to enforcement. We see in the photos that the crash where no other vehicle was involved, was driving on a UK reg. Surprise, surprise. If the Gardai clamped down, and forced all modified vehicles and UK regs to produce insurance, tax and licence at a station when stopped, you'd weed out a lot of the scumbags.

BrianD3

I was actually thinking last night when I wrote the post that there'll probably be a "garda crackdown" on the roads for the next week in response to the deaths. Sure enough, on the N4 Mullingar bypass this morning there were two speed checks - one on each side of the dual carrigeway. Also an unmarked car waiting in the hard shoulder a couple of miles away on single carriageway section. Not sure if he was involved in the speed checks. But I have never seen this amount of cops on a short section of road at the one time.

Will they be out in force at 3 am next friday and saturday night? I doubt it. Far easier to use resources to catch a few commuters going 5 km/h over the speed limit on a monday morning :rolleyes:

Going back to the crashes in Donegal, in the Civic one the back seat passenger died. The passenger compartment of the car is reasonably intact. It is pretty safe to assume that he wasn't wearing his seatbelt. It is also safe to assume that there was speeding and/or drink and/or bravado involved. As for the other crash where 5 died, the Peugeot is very badly damaged. You would expect the driver to die and the front passenger to die or be badly injured in a crash like that even if they had their seatbelts on. But you would expect at least some of the back seat passengers to survive had they all been wearing belts.

Rodney Trotter

8 people dead and not one SUV involved?

At least 3 cars which crashed did not adequately protect their occupants.


And, to the idiot who bemoned the fact that the driver of the Mazda Premacy was "taken out of the juristiction" to hospital obviously does not know the geography of Denogal and the fact that Aughnagelvin (sp?) Hospital, in Derry, is the closest A&E to the crash scene and is symptomatic of the cross-border co-operation whuich exists at all times for all emergency services for accidents on both sides of the border.

5500

Ann Elk wrote:

I know that it's not a catch-all solution, but I really believe that if the Government were to take the step of banning modifications that it would definately have a positive affect on the road-deaths toll. Week after week I see the wreckage of modified cars in the papers - it can't be all coincidence surely? Now, I'm not naive enough to think that this measure would solve the problem, but I do think that if you take a 1ltr Corsa, designed for town driving at reasonable speeds, attach a performance exhaust, a set of wheels too wide for the arches, a dump valve, lowered suspension etc you upset the fundamental dynamics of the car and make it an accident waiting to happen.

Generally speaking, cars are modified for one reason only - so that they can be driven faster - this alone should be enough for the government to find reasonable grounds for banning them.

Are yor for real?i can honestly say ive not once seen a modified car totaled or left in a ditch from an accident.Sure neither of the cars involved in the accident were modified!

As soon as speeding comes into the equation its automatically presumed its a "boy racer" or modifed car.People always seem quick to forget that drink and drugs may have been a major factor in the crash but instead they jump to the boy racer conclusion.

I dunno where your going either with cars are modified for one reason - to be driven faster,if i was you id do some research on modified cars because apart from you not being able to fit a dump valve to a corsa there of no performance gain anyways.

Our man in Havana

Rodney Trotter wrote:

8 people dead and not one SUV involved?

At least 3 cars which crashed did not adequately protect their occupants.


And, to the idiot who bemoned the fact that the driver of the Mazda Premacy was "taken out of the juristiction" to hospital obviously does not know the geography of Denogal and the fact that Aughnagelvin (sp?) Hospital, in Derry, is the closest A&E to the crash scene and is symptomatic of the cross-border co-operation whuich exists at all times for all emergency services for accidents on both sides of the border.

If he is at fault try getting him back to stand trial. Fat chance he would surrender himself.

Interceptor

Ann Elk wrote:

I know that it's not a catch-all solution, but I really believe that if the Government were to take the step of banning modifications that it would definately have a positive affect on the road-deaths toll. Week after week I see the wreckage of modified cars in the papers - it can't be all coincidence surely? Now, I'm not naive enough to think that this measure would solve the problem, but I do think that if you take a 1ltr Corsa, designed for town driving at reasonable speeds, attach a performance exhaust, a set of wheels too wide for the arches, a dump valve, lowered suspension etc you upset the fundamental dynamics of the car and make it an accident waiting to happen.

Generally speaking, cars are modified for one reason only - so that they can be driven faster - this alone should be enough for the government to find reasonable grounds for banning them.

Go back to Communist Russia where you belong. There are three breakers yards in Galway and if you take five minutes to look around any of them you will see that 99% of the crashed cars are normal, bog-standard cars. If your mind was any more narrow you would be called wafer-head. Do you know that Merc and BMW (and others) are forced by the German govt to limit their cars to 155mph? Why do cars imported to Ireland need to go this quickly? What happens if a speeding car hits your econobox Kia at high speed? You die, modified or not.

It is bad enough having to wear a shirt and tie to work without having to take the stickers off my car.

impr0v

If the modification embargo doesn't work, we can then experiment with mandatory oestrogen pills for all male drivers or, failing that, chemical castration.

Kersh

I have to say, the pictures in the paper of those 2 cars scared me. I dont know why they crashed , or who was at fault, but putting those pics in a tv ad, would definitely slow down most people.
Thankfully, im involved in motorsport, and Im an instructor at mondello, so I dont have any 'need' (for want of a better word) to speed everywhere, but I do see alot of idiots on the roads, who feel the need to show off their cars etc, and all the accidents happen when they come to a corner, cos as we all know, its easy to be quick in a straight line, different story when it comes to corners.
In my opinion, garda speed checks will not stop accidents like that one. These speed checks catch random ppl going over the limit on 2 lane roads usually, and are only a deterrent if the driver cares about points on his licence more than he cares about impressing the ladies. Also, I have never seen a speed check on an R road, ever, not that i think one would have prevented that accident, nor will it stop the one next weekend.

