Why cant English people say 'Doherty'

Newshound

Was watching a documentry on Kate Moss tonight and it strikes me everytime i hear an English person saying 'Doherty' that they say 'Dokerty' or 'Doe-erty'.

Its not just several English people that say it like this, its actually ALL of them.
Unbelievable.

*MmmPie*

I know, that really irritates me. Especially the ones who pronounce is as 'Dog-er-ty'.

kensutz

I know it all too well from first hand experience being over in Norwich every week and having Gary Doherty play for us. I had to tell the lads how to pronounce his name properly because they call him Doc-herty. Also thats why he's called the Doc too.

Ray777

When it comes to pronouncing anything vaguely Irish-sounding, most English people are idiots. Never watch an Ireland football match on Sky. They have no problem pronouncing 'Bixente Lizarazu', 'Filippo Inzaghi', even 'Andre Shevchenko'. Getting the cúnts to pronounce 'Mark Kinsella' though, is another story altogether. Ignorant ****.

Roddy23

also Cahill
they pronounce it Cay hill

Blackjack

Don't forget Gallagher, or more like Gall-a-gurr.

ctrl-alt-delete

Roddy23 wrote:

also Cahill
they pronounce it Cay hill

yeah that one wrecks my head, just thinking of it terms of martin cahill = martin cay hill - its like a posh gangster,

but it does not surprise me anyway, the english seem(as in my opinion) to be crap at everything they invented...

english
football
cricket(wow the ashes - beat 1 team)
world domination.

the list is endless

RefulgentGnomon

Yeah, watching snooker, it really pi55es me of with Ken Doe-herty about to take a shot. Although Tim Cahill's (the Everton player) name is pronounced Cay-hill...

whiskeyman

Newshound wrote:

Its not just several English people that say it like this, its actually ALL of them.
Unbelievable.

It is their language after all :rolleyes:


Perhaps it is us who cant pronounce it

dwayneburke

tis like the yanks trying to pronounce Donal....they ALL say Donald....just cant get there tongues arounf BTW i know its not my name but a friend of mine who went there on hols there a few years ago came back with the nick Donald and it stuck!!!

alleepally

And lets not forget the pronunciation of CJ Haughey as "Hockey" when he was King of Ireland.

But yes, I cannot fathom why they can't pronounce the names.

KTRIC

It's our way of rubbing it in that we're Irish and there's nothing they can do about it. I think it p!sses them off big time.

sceptre

It's likely because it's spelled very similarly to (or in the case of Gallagher, the same where it isn't 'Gallacher') as a name from far up north that they pronounce a wee bit differently to us there. So it's a problem of similarity and common practice. Slightly better excuse than leaving out the h in that well known footballer, Margaret TATcher in common use here.

One vote for "get over it in both countries for the love of something useful"

Flukey

Don't forget that the worst English in the world is spoken in England.

cregser

That Dokerty thing has annoyed me for a while now.

When I was on a sports trip to Leeds a few years ago we were hosted by families of the Leeds team. The family that hosted me had to request me specifically because they had so much trouble pronouncing the name of the guy originally selected to stay at their house, Oisín McGloughlan.

The grandad of the house kept saying things like: these are Corn Flakes, do you have them in Ireland? This is a motorway, do you have them in Ireland? Is Dublin in the north or the eh, south? (my answer: no the east).

Sparky

when you would ring up argos Ring and reserve, Dun Laoghaire was pronounced by the woman as Dun la-har.

The americans cant say Doherty either.

county

Ray777 wrote:

When it comes to pronouncing anything vaguely Irish-sounding, most English people are idiots. Never watch an Ireland football match on Sky. They have no problem pronouncing 'Bixente Lizarazu', 'Filippo Inzaghi', even 'Andre Shevchenko'. Getting the cúnts to pronounce 'Mark Kinsella' though, is another story altogether. Ignorant ****.

oh yes another anti-english thread,so in your post we english are idiots,***** and ignorant ****,your post is just full of bigotry

Laguna

Newshound wrote:

Was watching a documentry on Kate Moss tonight and it strikes me everytime i hear an English person saying 'Doherty' that they say 'Dokerty' or 'Doe-erty'.

Its not just several English people that say it like this, its actually ALL of them.
Unbelievable.

Go **** yourself, I'm English and I can pronounce Doherty. You're judging a nation of people on some jumped up cockney tart. Lets get truthful shall we?, why is it Irish people say "Ting" for thing, "Turty" for thirty, "Tremendoush" for tremendous?, need I go on?, oh I beg your pardon, I just made a sweeping statement about an entire nation, where did I see that before?

Well, you know what you can all do with the hatred of all things English surely?, vote Sinn Fein in at the next general election and watch them turn back the clock, changing all the road signs so they're in gaeilge, insisting that gaeilge is the first language. My, how happy you'll all instantly feel.

I do believe the phrase is "cead mile failte eg eireann ", it's direct translation may have changed in the last few years though

Endurance Man

Why cant the irish pronounce there H's?? :rolleyes:
Really silly post, there are loads of things the irish dont pronounce properly.

biko

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=280097

ziggy

This post has been deleted.

