Has anybody watched Rip off Republic on RTE

Sparky

just watching it now on rte, and there is some interesting stuff on it.

eth0_

Indeed. It's sickening that that groceries act is still a law here. Meant to protect corner shops by stopping multi-national grocery chains from passing on their bulk discounts to the customer - well, that worked REALLY well considering there are sooo many corner stored in 2005, yet the government refuse to drop the law!

He said a high court case had to be taken to take nappies off the list of products it's illegal for stores to pass on a discount on!

Unbelievable!

CCOVICH

I went along to the filming of one episode. Some interesting stuff, mostly anti-government (i.e. the government are the source of the rip-offs), I'm surprised RTE are showing it.

aidan_walsh

Don't suppose the TV license will get mentioned at all

DannyD

Great show, get your nappies posted or else pay the price.The shows were recorded on 19th, 20th, 21st and 22nd July 2005.

Dimitri

Its about time rte brodcast something like this we cant doubt that fianna fail/ pd's have boosted our economy however thay have ended up in the pockets of big business as a result and now are afraid of stepping on people's toes, a show like this is needed to huighlight the failings of the government seeing as they are always blasting on about how successful they are.

CJhaughey

I think he is trying to create a stronger consumer culture here, If there is one thing that we do well it is lie down and get fúcked in the ass by vested interests.
Fair play to Eddie he made a fairly dry topic entertaining, although that clip with the guy getting run over by the Rubbish men was pretty scary!

zappb

yea just finished - was a great show - with all the stealth taxes we get hit with, i heard an es
timation that we have 70% tax!!!

what a joke

Micheal Martin
Department of Enterprise, trade & employment
Kildare Street
Dublin 2.

whiskeyman

Essential viewing... they should show this in all secondary schools / colleges .. and workplaces too!
Fair play to all involved in the show.

Perhaps this show will have the status "Thats Life" had in the UK in the mid 80s.
We never seemed to have a decent consumer affairs prog.... and they had "Watchdog" also.
People need to be educated about the state of the rip-off republic we're in... maybe then we'll start acting on it.

Sarsfield

I thought it was pretty good overall. It may well have brought closer the end of the groceries order!

However he seemed to give the impression that taxation is a rip-off in itself. I disagree. The tax rip-off is when it is not well spent to deliver quality services and infrastructure. Maybe that's in episode 2?

Ardent

Thanks for the address, didn't have time to write it down, I'm sending a nappy to that f*cker.

CJhaughey

Sarsfield wrote:

I thought it was pretty good overall. It may well have brought closer the end of the groceries order!

However he seemed to give the impression that taxation is a rip-off in itself. I disagree. The tax rip-off is when it is not well spent to deliver quality services and infrastructure. Maybe that's in episode 2?

To almost paraphrase one of Eddies earlier shows:
Show me the Quality services and Infrastructure?
I don't see any from where I am standing now.
Crumbling disease ridden hospitals, Poor public transport nationally the list goes on...

whiskeyman

Ardent wrote:

Thanks for the address, didn't have time to write it down, I'm sending a nappy to that f*cker.

Remember... clean ones only.
Besides, they're full of sh*t in Leinster House anyway!

I hope it got good ratings and is the talk of pubs / offices for a long time.

Sarsfield

CJHaughey wrote:

To almost paraphrase one of Eddies earlier shows:
Show me the Quality services and Infrastructure?
I don't see any from where I am standing now.
Crumbling disease ridden hospitals, Poor public transport nationally the list goes on...

Isn't that what I just said?

Sarsfield

Ardent wrote:

Thanks for the address, didn't have time to write it down, I'm sending a nappy to that f*cker.

How much does it cost to post a nappy these days anyway?

Sparky

and musgraves no1 in rgdatas list. and oil prices went up today aswell, and the thing that gets to me is how taxes go up and their salary goes up aswell.

as said above its a joke, i can see alot of young people like myself emigrating if this gets worse, which it will.

eth0_

Sarsfield wrote:

The tax rip-off is when it is not well spent to deliver quality services and infrastructure. Maybe that's in episode 2?

