Intellectually stimulating/progressive music.

Karl Hungus

I'm sitting here listening to Atheist, a phenominal band that a certain DoctorJ introduced me to, and for those of you unfamiliar with the band, they emerged in the latter days of the Florida Death Metal scene merging their amazing technical Metal prowess with Jazz, before splitting up. They created something intelligent, challenging and altogether unique.

In the spirit of that, I thought I might start a thread about intelligent music. What do you find makes you think? What shakes up your noggin? Post about intelligent music, anything that's stimulating, challenging, barrier-breaking, or just outright unique. And don't restrict this to Rock/Metal either, personally, I'm quite the fan of The Mahavishnu Orchestra, a quite phenominal Jazz Fusion band.

Anyway, here's what Karl recommends everyone should own:

Cynic - Focus
Arcturus - La Masquerade Infernale

Click Here for my thread on Arcturus. I'm sure the good Doctor will be along any moment to tell everyone how amazing Cynic are aswell, and he's damn right! Focus is probably one of the most intellligent albums ever recorded.

Other bands of interest that I particularly love would be Opeth, Spiral Architect, Aghora, Enslaved, Porcupine Tree, Emperor, Sigh, Isis, Novembre, Pestilence, Cephalic Carnage, Coprofago, to name but a few!

Doctor J

Apart from the aforementioned I'd say Ohm are well worth checking out. Instrumental Jazz Fusion with a fairly strong foundation in Rock and all unbelievably skilled musicians. Dream Theater deserve a mention too. I'd also say Rust In Peace by Megadeth merits attention, it seldom gets the recognition it deserves as an outstanding technical display.

Rush deserve mention for being at it for so long to such a high standard.

But yes, Cynic are just the absolute greatest, IMO. The bend evolved at such an astounding rate from a fairly generic thrash/death outfit to creating one of the most inspiring albums I've ever heard and, on the way, contributed to incredible releases from the like of Death and Athiest.

Tar.Aldarion

i would go with isis and tool as being two bands off the top of my head that have made me think.their album and song ideas and backgrounds are interesting eg panopticon for isis and 46 and 2 for tool.just makes you think,ya know?

Ancient1

Apart from the titans you guys mentioned, i have to say Emperor again. What Ihsahn created when he was at an age younger than me is just beyond words. His musical vision is just scary and very few musicians command my respect in a way that he does. I think he's different, he stands out in a way. I don't know how to put it properly, but his perseverance in pushing his vision and creating it is just amazing. He's a true inspiration and i really admire him and his work.

Also, check out Terje Rypdal (on the excellent ECM Records). He's a Norwegian guitarist who, afaik, is the first to have conducted an orchestra using a strat. Now if that ain't something.....

John

My old favourites Einstuerzende Neubauten are definitely one for making you think. Seeing them live is amazing, all these weird sounds which assume must be samples are played live in front of you. They make use of scrap metal, power tools, jet engines, air compressors, pipes, regular instruments and other odds and ends. Best thing is it's not all just a horrible racket. They play some quite complex (but not mind bendingly so) and beautiful songs.

www.neubauten.org

Another artist that really bakes my noodle is The Hafler Trio. He makes use of lots of weird psychoacoustic phenomena. One CD I have makes you feel drunk and dizzy when you listen to it. Another is meant to be played at maximum volume and most of the bass is so low that when things rattle in your room they form a beat to the music. All of that album was made using a recording of the singer of Sigur Rós's voice. Absolutely amazing stuff.

Doctor J

Can't believe I forgot to mention Watchtower, who truly pioneered the more technical side of Metal. Guitarist Ron Jarzombeck's side project Spastic Ink also push the boundaries in ways mere mortals would find impossible.`

Tell me more about Porcupine Tree... it involves the guy who used to produce Opeth?

LightofDarkness

Anglagard- progressive music, very layered with complex arrangements
Pavor- just plain demolish all. Plus, they have one unbelievable bass player. Both albums are fantastic, "A Pale Debiliatating Autumn" and "Furioso." Technical death metal which surpasses most.
King Crimson- like I need to say anything about these guys.
Ron Jarzombek- His two solo projects are truly unique, "PHHHP!" and "Solitrily Speaking of Theoretical Confinement." Superb musician, can't wait for his project with Alex Webster and Chris Adler involving that Circle of Twelve Notes he's using.
Bone- dissonant progressive US band. Just plain odd, album is entitled "Uses Wrist Grab."
Sleepytime Gorilla Museum- must be heard.
And if none of you have Pat Metheny yet you'll be crushed horribly from above somehow. And for God's sake get LYKATHEA AFLAME "Elvenefris".