MorningStar

county wrote:

oh yes another anti-english thread,so in your post we english are idiots,***** and ignorant ****,your post is just full of bigotry

Hold on there, asking why English people mispronounce Irish names is a valid question. The BBC for example have department that deal with pronunciation and are unable to get the names right. Generally people take leads from such sources.
It has to be questioned why, what is meant to be a professional organisation that is meant to be neutral, is unable to name the neighbouring country and its leader. All through the 80s and even now news reporters have called Ireland "island". There will always be a degree of accent but this was/is more.
There is huge degree of ignorance about Ireland in England. They don't even know what to call the country, I have been asked a few times "Do I put down Southern Ireland or is it Eire". I can see why they would think either but they should know.
On the other side I hate ignorance and intentional stupidity such as "crips" instead of "crisps", "lurry" instead of "lorry", "axe" isntead of "ask" etc...
In saying that I have heard people of Irish decent misprononce their own names and in the US they misuse and misspell Sean! In Ireland we tend to pronounce the H in Thomas which is incorrect in the classical sense and Mexican people called Jesus how is that pronounced?

county

MorningStar wrote:

Hold on there, asking why English people mispronounce Irish names is a valid question. The BBC for example have department that deal with pronunciation and are unable to get the names right. Generally people take leads from such sources.


i have no problem with the OP but abusive comments like ray777 post i find highly offensive

englander

Slow day at the office/student union/playschool ?

Ha ha this thread ! Ok I'll take the bait...

Dont get me started on the many many things that 'YOUR LOT' say, that are very very different to the way the English words were intended to be used.

But some of us recognise differences in peoples dialect as interesting thing, not an annoyance.

What the hell are you doing watching 'DA BRIT' tv channels if you can't stand listening to British pronunciations of perceived Irish words ? Can I suggest spending more time watching the magnificent TG4 ?

If you choose to use another country's language and disregard your own, you should adopt that other country's language properly !

Perhaps you should all come across the water on English courses so you can get to grips with the English language a bit better ?

I've lived in Ireland for a number of years and have noticed a few irish-isms creeping into my language (you're grand, thanks a million etc..) but the day I say the word 'press' instead of 'cupboard' or 'messages' instead of 'shopping' I have asked my Irish spouse to shoot me

rubadub

david bowie (as in take a bow, ee)
bono (as in give a dog a bone, oo)

HelterSkelter

Ray777 wrote:

When it comes to pronouncing anything vaguely Irish-sounding, most English people are idiots. Never watch an Ireland football match on Sky. They have no problem pronouncing 'Bixente Lizarazu', 'Filippo Inzaghi', even 'Andre Shevchenko'. Getting the cúnts to pronounce 'Mark Kinsella' though, is another story altogether. Ignorant ****.

Just like all the Irish presenters on radio who can't pronounce ANY WORD WHATSOEVER that has the letter T in it..."compuisher" for computer, "ish" for it, "roish" for right, "moishorway" for motorway, etc etc. RTE are supposed to have an elecution department as well but they don't seem to pull their stupid presenters up on this. So to go by your theory all Irish are idiots, cúnts and ignorant wánkers.

HelterSkelter

englander wrote:

...If you choose to use another country's language and disregard your own, you should adopt that other country's language properly !

We didn't choose to use it.

magpie

Why can't Irish people pronounce Thames?

Why is the OP such a moron?

These are the mysteries of life.

QualderWahl

englander wrote:

If you choose to use another country's language and disregard your own, you should adopt that other country's language properly !

Perhaps you should all come across the water on English courses so you can get to grips with the English language a bit better ?

I've lived in Ireland for a number of years and have noticed a few irish-isms creeping into my language (you're grand, thanks a million etc..) but the day I say the word 'press' instead of 'cupboard' or 'messages' instead of 'shopping' I have asked my Irish spouse to shoot me

I don't wish to be drawn into an Ireland v England slanging match but I do feel it necessary to point out that we certainly did not "CHOOSE" to use the English language ! Need I remind you that all education in Irish was outlawed with the exception of the illegal hedge schools. Speaking of Irish was also deemed to be punishable by law. Need I remind you who was responsible for the imposition of these progressive laws ??

As for coming across the water to learn the Queen's English / received English, please don't make me laugh. Whilst I accept that oxbridge graduates do speak fantastically precise English, the average cockney, mancunian, scouse, brummie or geordie is scarcely comprehensible.

Surely it's time both of these Islands started to focus on areas of commonality instead of focusing on the insignificant traits that differentiate us as peoples.

savoyard

I think the reason is that it is two different alphabets from two different languages. H and R are two letters that Irish people pronounce very differently. Say E.R. to english person and they'll fall around the place laughing. They think you're talking about the donkey in Winnie the Pooh.

Doherty is a hard one for anglophones to prounouce and they tend to say docherty, dooerty, even dorothy. Plus the Scots version of the name is actually Docherty so that adds to the confusion. Basically, it's like asking us to pronounce a French word properly without knowing how the French alphabet works. My Irish aunt is a Gallagher who after years in England prounounces her name Gallacher because in general people can't deal with the silent g.

We speak Hiberno-english which is greatly influenced by the Irish language, whether we know it or not. And if Irish people haven't copped it on, how are others to? They read our names using the British alphabet, so in general, they don't pronounce letters the same as us. I'm sure they probably can't pronounce Thierry Henry the way a Frenchman could, why expect them to be able to prounce Eoin Doherty? That's my theory anyway

seamus

Englander, I think you'll find that the Irish speak English much closer to how it was originally spoken a few hundred years ago.

It's generally accepted that "Received Pronunciation", while extremely English and very posh sounding, is nothing like how English is originally spoken - the spelling and pronunciations don't match.