Huh? What? *looks out bedroom window* where are these quality services and infrastructure you speak of?

Dimitri

Sparky_S wrote:

and musgraves no1 in rgdatas list. and oil prices went up today aswell, and the thing that gets to me is how taxes go up and their salary goes up aswell.

as said above its a joke, i can see alot of young people like myself emigrating if this gets worse, which it will.

I know i'm definetely emigerating after i qualify, no way in hell am i going through what my sister and her boyf put up with just to pay a mortgage(sp?) thats just not living to me, undertaking a massive workload just to have somewhere to live and food to eat.

Sarsfield

eth0_ wrote:

Huh? What? *looks out bedroom window* where are these quality services and infrastructure you speak of?

Please read my comment again. I said the tax rip-off is when it's not spent well. Get it? I'm saying it's not!

It do not speak of good services. I point out they have not been delivered and I hope it is brought up in a later episode.

I simply said tax in itself is not a ripoff.

Does nobody speak English (or read full posts) anymore?

John R

Dimitri wrote:

I know i'm definetely emigerating after i qualify, no way in hell am i going through what my sister and her boyf put up with just to pay a mortgage(sp?) thats just not living to me, undertaking a massive workload just to have somewhere to live and food to eat.

Just be careful where you move. Earlier this evening there was a programme on the beeb about brits who bought properties in Spain. Developers are using some crazy compulsory purchase law to take the land from them (and Spanish owners), pay them derisory amounts for it and then charge the previous owners for the development costs. The people were ending up without all or part of their property and a massive bill for the pleasure.
It's nice to know that things are even worse in other parts of Europe. :rolleyes: FFS even Mugabe isn't charging people for destroying their homes.

DannyD

If people don't send nappies they have no right to complain.BE PROACTIVE

davej

If people don't send nappies they have no right to complain

Hmm. The logic of this sentence escapes me. Sending a nappy to the government IS one way to complain. So you're sentence pretty much reads: "People who don't complain have no right to complain".

Anyway I watched it last night, thought it was good - hopefully it will generate a few ripples and change a few more attitudes.

BTW I think it's worth creating a "send a nappy" sticky for this forum. Mods ?

davej

galwaydude

exactly, everyone on boards should send a nappy to micheal martin. Look what that woman in trim did with people power.

Thanx christ im emmigrating next march to the states for a year after watching that programme. Its crazy how some companies operate and get away with it and then line their pockets.

Sleipnir

Sure we all know we are being ripped off at every turn.
Send your nappies in!

Jip

eth0_ wrote:

He said a high court case had to be taken to take nappies off the list of products it's illegal for stores to pass on a discount on!

Unbelievable!

Not exactly. At the time when Dunnes and Tescos were having their tit-for-tat sales they were selling their nappies for nothing. Dunnes were taken to court for breach of the groceries act and they successfully argued that nappies are not a necissity and therefore not covered under the act.

K2

I've heard that it was Tescos that took the high court action, anyone know if this is true? The clip about the bin protesters was quite stunning, you could see the effect it had on the audience, I know I was quite stunned and shocked to see someone carried at speed on the front of a van.

the nappy has been put in the post and I am making a number available to my work collegues so they can do the same. Postal protests are an old trick but, as proven over the years by the likes of Amnesty and Greenpeace, it works. A 20% reduction in my shopping bill would be very welcome.

rondjon

I know it'll cost a bit, but should the nappies be sent by registered post? Given that the Department officials will know what's going on, and will recognise spongy A4 envelopes, if they're registered, they'll have to at least go through the trouble of accepting delivery.

ednwireland

John R wrote:

Just be careful where you move. Earlier this evening there was a programme on the beeb about brits who bought properties in Spain. Developers are using some crazy compulsory purchase law to take the land from them (and Spanish owners), pay them derisory amounts for it and then charge the previous owners for the development costs. The people were ending up without all or part of their property and a massive bill for the pleasure.
It's nice to know that things are even worse in other parts of Europe. :rolleyes: FFS even Mugabe isn't charging people for destroying their homes.

