Note through the door about barking dog

Wavey

Morning all.

Got an anonymous note in the door yesterday complaining that our six month old german shepard was barking all day while we were in work.
We also have a tiny little collie/terrier cross.

There is a park behind our back wall that alot of kids walkthrough to&from school so i suspect she just barks when people walk by.

I also know that some kids purposely walk along the back of the gardens whistleing and calling over any walls that have dogs behind them.

I do sympathise that it must me quite disturbing if the dog is indeed barking all day but what can be done about it?

We have left all kinds of toys out the back to keep the dog ammused but it obviously isnt working.

Anybody got any experience of this?

Thanks

Wavey

Arcadian

Easy solution is to keep the dogs inside when your at work and to leave them with their toys and also a stuffed kong, which will keep them occupied for a while.

Sifo

A guy who lives behind my house has a couple of dogs and they bark constantly, I'm not the type to complain but you should keep your dogs inside when your not there, if you don't have an ideal home for dogs you shouldnt have dogs... simple as

astec123

Have you tried setting up a webcam to see what is spurring the dog to bark? Try recording for a few weeks and if a not comes see if it truely is all day or just a few moments every so often.

the_syco

I think its only at night that they can complain about the noise. During the day, alot of dogs bark. And if one dog barks, the rest will join in.

disillusioned

As a dog owner I totally empathise.

There's a collar available that gives them a shock if they bark. It should only be worn by the dog when you're there but you could use it each evening for a period of time as a training resource. I know it sounds severe but I used it to appease an irritated neighbour and it worked - I tried it out on myself first too to make sure I didn't abuse the dog.

My parents had the ISPCA call to their house once because of complaints about their dog's barking. The ISPCA checked the dog's health, house etc and as there was no neglect, abuse etc they left happy. The dog's still there and still barks!

By the way, in my opinion an anonymous note is a coward's approach and if I was you I'd ignore it.

Wavey

Thanks for all the replies folks.

It does look like we will have to keep them in to avoid any conflicts. Its a pity cos I think its much healthier if they can be outside in the fresh air.

@Arcadian, The kong is the rubber toy that u stuff with peanut butter or similar? If so they have one of those.

Will probably leave them in for a week or so, then leave them out and try and record whats going on.


Cheers
Wavey

Raiser

Hmmn don't quit so soon, have two terriers - went through a phase of barking quite loudly at night - solution was to open bathroom window and slosh a half-glass of water in their general direction......after a few times they realised they were being anti-social and shut up.

Obviously only works if you're there - but if you were available to pester them with the odd splash at weekends and evenings then they should begin to shut up over time.....Part of prob. is that dogs can think they're being really good by defending the property and making a big show of bravado - if its discouraged for a while they'll be more inclined to stay quiet even if theres kids passing or other dogs etc.

Be a shame to have to lock them in all day.....Hope you get it sorted.....

doctor evil

Disillusioned I don`t think an anonymous note through the door is the cowards way at all and you would be a bit petty to ignore it. With neighbours you always have to be careful how you tread as you live beside them.

Wavey

@dissallusioned


Thats collar sounds a bit severe? Does it make the dog nervous or have any other adverse affect that you know of? Where did you buy it?
Also can you adjust the strength of the shock>

Thanks again

Wavey

positron

There is another type of collar, it will spray something to dogs face as soon as he/she barks - which is less cruel, but donno if its available in shops!

My own dog barks now and then, but we consistently ignore her when she is barking or whining, now she does that only if we leave her alone during weekends - weekdays, she just looks at us and sighs before we leave for work, and no barking all day!

GSDs can be very loud, but they are lovely dogs - good luck with yours!

Nala

I agree that a note isn't always a coward's way out. The person who wrote it could just have wanted to avoid a confrontation with you, a lot of people would not be as responsible as to try and solve the problem and would just deny that it's their dog that's being a nuisance or whatever.

LegacyUser

There are dogs that bark continuously in my estate. ALL bloomin night!! It wakes up any guests I have staying and I have to sleep in the spare room with ear plugs whenever someone stays over.

In general, I don't give a toss during the day if neighbours want to have a hooley but at night it is unaceptable to have a dog barking its head off in the back garden to the extent that people are woken up every time a bird as much as farts.

Don't get me wrong, I love animals! I have 2 cats.
On another note :
I do not think it is fair of you to own a dog and leave it all day cooped in the garden. It is probably bored out of its mind. Why did you get a dog if you just intend to leave it all day when your at work?? Dogs need human company and attention

peasant

bubby wrote:

I do not think it is fair of you to own a dog and leave it all day cooped in the garden. It is probably bored out of its mind. Why did you get a dog if you just intend to leave it all day when your at work?? Dogs need human company and attention

I agree ...not only is it not fair, it is actually downright cruel.

What gets me even more, is people who add another cruelty ...a bark collar, be it electric shock, water spray or scent. THEY DO NOT WORK !! Other noises can set them off, punishing your dog for something it didn't do.

The owner should train and control the dog, not some stupid gizmo. The dog will not learn from this. At best it will ignore the apparatus and bark anyway, at worst it will become seriously disturbed.

There seems to be a perception out there, that there is something like the God given right to dog ownership. Doesn't matter, if you're never at home, doesn't matter, if you haven't got the first clue about dogs and their welfare or training. Who cares about the dogs' needs ...let's just get one.

And when the problems get too big or the neighbours complain too massively, let's just get rid of it. Give it to the pound (where it will be killed after 5 days ...but hey, it had a chance someone else might have wanted it...)

Ohh ...and if, after a while, we find that something's missing ...lets just get another one...sure the neighbours will have calmed down by then...and this time we'll get a different breed ...that'll fix it!

Wake up, people!

FranknFurter

peasant wrote:

I agree ...not only is it not fair, it is actually downright cruel.

What gets me even more, is people who add another cruelty ...a bark collar, be it electric shock, water spray or scent. THEY DO NOT WORK !! Other noises can set them off, punishing your dog for something it didn't do.

The owner should train and control the dog, not some stupid gizmo. The dog will not learn from this. At best it will ignore the apparatus and bark anyway, at worst it will become seriously disturbed.

There seems to be a perception out there, that there is something like the God given right to dog ownership. Doesn't matter, if you're never at home, doesn't matter, if you haven't got the first clue about dogs and their welfare or training. Who cares about the dogs' needs ...let's just get one.

And when the problems get too big or the neighbours complain too massively, let's just get rid of it. Give it to the pound (where it will be killed after 5 days ...but hey, it had a chance someone else might have wanted it...)

Ohh ...and if, after a while, we find that something's missing ...lets just get another one...sure the neighbours will have calmed down by then...and this time we'll get a different breed ...that'll fix it!

Wake up, people!

EXACTLY!, thanks for saving me from having to type all that

b

disillusioned

peasant wrote:

What gets me even more, is people who add another cruelty ...a bark collar, be it electric shock, water spray or scent. THEY DO NOT WORK !!

Actually the collar DID work for me, perhaps when you used it you used it incorrectly?!

peasant wrote:

At best it will ignore the apparatus and bark anyway, at worst it will become seriously disturbed.

That certainly didn't happen to me but it's interesting that it happened to you


I love my dogs and they are happy dogs. They are outside while I work and inside when I'm home. They enjoy their space, their walks, their grooming, their meals etc and I'm not gonna change the way we live as long as they are content.

peasant

disillusioned wrote:

Actually the collar DID work for me, perhaps when you used it you used it incorrectly?!

The issue is not, if the collar did work for you or not, it goes far deeper than that.

Any soulless mechanical device will not TRAIN your dog, it will at best CONDITION it.
Dogs are very eager to learn, to pick up rules and regulations that allow them to fit into their environment and their "pack". By letting a mechanical apparatus set the rules, you are removing yourself out of the loop. The dog will not learn, that not to bark is one of your rules. All it will get conditioned to is that when it barks it gets hurt. While the end result may (and I say MAY) be the same ...a non barking dog ... the dog hasn't learned anything at all.
The collar doesn't make any graduations. Its either shock or no shock. So the dog gets conditioned not to bark at all ...ever. Whereas you might actually be quite happy, if your dog alerts you to somebody climbing into your garden, trying to nick your lawnmower. If you TRAIN your dog, you can give it a job. "Bark at intruders, don't bark at birds or leaves rustling in the wind" and the dog will understand and be happy (dogs need a job).

Its a matter of attitude as well. By handing over the "training" of your dog to a mechanical device, you're basically reducing the dog itself to a mechanical level. "I want you to work the same way as my TV. Play and entertain me, when it suits me, otherwise sit quietly in the corner"
That is simply WRONG. Dogs are living, breathing sensient beings ...not white goods. They are for living with, not for using or consuming.

As for the collars themselves:
They get triggered by a microphone. These pick up all sorts of sounds. Coughing, sneezing, other dogs barking, or even loud cars going by. What is your dog supposed to "learn" when it gets punished for all those things? It'll "learn" to hate other dogs or lorries for example as it gets zapped everytime one of them goes by.
Sprays aren't any better, they stick to the fur of the dog and it get's perma-punishment from a scent that it can't stand and get rid of any more.
CRUEL, soulless and wrong ...that's what these collars are.

There is a reason why dogs don't come with a remote control. You need to understand them, respect them and get involved with them.

If you don't have the space or time to give them understanding and involvement ...at least give them some respect and DON'T GET ONE !

disillusioned

Thankfully we are all entitled to our own opinions.

peasant

disillusioned wrote:

Thankfully we are all entitled to our own opinions.

It's not just an "opinion".
Simple thruths and facts ...no more, no less.

I'm not trying to condemn you, because you used one of them collars. Everybody makes mistakes, especially when they don't know any better.

Wouldn't you rather learn how to successfully interact with your dog? Recognize its strengths and limits, build a relationship, understand it?
Make it understand you?

Can be done ....not with a collar though ...and not with your attitude.

Think about it.


Please !

dudara

peasant wrote:

It's not just an "opinion".
Simple thruths and facts ...no more, no less.

I'm not trying to condemn you, because you used one of them collars. Everybody makes mistakes, especially when they don't know any better.

Wouldn't you rather learn how to successfully interact with your dog?Recognize its strengths and limits, build a relationship, understand it?
Make it understand you?

Can be done ....not with a collar though ...and not with your attitude.

Think about it.


Please !

Please don't sound so condescending.

What you're posting here are your opinions, as your posts are not backed up by hard indisputable facts. You do talk a lot of sense, but people won't listen unless you improve your style.

disillusioned

I've a friend who runs a kennel, she's also a breeder and heavily involved with the Irish Kennel Club. She has advised that in her opinion the collar is ok and has used them herself when necessary.

@ Wavey:
I bought my collar at the pet store in Kinsealy (northside of Dublin). Have you made any headway with your dog or your neighbour?

amerden

dudara wrote:

Please don't sound so condescending.

What you're posting here are your opinions, as your posts are not backed up by hard indisputable facts. You do talk a lot of sense, but people won't listen unless you improve your style.

I don't think "peasant" was being condescending, he/she is just being passionate about animals and their well being, if more of the population of this country was as caring we wouldn't have such cruelty to any animal.

disillusioned wrote:

I've a friend who runs a kennel, she's also a breeder and heavily involved with the Irish Kennel Club. She has advised that in her opinion the collar is ok and has used them herself when necessary.

In my experience some kennels/breeders can be the cruelest places off all for dogs. Profit takes priority over animal welfare.

peasant

I would love to post hard, indisputable facts about the "right or wrong" handling, training, etc of dogs in general.

Problem is, there aren't any ...or thousands of them ...whichever way you look at it.

Anyone can call themselves a dog trainer. Anyone can invent "THE METHOD" and go out there and sell it. And produce reports and statistics about how wonderfully it works. Same goes for dog "training" products. Bark collars, Haltis, choke chains and the like. Any research will bring up pages upon pages praising whatever it is into the high heavens. Equally you will also find pages upon pages condemning that particular product or method to hell.
People being people, that's just the way it is ...everyone thinks that THEY have got it right and everybody else is wrong.

But it is very simple really:

There is NO universal method to train your dog. Every single dog is an individual and will react differently to its environement. Every single dog has good days and bad days, talents and limits.
That is why a "one size fits all" approach will not work. It MAY (if you're lucky) but there is no guarantee.
Every dog needs to be assessed individually and treated individually.

Factor into that that every owner is an individual as well, reacting individually to any given situation, putting their own personal spin on any traing method, and you will realize that there can be no hard, indesputable facts, as every dog- owner -team is different, producing different results.

As a beginner, looking for advice, the multitude of contradictory information out there is really baffling. And everybody you turn to totally rubbishes whatever you thought you had already learnt and understood and tells you something completely different is the only proper way.

No wonder people are confused and try everything and anything, making things worse in the progress.

But actually, it IS really simple:

Dogs are unequalled in adapting to their environement, their group, their pack. That's what they do best. Check out how a certain "pack" (ie. your family) works, what makes it tick, what the do's and dont's are and then exploit that knowledge to their best advantage. Who is a soft target, who is not to be messed with. When does it pay to follow the rules and when can I get away with doing what I like.

To get the best possible relationship with your dog, you only need to follow a few simple rules:

Respect your dog for the individual it is.
Learn to trust your dog, as it learns to trust you.
Observe your dog, as it observes you.
Set up clear and precise rules and stick to them. Consistently and consequently.
Don't punish your dog, correct it.
Be the reliable, consistent and consequent leader it is looking for.
Give it some freedom to make its own decisions, as a good leader would.

Learn to apply these rules to all and any situation, work at yourself to be consistent and predictable and your dog will follow you ...happily. Given some time you will create an understanding between each other. The kind of understanding that makes dog ownership such a wonderful experience.

Unfortunately these days, many people look at a dog like an item. Something that is there for their amusement. That provides entertainment for a few hours a day and get's put away in a corner when it's not wanted. The dog is expected to function "like it says on the tin" or in that case, some bogous breed "desription" written up by a breeder keen on selling puppies.
As a result, the dog gets treated disrespectfully. I gets bought, used, fixed, adjusted. Dogs being the truly incredible animals they are, a lot of times the owner still gets what he wants from a seemingly "happy" dog.

But try the other way and you will be amazed!

fightin snr

Fair play peasant,probably the most concise post I`ve ever read on boards.......
It`s simple methodology put the time and effort in and you should reap the rewards,I don`t care what anyone says there`s no quick fix

LegacyUser

peasant wrote:

Unfortunately these days, many people look at a dog like an item. Something that is there for their amusement. That provides entertainment for a few hours a day and get's put away in a corner when it's not wanted.

peasant, some very well phrased posts. Thanks! Just to re-iterate! Don't buy a dog, leave it all day in the garden while your at work and wonder why it has behavioural problems.

delly

This may help, not a coller, but works in a similar method i think.

For the record i don't think its right to have a dog and not be home during the day. I've longed to own a couple of golden retrievers for the last number of years, but i won't get them until myself or my wife can be at home for the full day.

Raiser

I've longed to own a couple of golden retrievers for the last number of years, but i won't get them until myself or my wife can be at home for the full day.

One dog at home during the day is not good news at all.

I REALLY REALLY think that two dogs at home in a reasonable sized garden - with a bit of room to get up to stuff and a few toys is feckin grand.

- My two chase each other, play-fight, chew their toys, snooze, dig random holes (?) sunbathe, play-fight, chew things I forgot to put in the shed, snooze some more.

They have a better quality of life than I do Mon. to Fri.

Why shouldn't you get a couple of retrievers? Do you need to retire from your job first so you can wipe their bums afterwards..... :eek:

How did dogs ever survive before we domesticated them and gave them silly names.....?

I would say to anyone that has one dog out the back to PLEASE consider buying a companion dog - Its not harder to care for an extra dog - its as easy to fill two bowls as one - all dog associated tasks are just done X2 if that makes any sense.....

peasant

Raiser wrote:

One dog at home during the day is not good news at all.

I REALLY REALLY think that two dogs at home in a reasonable sized garden - with a bit of room to get up to stuff and a few toys is feckin grand.

I would agree that having two dogs is a huge improvement, from the dogs' point of view. They are social animals and need and enjoy company. (Check first, that they DO get along, though ...some dogs just can't stand one another)

As far as your relationship to the dogs is concerned, it doesn't really make any difference whether you leave one, two ore more dogs home alone all day.

(Don't get me wrong ...you don't have to watch your dogs every minute of the day ..actually they quite enjoy some "time out" every now and then.)

Fact is, they are still left leaderless all day. To some dogs this will be no problem, to others it could be an open invitation to dream up all sorts of mischief and / or undesirable behaviour.

delly

Thats one of the reasons for getting two dogs, company for each other.

I reckon it'll happen soon enough tho', wifey is taking a career break some time in the near future.

LegacyUser

delly wrote:

Thats one of the reasons for getting two dogs, company for each other.

I reckon it'll happen soon enough tho', wifey is taking a career break some time in the near future.

No no .. trying to justify leaving one dog in the garden all day by buying another?? No way!! With regard to the post above implying that y0u have to be retired before you can get a dog - my answer -

If there is nobody in the house all day - a dog is NOT a good pet to choose. Why? Leaving a dog cooped up all day is NOT fair on the dog, AND not fair on your neighbours. The house two doors down from me has 2 dogs - one barks - the other barks - ALL night.

There are plenty of other pets out there, if your not home for 9-10 hours of the day then get a cat or goldfish. Nobody is saying you need to wipe their arses (as some poster nicely put it above). Fact is - dogs like human company and they deserve to be walked and played with as opposed to left in the garden all the time.

FranknFurter

Would you put a shock collar on the neck of a toddler who cries at innapropriate times?

Your dog is essentially no different.

You can teach respect and obedience without hurting the animal, through patience and time.:(

Also, heres a fact for you, I have seen dogs die via shock collars, how? if a dog has a (maybe undiagnosed) heart condition or epilepsy, the pulse can kill, specially smaller dogs.no matter what trainers or manufacturers may say to get you to buy their product.


b