OLP

a friend of mine sent me a song called The General by a band called Dispatch, i'd never heard of the band before so i gave it a listen and i just think that the song is very well written and i dunno what but it just made me think.

Scratch Acid

Here's some albums I find "Intellectually stimulating".

Orthrlem - Asristir Vieldriox (This has to be heard to believed...The guitarist sounds like a cross between Steve Vai and Greg Ginn)

Ornette Coleman - Dancing in Your Head (One of Coleman's most experimental and interesting records)

Sun Ra - Unity (Possibly Sun Ra's best live album)

Foetus - Nail (...)

Ulver - Bergtatt (Hm)

Big Black - Atomizer (Yeah)

Also: Arcturus do indeed kick scrotum.

Karl Hungus

Yeah, there's definetly a lot I've not mentioned. King Crimson, Ulver, Dream Theater, Pat Metheny, Rush, and Ancient1 is right, must mention Emperor again.
There's definetly a lot I need to check out myself aswell.

Speaking of Ulver though, "Themes From William Blake's The Marriage Of Heaven And Hell" is one ****ing unreal album!

pbsuxok1znja4r

Well, John Cage has some of what you might call "challenging" music, if you're into that sort of thing. Personally I think it's pretentious excrement, but, there you go; no accounting for taste. The Dresden Dolls are just a little bit "out there", and they ain't bad.
Isis really are awful, IMO.

Scratch Acid

Karl Hungus wrote:

Speaking of Ulver though, "Themes From William Blake's The Marriage Of Heaven And Hell" is one ****ing unreal album!

Yes indeedy. I think my favourite Ulver has to be 'Nattens Madrigal' though.

Karl Hungus

Could you describe what John Cage is like at all tommy?

pbsuxok1znja4r

Heh, I'll try... his compositions tend to defy alll categorisation and description though! 'Sublime mechanical asceticism' is one applicable description, or so I've heard. Mostly, though, his music is just silent....very silent. Have you heard the song "seven haiku"? Or are you familiar with his composition "4:33" ? It's four minutes and thirty-three seconds of silence. It certainly 'challenged' me, that's for sure, lol.

Karl Hungus

Silence, eh? Yeah, I see what you mean about pretentiousness so. I'd prefer to listen to something with a little more substance.

pbsuxok1znja4r

Well, granted I've only heard 5 or 6 of his pieces, I've been told he does have some more conventional music, I just havent heard it yet. I'm no authority on John Cage, really.

Scratch Acid

scouser.tommy wrote:

Mostly, though, his music is just silent....very silent. .

... Listen to some of his other music before making statements like this, please. John Cage was one of the 20th century's most important composers and a pinoeer of electronic and avant-garde music in general. Don't judge him on the strength of 4'33"...

006

devil doll
limbonic art
Ephual duath

It wasn't me!

Karl Hungus wrote:

Silence, eh? Yeah, I see what you mean about pretentiousness so. I'd prefer to listen to something with a little more substance.

I'd prefer to listen to something.

Steoob

definatly opeth.. they actually make me think... i cant think or devote my atention to a single other thing when im listening to them

Mystic Fibrosis

John Cage was also one of the first people to experiment with using turntables as an instrument, and this was back in the 30s.

Sunn O))) are interesting as well.
Pretty much everyone who has played/plays with Einstürzende Neubauten has some really interesting solo stuff. I'd recommend NU Unruh's solo stuff, and the new Alexander Hacke cd.

mike65

Who are all these bands? God I know I'm old when Rush and King Crimson are the most familair names!

I nominate Blue Oyster Cult and The Who both driving rock bands with lyrics which hardly ever mention love except in an "s&m" way for the BOC! Whatever became of Kings X? Anyone remember them?

Mike.