What amazed me is that these people said they expected the law to be the same as britain - when people say how cheaply spain build public infrastructre maybe this is part of the reason (i'm sure it is) we'd all what some compensation if our land is taken for a road or something else, although the amount you get isn't that large if your not in the right circles a frind had half his front garden taken for a road and got a few thousand quid but the rock breakers shook the old house to bits damp proof course has gone but couldn't get anything from the contractors. i'd still rather live in ireland than england (where i moved from).

Eoin

I found some of the facts very interesting, but overall I found the show incredibly patronising - am I alone in this? To me had the feel of a secondary school teacher doing their best to keep their students interested in an economics class.

galwaydude

give eddie hobbs a chance as this was the first episode of the series

Tazz T

I thought it was a great show. A real eye-opener, even for me, and I thought I'd researched these things. I think he had to dumb it down so not to blind everyone with jargon.

Using children to demonstrate his point and the 'nappy' ploy was tantamount to saying everytime you let yourself get ripped off, its your children who pay the price. A bit harsh but effective.

Surprised how 'anti-government' the show was. There will be some reaction to this.

A wake-up call for the Irish consumer at last.

Drag00n79

I saw it too. I was going to record it but missed the first five minutes so didn't bother. I assumed RTÉ would repeat it late some night later in the week, but no, the show is not being repeated. Next week's deals with the entertainment industry.

Morgans

What I cant believe was the gasps from the audience when the bin tax protestor was carried on the bonnet of the van. It was all over the news for the most of a week when Socialist TD Joe Higgins was sent to jail. It shows to me how many, not all, of those up in arms now after viewing the program are too lazy to find the information for themselves, and in many respects are the people that companies who rip off target. It is shown on prime time tv then we will take action.

It is good that the program should once again bring it to the attention of the public how ripped off we are, but I dont think it will have a shred of difference in the long run.

One poster earlier called out hospitals disease ridden, it may be true to some extent, but no more than hospitals anywhere in the world. Having spent a fair time in hospital lately, I have to say that A&E is traumatic and slow, but apart from that I have been quite happy with the service I received. I'm sure there are harder cases than mine, a week long stay, but my opinion is that it has as much to do with administration as money being pumped into it. From when I first went to college, it took about 4.5 hours to drive to Dublin, it now takes 3 hours. Some of the services that we have got such as hte Luas, Port Tunnell and M50 are obviously late and over budget, but many services have improved dramatically. Vested Interested within services will always complain. Teachers will always want better equipment, hospitals will always want better equipment, even if the services are about perfect. Thats not a bad thing, but it is a little overplayed my opposition in my opinion.

Aspro

It was a breath of fresh air to see the likes of that show last night as opposed to the usual dumbed down TV diet of Soaps, Reality TV, and The *cringe* Lyrics Board.
It was great to see that it was on at prime time as well so hopefully more workplace conversations today will be about how were getting fleeced in this country as opposed to who got evicted from Big Bore.

I read that the show will only air for 4 episodes. Hopefully not. We need a consistent investigative show like that to make people sit up and notice.

We also need a more in depth analysis as to why the likes of stealth taxes are introduced (i.e. privatisation of public utilities) and why we can continue to be ripped off while politicians and their big business buddies try to make us look like delusional fools with their denial.

rondjon

Aspro wrote:

It was great to see that it was on at prime time as well

It's hardly prime time on a monday night in the middle of summer on the 2nd week of most peoples summer holidays when people are either out of the country, or at least outside, out and about.

If RTE were really serious about it, they'd have it on in prime time at the beginning of September when there's a bigger chance of people watching it.

