Is a college degree essential in life?

PHB

I've recently realised I am without a doubt brainwashed by the department of education, so I was wondering what everyone else thought.

Do you actually require a college degree to get a decent job?
Does it just make it easier?
Does it actually make it easier?

If you are highly capable and could succedd in college if you wanted to, would you actually need the degree, or will you do fine without it?

djmarkus

I would say yes, but in the ireland of today its "Not what you know, its who you know"

AARRRGH

No. Most of the stuff you learn in college has nothing to do with the real world.

For example, my computer science degree, i could have thought it to myself in about 3 months. And none of it can be applied to the work place. A complete waste of time.

Also, you can just pretend you have a degree. No employers check.

angeldelight

I dunno, not necessarily. Depends what area you're interested in working in. Obviously there's some jobs you simply can't get without a degree, mainly for the safety of others! Thinking of my mum as an example, she didn't go to college, was just doing few small jobs for years then 5 years ago she joined company she's with now at very bottom level. She's now managing 70 people, the majority of whom joined the company before her and have degrees in a related subject. She just works hard and does very good interviews! None of the jobs she had previous to this one were in a similar area so she really did start at the bottom.

evad_lhorg

ah yes she is a great woman!

Necronomicon

As mentioned above somewhere, it all depends on what direction you want to go. There are obviously loads of areas where a degree is needed.
But talking about life in general, no I don't think a college degree is absolutely essential. There's always options. I know a few people who had no real interest in going to college, people who wanted to do a trade and start working for a living as soon as they left school. They're as happy as the next person.

Dave!

Well you obviously don't need one to become a brick-layer, but for alot of jobs, yes, you do. I'm starting college tomorrow, but not because I want a degree, just for the experience and to make good friends, have a laugh, etc.

BlitzKrieg

Do you actually require a college degree to get a decent job?

Mostly no...depends what sort of job your thinking of. Some jobs are highly specialized and would defitnally require a degree in that field at least. Others would require you impressing them with your CV and a number of years back a degree would be very impressive...not so much today. So alot of jobs will be looking for a little bit more.

Does it just make it easier?

Depends on what your planning to study and what career your taking.

Does it actually make it easier?

Not really. Experiance is a vital part of work and nothign in college will replace it. People who have worked in that industry longer will always be employed and promoted before. But College (again depending on subject and job) will make it easier to get hired into the industry and after you get that initial experiance you will start climbing.

angeldelight

evad_lhorg wrote:

ah yes she is a great woman!

Thats not why I said it, for the most part what she does/doesn't do in work means little to me. Was only backing up my opinion with something I know to be true rather than just giving answer off top of my head

Aislinn

Here's my two kopeks...Not worth a damn in this market but I'll share anyway:

Not knowing what area you are in or what field you're interested in, I would say that :

A) You do NOT need a degree if you intend to be self employed.
You DO need a degree if you intend to work for anyone else simply for the social standing and "power" it gives you in the workplace...


Personally, I have been self employed for so long that I doubt very much I could keep a job. I've been so independent for so long, which breeds a certain rebelliousness (and a bit of arrogance, mind!) that I'd probably end up fired, not because I can't do the job, but because I just can't listen to idiots or take orders from anyone....So far, I have never had a degree and haven't missed it....
Yet!!!!
I find myself in uni (I'm in my late 30's) simply because I love the subject matter I have discovered and its' "fun"....So here I am, not needing a degree to survive (I already do that very well, and comfortably) but getting one for love of the subject....This is the best way to go in my opinion....

Never discount the possibility of being your own boss and working for yourself. It's very rewarding, has many more advantages than disadvantages and the freedom that it offers is just the tip of the cake...it's a great way to live if you can possibly swing it.

Best wishes to you in your own endeavors...let us know how it all turns out will you?? Would be interested to know...

jetsonx

no, not with the level of cronyism that goes on in this country.

Right_Side

In my opinion, in the current environment to work in the private sector (not trades obviously!), a degree from a university is required with minimum 2:1 or first. A masters degree should also be obtained to give the extra edge.

Then it's all experience, experience, experience.

Note: University= TCD, DCU, UCD, UCC, NUI Galway or NUI Maynooth. But to be honest international employers would be most impressed with TCD.

Lafortezza

Do you need a college degree to do a good job? No

Do you often need a college degree to get a decent job (or even an interview)? Yes.

nesf

Right_Side wrote:

Note: University= TCD, DCU, UCD, UCC, NUI Galway or NUI Maynooth. But to be honest international employers would be most impressed with TCD.

The college that is most impressive is dependent on the department within it. Different colleges are noted for "being good" at producing graduates of certain disciplines. The whole TCD thing is a myth. It's a good college, but any of the other NUIs are comparable for many things, better at some and worse at others. There is no one "better" college in this country tbh. Each have their own strenghts and weaknesses.

Especially at post grad level.

nesf

A college degree is not essential for life.

You can live without one, and work without one. Some industries don't rank academic qualifications highly versus experience.

But, for some industries, a primary degree is minimum.

You oculd say you're restricted by not having a degree, but you are also restricted by having one. Having an Arts degree won't get you into Engineering etc.

It does definitely help to have a few letters after you name in most industries. You also need experience though, that's something graduates tend to forget.

Right_Side

lafortezza wrote:

Do you need a college degree to do a good job? No

Do you often need a college degree to get a decent job (or even an interview)? Yes.

Agree on point number 2, 100%.

Jobs like: Doctor, Denist, Physio, Engineer, Economist, Microbiologist etc. ... college degree is essential. Wouldn't fancy getting my teeth done by Joe Bloggs off the street.

Right_Side

nesf wrote:

The college that is most impressive is dependent on the department within it. Different colleges are noted for "being good" at producing graduates of certain disciplines. The whole TCD thing is a myth. It's a good college, but any of the other NUIs are comparable for many things, better at some and worse at others. There is no one "better" college in this country tbh. Each have their own strenghts and weaknesses.

Especially at post grad level.

I agree with you.

But lets be honest, two grads go to America and present their degrees. Both did biology, for example, and both got a 2:1, equal levels of experience etc. One has a degree from Trinity and one has a degree from NUI Maynooth. Who gets the job? The cold truth is the Trinity grad 99 times out of 100.

Same as two guys coming to work in Ireland with the same qualifications again. One went to Oxford and the other went to Bristol. For all I know Bristol could have an amazing biology department but you take it for granted that Oxford does.

nesf

Right_Side wrote:

I agree with you.

But lets be honest, two grads go to America and present their degrees. Both did biology, for example, and both got a 2:1, equal levels of experience etc. One has a degree from Trinity and one has a degree from NUI Maynooth. Who gets the job? The cold truth is the Trinity grad 99 times out of 100.

Same as two guys coming to work in Ireland with the same qualifications again. One went to Oxford and the other went to Bristol. For all I know Bristol could have an amazing biology department but you take it for granted that Oxford does.

It doesn't really work like that for a lot of industries. Yes if the company hiring you has no idea of the college system over here perhaps but not if the company hiring knows the industry and it's graduates well.

Speaking from experience in this, most industries know better than to assume TCD grads are better. It's not the Oxford of Ireland

Flukey

Well it is better to have than not. I studied for one at night a few years back. It hasn't made a lot of difference to my career in truth, but I am glad to have it nevertheless. It is a requirement for lots of things. So if you can do a degree, then by all means do so.

0utshined

Is it essential?

No, but it can help. It is a way in to certain jobs and can show employers you can stick with something to the end. Even if you don't use the skills directly you should be able to apply them to different situations like researching a topic, analysing it and working through to a solution.

jimmycrackcorm

I'm always amazed by how many people work in IT that have a non-IT degree. Many with degrees that only have loose or non-existent connection with their actual work. I can only conclude that they could do the job without having done the degree.

A only degree is useful to get into the workplace - it's all learning on the job after that. If you have Talent, Ambition and a lucky break getting into a company then you will go far.

IceHawk

Right_Side wrote:

Note: University= TCD, DCU, UCD, UCC, NUI Galway or NUI Maynooth.

What about UL?
Not good enough for you? :mad:

Anyway, to the OP, I think a degree nowadays is about the same level as the LC would have been about 10-15 years ago, in that about the same proportion of the population are now doing Degrees as would have been finishing secondary school previously. I don't think a degree is essential in getting a job, but if you're competing for a position with someone with a relevant degree, you'd better have some good experience to give you an edge.
I know that in engineering, what qualifications you hve determine where in a pay structure you start in a company, and it can limit your promotion possibilities if you don't focus on improving yourself while working.

JungleBunny

I am still not sure whether or not my 5 years in college did me any good.
I was never asked to prove that I went to college or even sat my exams in any interview and nobody mentioned it since. (kinda like the leaving cert that nobody now cares about)
I work in IT/Software and most people I work with either did not go to college or studied something completely different. How they got this job I still have no idea and it does pi$$ me off when I think that I slaved 5 years in college, only to get the same job and money as somebody who just did nothing.
I think at this stage all that counts is who you know and how much experience you have.
Since Ireland has the highest percentage of school leavers going to college (worldwide I think), a college dgree is nothing spectacular in Ireland anymore.

Right_Side

IceHawk wrote:

What about UL?
Not good enough for you? :mad:

Apologies.

0utshined

Right_Side wrote:

In my opinion, in the current environment to work in the private sector (not trades obviously!), a degree from a university is required with minimum 2:1 or first. A masters degree should also be obtained to give the extra edge.

Then it's all experience, experience, experience.

Note: University= TCD, DCU, UCD, UCC, NUI Galway or NUI Maynooth. But to be honest international employers would be most impressed with TCD.

I'm curious Right_Side. What makes you think that an employer will care that you went to one of the Universities you've mentioned rather than an IT?

comad

I'd rather have a degree than not have one.

Now that I have two IT degrees, I'd say that they are very important for getting a start in IT unless u know someone who'll get you a job. Once you're in the job, hardwork, talent, fair ,determination etc count for more.

Hitchhiker's Guide to...

true about the universities and their relative merits. Within Ireland employers know exactly which courses are best within universities, they don't choose a particular university as being best overall. Although, obviously it will help if the person interviewing you and making a decision on hiring you went to the same uni as you. There is, however, an important issue regarding the 'winning effect'. TCD consistently gets more postgrad scholarships than any other uni - presumably this is because better students are attracted to what they feel is a better college - this then makes the college better as a result.

College is good from a social development point of view; however it does seem to be of relatively limited use outside of the sciences/engineering/health faculties. Obviously, with some exceptions in the arts areas. The key benefit of any degree imho (and as noted in a previous post) is that it helps get you considered for an interview, rather than its use in helping you do your job.

BigEejit

I had a boss who absolutely refused to hire people with masters degrees and other post grad qualifications ... in his estimation they were layabouts who didnt have the balls to go out into the workplace .........

For myself, nothing I learned in college was ever used again, waste of time ... did it get me my first job / foot on the ladder ... I dont think so, it may have had a bearing on me getting an interview .. I was never asked to show proof of what I had done, as long as I could pick up the job/do the job then everyone is happy

ADUB?

A degree is needed in nearly all professions now.
The days of walking in and out of jobs without the necessary qualifications are gone.

Experience cant be thought but you still need that bit of paper, look whats happened in world of teaching as a guidline, teachers working for years now going back and getting their HDips cos they dindt have them and would be out of a job

While a degree doesnt teach you how to do a job on practical sense, it gives you underlying theories and background that helps you on day to day basis. So thats why they are needed

On the TCD, UCD, DCU, UL, MAYNOOTH, IT blah blah front.
Having ACTUALLY attended and graduated from DIT, TCD and DCU at various levels
I can comment more readily, then the person that felt in someway qualified to roast or brag about a certain place over another.
UNI's are all pretty much the same very little difference in the quality of graduate. If a student doesnt want to work then he/she will be sh*T no matter where you attend.

The only way attending a certain UNI might help is if the interviewer identifies with you down to the fact that you've attended there also.

ADUB?

BigEejit wrote:

I had a boss who absolutely refused to hire people with masters degrees and other post grad qualifications ... in his estimation they were layabouts who didnt have the balls to go out into the workplace .........

Did your boss have any qualifications himself? I take it he didnt have a masters/post grad. Are you sure was it not the case of green-eyed monster?

Did your boss, not realise that quite a few master/post grad students work full time and do post grad's part time/ evening.

Would that not qualify your boss as much more of a layabout then?

BigEejit

ADUB? wrote:

A degree is needed in nearly all professions now.
The days of walking in and out of jobs without the necessary qualifications are gone.

Experience cant be thought but you still need that bit of paper, look whats happened in world of teaching as a guidline, teachers working for years now going back and getting their HDips cos they dindt have them and would be out of a job

While a degree doesnt teach you how to do a job on practical sense, it gives you underlying theories and background that helps you on day to day basis. So thats why they are needed

I think the need for the bit of paper is mostly only in heavily unionised jobs (used for pay scales etc) ... the job I am doing now is very technical but there are several of my colleagues that have no technical qualification, and my employer didnt even ask, as long as they could pick up the skills and do it effectively everyone is happy ....