Big Nelly

Was on the news about 6 months to a year ago now how the Garda checked car engines to see if they where the same engine as the person had insured up in Donegal....over 2 days at a weekend they caught over 20 people with bigger engines in there cars than they had made out on there insurance information.....Donegal is a disaster.....has been known for years that they "soup" up there cars or go to the North and get engine doen up or have larger engines.....every weekend at this stage there is an accident up there!!!

I myself was there a few months back....just going thru on way to Islands for weekend.....road where empty and there was about 5 of us in a cru cab.....no real sign posts to tell us speed limits but we kept going at normal speed....anyway coming into this town came around the cornor to be faced by 2 cars coming down the road racing each other.......we pulled in and althou one of them pulled back abit only we pulled in off road there was no slowing them down......roared on down the road and around the cornor with the other bloke after moving back out onto the other lane.....if anyone came around cornor then it would have been another head on collision....and then we would listen to RTE news where mammy is going on about poor wee Jonny and how great a driver he was and so on......s***h**ds!!! again everyone blames the Garda....why should we??? why not blame the gobs**ts flying up and down the road thinking they are Mikey Schumacher.....if it was me and they where doing it outside my house....would go and buy one of those stinger things the cops have.......see them coming....fling it out....20-30 yards down the road and 4 flat tyres........or instead of complaining about the Garda trying to manage every back road here there and everywhere....why not ring them and tell them exactly where and who is driving like a nut case.....

At home in Cavan there was 2-3 fellow that left school and where working....so of course they all buy car....put stupid exchaust on them and start to roar up and down the road everyday trying to see who was fastest.....like one day at shop and asked one of them to move car so I could get to pumps.....even thou he didnt have to move 10 yards....sat in car while he revved the **** out of it and then a big skid to take off.....anyway about 2 weeks after this started to happen....someone(not me) had told the Garda so they where on the road and caught them 2-3 times each....not sure what happened but they stopped for a while......4-5 months later same crack started again.......so father went up to little jonnies father and told him to cop the f**k on or he would be reported....end of that.....simple people!!!

Anyway those who said a seat belt is useless are also s***h**ds in my opinion!! not attacking anyone here or any personal attacks but the amount of people I have seen all around the country that never wear seat belts is gas and so stupid........seat belts are proven to save lives.....my cousin when he was 18 was out driving and clipped a kurb.....threw the car around and he went side ways into a wall...hit on passangers side....had no seat belt on so was flung from drivers side over to smash his head off roof on passanger side.....if he was wearing a seat belt would be here today....you go and look at the imprint of someone's head in a car roof and then say seat belts are no good!!!!!

blastman

I think we should avoid getting too wrapped up in the fact that 8 people were killed in one weekend, as tragic as that statistic is. There will always be freak occurences where accidents happen in close proximity and the hand-wringing begins in earnest. This doesn't happen every weekend (thankfully) so while we should continue to try to make the roads as safe as possible, we shouldn't let hysteria cloud the issue.

As an aside, I was travelling to work this morning on my usual route and was on a well-tarmaced section R road. However, as I went round a bend at about 70km/h, I nearly went straight into the ditch as loose chippings had been put on the road yet there was no sign in advance warning that they were there. Things like that don't encourage your faith in authorities' seriousness about road safety.

Ann Elk

Seamus - I think that the possible top speed of a car is not an issue if the car is designed and engineered with those speeds in mind. This is the case with the Porsche and certainly not the case with many of the modified cars.

Eireal - A few points

Firstly, you and I must read different newspapers. I also work for a major car insurer and am well aware of the incidences of accidents involving modified cars (the majority of which are not disclosed by the way).

Secondly, if Im not mistaken, the 306 involved had a set of alloys which I'm pretty sure are non-standard.

Thirdly, I'm not referring solely to this particular accident. I'm well aware of the exent of the problem posed to road safety by drink/drug driving, likewise for driving when over tired, the terrible state of some of our roads etc., etc. But I ask you one question - if it really is the case that drivers of modified cars don't regularly drive in an unsafe fashion - why the reputation. Personally, and without exaggeration the majority of such cars I see are driven in a fashion which contravenes some of the rules of the road.

Finally, with regards the performance aspect - I admit that my mechanical knowledge when it comes to certain modifications sn't top notch - I'm neither a mechanic nor an avid modifier but I do possess a modicum of common sense and I know that dump valves weren't designed or fitted because they make a 'pretty sound'.

Whether or not they can be fitted to a Corsa is immaterial for the point of the argument - swap it for a Focus if it makes you feel better.

NOx kits do imrove performance.
Uprated air filters do the same.
So do superchips.
So do performance exhausts.
Urated brakes allow the driver to maintain higher speeds for longer before they have to brake.
Lowered suspension aids cornering at hih speeds.
Larger alloys do likewise.

Now don't try to tell me that these modifications are done without performance enhancement in mind because won't belive you.

By the way, I'm not talking about purely cosmetic modifications such as (certain types of) bodykits, and aloys which are the same dimensions as the manufacturers originals. It's where the performance is boosted that presents the problem.

magpie

Once again proof positive of the facts:

1) The vast majority of road deaths occur on single lane rural roads
2) The vast majority of road deaths occur between 9 pm and 4 am

What do the government do?

1) Put more concealed speed traps / cameras on dual carriageways in urban locations during rush hour to increase revenues
2) Ramp up their advertising campaign shifting blame for the carnage onto individual drivers rather than face up to their responsibility to improve roads and police them efficiently