Aspro wrote:

I read that the show will only air for 4 episodes. Hopefully not. We need a consistent investigative show like that to make people sit up and notice.

Only 4 were recorded.

Reaction to this one will presumably dictate whether more are recorded or not.

tinofapples

Eye-opening and sickening at the same time

ambro25

Shamrok wrote:

Next week's deals with the entertainment industry.

Is there gonna be anything discussed about the IRMA's current 'P2P shenanigans', perchance?

rondjon

ambro25 wrote:

Is there gonna be anything discussed about the IRMA's current 'P2P shenanigans', perchance?

Why would there be? That's hardly a ripoff. They're merely seeking the enforcement of the law of the land.

Sarsfield

ambro25 wrote:

Is there gonna be anything discussed about the IRMA's current 'P2P shenanigans', perchance?

:rolleyes:


I've been to the RGDATA site as I always like to consider both sides of a debate!

One part of it interested me - the Groceries Order is supported by the StVdeP, Combat Poverty and Cross Care. Why?

Most of the rest was statistics. Not lies, not damned lies, just statistics

rondjon

[QUOTE=SarsfieldOne part of it interested me - the Groceries Order is supported by the StVdeP, Combat Poverty and Cross Care. Why?[/QUOTE]

Was this SVP during the time when the Groceries Order was implemented because H.Williams had been closed because of predatory pricing and it was felt that all low-cost supermarkets might be forced out of the market to the detriment of consumers?

Or is it the SVP of today?

RGDATA are, I'm sure, like most people, willing to pick up on any comment or quote made anytime in the past in order to justify their position.

I can find no indication anywhere of the SVP stating themselves that they are in favour of the Groceries Order.

Agent Orange

galwaydude wrote:

Thanx christ im emmigrating next march to the states for a year after watching that programme. Its crazy how some companies operate and get away with it and then line their pockets.

Yeah, because it's completely different in the US. :rolleyes:

rondjon

davej wrote:

Hmm. The logic of this sentence escapes me. Sending a nappy to the government IS one way to complain. So you're sentence pretty much reads: "People who don't complain have no right to complain".

To me the point is that people who don't complain don't really have a right to further complain that nothing is being done about stuff.

For example. Joe Blow complains that all restaurants are rip-offs and provide rubbish service to his mates in the pub, or on a forum such as this.

But at the weekend, Joe Blow gets shafted in a restaurant and says nothing to the waiter/manager/owner about the shafting he's just received.

He waits till he gets home to log on, or to the pub to spout further to his mates.

There's no point in that, and it's an unfortunate, but very very common way for Irish consumers to behave.

Pigman II

eoin_s wrote:

I found some of the facts very interesting, but overall I found the show incredibly patronising - am I alone in this? To me had the feel of a secondary school teacher doing their best to keep their students interested in an economics class.

Yeah I got this feeling too. Maybe I'm just getting cynical in my old age or maybe it's just because I've got a guy who earns €300k+ p/a telling me how 'the man' is keeping me down or maybe it's because I don't believe that posting a packet of 'neeeapeeees' to Michael Martin is going to make a jot of difference.

The whole thing felt like an exercise in self promotion rather than a blueprint on how to 'fight the power' as tho Hobbs is setting himself up to be Irelands answer to Michael Moore or Mark Thomas. Like someone alluded to earlier will Hobbs be doing a segment on TV license fees? Will he put his money where his mouth is and bite the hand that broadcasts him? Somehow I think not.

The only thing I took from this show was that whilst in China people will stand in front of a tank because they wanted the right to vote in Ireland we'll stand in front a truck because we don't want to pay bin charges. Pretty much sums up the mind-state of this country a.t.m. and the zeitgeist that Hobbs is tapping into.

pan

All taken from www.entemp.ie

Office of the Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment:
Address:
Department of Enterprise, Trade & Employment
23 Kildare Street, Dublin 2.