WweHardyV2

Althougth their not as heavy as Opeth or Atheist,System of a Down are really stimulating sometimes. Their lyrics get u thinking about politics,war and death and what happens after u die!!I recommend all their albums
System of a Down***
Toxicity*****
Steal this Album**
Mezmerise****

AdMMM

Tool get me thinking as do Liquid Tension Experiment.

Kilgore-Trout

Miles Davis
Captain Beefheart(makes me go HUH?? )
Frank Zappa
Edgard Varese
Claude Debussy
Most prog bands(Rush, Yes, Genesis, Van Der Graaf Generator, Pink Floyd, Soft Machine etc.)
Steve Hackett

ANarcho-Munk

Check out this lad, he's a really great guitarist (international busker tbh), his music really makes me think and he has the two handed tapping skill down to a tee.

Here's some mp3's for ye http://home.hetnet.nl/~ksund/mp3s.html
(legal mp3's btw :rolleyes: )

Kilgore-Trout

his playing reminds me of Pierre Bensusan( anyone who has not heard him should check him out too!!!!)

Beautiful stuff

ANarcho-Munk

Ahh I forgot to mention his name, his name is Carlos Vamos

Treebeard

I don't think these have been mentioned

Jason Becker
Cacophony
Steve Vai
Symphony X

John

Mystic Fibrosis wrote:

John Cage was also one of the first people to experiment with using turntables as an instrument, and this was back in the 30s.

Actually it was the fifties but he was still the first person to scratch on record on the piece "Rozart Mix". I personally think 4'33" is a masterpiece. It's NOT a silent piece. The whole point of it is that people pay attention to the sound around them. Cage was big on opening music up to "non-musical" sounds. He was more important to modern music in all its forms than most people you can mention. There's an excellent book called "Conversing with Cage" that I heartily recommend.

Pretty much everyone who has played/plays with Einstürzende Neubauten has some really interesting solo stuff.

My solo stuff isn't that great.

I'd recommend NU Unruh's solo stuff, and the new Alexander Hacke cd.

The Unruh album is excellent. Very very strange though. He's got some new stuff coming out sometime in the near future. Four performances on dvd based on the four elements. I've only heard the Air performance but it was really impressive.

Alex's album is a totally different kettle of fish. Much more accessible than Neubauten or any of the other member's side projects. Herr Hacke says he's planning a tour soon with a rotating line up that will change with each date, sounds interesting. Even if he did a DJ tour I'd be happy, I saw him in Berlin last year and it was one of the maddest sets I've ever heard. A friend of mine saw him last week doing a DJ set with Jim Thirlwell (Foetus) and raved about it. And raved during it I think.

Mystic Fibrosis

Man, how could I have forgotten to mention Steve Vai. If you're into theory or complexity some of his stuff is seriously intense.

The only thing I don't like about Cage is that The Wire tend to worship him a bit which puts me off some artists.

John, has Jochen Arbeit got any solo stuff out? I've never heard of any and I've always wondered how he got drafted into the band.

Baggio

Karl, good stuff,
...well no surprises here RUSH are the most shall we say consistant of those mentioned..high standarsds of music, musicianship and lyrical writing by Peart,,,their whole persona is one of skill and deeper thinking in every way...if thats what yer after,,their the band to start and end up with,..countless examples and albums,,from 2112 to Vapour Trails and everything in between. Hemispheres and A Farewell To Kings , Permanant Waves and Moving Pictures,,, Grace Under Pressure and Power Windows etc etc...you'll see what I mean
Dont forget another legendary band who for some reason that I cant figure out rarely get a mention here - Jethro Tull..marvellous musicianship and Ian Anderson's often chaotic lyrical and and comecil sens of toubnge in cheek descriptions great stuff...again loads of Albums there..including the Grammy Metal/Hard rock winning album "Crest Of A Knave"
*apparantly Metalica and their auntarage were meant to scoop it but the ol' boys from Tull got it and quite right too * anyway there's loads of veryy interesting stuff there..its all about being open to diverse styles, interesting thoughts/ideas and great musicianship...if thats you...well these 2 bands are right up your street.

ciao' amigo...Baggio.....

It wasn't me!

John2 wrote:

There's an excellent book called "Conversing with Cage" that I heartily recommend.

