Moving from UTV to BT

OFDM

I'm seriously considering moving from UTV's 1Mbps Clicksilver (€30/month exclu. line rental) to BT's 1Mbp Broadband (€40 inclu. line rental) to save me €13 a month.

What I'd like to know from other boards posters is what kind of pitfalls, if any, I should be aware of or any other advice you might have based on completing such a transfer.

FYI my Clicksilver account was activated in March 2004 (so 12 month minimum contract has passed) and I didn't sign up for UTV Talk when it became available.

dub45

OFDM wrote:

I'm seriously considering moving from UTV's 1Mbps Clicksilver (€30/month exclu. line rental) to BT's 1Mbp Broadband (€40 inclu. line rental) to save me €13 a month.

What I'd like to know from other boards posters is what kind of pitfalls, if any, I should be aware of or any other advice you might have based on completing such a transfer.

FYI my Clicksilver account was activated in March 2004 (so 12 month minimum contract has passed) and I didn't sign up for UTV Talk when it became available.

There is a method available (port transfer I think its called) which should mean that you can move virtually seamlessly between isps. BT should be able to initiate this for you although I think I remember reading here that some of their csr's are not aware of it so you may have to push a bit for it. Under your T&C's with UTV you will have to give them a month's notice of your intention to move.

kaizersoze

Have a read of this thread
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=272262

Gegerty

I'm doing the same. I originally applied online and heard nothing back and when I rang them there was no record of my application so I did it there and then on the phone. I had to fill out a transfer form and fax it back to them. They told me there would be absolutely no downtime and when I told them I had to give a months notice so how does that work he went to his supervisor and asked and he was told its fine they'll take care of everything. Thing is I still haven't heard anything from them after a week, not even a confirmation email to say the wheels are in motion. I guess I'll just have to keep chasing them up on it.

I'm transfering my line rental and phone also by the way, both contracts are finished.

Benster

Based on my current experience doing a "relocation" I'd say hassle BT as much as you can to get updates / push them along. Apart from one occasion (because I flipped with them) their CSRs NEVER get back to you. I'm wondering if the incompetence of their accounts dept is spreading... :mad:

OFDM

Is there and ideal "time of the month" to transfer so that you don't get charged for 4 weeks by UTV that you won't be using?

OFDM

From the eircom to BT thread:

kaizersoze wrote:

I did indeed. I rang them and they told me that the monthly subscription wasn't cancelled even though I switched to BT so I still had to pay.
I cancelled straight away by email after the phone call. Ahh well it's my own fault really I suppose. The price you pay for no downtime.
Just in case anyone else is wondering, my "final" bill from UTV today included the advanced BB subscription for July even though I'm with BT since early June. Aparently,according to UTV, the DTAF cancels the BB service and allows the transfer to a new supplier but doesn't cancel the subscription :rolleyes:
So, the moral of the story is...CANCEL the UTV subscription as soon as you go live with BT

Did anyone else have this problem?

[edit]
I read on the eircom to BT thread that you don't pay the €50 connection fee if you already have broadband from someone else and you get BT's line rental inclusive BB. But on BT's website it states there's a €50 connection anyway. Which is it?
[/edit]

kaizersoze

OFDM wrote:

Is there and ideal "time of the month" to transfer so that you don't get charged for 4 weeks by UTV that you won't be using?

It's very hard to avoid it if you don't want any downtime because the UTV BB subscription is paid a month in advance. I got caught for an extra month but that was probably my own fault by not contacting UTV as soon as I went live with BT.
You can avoid paying for the month you won't use by cancelling UTV and waiting until it's switched off and then apply to BT. Then cantact UTV again and get a cancellation number and send that to BT. But this adds more complication to the process and your guaranteed about a month downtime, maybe more.
My advice would be to contact BT sales (get the name of the rep your dealing with and put his/her name on the envelope) and get them to send out the transfer form. Fill it out and send it back and wait to go live with them. Then email UTV (admin@u.tv) and cancel your subscription.
I'm not sure about the installation charge cause I signed up before the current packages were released.