Fax No: 01-6312815

Bridget Flynn
Private Secretary to Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment (Micheál Martin, T.D.)
01-6312172
bridget_flynn@entemp.ie

Or

Minister Micheál Martin,
Department of Enterprise, Trade & Employment,
23 Kildare Street,
Dublin 2.

Telephone: +353 1 631 2121
LoCall: 1890 220 222
Fax: +353 1 631 2827
E-Mail: info@entemp.ie

Sample letter

Dear Minister Martin,

On Monday night the 8th of August 2005 I watched a television programme on RTE where a Mr. Eddie Hobbs explained the details of the Groceries Order legislation that is currently undergoing review by your department.

As a registered voter, consumer and citizen of this country, I would ask that you not betray the trust that I have placed in you as an elected minister of state by allowing big business lobby groups such as IBEC and RGDATA to influence your decision on the Grocery Order in any way.

I would also ask that you repeal the Groceries Order as I feel that it unnecessarily adds to the cost of purchasing everyday goods.

Regards,

Your Name

whiskeyman

pan wrote:

Sample letter

Dear Minister Martin,

On Monday night the 8th of August 2005 I watched a television programme on RTE where a Mr. Eddie Hobbs explained the details of the Groceries Order legislation that is currently undergoing review by your department.

As a registered voter, consumer and citizen of this country, I would ask that you not betray the trust that I have placed in you as an elected minister of state by allowing big business lobby groups such as IBEC and RGDATA to influence your decision on the Grocery Order in any way.

I would also ask that you repeal the Groceries Order as I feel that it unnecessarily adds to the cost of purchasing everyday goods.

Regards,

Your Name

PS: Please find enclosed one nappy as a sign of my commitment to this cause.

cuckoo

I found the stuff about cement to be very interesting, and while it feels like the deadest of flogged horses i did learn some new stuff about house prices (like, i'd never paused and actually thought 'why the heck do solicitors get paid a percentage of the house price to do the conveyencing (sp?)?').

However, i did find the stuff with the kids a little irritating - the selling sweets/apples bits to the children were cutesy, but went on a little too long.

And, i don't need to send a nappy in order to have the right to complain about how our government is running things - i voted in the last election. Anyway, from an environmental point of view all those nappies are just going to end up chucked in the bin - how's about people send letters/emails/faxes/etc?

rondjon

Pigman II wrote:

Yeah I got this feeling too. Maybe I'm just getting cynical in my old age or maybe it's just because I've got a guy who earns €300k+ p/a telling me how 'the man' is keeping me down or maybe it's because I don't believe that posting a packet of 'neeeapeeees' to Michael Martin is going to make a jot of difference.

The whole thing felt like an exercise in self promotion rather than a blueprint on how to 'fight the power' as tho Hobbs is setting himself up to be Irelands answer to Michael Moore or Mark Thomas. Like someone alluded to earlier will Hobbs be doing a segment on TV license fees? Will he put his money where his mouth is and bite the hand that broadcasts him? Somehow I think not.

The only thing I took from this show was that whilst in China people will stand in front of a tank because they wanted the right to vote in Ireland we'll stand in front a truck because we don't want to pay bin charges. Pretty much sums up the mind-state of this country a.t.m. and the zeitgeist that Hobbs is tapping into.

It's unfortunate to see so many people here taking the view that they were being preached to. You're lucky that you're all reasonably intelligent and "with it" and know what's going on around ye. Yet, ye know all that and still do sfa about the whole thing except be cynical about it all and use words like zeitgeist.

But you folks are in the minority, and since ye probably are too cynical to even vote as well, it's the regular Joe Blow in this country that now needs to be informed.

These normal people, working away, keeping their heads down, living from day to day, are most impacted by everything that was being highlighted, and to get these people interested, upset, and ready for action, is what's needed to get a groundswell started to try to get things changed.

rondjon

cuckoo wrote:

And, i don't need to send a nappy in order to have the right to complain about how our government is running things - i voted in the last election.