Is there any writing in it?

fortuneg

Some of my favourite prog bands would have to be Camel & Yes.
Camel's album "Mirage" & Yes' album "Close to the edge" are nearly impossible to fault!
Then if you're into a more Jazzy, fusion mood Herbie Hancock's albums "Headhunters" & "Thrust" are brilliant too. A brilliant mix of jazz & funk me thinks.
Meshuggah are also very challenging, just try working out their time signatures:)

Karl Hungus

fortuneg wrote:

Meshuggah are also very challenging, just try working out their time signatures:)

In fairness though, Meshuggah aren't the most intelligent band around... The constant chugging gets extremely tiresome. Sure, they've got some interesting time signiatures, but they're just chugging the same note a lot of the time.

smackbunnybaby

Karl Hungus wrote:

but they're just chugging the same note a lot of the time.

yeah but its in a different time signature

PiE

Karl Hungus wrote:

Silence, eh? Yeah, I see what you mean about pretentiousness so. I'd prefer to listen to something with a little more substance.

Only about 1/10th as pretentious as this thread mind you ;x

Karl Hungus

PiE wrote:

Only about 1/10th as pretentious as this thread mind you ;x

And what exactly is this thread pretaining to?

Ravelleman

My mentions go to (among others):

Yes - Closer to the Edge
Rush - Hemishperes
Jethro Tull - various
Kansas - various
Simon and Garfunkle - various (Seriously, you really have to listen to them to appreciate the music. The vocal harmonies, the melodies, the orchestration. All perfect)

Guess who likes prog rock...

ShreddedHumans

I don't understand what people mean by "intelligent music". The people playing it are intelligent, or the people listening to it are intelligent, or what? If it is the merging of styles then I would go with Al Di Meola, he is a jazz fusion guitarist.

Doctor J

I think it's more "music that isn't always in 4/4 and goes intro-verse-chorus-verse-chorus-bridge-guitarsolo-verse-chorus-chorus"

Stuff that required a bit of imagination to write

John

Mystic Fibrosis wrote:

John, has Jochen Arbeit got any solo stuff out? I've never heard of any and I've always wondered how he got drafted into the band.

He doesn't have any solo albums but he's been part of the Berlin scene since Neubauten were but a new band. He was in Die Haut (who Blixa and Alex also played with, along with Nick Cave, Lydia Lunch, Kim Gordan, Debbie Harry(!) and loads of others that I forget now). He plays guitar at the moment for a guy called Martin Dean who's kind of lounge music, good stuff but very different from what I was expecting.

Karl Hungus

Doctor J wrote:

Stuff that required a bit of imagination to write

Indeed.

Speaking of intelligent music, have you ever heard Madder Mortem, Doc?

JC 2K3

Rush 2112, Roxy Music - Roxy Music and Jethro Tull - Aqualung are 3 of my faves.

Also, Sonic Youth - Daydream Nation is great if you are looking for something different - Cross the Breeze is a great progressive track.

Scratch Acid

JC 2K3 wrote:

Sonic Youth - Daydream Nation

Meant to put this on my list. Probably my favourite album of all time.

Mystic Fibrosis

Madder Mortem for the win tbh.

I'm annoyed I didn't see them with Opeth

Karl Hungus

Mystic Fibrosis wrote:

Madder Mortem for the win tbh.

I'm annoyed I didn't see them with Opeth

I did.
And I saw Opeth back when they played with Katatonia and Novembre in the Shelter. Christ, that was probably one of the greatest gigs of my life.

PiE

Fine so, Menomena.

So strange they needed to write a computer program (called 'Deeler') to fit the compositions together.

O WOE IS ME I FEEL SO PRETENTIOUS

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

ooh yeah, menomena good stuff


dEUS would be another one..

Doctor J

Karl Hungus wrote:

Speaking of intelligent music, have you ever heard Madder Mortem, Doc?

Can't say I have. Who they?

Karl Hungus

Doctor J wrote:

Can't say I have. Who they?

Norwegian Band with a female vocalist, use a lot of interesting time sigiatures, strange discordand riffs and have some amazing songwriting skills. I'd say give a listen to this, but keep in mind, it's quite easily the poorest song of the album. Give a listen to this and this aswell. Should give you a decent overall idea, but definetly not their best stuff.