OFDM

Thanks kaizersoze (and everyone else), I'll give it a shot.

But about the €50 connection fee, will I have to pay that or not?

Gegerty

kaizersoze wrote:

It's very hard to avoid it if you don't want any downtime because the UTV BB subscription is paid a month in advance. I got caught for an extra month but that was probably my own fault by not contacting UTV as soon as I went live with BT.
You can avoid paying for the month you won't use by cancelling UTV and waiting until it's switched off and then apply to BT. Then cantact UTV again and get a cancellation number and send that to BT. But this adds more complication to the process and your guaranteed about a month downtime, maybe more.
My advice would be to contact BT sales (get the name of the rep your dealing with and put his/her name on the envelope) and get them to send out the transfer form. Fill it out and send it back and wait to go live with them. Then email UTV (admin@u.tv) and cancel your subscription.
I'm not sure about the installation charge cause I signed up before the current packages were released.

I thought the whole point of the transfer form is that it give BT permission to cancel UTV on your behalf? This sounds like more UTV carp to me, I think the best thing to do is wait till you go live with BT, pay your last month with UTV and then cancel your direct debit/credit card transaction. Fook them and their billshut cancellation policies. Anything that is designed to catch consumers out and swindle money cannot be upheld, I guarantee they can't do shoot.

dub45

Gegerty wrote:

I thought the whole point of the transfer form is that it give BT permission to cancel UTV on your behalf? This sounds like more UTV carp to me, I think the best thing to do is wait till you go live with BT, pay your last month with UTV and then cancel your direct debit/credit card transaction. Fook them and their billshut cancellation policies. Anything that is designed to catch consumers out and swindle money cannot be upheld, I guarantee they can't do shoot.

UTV's Terms and Conditions clearly state that a month's notice of cancellation is requred so how is that designed to catch consumers out? And until recently anyways that was the polcy with virtually all isps.

OFDM

dub45 wrote:

UTV's Terms and Conditions clearly state that a month's notice of cancellation is requred so how is that designed to catch consumers out? And until recently anyways that was the polcy with virtually all isps.

So when should I contact UTV to tell them I intend moving? After I ring BT, after I send in the DTAF form, or after I go live?

kaizersoze

OFDM wrote:

So when should I contact UTV to tell them I intend moving? After I ring BT, after I send in the DTAF form, or after I go live?

After you go live if you don't want any downtime.

dub45

OFDM wrote:

So when should I contact UTV to tell them I intend moving? After I ring BT, after I send in the DTAF form, or after I go live?

I would be inclined to contact UTV as soon as I completed the DTAF form. I could suggest ringing BT and asking how long the whole thing takes (and then base the timing of the UTV cancellation on that) but it is unlikely that you will get a definitive answer.

Timing of the switchover is unfortunately becoming almost an art form in itself!!!

Gegerty

dub45 wrote:

UTV's Terms and Conditions clearly state that a month's notice of cancellation is requred so how is that designed to catch consumers out? And until recently anyways that was the polcy with virtually all isps.

The DTAF is a transfer form, that means UTV stops and BT starts and it should be seamless. It was my understanding that once I filled out the DTAF form then that was that. Once BT take over I'm done with UTV. Now it turns out they just keep charging you until you ring up and cancel, and even then they charge you for 1 extra month, even though they know you've switched to BT. This is clearly designed to catch people out and swindle them out of their hard earned money.

I know about the 1 months notice, surely once BT contact them and request a transfer then thats notice? Isn't that why you sign the DTAF? It give BT the authorisation to cancel UTV? Isn't that why it takes a month for the switch to take place?

If its not UTV sly tactics then maybe the info given in this post is wrong.

OFDM

Can you request UTV to cancel Clicksilver on a specific date?

kaizersoze

OFDM wrote:

Can you request UTV to cancel Clicksilver on a specific date?

I doubt it. And even if you could they would probably screw it up :rolleyes:

dub45

Gegerty wrote:

The DTAF is a transfer form, that means UTV stops and BT starts and it should be seamless. ...................
I know about the 1 months notice, surely once BT contact them and request a transfer then thats notice? Isn't that why you sign the DTAF? It give BT the authorisation to cancel UTV? Isn't that why it takes a month for the switch to take place?

If its not UTV sly tactics then maybe the info given in this post is wrong.

It is ironic I think that given that probably nobody has criticised UTV more than me over a long period over aspects of their Terms and Conditions that I should find myself defending them. The fact is that their Terms and conditions state that you have to give them a month's notice of your intention to terminate the contract - that is clearly stated when you sign up and you accept that when you accept the contract. Now if you notify UTV of your intention to leave and they charge you beyond the correct date i.e. a month from the date of notice then they are wrong it is as simple as that. The onus is on you to notify them not bt or anyone else that you may be signing up with. There is nothing sly about it it is clearly stated in the terms and conditions.

dub45

OFDM wrote:

Can you request UTV to cancel Clicksilver on a specific date?

In theory your Clicksilver should be cancelled a month after you notify them but bear in mind that Eircom have a role to play etc etc and it is probably difficult from an administrative point of view to tie it down to a specific date but it should fall in and around a month from notificiation.

OFDM

Is an email enough notification for them or do I have to phone or write a snail mail?

dub45

OFDM wrote:

Is an email enough notification for them or do I have to phone or write a snail mail?

I would suggest emailing them (but they can be slow in this dept!) and ask for an acknowledgement of your request by return. Also ask them when the bb is likely to be terminated. If you do not receive an acknowledgement within a couple of days then phone them. Belt and braces!

kaizersoze

OFDM wrote:

Is an email enough notification for them or do I have to phone or write a snail mail?

I emailed admin@u.tv and got an auto response instantly. Next day I received a cancellation confirmation email from Louise Murray in UTV. They will not accept a cancellation over the phone. It has to be in writing (either email or snail mail).

OFDM

I just thought of another few question. Approximately how long does it take from the time you send off the DTAF form to become active?

Also when does the BT billing period and download cap period start? From when they make your account active? From the first day you log on? Or from the start of each month?

zuma

OFDM wrote:

Also when does the BT billing period and download cap period start? From when they make your account active? From the first day you log on? Or from the start of each month?

From the first day that your username/password is activated(when you set it up and get a DSL connection).

OFDM

zuma wrote:

From the first day that your username/password is activated(when you set it up and get a DSL connection).

So not from the first day you log on?

Say you go active on the 15th of the month, would you (a) be charged for a full month for that month, (b) receive a reduced charge for that month or (c) be charged every month from the 15th of one month to the 15th of the next month?

kaizersoze

OFDM wrote:

I just thought of another few question. Approximately how long does it take from the time you send off the DTAF form to become active?

9 working days in my case.

OFDM wrote:

So not from the first day you log on?

Say you go active on the 15th of the month, would you (a) be charged for a full month for that month, (b) receive a reduced charge for that month or (c) be charged every month from the 15th of one month to the 15th of the next month?

Your billed from when your line is activated. If you have your own modem you can go online straight away without waiting for the BT modem to arrive. You will only be billed for the portion of the first month that the line is active. It depends on your billing cycle but it's unlikely to coincide bi-monthly.

OFDM

kaizersoze wrote:

If you have your own modem you can go online straight away without waiting for the BT modem to arrive.

Do they email you the username and password to log in or is it the same as the one you choose on the DTAF form?

kaizersoze

OFDM wrote:

Do they email you the username and password to log in or is it the same as the one you choose on the DTAF form?

It's the one you chose when you signed up. Just add "@iolbb" or "@BTBB" at the end of your username.

OFDM

Why are BT looking for a €125 deposit off me? Did anyone else get asked for this?

Dec4

It's the one you chose when you signed up. Just add "@iolbb" or "@BTBB" at the end of your username.

Couldn't figure out why my username & p/w wouldn't allow connection to BT server. Rang Tech Support (1890923111 ) .. had forgotten to add username@btbb.ie. This is missing from the quickstart guide they provide and does make a difference.

dub45

OFDM wrote:

Why are BT looking for a €125 deposit off me? Did anyone else get asked for this?

I think it may have something to do with not being a householder?

OFDM

dub45 wrote:

I think it may have something to do with not being a householder?

That's ridiculous. They have my credit card details, what do they need €125 for on top of that for? Do they think I going to steal the telephone line on them?

Additionally, there is no mention of a requirement for a €125 deposit in the terms and conditions and neither is there any legal documentation that guarantees I will ever get it back.

Forcing people who are living with parents or renting to pay what is essentially a non-refundable tax free gift to BT is simply extortion.

dahamsta

You can delete your credit card details through their website.

I have no problem with the deposit, I think it's a reasonable measure to prevent fraud. What I do have a problem with is their lack of transparency on the factors that will cause it to be required, the lack of information on when it will be refunded and how, and the lack of a receipt for the amount taken.

I took this up with BT's Head of Consumer Sales & Service a few months ago and he told me that I should have received a letter regarding the deposit and that I may not have received it because of anomalies in my order, but I still haven't received it. Did you?

(I'll be talking to that chap again on Monday, so do let me know so I can mention it to him. Also the timescale involved, i.e. if it's only a couple days, it could be in the post.)

adam

OFDM

dahamsta wrote:

I took this up with BT's Head of Consumer Sales & Service a few months ago and he told me that I should have received a letter regarding the deposit and that I may not have received it because of anomalies in my order, but I still haven't received it. Did you?

I received the letter in the post.

It says to return the cheque or postal order "in the Freepost envelope provided", yet no such envelope was provided. If they can't even include a freepost envelope that they're supposed to why should I give €125 that I will most likely never see again?

dahamsta

What did the letter say? Did it explain why the deposit was needed, and when it would be refunded?

OFDM

dahamsta wrote:

What did the letter say? Did it explain why the deposit was needed, and when it would be refunded?

They made no explanation of why it was need. The 1800923923 people didn't know why it was there either, just that it had to be paid.

Here's a link to the letter:

dahamsta

OFDM wrote:

They made no explanation of why it was need.

...or when it would be refunded. I have mixed information about this myself, I've been told both six months and a year on the phone, and the only factual information I could get out of their manager was that it would be refunded if service was cancelled.

As far as I'm concerned I'll be looking for my money back when the six months expires, because that's what I was told on the phone, but I left nailing it down go in the end the last time around because I was just sick of going around in circles with them on another issue.

I have to contact the guy again on Monday rearding a billing issue so I'll bring this up again. I'll let you know the official answer, and I'll try to convince him of the idiocy of the current setup. Again.

If you'd like to talk to him yourself, PM your name and contact details to me and I'll pass them along.

adam

dub45

I find it incredible that a so called reputable company will out of the blue request a deposit of a significant amount of money without any explanation as to what it is required for or when it will be refunded. And it is even more incredible that the number they give you as the fount of all knowledge knows nothing about it either!!! How does this crowd manage to stay in business at all? :eek:

On further reflection I wonder about how easy it might be for them to 'claim' the deposit given their legenday inability to run their billing department particularly when it does not seem in any way unusual for them not issue bills to people for over a year. So after a year you might easiliy find yourself not alone fighting off their debt collectors but trying to get your deposit back :rolleyes:

dahamsta

It is pretty incredible, and it annoys me personally that this is still going on, after I spent a good deal of time on the phone and in emails explaining the issues in detail to the guy that's supposed to be in charge; who promised that silly things like this would be addressed. Some issues I can understand taking time, because they're complex; this isn't, at all. It's a web page and a letter. It's common courtesy.

adam