More of it.

When invited by the minister to tender your thoughts on the Groceries Order which is artificially propping up grocery prices, did you tell the minister what you thought???

Sarsfield

eoin_s wrote:

I found some of the facts very interesting, but overall I found the show incredibly patronising - am I alone in this? To me had the feel of a secondary school teacher doing their best to keep their students interested in an economics class.

Unfortunately, I feel it's the only way to communicate with a very large proportion of the general public. It's patronising to anyone with half a brain, but that's a minority of the modern TV audience

Mr Hobbs is a bit of a showman. The format emphasises that. A lot of his points were over-simplified. Some were not entirely fair (IMHO). People will start seeing ripoffs everywhere (even where there are none). But if it scares suppliers & Government into doing something, then maybe we'll all benefit anyway.

I support the bin-tax but don't really agree with driving vans over protestors. The fact that the video seemed to surprise the audience shocked me. They were obviously all waching Corrie or Big Brother and not the News back then.

I'm beginning to return to my original position that ripoff Ireland IS our own fault. We haven't bothered to educate ourselves, so we deserve what we get.

Eoin

Pigman II wrote:

Yeah I got this feeling too. Maybe I'm just getting cynical in my old age or maybe it's just because I've got a guy who earns €300k+ p/a telling me how 'the man' is keeping me down or maybe it's because I don't believe that posting a packet of 'neeeapeeees' to Michael Martin is going to make a jot of difference.

I don't think the sound of his voice made it any easier to put up with.

Pigman II wrote:

The whole thing felt like an exercise in self promotion rather than a blueprint on how to 'fight the power' as tho Hobbs is setting himself up to be Irelands answer to Michael Moore or Mark Thomas. Like someone alluded to earlier will Hobbs be doing a segment on TV license fees? Will he put his money where his mouth is and bite the hand that broadcasts him? Somehow I think not.

An EXCELLENT point - is RTE not one of the best cases of a monopoly in Ireland? Look at the quality advertisement-free broadcaster that is the BBC - that is what I would expect from my TV license. Someone said in this thread to give Hobbs a chance because it was his first program. Why should I? For the money he is getting (again from our licenses) for the program, why should anyone "give him a chance"?

Pigman II wrote:

The only thing I took from this show was that whilst in China people will stand in front of a tank because they wanted the right to vote in Ireland we'll stand in front a truck because we don't want to pay bin charges. Pretty much sums up the mind-state of this country a.t.m. and the zeitgeist that Hobbs is tapping into.

I seem to remember that the driver of the van that drove with the guy attached to the hood got off very lightly, as the judge basically said "what do you expect is going to happen when you jump on the front of a moving vehicle?". I had to agree really, whether or not the bin charges were right or not, the manner in which those people protested was against the law, so their recourse is limited.

The good point about the program that it was a new way of demonstrating the rip-off culture over here, and how the government is (seemingly) responsible for it. Everyone knows it is happening, but it appear that a fresh outlook was required. This was definitely achieved by the show, however whether it needed to be as dumbed down and as patronising (as I thought it was is) up for debate.

ambro25

rondjon wrote:

Why would there be? That's hardly a ripoff. They're merely seeking the enforcement of the law of the land.

I am not disputing the purpose of IRMA's actions - "enforcing the law of the land".

My suggestion/question, which I admit should have been more explicit, shall be rephrased as such:

"would there be any discussion of current entertainment pricing and distribution models, in the context (insofar as Ireland is concerned) of the IRMA (and/or Irish parties concerned) taking a big stick approach to digital forms of entertainment distribution (all illegal that they may be) and not promoting/offering much in the way of carrot, e.g. promote/facilitate/assist 'legitimate' online stores of downloadable entertainment media..."

I did not think that I needed to be so explicit, judging from posts in the thread and wrongly assuming comprehension from readers. Happy now? :rolleyes: